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ORIGINAL: Cherylmazana

Ahh but the planet of Gor and its associated culture do not exist any more than Plato’s cave, it is just a way to show the underlying principles, in an extreme format. In Imaginative sex he is talking reality, in the Gor series fantasy, Norman sees the difference between the two, he does not confuse one for the other.

Norman has said many times that the books are not supposed to be lived, that they are not a blueprint for living. However many people will see them in various ways, and its easy to ignore someone if you don’t like what they are saying even if it is the author of the books.

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This I feel is why there can never be consensus about Gor.

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Orion your choices are your own, I have never told anyone how to live their life, I have enough problems living my own and I also cannot say what makes a true man, personally I believe being born a man is a good start.

Cheryl

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So are you a Normanite or a Gorean?

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ORIGINAL: Cherylmazana

Ahh now we have a whole different ball game, is fantasy reality if you believe it strong enough?

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ORIGINAL: Cherylmazana

Ahh now we have a whole different ball game, is fantasy reality if you believe it strong enough? Are the would be Masters and kajira living vicariously in the chat rooms “real” while they live their “real lives” ignoring their very real wives and husbands doing the 9-5 in a dream just waiting to get home to live their fantasy on-line Gorean reality because they believe they are in their minds. Or is that a subject for another discussion?

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I say I am a Gorean free woman, however I do not have a closed mind to the words John Norman has said in other places that can illuminate the novels. In the same way I read other philosophers and see where their beliefs and ideas have influenced these novels as well. Nothing exists in a vacuum after all.

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As for being defensive, I believe you first mentioned “true man” I don’t think I have ever used that expression myself, I picked up on it that is all as it seemed unusual to have such a strange buzz word suddenly appear for no reason. A man is simply a man, unless he chooses to have his cock removed and hormone therapy to turn him into a woman but again that is another discussion and not one suited to this forum.

Cheryl

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ORIGINAL: Cherylmazana

If the first attempt does not work then try again.

"If man's natural role is that of hunter and captor and woman's is that of game and captive, our instinctual sexual fantasies would be precisely what they are. We are, of course, or should be, far from the jungle. Rape, real rape, even if we are naturally inclined to do it, is not to be done. Our rights to self-expression end where the other person's feelings begin. Civilization, as Freud recognized, requires restraint. All things considered, civilization is better than the jungle, and it is a fragile and delicate set of relationships. We have lost it many times, and we must try not to do so again.

In short, a true man, one with normal aggressions and fully operating glands, presumably desires to rape, but also, having a hard-won manhood, does not in fact rape. This is not particularly because he does not wish to agitate the precinct detectives, but rather because, when the chips are down, if he really had the choice, he would not want to hurt or intimidate a woman. He might desire to do so, but, on the genuine level of humanity, he just would refuse to do so. It is not a humanly good or worthy thing to do. From a woman's point of view a man who wishes to rape her but does not, because he gives her her due as a human being, is probably more interesting to her as a male than either one who does not wish to rape her, who does not find her worth the fantasy, or one who catches her by accident in a dark alley and does in fact penetrate her, ejaculate and dash off. The first man excites her; the second two, in their different ways, are bores."

John Norman Imaginative Sex, pp 53-4