Do you believe in non-consensual slavery?

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Do you believe in non-consensual slavery?

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All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Gorean Lifestyles >> Do you believe in non-consensual slavery?

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[Poll]

Do you believe in non-consensual slavery?

Yes...

21% (63)

Hell Yes...

17% (50)

No...

15% (45)

Hell No...

32% (94)

Depends on the wench...

12% (37)

Total Votes : 289

(last vote on : 3/8/2012 9:13:55 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )

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Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 2:59:19 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

Tal and Greetings Gorean,

This is a post focused on the Goreans here, you may comment if you aren't but you will be judged accordingly.

I'm not a nut about always going on about slavery, but I'm curious about you folk.

If you are aware of why I am asking this question, reserve the reason to yourself. Ok, on to the question.

Do you believe in unconsensual slavery? Why?

If you took the time to vote, give a short reason.

Live well,

Bull

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

Post #: 1

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:37:28 PM

BeingChewsie

Posts: 1633
Joined: 10/27/2005
Status: offline

Since I voted "Hell yes"..I'll leave a short reply :).

Consensual slavery is an oxymoron, non-consensual slavery is redundant.

I always understood it to mean the person consented to enter a process that would render them a slave, therefore making ongoing consent entirely moot. I believe it has come to mean "ongoing voluntary submission" completely and utterly controlled by and at the whim of the "consensual slave".

As always YMMV. Thanks for the poll Bull.

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 2

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:40:08 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

excellent wench......

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

Post #: 3

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:41:24 PM

HisCompletely

Posts: 53
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline

slavery is a choice, to me it is a human right as voting is, even though the law sees it differently. I think If the slave gives that right away knowingly, it is valid among the two involved. The legalities are something that I would not think about, i would think about what I decide to do.

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

Post #: 4

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:43:21 PM

HisCompletely

Posts: 53
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline

I believe that as long as you are consenting to something that is your decision and does not harm anyone else, it is valid.

(in reply to HisCompletely)

Post #: 5

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:43:51 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

I'm glad you explained your position girl. It may well be valid. I'm not of the mind to say just yet.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to HisCompletely)

Post #: 6

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:46:56 PM

BlackKnight

Posts: 767
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Hell Yeah!
I've always had a problem with this, I love the endeerment it symbolizes(con.slavery) but it isn't true slavery.
It's just the degree of the submission.
I like the idea of having something over someone that binds them.

_____________________________

'Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.'
Life of Reason, Reason in Common Sense, Scribner's, 1905, page 284"
George Santayana

Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get me!

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 7

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:48:23 PM

HisCompletely

Posts: 53
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline

Now I hear the words "non consensual" NO!!!! Consensual, yes!!! I don't believe in anything that is non consensual.

(in reply to BlackKnight)

Post #: 8

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:56:32 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

just keep watching the posts girl, you'll get it soon enough.....

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to HisCompletely)

Post #: 9

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:57:51 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 8563
Joined: 1/12/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

Tal and Greetings Gorean,

This is a post focused on the Goreans here, you may comment if you aren't but you will be judged accordingly.

I'm not a nut about always going on about slavery, but I'm curious about you folk.

If you are aware of why I am asking this question, reserve the reason to yourself. Ok, on to the question.

Do you believe in unconsensual slavery? Why?

If you took the time to vote, give a short reason.

Live well,

Bull

Greetings Master Bull,

Like, beingchewsie, I also voted 'hell yes' but for different reasons. Being a slave was something I had to discover about myself so it wasn't a choice but rather the result of a journey. I did not consent to being a woman as I was born this way and I feel the same way about being a slave. There are much easier walks to take and given a 'choice' in the matter, I don't believe I would choose this particular path. What I did and do choose is to accept myself and what I am. I find it interesting that Master saw a slave at his feet long before I was able to accept the truth of it.

Celeste

_____________________________

۩ "The mind, once expanded to the dimensions of larger ideas, never returns to its original size." ۩
~Oliver Wendell Holmes~

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 10

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 3:59:58 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

very good girl..............

Hey where the hell are the responses of the free men.....come on fellas, it's only a question...

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Post #: 11

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 4:03:29 PM

ameenah

Posts: 164
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

Greetings to the Free,
greetings girls,

ameenah believes it is the Man's will that makes and keeps the slave. An enslaved girl is well... enslaved. If she could, in her mind, truly choose whether to continue or discontinue consent... she is not a slave at all.

Respectfully,
~ameenah{Orion}

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 12

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 4:41:19 PM

Aswad

Posts: 6908
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

Hey where the hell are the responses of the free men.....come on fellas, it's only a question...

It's a question that merits a well crafted answer, Bull. I voted "depends", and I've got an outline for an answer.
Letting that outline ferment overnight will give a more full-bodied flavour to the answer, though.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 13

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 4:49:39 PM

AdiraSpice

Posts: 38
Status: offline

'Lo

I find non consentual slavery Depends upon the Master's Mastery.

If one can actually keep my on my knees for I can not hold myself there

Be Well

_____________________________

Adira

"I ain't settlin', nooooo, tired of shootin' too low,gonna raise the bar high"....

"Girl, don't forget what your knees are for"
Sugarland

(in reply to Aswad)

Post #: 14

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 5:09:09 PM

Rule

Posts: 8016
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline

It is a simple question. It requires a complex answer. I therefore have questions myself.

Non-consensual slavery of what?

So let's assume the prey is a free woman who is not a natural slave or submissive. Evil will not hesitate to take her. Good may take her if it is in her best interest or if it is in the best interest of the house or community.

I am more inclined to the 'Hell no', but have a slight hesitation towards the 'Depends on the wench'. I recall again saint Patrick's vehement opposition against slavery (in his time mostly of the non-consensual variety).

Also: Evolution theory requires sexual selection - i.e. free choice between males - by the females of the species for the evolution of the species to occur at the highest velocity. Slaves have no such choice, so it is to be expected that a slavery-solely population will become extinct.

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 15

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 5:20:36 PM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
Status: offline

Depends on the wench.

I look at it as a straight value proposition. Being a moderately greedy and possessive sort, I want my property to be worth something; I want it to be valuable. Regarding slaves, the question becomes what mode of slavery, what dynamic, allows her to thrive and be valuable to me.

_____________________________

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 16

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 5:23:24 PM

patwi

Posts: 296
Joined: 6/24/2007
Status: offline

Greetings.

    Though I am neither Goren, slave or even submissive, I will toss in an answer here. I do hope it's alright with Bull if I do so.

    I also think non-consensual slavery is an oxymoron. Isn't that the definition of slave? Owned by another and possesed of no rights? In my eyes, a slave loses her rights to consent to anything the moment she becomes owned. I suppose then, she had better be wise in who she begs a collar of...

    The idea of a consensual slave just seems like a submissive who enjoys playing at being a slave, but needs the feeling of a safety net.

    Again - I may not even be qualified to answer this as I am neither slave, Gorean or submissive!

   Now - if you Bull refer to non-consensual slavery as in the enslavement of a race (such as Africans) or the brutally enforced slavery of women and children in places such as Thailand then - I would certainly say it's something I am strictly opposed to. But, it does exist.

    I can condone the slavery I spoke about in the first paragraphs, when a woman (or man I suppose) simply *is* a slave in the core of her being. SHe wishes it, she chooses it, she aches for the collar. Does she consent to what she is born as? There's nothing to conesent to it seems, she simply *is*. However, the more ugly form of slavery which destroys lives rather than fulfills them well, I can't imagine any decent person who might condone that.

(in reply to Rule)

Post #: 17

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 5:27:22 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

It is a simple question. It requires a complex answer. I therefore have questions myself.

Non-consensual slavery of what?

women of course...

quote:

So let's assume the prey is a free woman who is not a natural slave or submissive. Evil will not hesitate to take her. Good may take her if it is in her best interest or if it is in the best interest of the house or community.

Do remember a Gorean asked this on a Gorean board, while I respect your opinion as a man, I am Gorean.

quote:

I am more inclined to the 'Hell no', but have a slight hesitation towards the 'Depends on the wench'. I recall again saint Patrick's vehement opposition against slavery (in his time mostly of the non-consensual variety).

Also: Evolution theory requires sexual selection - i.e. free choice between males - by the females of the species for the evolution of the species to occur at the highest velocity. Slaves have no such choice, so it is to be expected that a slavery-solely population will become extinct.

I don't use slaves for population of the next generation of free. You have a sympathy factor in your make-up don't you Rule? Saint Patrick has little to do with my thought process outside of a reason to wear green and consume green beer. So his plight as far as slavery is your issue to face.

I do see however that the beast is within you, you have that fore that would conquest some beautiful unwilling suspect. Good for you, nature does beat within your heart.

Bull

P.S. Most likely tomorrow I'll voice my view on the matter, at some point anyway.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to Rule)

Post #: 18

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 5:43:36 PM

xBullx

Posts: 3962
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

Hello Patwi,

I'm just going to interject a comment, a question or two. Thanks for your participation.

quote:

ORIGINAL: patwi

Greetings.

Though I am neither Goren, slave or even submissive, I will toss in an answer here. I do hope it's alright with Bull if I do so.

Perfectly fine, in fact I was hoping you'd drop by, you have a lovely throat. (winks)

quote:

I also think non-consensual slavery is an oxymoron. Isn't that the definition of slave? Owned by another and possesed of no rights? In my eyes, a slave loses her rights to consent to anything the moment she becomes owned. I suppose then, she had better be wise in who she begs a collar of...

I used the term non-consensual in contrast of that all to present form of "slavery" that is known by the majority of lifestyles within these message boards.

Wise assuming she had a choice. But wouldn't it make your heart race to see a powerful man take you and thrust his will upon you. Oh, and do try to avoid taking that in a sexual connotation. I'm not taling about rape. Imagine a man that values your qualities as a woman and insist you maintain yourself in those parameters. (winks again)

quote:

The idea of a consensual slave just seems like a submissive who enjoys playing at being a slave, but needs the feeling of a safety net.

Again - I may not even be qualified to answer this as I am neither slave, Gorean or submissive!

Oh, I think you did that rather well.

quote:

Now - if you Bull refer to non-consensual slavery as in the enslavement of a race (such as Africans) or the brutally enforced slavery of women and children in places such as Thailand then - I would certainly say it's something I am strictly opposed to. But, it does exist.

Slavery is slavery, it may or may not be productive. It may or may not be right, but according to who?
What reason do you have for your objections? You are correct in the existance of slavery, but why is it wrong?

Fairly soon it should be obvious why I asked this question of the Goreans, but they seem................shy on this topic.

quote:

I can condone the slavery I spoke about in the first paragraphs, when a woman (or man I suppose) simply *is* a slave in the core of her being. SHe wishes it, she chooses it, she aches for the collar. Does she consent to what she is born as? There's nothing to conesent to it seems, she simply *is*. However, the more ugly form of slavery which destroys lives rather than fulfills them well, I can't imagine any decent person who might condone that.

I to am not fond of anything destructive.

Live well,

Bull

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull

I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to patwi)

Post #: 19

RE: Do you believe in non-consensual slavery? - 10/5/2007 5:54:28 PM

patwi

Posts: 296
Joined: 6/24/2007
Status: offline

Greetings again, Bull

Fist let me say, you just made me blush a teeny bit, thank you for the compliment. *grins* I may have assumed the girl has a choice in begging a collar - this itself does seem like a silly assumption after you put it that way. I admit, I enjoy strong alpha males myself.

I don't think slavery in general is wrong where it relates to natural slaves. However destructive slavery as you put it, I do think is wrong. Why? Well let me ask you - what use would a slave be who is miserable? I personally can't agree with the enslavement of those who don't have the natural inclination to be slaves. The kidnapping of female children to sell into slave markets, for example, is heinous. I myself would hate to be forced into doing something I didn't want to do in the first place.

Patwi.

(in reply to xBullx)

Post #: 20

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