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Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls.


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Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 9:52:04 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4212
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline 		It is called the Street of the Writhing Slave. It is dark and narrow, and not far from the wharves. It has its name from the fact that most renters of, and dealers in, Coin Girls in Victoria, keep their kennels on this street. The girls of the day, designated by a coiled whip pressed against their left shoulder, wearing their neck chains, with the attached bell and coin box, are sent into the streets in the late afternoon and expected to return before the nineteenth ahn. And woe to the girl who does not return with a jangling coin box on her neck chain! Some girls, once designated, and locked in their accounterments, kneeling, weeping, scratch even at the insides of the stout gates of their masters' houses, hoping to be sent into the streets early, that their chances of turning a profit for their master, and thus avoiding a beating or torture, may be enhanced. Such a lenience, however, is seldom shown to the girls, as it is against an agreement binding the entrepreneurs engaged in this trade. Sometimes the girls are sent into the streets with their hands braceleted behind their backs. Sometimes they are sent into the streets with their small hands free, that they may use them to please their master's customers. Sometimes a new girl is sent into the streets on a leash, with an older girl, that she may learn how a Coin Girl behaves.

- Guardsman of Gor

While I hope this topic isn't taken too seriously, I think it does illustrate a profound difference between the type of slavery a kajira may encounter, and the type of slavery a typical D/s submissive or slave may expect. 

Yet, I can't think of a single man who owns a slave, and requires her to work in either of these professions.  Why is this?

Stephan


< Message edited by Stephann -- 8/4/2007 9:53:58 PM >

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:07:48 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		I've known plenty of owned M/s slaves who were whored out.  But then I've been an owned whore myself so perhaps I took note of them more than usual- whoring isn't very welcomed in Ds/Ms culture in general.

I have to say I haven't seen it as very prevalent in gorean culture.  I wonder if goreans could postulate whether there are more gorean whores vs M/s whores?

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:11:01 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4212
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline 		Hi LA,

I suppose I was more asking in terms of why it doesn't happen more often as a 'regular' activity, vice an occasional kink.  It's a very different mentality for a girl to go to a strip club with her owner on amature night, have one too many, and end up dancing, than it is for her to do it three or four nights a week for a year.  I'm in complete agreement, though, as a fetish/kink, it seems to rank somewhere between scat and diaper play.

Stephan


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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:12:18 PM   
Najakcharmer


Posts: 2121
Joined: 5/3/2004
Status: offline 		Possibly because of the thrilling John Norman adventure novel that we will never see: Free Clinics of Gor.  The Priest-Kings may have a cure for AIDS and herpes, but so far they aren't sharing.  

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:21:16 PM   
RavenofPK


Posts: 320
Joined: 6/22/2005
Status: offline 		Ahhhh.........the good ole aids/herpes paranoia card. God forbid anyone take any accountability and responsibility to lesson the likelyhood of passing or contracting anything.

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:28:10 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4212
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline 		Naturally the lapdance induced AIDS epidemic is a consideration....

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:39:19 PM   
Freki


Posts: 8
Joined: 7/17/2007
Status: offline 		To me, it is not a question of being afraid of STD's though that can be a factor, i personally feel that the culture here though is based upon the tennants of the novels, it does sway to the culture here IRL.  Prostitution is seen as bad, whoring is synomous with prostitiution, and I feel that the respect not accorded to someone that you own/have charge over when you do this is not honorable.  What I really see stopping people from really doing it or admitting they do it is the legal ramifications of said acts in the united states and many other countries across the world coupled with the STD scare of Herpes or Aids, you have to be careful or you could find yourself unknowingly infected and spreading it even worse. 

and before anyone says well you can take percautions, but you can not be 100% sure for approximately 6 months after the ONE act with no other acts inbetween to make sure you don't have HIV, and even then it could be as long as 12 months before HIV really pops up (though much more common to be detected at 6 months).   You may call me not Gorean for thinking this way, but I have many other mental and social standards as well as the Gorean that I am starting to understand and learn about, and of those the most is honor much like a Samurai I hold honor above all else.

Freki

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 10:46:16 PM   
Najakcharmer


Posts: 2121
Joined: 5/3/2004
Status: offline 		Are you honestly saying that there is no risk of STD's involved in sex work?  There are certainly ways to go about it that significantly reduce the risk, and in some cases when the contact is limited the risk is pretty near zero.  But there is some degree of risk attendant on having intercourse with multiple partners even with the careful use of condoms.  What I'm suggesting is that this risk may be a factor in making the decision.  

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 11:11:14 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4212
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline 		A woman has a better chance of dying from the drive to work due to an accident resulting from a flat tire, than she does contracting AIDS when using a condom.  When was the last time you changed your tires?

Yes, it could be a factor in the decision not to engage in prostitution, specifically.  There are, literally, dozesn of threads related to the HIV and multiple partners topic.  It would be a shame to turn this into just another one.

Stephan


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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 11:37:22 PM   
Freki


Posts: 8
Joined: 7/17/2007
Status: offline 		The opinion of one was taken and several people decided that it warrented being turned into an issue of what was said.  and you just continued this.  You first opened up this thread to this when you said "why is this?"  if you didn't want that mentioned you should have said so.  that way we wouldn't make you think the thread is being taken over by this.

in my post I also offered up another thought as to why it does not happen much.  I won't repeat what is said but just because ot has been said before doesn't mean it isn't relevant.

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/4/2007 11:47:08 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4212
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline 		Greetings Freki,

I did notice your comment on community standards.  Half of what I suggested, is in fact a legal profession. 

I'm not bothered by people saying "I think STDs are a factor."  Certainly they are.  They are not, however, even close to the root cause.  I'm holding my thoughts on that, because I'd like to see what others say, and not make this thread about "Why Stephan thinks ......."

Stephan


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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 12:45:54 AM   
Totalmaster4you


Posts: 1359
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		Tal to the Free and the owned
Tal Stephann
To try to continue your thread I had this thought, that when people play in public no sex is allowed. When I belonged to a private group (not Gorean) when we played sex was permited with consent of the owner. Frequently slaves were exchanged either for the evening or several hours and I never saw any monies change hands. Stephann, I believe it's the external legal issues that disuade Masters from this endeavor. However that "Master" who was arrested in Florida certainly didn't have any difficulties with this concept but it's his arrests that affects the rest of our thinking. I wish you well.
TM4Y

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 1:08:40 AM   
KiandPhoenix


Posts: 205
Joined: 8/1/2007
Status: offline 		Doubble posted somehow

< Message edited by KiandPhoenix -- 8/5/2007 1:12:13 AM >

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 1:10:52 AM   
KiandPhoenix


Posts: 205
Joined: 8/1/2007
Status: offline 		I would just like to note that I live in the strip club culture. My sub is a dancer, my cousin works at her club. That being said in 49 states Strippers are not prostitutes in 90% of the clubs. My sub has worked in several states in a TON of clubs, and most of them have strict policies about prostitution. They will randomly follow every girl home, and if you are caught with a customer (even in your off time) you are fired, and in some cases black listed for a hundred miles.

While most clubs are tolerent of any other illigal activity you may choose to engage in, and wont call the cops, prostitution is not acceptiable.

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 1:27:50 AM   
Cadogan


Posts: 3
Status: offline 		My car isn't a cab. I may lend it to my brother.
 
C

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 2:17:49 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4212
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline 		I suppose I should point out, I'm not necessarily addressing the legality (or lack thereof) regarding prostitution.  It isn't illegal everywhere. 

I listed strip clubs, simply because it's the closest thing to the coin girl concept that is legal, in most of the United States.  I think some of the knee jerk responses so far, illustrate just what the word 'slut' seems to men, in regards to a slave.

Stephan


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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 5:03:51 AM   
VadFarkas


Posts: 923
Joined: 6/7/2007
Status: offline 		Cadogan,
I like your saying.
After allowing my wife to dance all night with other men and asked if that made me jealousy, I always said "She is like my Harley, you guys can kick start her, but I ride her home."

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 6:55:53 AM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7329
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		Greetings Stephan,

It will depend upon the feelings the owner has for his property. If he views her as just another end table, easily replaced, and only useful in a very narrow scope, then they often indeed have their girls do these sorts of things. Over a year ago, after being exposed to Gor, I had the unfortunate opportunity to be exposed to a Gorean Man that has two slaves. Both worked at strip clubs, but they each had a different set of rules. One he had gotten pregnant a couple of years previously, and she was limited to stripping and that was it. The other was not limited at all, and was also an escort, and amatuer adult movie performer. When they returned to his house from work, they were expected to have a certain amount of money.

I have also seen these in non-Gorean M/s situations as well, but as stated it is not very accepted. I see stripping as what would be the closest, most common line of work to that of a coin girl. I found that to be more prevelant in alot of the non-Gorean M/s relationships I had heard of.

As to the comment about 90% not prostitues in strip clubs, it will depend upon the area, the club and the girls working there. With the introduction of VIP rooms into many strip clubs, it allows for situation where a girl can be wore down, more easily drugged, or attract those that already do. I guess working in the business as a barback, and then floor manager for a couple of years, when I was younger, gave me a good perspective of what was, and having friends in the business now, what is.

Orion

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 7:00:41 AM   
Leonidas


Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline
quote:

While I hope this topic isn't taken too seriously, I think it does illustrate a profound difference between the type of slavery a kajira may encounter, and the type of slavery a typical D/s submissive or slave may expect. 

 
I think, anyway, that I understand the nature of your question.  People are getting wrapped around the axel here about there being sex involved.  God bless 'em, those puritan roots show through no matter how hard you try to dye them.

I whore my girl out, and she turns a pretty penny for me.  She just happens to do it as a "business analyst" rather than by sucking dick.  Now, before she gets her feelings hurt, I'll say that she's at least as good at sucking dick as she is doing analysis, but that's neither here nor there.  The principal is just the same though.  Men pay me for her talents and skill.  She is in that way an asset, assuming, of course, the cost of keeping her deducted from what she earns for me shows a profit.  She is an asset in many other ways, so the full measure of her worth to me can't be easily talleyed on a balance sheet.

Edana doesn't work as a coin girl, because that's not the business I'm in, no more, no less.  She does work related to my field, which is handy, because I can coach and mentor her, which, of course, bodes well for the profitability of keeping her.  Edana is property.

Unless I'm mistaken that is what you are getting at.  In the D/s community at large "slavery" is more or less a variant on a romantic relationship.  Gorean girls are considered to be property in every sense of the word.  They are in their master's houses to serve, and be an asset to the master and the household.  If their master is fond of them, it's probably because they do it well.

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RE: Strippers, Prostitutes, and Coin Girls. - 8/5/2007 7:22:07 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 37373
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Tal Leonidas,

This is interesting in ramifications to me, and I have mused on this as of late for personal reasons. 

Assuming nearly full agreement per usual, it then says that a Master's contol of his property could conceivably (*nb that word in this context) be put to less than  efficient use, ie, assume Master is  a bricklayer, and uses his  slave to hod; now, slave may be a brain surgeon, but Master knows and controls his domain in bricks.  Therefore, the slave while for all intents and purposes is a screwdriver, the slave is used as a plier. Now, a more 'generalist' owner would certainly be able to take advantage of the brain surgeon without harm to his wellbeing (as anyone I think would find this more pleasing in situ).   I know I use extreme example here, but the ephameral thought is somewhat cogent, I believe.

Ron

edited because I can't spell for shit (not that the spelling is now flawless)



< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/5/2007 7:25:38 AM >

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