Your Policy on Property? (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 4:15:18 PM)

Tal,

While nittaa is stuck in Canada a few days (waiting for an auto part, and everything's closed for Canada Day--she'll be here tomorrow), we stay in touch via phone. While she was out, some guy smacked her ass. "You looked like you needed your ass whacked," he said.

"What did you do?" I asked. "Knee to the groin," she responded (nittaa is a black belt). "No one touches your property but you." This is correct--that's my rule. If her ass needs whacking, I'll do it, thank you very much. [Remember that post a few months ago where she mentioned she'd probably get her ass whacked for posting that? she was right.]

"Good girl," I told her. "Anyone else touches you, take them down."

Now, on Gor, of course, she'd be just a girl. But we're on Earth, and I'm possessive.

So I'm just curious--what's the policy in your House?

Comments welcome from both Free and slave.

Best,

Tim




Happy4Life -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 6:31:32 PM)

Tal,

I am a greedy bastard, it's mine all mine when it comes to her body. Now I will allow her to serve and be pleasing to others, just as long as they respect the fact that she is My property




Stephann -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 6:55:00 PM)

Tal Tim,

Not to be contrary, but if you were to learn that the man was, in fact, Gorean, would it have made a difference?

More food for thought; if a girl on Gor was physically capable of overcoming a man who attempted to slave-rape her, would it not only make sense that in a world where might makes right, her might made her right?

Personally, someone touches something of mine, without my permission, they're asking for trouble; whether I'm there or not.  That's not a uniquely Gorean issue; it wouldn't have been the fact that her ass was smacked.  It would have been the fact that he knew he was doing something contrary to the laws and norms of our society.  It isn't an issue of being possessive for me at all, but rather being protective to ensure that she isn't harmed.  If she enjoyed the ass smack, I'd have advised her to ask for another one.  Just me.

Stephan




aeleberaNB -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 7:12:12 PM)

Greetings Master Tim:

~~smiles~~

While Master and i do not live together yet, He has advised me that if anyone attempts to touch my ass without His prior consent i am not only to do what is necessary to protect His property, but to inform Him right away, telling Him who and where it happened.

i had a situation where a guy i used to know tried that recently and got what was coming to him. i informed Master immediately and He said i did the right thing.

Master has said that i am allowed to serve and be pleasing to others as long as they respect that i am not allowed to do anything other than serve food or drinks while away from my home or here in my home, but the minute that they go past that i am to do what i have to in order to protect what is His.

wishing You well,
aelebera{NB}




Musicmystery -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 7:23:54 PM)

Good question. That's actually my question too.

If Bull, for example, a man I respect, and who could probably beat the living crap out of me, took liberties with nittaa (and I'm sure he wouldn't), we'd have a problem, and not one I'd walk away from. Leonidas said something similar about edana--he doesn't share with people he doesn't know, I think he put it.

If we were on Gor, you are right--her actions would even be a crime (remember Slave Girl, where they must run from sleen, and where even not desiring a man's touch is a crime, for example).

On your last paragraph, we're in complete agreement. On the other hand, Gor, as people endlessly post, is about honor--and if we're on Earth, that honor extends here. To continue my hypothetical, if I ran a raid to Iowa and captured Natalie--Bull WOULD beat the living crap out of me (and if that's all that happened, I'd be damn lucky!) And your last sentence--nittaa knows FAR better than that!

Anyway, that's the point of my post--exploring these questions. Thanks!

And Bull--thanks in advance for being a good sport. I knew you would.

Gentlemen, I just wish more men were men of honor.

Best,

Tim





xBullx -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 8:40:18 PM)

Tal Tim,

  I know your intentions are honorable. In no way could I take offense to your illustration.And you would never have to worry about my hand taking advantage of your girls ass, I was only thinking about it, not actually going to do it....lol.

  I was speaking to a girl about this very subject this morning. She was curious as to my thoughts and what I would expect with her interacting with other men. I will spell it out my thoughts and standards as I did to her.

  Now remember this is analogy and not an direct example. I have a very nice pickup, SOMETIMES Natalie gets to drive it, ohhhh, it's all tricked out cowboy like and damn I look good in it. Markibus asked how old it was when he was here and I told him 2 years old and he said damn, it still smells new. I'm fussy, very damn fussy. My bet is I may possibly have a stricter code of standards for my free companion, than some men do for their slaves. I'm not gloating, merely illustrating the point. My youngest and wildest son, has NEVER driven my pick-up. The older has maybe once or twice. Apart from that.....uhmmmm, no one that I can think of has driven it. This is my property, but not even my most prized piece of property. I'm worse about the John Deere....

  If I ever settle on another slave, and I have my eye on 7 or 8 of them...She'll be something that I like a tad bit more than the pick-up and the John Deere(did I say that) or she'll have a boot mark on her ass. The point I want to make is what's mine is mine, I to am not going to let just anyone touch my property, I've worked hard for what is mine as I assume other men have for what is theirs. I do have some friends that if around and swatted my wench playfully on the ass in a friendly/ playful gesture, we would all laugh and the girl would most likely be expected to wiggle it at them.

  The contrary to this is their are a limited number of honorable men walking these dusty streets and their, well, I doubt I'm the best judge on honor, but I will say that their is a very limited number of men that I respect their intentions. I would like to imagine that on that planet that would be Gor; men would not disrespect another simply because they could; they would not direspect the property of another simply because they could, and noble men would in fact stand united against an asshole of a man that thought he could act as a self serving, spoiled, undisciplined troll of a man.

  It goes back to the book "Outlaws", I believe where it described this man that could afford a slave may in fact offer a guest the use of her for the evening; but a courtesy of the guest would in turn, be to graciously thank the host and pass on such an honorable offer. My bet is if a man thought the guest would not live up to the custom, he wouldn't have allowed the guest in his house to begin with....Now, if a man was wealthy and had a pleasure garden of dozens of sluts, well, there is certainly a reason he has that many, and my bet is his favorite wench(es) won't be there available to just anyone. Come one, Goreans in the books may have a different train of thought, and may have in theory a better sense of nobility than we, but they surely have their moments as well.

  Remember Daffy Duck in that cartoon where he had the pearl......it's mine, mine, all mine I tell ya..............!!!
Some days we have a little daffy in us and some days we duck........it.

Live well,

Bull




Stephann -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 8:45:34 PM)

Tim,

I'm right with you, there.  It's a catch-22; we desire women to be beautiful, desirable, heated, wanton, hungry sluts.  Then we tell them if anyone touches them without our express permission, they're supposed to fight it.  Smacks a bit of getting them all gussied up (hair, nails, new dress) for a date, and then taking them to Mickey D's.  We say it's a question of honor, yet I don't equate honor with sexual liberties.  Gorean philosophy as a whole has firm roots in men being in a rightful place of dominance, by our very physical nature (natural law argument ad nauseum) yet the very moment another man a thousand miles away makes an effort to assert his own physical dominance over the woman, we go into a chivalric tirade.  Yes, I say we, because I suffer from the same double standard.

So, to a degree, I try to remember that if she's so smokin hot that a man's willing to risk 15 years being the playtoy of 'Bruno' and the sweethearts for a roll in the hay with my girl, I feel rather good.  I also wouldn't hesitate to fix his wagon before he goes.

Stephan








Kirata -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 8:48:40 PM)

Tal Tim,
 
This seems to be heading toward a focus on girls, but I think you got the topic title right. It's about personal property generally. I don't like other people using my tools. I take care of my tools. I want them treated right, and I want to know where they are. Same with my car. Don't even think of ever driving my car unless I trust you and know that you will handle it with both skill and care. I have a cat pal (a black Maine Coon cat). His name is Aiki. Don't go trying to corral him with the itchy-kitchy crap. If he likes you, he'll come over. Leave him alone, sit down, and don't squeeze the fruit or the girl.
 
IWYW,
 
Kirata
 




ygraine -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 8:51:52 PM)

Evening Herd-sta
I think you touch on something very fundamental and important in your post.  Property is property.  Even when you have a great relationship with another man, if he were to kick the tires on your JD (god forbid, folks, he WAXES the thing), I think it would be an affront to you. 
Even if the man was Gorean, I think it would still offend especially if you did not know the person.
I know there are several places in the books that are quoted for this matter, both on the pro and con side.  However, when it comes to a simple property issue, bottom line, it is not likely that anyone is going to let a stranger do what they want with it, slave or tractor!
This subject brought up another potential thread, Tim.  I thank you for it.
I wish you all well.
Y




xBullx -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 8:58:33 PM)

Hey, what do you mean it's a focus on the girls, I was focused on my pick-up..........

Bull




smilezz -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 9:13:11 PM)

Good evening Sir,

As Thorns puts it:  mine, mine, MINE!   *chucklez*
He's a greedy rat bastid and will tell you so.   He also knows i am quite capable of taking care of myself when/if needed.  I enjoy the human touch, i do however have this thing about someone coming up behind me......touching my shoulder(s).  An unfortunate man took it to far one evening and ended up with a broken nose...i warned him, a few friends that know me warned him, he decided that because i was a girl i could not possibly mean what i say.  (and told me this to my face)

Thorns knows i am a very affectionate woman, He knows that i enjoy hugs from other Men, He knows i enjoy the presence of other Men and that i am more comfortable with them than women.........however, He does not share/loan out this piece of His property with other Men.

He expects me to take care of  "His" property while He is away.......the only correct answer is:  Yes Master. 

Hope you enjoy your evening....

~smilezz~





Stephann -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 10:01:43 PM)

Gentlemen,

There's a very good reason I didn't mention property rules in terms of a female.  Simply put, we wouldn't send a truck, a cat, or a new big screen television to the store to buy groceries, or to Canada to visit their sister.  These pieces of property might be coveted, but (with the exception of the cat) aren't likely to decide one day not to belong to us.  Furthermore, there is already an existing set of social conventions regarding the protection of both property, and relationships; telling an aggressive man "I'm married/have a boyfriend/am involved" is likely to be more effective than saying "I'm already owned."  Because the girl still possesses the capacity to choose to leave, her status as property remains a completely voluntary choice on her part.  It isn't a significant difference until she chooses to leave.

Having said that, I wouldn't drive a nice car to the 'hood.

Stephan




patina -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 10:56:16 PM)

Greetings Masters:

May I ask a question of You on something I have had other Masters demand?   One of You mentioned about having Your girl dress up and go out then she is pestered by other males.  Why is it that Masters want their girls to pratically dress as prositutes?  I have had at least 3-5 tell me I would have to dress that way.  For that reason and others I declined to talk with them any further. They then are upset when she has other guys try to either touch or contact her.   To me they caused the problem. 

I hope I have not offended anyone with my remarks.
If I am talking out of place and saying it in a way I should not I ask for forgiveness and instruction on how to phrase it properly. 


peace be to all

patina 




Kirata -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/2/2007 10:59:58 PM)

Stephan,

With regard to girls, I think whether or not they might "decide one day not to belong to us" is largely irrelevant. Shit happens. We are who we are. If they decide they don't like it, the door is still in the same place it was yesterday.
 
K.




Luther6 -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/3/2007 5:29:40 AM)

Tal Bull:
    I do not recall any passage in the books where it was expected as courtesy for a guest to refuse an offer of a slave.  I am aware of several posts stating the general courtesy of sharing slaves with guests.  This appears to be a common custom.

"In a large house, with various slave girls, it is thought only an act of courtesy on the part of a host to permit a guest the use of one of the girls for the evening.  Each of the girls considered eligible for this service, at one time or another during the evening, will approach the guest and offer him wine.  His choice is indicated by the one from whom he accepts wine."
(Assassin of Gor, p.89)

“Yes,” she cried, angrily.  “I was pleased!  He was handsome, and strong, and Gorean, and I was a female slave.  I thought he might ask for my use, and that it would be granted him by you in Gorean courtesy!”
It was true.  Had a guest expressed interest in Vella, Elizabeth, a former secretary from Earth, one of my slaves, I would surely have given her to him for his night’s pleasure.  And if he were not fully pleased, I would have had her whipped in the morning."
(Beasts of Gor, p.16-17)

"It is a common Gorean hospitality to offer the use of one’s slaves to guests, if they should find them attractive."
(Fighting Slave of Gor, p.174)

"It is common to provide a guest with a girl for the night, to see to his comfort."
(Rogue of Gor, p.196) 

Though this is a common custom, it is far from absolute.  There is ample evidence in the books where Gorean men would refuse to allow their guests to share their slaves.   

"It is a common Gorean hospitality to offer the use of one’s slaves to guests, if they should find them attractive. The Lady Florence of Vonda, she to whom I belonged, could give or assign me, as any slave she owned, to whomsoever she pleased.  She had, however, at least thus far, kept me for herself.  Sometimes when there were guests at her villa southwest of Vonda I was kept locked in my kennel."
(Fighting Slave of Gor, p.174)

"Although Marcus was harsh with his slave, pretending even to a casual and brutal disdain for her, he was also, it might be mentioned, extremely possessive where she was concerned.  Indeed, he was almost insanely jealous of her.  She was not the sort of girl, for example, whom he, as a host, even at the cost of a certain rudeness and inhospitality, would be likely to hand over for the nightly comfort of a guest.  It would be at his slave ring alone that she would be likely to find herself chained."
(Magicians of Gor, p.27-28)

So, many of the positions evidenced in this thread certainly have support from the books.  One certainly does not have to make their slave available for everyone and anyone.
 
Luther   
 








OrionTheWolf -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/3/2007 5:47:11 AM)

Fast Reply,

Greetings Tim,

The answer is easy: My property, My rules. There must be some extreme trust in someone before I allow them the use of any valuable property. I have found very few individuals in my entire life that I have extreme trust in.


Orion




caitlyn -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/3/2007 6:28:23 AM)

General, etc ...
 
I don't want to make this post about 'the girl', or move it off the comparison to lawn mowers and power tools [;)], but ...
 
We are only talking about a pat on the backside, as opposed to 'use', persay. When I'm involved with someone, I try to look as hot as possible, all the time, whenever we are around anyone he knows. I think most guys really like all the other guys to think, "Damn, he has a smokin' girlfriend!"
 
I would even think it cold go a step further ... "You swatted her on the butt and got away with it ... imagine what I get away with." [;)]




tangy -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/3/2007 6:54:31 AM)

greetings patina,

i dont think men like woman to dress up like "prositutes" but many men like to dress thier girls up to look sexy, i think this is because so other men can LOOK at them, they like the fact that other men do look but cant touch. if someone does end up touching, some men just flip out about it, and i feel sorry for the guy that does end up
touching cuz its not pretty. but, its kinda of a turn on that a man ( for me anyways) wants me to dress up so revealing to show off, hell i dress up revealing to show off lol its exciting when men look but
thats me.


p.s  hello caitlyn,

When I'm involved with someone, I try to look as hot as possible, all the time, whenever we are around anyone he knows. I think most guys really like all the other guys to think, "Damn, he has a smokin' girlfriend!" "

they sure do! but if one of them guys were to touch, look out! all hell breaks loose . but also i been with some guys that blame me for attracting other guys....its my fault for acting like a slut....guys are so weird lol  


well wishes,
tangy




fyreredsub -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/3/2007 7:13:27 AM)

greetings patina,

when dressing for Master, we are in silks.....around the House.

When He takes us out in coffle, we are 'street legal'[:D] look....

For work, whatever our 'business' dress code is.....fyre does business causal, one of her chain sisters wears scrubs another is in uniform,right down to the gun and cuffs.

BUT no one just touches us....

and fyre isnt sure if she is reading your thinking right but were you implying a girl is asking for it by dress? because fyre would dress much more conservitately if it werent for Master Rules.....

damn if some stranger touches fyre......fyre has to walk 'femine' and many other things but that gives no one rights....

she's gonna go off  and be like white on rice on his ass

oops forgot, we serve(not service[;)]) in silks during gatherings as well, (no one touches without permission (hair,hand, collar).

and never touch one of his girls collars.......... without asking Master can you see it first....




Leonidas -> RE: Your Policy on Property? (7/3/2007 7:29:25 AM)

I wish more men were bold enough to slap edana on the ass. 

Since my name was mentioned, I should probably clerify.

I wouldn't send edana to serve a man that I don't know, mostly because he'd probably end up being conflicted hairball of chivalry, courtly love, and all kinds of needy, and do nothing more than further her notions that that is what men are supposed to be like that she had 31 years to develop before I stripped and collared her.  I don't need the aggrevation.  I have no illusions about needing to "protect" edana from such men.  I'm sure they'd be quicker, more polite, and generally less demanding than she's used to.

Edana is a slave and a slut.  It'd probably do her good to be tossed to a guest who knew that, and how to make use of a slave and a slut once in a while.  Good in the sense that it would disabuse her of notions she still harbors about slave just being shorthand for "kinky girlfriend".  Sadly, I don't know any men like that anymore, so edana has never been shared.

When I lived in Northern Idaho, I had a pickup truck too.  It didn't look new, and it certainlly didn't smell new.  It was usually covered with mud, and smelled of fresh kills, sweat, fish bait, and various other things decidedly not new car like.  It had a small-block chevy stroker motor that I built myself, mated to a transfer case with a warn overdrive and 5:89 final drive ratio axels.  It would climb anything short of a tree.  I don't still have it, of course, and probably wouldn't even if I had only ever taken it out of the garage to wax it or be seen in it.  What I do have are the memories of all the fine times and trouble that old truck saw me into and out of.  I think that's the way of things, and in the end, all a man can ask.




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