quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian
Well the goal is clear. How do I arrive at the goal is my quandry.

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
why would I worry about that tripe?

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

You fuckin' people have to stop right here, you drive me nuts.  I try and not go off, but I have to.  I am jumping the post before here mostly, but you people are fucking around here and what 'IS good for JODI better be what the fuck is good for you'  you can't prance around here like a couple of goddam fags and fuckin hold an Althing about this shit.

IFF (meaning if and only if (mathematically)) I am the responsible party, the director, the captain of the ship, the necromancer, the god,  the end all to be all, then by god what is good for me, is also good for my household........why would I worry about that tripe? If she wants the fuckin house painted pink, she should wait upon her desires to slut for a pink house painter.  As for me and my house, we will have a grey one, all will be fed, get a little drink, some loving and some hard times, but THOSE WOMEN just like my cars and tractors and kith and kin and kind and kine (cows) will get what they need to survive and me flourish, and by god when it comes to the same thing, it is beautiful for all concerned, but if I do well, will those in my sphere of influence eat rocks?

Get a sack by deciet,
grow a sack,
buy a sack,
but for christ's sake get it by any means you can.

This discussion you are having makes me feel gay, and I will not ever feel comfortable with it.

I (*NB) am a man.

Hup, Ron, whatever

quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian
I'd like it of someone can refer me to an actual quote that talks about a homestone being in an actual dwelling, because I don't remember it.

quote:

They may, of course, somewhat simply, be thought of as symbolizing various things, and perhaps different things to different people. They can stand, for example, for a city, and, indeed, are sometimes identified with the city. They, have some affinity, too, surely, with territoriality and community. Even a remote hut, far from the paved avenues of a town or city, may have a Home Stone, and therein, in the place of his Home Stone, is the meanest beggar or the poorest peasant a Ubar. The Home Stone says this place is mine, this is my home. I am here.~pg485Magicians

quote:

It is the Home Stone which, for the Gorean, marks the center. I think it is because of their Home Stones that the Gorean tends to think of territory as something from the inside out, so to speak, rather than from the outside in.
Consider again the analogy of the circle. For the Gorean it is the Home Stone which, so to speak, determines the circle. There can be a point without a circle; but there can be no circle without its central point.~pg144FightingSlave

quote:

The community of those who had been Waniyanpi, of course, was not identified with a particular area of land, and certainly not with a territory occupied under the conditions of a leased tenancy. It now, in the Gorean fashion, for the first time, tended to be identified with a Home Stone. The community could now, if it wished, the Home Stone moving, even migrate to new lands. In Gorean law allegiances to a Home Stone, and not physical structures and locations, tend to define communities.~pg473BloodBrothers

quote:

Whereas I was of high caste and he was of low, yet in his own hut he would be, by the laws of Gor, a prince and sovereign, for then he would be in the place of his own Home Stone.~pg28Outlaw

quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian

I feel like I'm finally clear about what I want, and can stick to it.  I hope it's not too late.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Totalmaster4you

Tal to the Free and property
Greetings to shysecret, kimveri, barelyanangel and Obsidiansnamaste,
Would you let me know if you read all the prior posts, particularly Orion's first post as well as mine, before you posted  on this thread. I'd prefer you respond off thread as I don't wish to hijack this thread .(that's Bulls job anyway.lol)
 
akbarbarian; The only thing you got from my post was the homestone??? That more than anything else should tell you how much you have to learn and mature!!!
 
Moderator 6: Your post surprised me. Compared to what I have seen on Ask a Master this has been tame and mostly geared to helping. Is it the norm for such differing standards to be applied or is there a new overall standard now being used? Thaqnkyou in advance.
 
TM4Y

quote:

ORIGINAL: charlotte12

I don't usually post on the Gorean board as i feel that i have much less to offer than i have to learn but i thought it might be ok in this thread. I know you are probably wanting to hear more from men but one thing you said has stayed with me and i wanted to make a brief comment. Please don't let Jodi feel that her identity is being shattered if she is not accepted as kajira on this thread. Perhaps she is in fact kajira (i will not attempt to offer an opinion since i have limited knowledge) but i believe this must be something she begs because it is who she truly wants to be. Or perhaps she is not kajira in which case i would hope she does not feel that she is somehow lacking. From my very limited knowledge of this culture it seems to me that being Gorean is about embracing who one truly is which to the people here is Master or kajira. If Jodi does not find this fire burning within her than yes, she is probably not a Gorean slave but that does not make her less worthy, just perhaps to a Gorean man as property.

I will not offer other advice for your situation as i dont' wish to disrespect anyone by claiming extensive knowledge. I simply speak as a young girl who is also exploring and figuring things out. It sounds to me like you are both very confused and need some time to figure things out before you try to own or be owned.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian

I feel like I'm finally clear about what I want, and can stick to it.  I hope it's not too late.

I sent you an olive branch by PM if you're interested.

But in any case, as various experienced Goreans here have said, if your goal is to be Gorean, you will need to spend a lot of time working on yourself, and you should not attempt to bring anyone else (including Jodi; perhaps someone else could take care of her in the mean time, or perhaps she would like to learn more about herself with her sub in the mean time?) into that until you are done assimilating it all. Since some important aspects of the philos were not clear, it would probably be a good idea to read a lot of threads on this forum, as well as familiarizing yourself with a few older cultures in order to recognize how these aspects have been reflected in other cultures over the years. There seems to be a strong correlation between how well read the Goreans here are and how well they are able to articulate the foundations of their beliefs and understand how these fit in with human nature.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Karynn

Tal AK

I really think that there are a lot of issues popping up in the answers found following your initial post. I believe that because so many of us have such a vast background of experiences, you'd find a millieu of responses even if all of them were "right" they could be wrong for you. Does that make sense?

First of all, there is a sense of Goreans doing whatever they wish with their property because that's ownership, that's Gorean, and that's what slavery implies. However, within the realm of common sense and the law, some things a Gorean could do might also land him in jail. If a Gorean makes choices that exercise his fundamental right to action that contradicts the local laws, he still has the right to act but must understand he has consequences as well. There were just as many examples of legalism and consequences in the books as there are in our current reality.

Secondly, your initial probing ideals introduced several levels of reaction at the same time because you spoke of activities many consider sexual deviance and/or kink along with slave "rights". It's tough to separate what was said about the former from what has been consequentially discussed in the latter since your post. There are few who live in a Gorean lifestyle that would support any reference to slave rights. The very definition of an M/s relationship in Gor precludes that slaves do not have rights so discussing them with said slave nullifies the conversation because it isn't a Gorean conversation.

If you want to then focus on the kinks you mentioned regarding whippings and goldenshowers or scat, and you want to relate that to Gor, that's something again in the realm of owning Gorean property and your will and whim to do what you want with your girl and though some might find any or all of what you mentioned extreme, it is your home and your business. If you beat a woman beyond black and blue, and it is against her will, and she chooses to tell someone locally, I can be almost certain there are legal rammifications. If you are coupled to a female who is an extreme masochist and finds pleasure in black and blue type beatings, has in some form consented to such along the way then you do not need our permission as a community to continue to enjoy your girl in ways that please you.

Many have asserted that a general stereotype presented by Norman in the series implied that Goreans were not generally sadistic with their property but cared for his girl as he might care for his Tarn or his sword. Property treated well tends to last longer, perform better and ultimately offer greater pleasure. A Tarn that never escaped the tarncot would eventually lose its ability to fly. Would a Gorean think that's wise use of property? I think not. Personal opinion regarding the extremes in the Gorean novels and the extremes in reality are truly that. Personal opinion.

I do believe that Gorean men hold one another accountable. Community stands as a whole unit so that at times, if someone in a group strays, the other men involved in the same group might collaborate in such a way to encourage a Gorean brother to return to the best process and practice of life. I don't believe that every Gorean man would give every Gorean in his community the same respect. Even in our community, some here have earned more respect than others. Some have known one another for weeks while others have known one another for years. I believe strongly in accountability as a Gorean theme presented in the books and one that extends to our reality. Regardless of city or Wagon camp, Tribesman or Tarnsman, once a Gorean had crossed the will of the community beyond the realm of acceptible behavior, the Gorean was banished. There were various names assigned this act of accountable consequences depending on location and book you read, but it is a very present ideal and something very worthy of our recognition in our current day and time.

Mentorship has its merit in both Gorean M/s and in mainstream BDSM--M/s. Men really can help other men through tough experiences. There is comradery in shared difficulties. There is sincerity in honest thought. And there are advantages for the entire community, men, free women, slaves and children, when the men create an environment that is basically sound and health and focused.

I know that Gorean men do not care much for strangers. I know they do not care much for idiots. I know that they do not care for others telling them what to do or how to live. I do know though that in a community, the very existence of the community can help you figure out the answers to all that you shared, and all that you may face as you step forward in your life and understanding of Gor or not Gor, M/s or lifestyles otherwise.

I wish you well in that journey,
Karyn