RE: FW Dialogue (Full Version)

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amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 7:06:43 AM)

Here is some information about a voter's resource I've found to surprisingly enlightening.  http://www.neighborhoodamerica.com/connect2elect.html

You can utilize this resource by establishing a profile at http://www.connect2elect.com/ .  Don't forget to check out the resources section.
 
My reasons for not favoring Clinton in this election are multiple.  One of them, however, is extremely selfish.  I believe that four years of her are likely to set women back at least 50 years in US politics - not something I want to see, when I consider my progeny and their future off-spring.  Another is her aliegence to that Evil Empire known as the Insurance Industry.
 
I've managed to eliminate some candidates from both of the mainline parties, based on record and standing on key issues, moving them to the "I'll write in for Minnie Mouse first" column.  I've also eliminated any that I believe I could do a better job than.
 
Regards-
Grace



Sylverdawn -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 8:08:43 AM)

Funniest thing  Ihave heard in a while:
 
The cop pulled her over, walked up to the car, and with that classic
patronizing smirk we all know and love, asked, 'What's your hurry?'

To which she replied, 'I'm late for work.'

'Oh yeah,' said the cop, 'what do you do?'

'I'm a rectum stretcher,' she responded.

The cop stammered, 'A what? A rectum stretcher? And just what does a
rectum stretcher do?' 'Well,' she said, 'I start by inserting one
finger, then work my way up to two fingers, then three, then four,
then with my whole hand in. I work from side to side until I can get both
hands in, and then I slowly but surely stretch, until it's about 6
feet wide.'
'And just what the hell do you do with a 6 foot a**hole?' he asked.

'You give him a radar gun and park him behind a bridge...'
Traffic Ticket $95.00
Court Costs $45.00
The Look on Cop's Face PRICELESS

Thank You,



Sylverdawn -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 8:11:46 AM)

and on the other side of the coin here are two sidtes you might find equally enlightening
 
Center For Public Integrity: http://www.publicintegrity.org/default.aspx
Fund For Independence in Journalism: http://www.tfij.org/

the lastest study there is interesting




amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 9:31:10 AM)

Thanks for the links, SD. 
 
Here is another one that I've found useful.  Frankly, considering the source, I've been amazed at how non-partisan it is, and have much effort is put forth to be accurate.
 
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/
 
Regards-
Grace



Maahsatti -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 11:17:00 AM)

Greetings,

  Well, I was going to give a bit of that honesty, you claim to admire so much, but I feel when most people say they admire Gorean honesty and bluntness, they mean they like it only if it doesnt become too murky or real. I have decided to refrain from posting my *honest* opinion, so if you like, feel free to message me if you want to hear the unbridled truth from (my) perspective.

Maahsatti



ElizabethAnne -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 2:01:45 PM)

Hello Grace,

I have a little time, and I wanted to respond.   My vote will go for John McClain, I have admired him for several years, and I like what he says, pluse he is not extreme right - like Mitt Romney, no way do I want someone THAT conservative in the White House.  Honestly that man scares me.  

As far as HC, whew, no way and no frigging way do I want her.    I recall vividly she was given total automony for the health care system when hubby was president, she couldn't fix that....why in the world do people think she can do it now?   And hell that was HER only thing then, as President, she would well...the thought of her as Commander in Chief...  If I think Romney is scary, the thought of HC is horrifying.   Her latest stunt of "crying", pffft....gimme a break.  Good grief.

Even in Detroit as Romney PROMISED to get the auto jobs back - for votes; McClain said the auto as Detroit knew it is gone, it's time for high tech industry, to retrain.   AND saying this did not win him votes there - BUT only made me more resovled to vote for a man that does not say anything to anyone just for votes.

Good topic.  You know Ladies, we keep this up, and the men will be over here!

Take care,

Liz



Terrah -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 4:28:26 PM)

Tal Everyone,

Well sadly to say the mare lost her baby, it was born too soon, the lungs were not developed enough and though he was living when born, he never took a breath. The mare, her name is Red, she is doing ok, I just got another update from the vet moments ago, and the problems she was having with the placenta passing he helped her out a bit and took it from her. I know that sounds gross, but in a way it's a very good thing, once the placenta passed she walked around for a bit much better than she has in the past 10 days.

The vet seems to think now she is going to be ok, he said the placenta was in a very bad spot near her belly and was stuck there for some reason, it doesn't mean she can never have a baby again, but since she was so ill and just wasn't getting better things happen for a reason. I would choose her over the baby any day. Here's hoping she makes it through the night just fine and tomorrow Jack will go and see her again and give me another update as the vet is out for the day.

Thank you all again for your concerns and best wishes. I am ok a little sad for her, ok a lot sad for her and for myself as I had hoped after all this she was going to be ok and carry to term, but I never really expected it either. Hopefully this will be her last hurdle in her road to recovery, she should be home by the weekend if all goes well enough for her, just one more thing to ask, pray she doesn't get flounder now, if she does, she will die, if in the next couple days she doesn't, she should pull through.

I wish you all well..

Terrah

PS I'll comment on the Pres later..



amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 5:02:17 PM)

Terrah -
 
Huge hugs to both you and Red.  Life surely isn't always fun.
 
Best-
Grace



ygraine -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 5:07:34 PM)

Terrah,
I am sorry to hear of your mare's continuing struggles.  Please keep us updated on her health now that the baby was born.
Y



Maahsatti -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 7:06:58 PM)

Terrah,

My sympothies go out to you and the mare.

Babs



amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/23/2008 7:37:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ElizabethAnne

Hello Grace,

I have a little time, and I wanted to respond.   My vote will go for John McClain, I have admired him for several years, and I like what he says, pluse he is not extreme right - like Mitt Romney, no way do I want someone THAT conservative in the White House.  Honestly that man scares me.  

As far as HC, whew, no way and no frigging way do I want her.    I recall vividly she was given total automony for the health care system when hubby was president, she couldn't fix that....why in the world do people think she can do it now?   And hell that was HER only thing then, as President, she would well...the thought of her as Commander in Chief...  If I think Romney is scary, the thought of HC is horrifying.   Her latest stunt of "crying", pffft....gimme a break.  Good grief.

Even in Detroit as Romney PROMISED to get the auto jobs back - for votes; McClain said the auto as Detroit knew it is gone, it's time for high tech industry, to retrain.   AND saying this did not win him votes there - BUT only made me more resovled to vote for a man that does not say anything to anyone just for votes.

Good topic.  You know Ladies, we keep this up, and the men will be over here!

Take care,

Liz


Below (wayyyyyyyyy down there, LOL) you will find links to the official websites for a large number of the candidates.  For some of the candidates, my personal comments have been written in, above these links.  So far, I find myself faced with the reality that none of the candidates truly comes close to what I believe, when the following issues are evaluated:
 
War in Iraq
Foreign policy in general
Trade policy
Patriot Act
Civil Liberties in general
Degree of strictness in Constitutional interpretation
Gun control
Social Security
Health Care
Importation of pharmeceuticals
Stem cell research
Abortion
Balanced Budget
Same sex marriage
Legalization of marijuanna
School vouchers
Illegal immigration
Legal immigration
Taxation in general
Income tax reform
Campaign finance reform
Death penalty for federal crimes
Domestic oil drilling
Developement of alternative energy sources
Environmental issues
 
With the list above, about the best I can get is roughly 1/3 agreement with any single candidate.  A few candidates, on both sides of party isle manage 1/3 agreement with me.  The rub comes with which roughly 33%. 
 
I am now in the process of develdopeing three sets of priorities and possitions, related to the issues listed above.  They will be ranked in order of preference, as a whole package.  From there, I'll see if I can manage to get agreement of better than 60% with a candidate, on my top 10 priorities, in at least one of my three lists.  If I can, that's the person who'll get my vote.  I'm not holding my breath.  
 
If unable to reach that benchmark....well...not sure what I'm going to do, exactly, but I will make the best and  most educated choice possible, given my personal beliefs and the available choices.  I can respect any citizen who makes the effort to vote intelligently, and true to their belief system.  What I can't abide is the refusal to vote, or making no effort to thoughtfully vote in the way you believe best for our nation (obviously speaking to US citizens here).  My personal belief is that every nation on earth would be better off in the long run, if it's citizens who have the right to vote would do the same.



Candidate Biden's Website
Learn more about candidate Joe Biden.
http://www.joebiden.com/

Candidate Brownback's Website
Learn more about candidate Sam Brownback.
http://www.brownback.com/

Candidate Clinton's Website
Learn more about candidate Hillary Clinton.
http://www.hillaryclinton.com/splash/
I personally find Clinton unacceptable on social issues, health care reform (due to her being so chummy with the insurance industry), and civil liberties (she has been a supporter of the PA).  There are other issues I have with her, but these are enough, in and of themselves, for me not to vote for her. Edited to add When taken in light of what I saw of her attitudes, words, and behavior during her husbands administration.  Chief issues there, imo, were her blatant disregard for subpeonas and legal procedure, as well as her obvious thirst for personal power.  My nightmare scenario is having to flip a coin between she and Giuliani.

Candidate Cox's Website
Learn more about candidate John Cox.
http://www.cox2008.com

Candidate Dodd's Website
Learn more about candidate Chris Dodd.
http://chrisdodd.com

Candidate Edwards' Website
Learn more about candidate John Edwards.
http://johnedwards.com/splash/
His views on education are problematic for me.  Supported the PA, another strike.  Mixed bag as far as social issues go, when compared to my own views.  He is pro alternative energy research, which is a plus.  He talks a decent game with regard to health care, but I'm not convinced he can do the job without breaking the bank, so to speak.  His voting record on balancing the budget seems better than average.  For some reason that I can not pinpoint, I do not trust him.  I've learned over the years to listent to that feeling when I have it.

Candidate Giuliani's Website
Learn more about candidate Rudy Giuliani.
http://www.joinrudy2008.com/
I sincerely fear that Giuliani would do in Iraq what Johnson did in Viet Nam.  He is supportive of the PA - a big stike against him, in my book.  With regard to social issues he and I are far apart.  I see little to encourage me in what little I've heard or seen in print regarding his foreign policy and trade views.  I find Rudy to be scary.

Candidate Gravel's Website
Learn more about candidate Mike Gravel.
http://www.gravel2008.us/
On social issues he presents a mixed bag for me.  He is, however, closer to me than the vast majority of candidates.  His open and consistent critisism of NAFTA is a plus,  IMO.  I like his views on social security.  I like his stance on vouchers, and disagree with his proposed approach to health care reform.  He is closer to my position on civil liberties than most of the candidates.

Candidate Huckabee's Website
Learn more about candidate Mike Huckabee.
http://www.mikehuckabee.com
His stance on how to deal with immigration crisis is problematic for me.  His views on Iraq are not endearing.  Mixed bag on social issues, disagrees with me on a LOT of issues.  He favors the flat tax, which I consider to be a plus.  Granting pardon to a killer who then went to another state and murdered a woman is a big minus.  While he and I share some of the same religious views, some of his statements regarding his views in light of his spiritual beliefs present a very large minus, IMO.

Candidate Hunter's Website
Learn more about candidate Duncan Hunter.
http://www.gohunter08.com/

Candidate Kucinich's Website
Learn more about candidate Dennis Kucinich.
http://www.dennis4president.com/
He has consistantly opposed the PA, and this I regard as a huge plus.  Opposed NAFTA, CAFTA, GATT, and isn't a fan of the WTO - another plus.  His voting record with regard to balancing budgets is superior to the vast majority of candidates running.  His environmental record seems sound.  On social issues, again a mixed bag, but closer to me than the majority.  He and I have some agreement, and some differences, on immigration issues.  We disagree on the subject of school vouchers, and on how to fix the health care system.

Candidate McCain's Website
Learn more about candidate John McCain.
http://www.johnmccain.com/
There was a time when I'd have voted McCain, any day of the week, and in any election.  That time has passed.  For most of his career he was what I thought of as an Independent minded Republican.  His obviously reluctant support of Bush for reasons of party politics was a bitter pill for me to swollow.  His views on social security I could live with.  His stance on civil liberties has begun to concern me.  I give him consistantly high marks for his efforts at campaign finance reform.  His views on immigration are ones I could live with.  There is a deep concern within me that he would do in Iraq what Johnson did in Viet Nam.  He appears to have a better grasp of foreign policy issues than most of the other candidates, and this is a plus.  Mixed bag on social issues, and health care issues.  The point where he appeals to me most  is that you know where you stand with him.  I can tolerate a leader I disagree on various issues far better if he is open, honest, and fairly consistant in his views.  I do not expect anyone to never change their mind; that is as bad as changing it as frequently as you hopfullydo your underwear.

Candidate Obama's Website
Learn more about candidate Barack Obama.
http://www.barackobama.com/

Candidate Paul's Website
Learn more about candidate Ron Paul.
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/
I give him high marks where civil liberties are concerned.  Likewise, on balanced budget concerns.  My views are mixed with regard to his stance on social security. 
He is in agreement with more often than not on social issues.  His views on immigration are problematic for me, and his environmental record appears weak.  I have concerns about his ability to establish raport in foreign policy situations, though his "mind our own business" outlook is distinctly refreshing. 


Candidate Richardson's Website
Learn more about candidate Bill Richardson.
http://www.richardsonforpresident.com/

Candidate Romney's Website
Learn more about candidate Mitt Romney.
http://www.mittromney.com/
The man scares me.  His views on social security are deeply troubling.  His views on civil liberties even more so.  Some of what he says with regard to health care is encouraging, while other points are just the opposite.  His current pandering to the NRA began too close to the election for me to see it as anything but a political manuever, especially in light of his past record on gun control.  His views on immigration are not, imo, completely realistic.  He seems a bit uncertain on environmental issues.  Overall, I get a strong, "I don't trust this man" feeling from him.

Candidate Tancredo's Website
Learn more about candidate Tom Tancredo.
http://www.teamtancredo.com/

Candidate Thompson's Website
Learn more about candidate Fred Thompson.
http://www.fred08.com/
His views on social security are tolerable, especially his support of "lock box".  I have conerns he would do in Iraq what Johnson did in Viet Nam.  He gets acceptable marks from me with regard to national dept and balanced budget issues.  His stance on Scooter Libby is a huge negative, imo.  Mixed bag on social issues.  He favors school vouchers, which I consider a plus.  He gets a thumb down from me on health care issues, and mixed reviews on the environment and immigration.

Candidates on the Issues
Learn more about the issues
http://www.ontheissues.org

Compare the Candidates
See how the candidates compare on the primary issues
http://selectsmart.com/president/2008/comparethem.html

Vote Smart
Learn more about the candidates at both state and federal levels
http://www.vote-smart.org/



Mitzie -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 4:06:46 AM)

Terrah

          I am so sorry to hear that you lost the foal poor thing,

I really hope the mare  comes through all this illness my thoughts are with you
  
                     Mitzie



Aswad -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 5:46:19 AM)

Edit: nm



OrionTheWolf -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 5:52:12 AM)

Greetings Grace,

You may want to research the "pardon" issue, since your comments shows inaccuracies in what actually occured. The State Parole Board paroled the individual, the most Huckabee did was write a letter in favor of the parole. Huckabee admits his mistake, which many politicians do not do. He did commute the sentences of several murderers, but again you need to read the specifics. I wasn't going to post in this thread, but I hate to see inaccuracies.

Live well,
Orion


quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

Candidate Huckabee's Website
Learn more about candidate Mike Huckabee.
http://www.mikehuckabee.com
His stance on how to deal with immigration crisis is problematic for me.  His views on Iraq are not endearing.  Mixed bag on social issues, disagrees with me on a LOT of issues.  He favors the flat tax, which I consider to be a plus.  Granting pardon to a killer who then went to another state and murdered a woman is a big minus.  While he and I share some of the same religious views, some of his statements regarding his views in light of his spiritual beliefs present a very large minus, IMO.



amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 6:50:08 AM)

Good morning, Orion -
 
I appreciate your post, and will look into it further.  Any links to other material you could suggest would be helpful, as I've run into more than one account of the situation. 
 
Politics often gives me a headache, simply by virtue that it involves people, who for me, tend to be extremely headache inducing.  I want one of those bumbper stickers that says, "The more I know people, the better I like my dog."
 
Regards-
Grace



OrionTheWolf -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 4:04:22 PM)

Greetings Grace,

It gives me one as well. Here are a few items:

" Wayne Dumond’s journey to freedom started when Bill Clinton’s liberal Democrat successor to Governorship of Arkansas, Jim Guy Tucker, commuted Dumond’s sentence from life plus twenty years to a total of 39 years. Thanks to Tucker this dangerous predator became eligible for parole in 1994 instead of being locked away from society forever. Huckabee inherited this issue when Guy Tucker was convicted of corruption associated with the Whitewater investigation and forced to resign. "

So this action made the guy eligible for parole.

" Huckabee was never shy about his intentions regarding Dumond, he leaned heavily to the side of seeing the man released. The parole board saw it this way, too. The reasons for this were because compelling evidence shed light on the possibility that Dumond was actually not guilty. Any good Governor or parole board would do their ethical best to err on the side justice. "

Even here in Georgia, Govenor's often will offer advice on parole's and base this off the convict's record while incarcerated, and the facts of the case.

Some of the situation:

"The case was politically charged in the state of Arkansas because the victim in the rape that sent Wayne Dumond to prison for life plus twenty years was Ashley Stevens, a teenaged cheerleader and cousin of Bill Clinton. "

"One of the most emotionally charged moments in this continuing saga was when Ashley Stevens went nearly nose to nose with Governor Huckabee and said, "This is how close I was to Wayne Dumond, and I will never forget his face, and you will never forget mine. He's the one that raped me." Oddly enough, according to NewsMax, she couldn’t remember the eye color of the man whose face she would “never forget”. When giving a description of Dumond she got this basic fact wrong along with a botched description of the vehicle he was driving.

There are other problems with this case that are on a genetic level, and when we say “genetic” we don’t mean the foggy memory that seems to kick in whenever somebody with Clinton DNA has to answer questions. We mean that the DNA from the crime scene didn’t match that of Wayne Dumond. "


Huckabee said afterwards that he was wrong, something many politicians do not do. When Govenor he operated as such, rather than take politically safe decisions for his future.

There are other problems I have with Huckabee, but this is not one of them, as he did his job in this situation, just as many Govenors have, and should do.

http://www.therant.us/staff/cherry/2007/12072007.htm

http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2007/12/05/abc-misleadingly-claims-huckabee-pardoned-rapist


Those are two but I recommend to do your own research.

Live well,
Orion


quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

Good morning, Orion -
 
I appreciate your post, and will look into it further.  Any links to other material you could suggest would be helpful, as I've run into more than one account of the situation. 
 
Politics often gives me a headache, simply by virtue that it involves people, who for me, tend to be extremely headache inducing.  I want one of those bumbper stickers that says, "The more I know people, the better I like my dog."
 
Regards-
Grace



Musicmystery -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 5:39:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

Good morning, Orion -
 
I appreciate your post, and will look into it further.  Any links to other material you could suggest would be helpful, as I've run into more than one account of the situation. 
 
Politics often gives me a headache, simply by virtue that it involves people, who for me, tend to be extremely headache inducing.  I want one of those bumbper stickers that says, "The more I know people, the better I like my dog."
 
Regards-
Grace


Grace,

You are, of course, making it harder than it is, as some of these people are no longer running!

Richardson, Thompson, Kucinich (and I think Gravel?) have all dropped.

Happy Picking.

Tim



amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 7:29:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

Good morning, Orion -
 
I appreciate your post, and will look into it further.  Any links to other material you could suggest would be helpful, as I've run into more than one account of the situation. 
 
Politics often gives me a headache, simply by virtue that it involves people, who for me, tend to be extremely headache inducing.  I want one of those bumbper stickers that says, "The more I know people, the better I like my dog."
 
Regards-
Grace


Grace,

You are, of course, making it harder than it is, as some of these people are no longer running!

Richardson, Thompson, Kucinich (and I think Gravel?) have all dropped.

Happy Picking.

Tim


They are listed for a couple of reasons, Tim. 
 
First, I don't want to have to completely research every candidate from the ground up next election cycle.  Secondly, one of them may yet be tagged as a VP candidate.
 
That said, yes, I probably do make it more difficult than need be, and in the end I may well vote in a manner consistent with my initial gut instincts.  What I'm not willing to do, however, is risk the future of my nation and descendents to gut instinct alone, when the situation doesn't demand that type of split second decision.  IOW, if I were a man, I'd be "trying to think with more than one head". [;)]
 
Regards-
Grace



amelliagrace -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 7:31:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Greetings Grace,

It gives me one as well. Here are a few items:


Orion-
Thanks for the information and suggested links.  They are appreciated.
 
Regards-
Grace



Vendaval -> RE: FW Dialogue (1/24/2008 10:08:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

For the non-Gorean FWs:
 
Were you at any point a non-Gorean slave prior to becoming a FW?

No
 

Do you consider yourself to be a dominant?
 
Yes

 
Were there any specific events in your life which either fascilitated, mandated, or precipitated this change?

I discovered the Gor books while still a school girl and became fascinated by the idea of a Counter-Earth.

What particular points of philosophy and lifestyle keep you from identifying as a Gorean?
 
I have had the pleasure of  meeting a few Goreans in real time and had many interesting conversations with others here on CM or in chat.  I enjoy discussing the philosophy and lifestyle with those open to talking people on the "other side".  My own personal identity is very individualistic and not one that fits any particular model.

What aspects of Gorean philosophy and interaction with Goreans cause you to spend time in this particular Gorean forum?
 
As mentioned above, several people in this particular forum have been interested in sharing ideas and inspiration with me.  I appreciate their hospitality and kindness.
 
Warm regards grace,
 
Vendaval 




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