quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Slaves, just out of curiousity, would you be personally affronted if your Master did not choose to discuss politics and this sort of thing with you as to his determinations and want your insight based on your perceptions of everything because he has determined you will vote as he chooses and therefore, he sees no need to discuss same with a slave?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterDale

Tal Zarius`         I believe that my slaves  vote is  mine to use as  I desire,  she is owned.  As for  my Free companion  she is the same  because  she is submissive to me.     they are always willing to support my interests.  Thanks again for the  gathering on saturday  had a great time.     Master  Alan

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ORIGINAL: MasterDale

I believe that my slaves  vote is  mine to use as  I desire,  she is owned.

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ORIGINAL: Kirata

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ORIGINAL: MasterDale

I believe that my slaves  vote is  mine to use as  I desire,  she is owned.

Allowing his slave to vote, or not, is certainly within any Gorean Master's prerogative. But telling slaves how to vote crosses an ethical line. That is simply using your slaves to multiply your own vote. It may please you to imagine that your opinion deserves to be counted twice, or three times, because you own a girl or two. But I would beg to differ.

K.

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ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterDale

I believe that my slaves  vote is  mine to use as  I desire,  she is owned.

Allowing his slave to vote, or not, is certainly within any Gorean Master's prerogative. But telling slaves how to vote crosses an ethical line. That is simply using your slaves to multiply your own vote. It may please you to imagine that your opinion deserves to be counted twice, or three times, because you own a girl or two. But I would beg to differ.

K.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PhantomOp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterDale

I believe that my slaves  vote is  mine to use as  I desire,  she is owned.

Allowing his slave to vote, or not, is certainly within any Gorean Master's prerogative. But telling slaves how to vote crosses an ethical line. That is simply using your slaves to multiply your own vote. It may please you to imagine that your opinion deserves to be counted twice, or three times, because you own a girl or two. But I would beg to differ.

K.

Tal, Kirata.

One thing I have noticed as a Gorean is that the ethics of a Gorean society differ from the ethics of an Earthly society.  For example, a Gorean has no issue with the concept of killing someone that has merely raised a weapon in a threatening manner against them.  In the US, however, one can only use a like amount of force to respond, so killing someone for holding a billy club in a threatening manner would be seen as excessive, and would place the Gorean, acting according to his Gorean ethics, in legal trouble.

So the question I have is simply, which ethical line is being crossed?  I see no crossing of a Gorean ethical line here.  And as for ethics in Earthly politics... well, I have no wish to hijack this thread, as *that* discussion is heated enough to fill multiple websites.

I wish you well,

PhantomOp

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ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: Trevelyan

If you accept the conventional Gorean point of view, the slave is an animal, not a person, and therefore has no right to vote.

Tal Trevelyan,

The "conventional Gorean point of view" (outside the law) is that both men and women are animals.

Is there a human animal beneath the conditioned ideologies? ...it lies within us, in the chemistry of every living cell in our bodies. In denying it we, truly, deny only ourselves. In hating it, we hate our own hearts and our own blood. We are not so terrible, really. It is only that we are men and women and not something else. -Rogue

It is true that a slave has no legal standing as a person under Gorean law, but that is a different matter. Here, she does. If she's not allowed to vote, it's because I said so -- not because she's "an animal, not a person". Which, incidentally, is doubtless how the law on Gor got created in the first place. Free Men said so.

A slave girl's legal status on Gor is that of an animal; she is domestic livestock, property. But she is not an "animal" in any other sense than we all are.

I presume, of course, that I am only clarifying your statement.

IWYW,

Kirata

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ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Tal Orion,

That's oversimplifying it, though.

Also, Democrats have the super delegates. Republican votes are magnified by the "winner take all" philosophy toward state contests---this is what has allowed McCain to take the lead.

On the Democratic side, super delegates or no, everything is still up for grabs between Clinton and Obama, as the Dems count delegates proportionally. [This primary may well need to be resolved at the convention---and there's nothing wrong with that.]

Best,

Tim

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Everyone has the right to vote as they please, even though I am sure that most Earth Gorean slaves would vote as their Master or Mistress tells them to.

quote:

Super Delegates count as more than one vote, and that was the point I was making. Taking all delegates because all the single votes are in the majority towards someone is fine, that is how elections are won, but I do not like the fact that a party philosophy says " we are all equal", when their rules for determining a candidate is contradictory to that. This is different than people banning together to create a voting block, which occurs all of the time.

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ORIGINAL: Kirata

Tal Orion,
 
The parallel you are drawing between being a slave and belonging to "a union or club or group" totally escapes me.

IWYW,

Kirata

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ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

On the case of an owner using his property or FC's vote, it is a voting block.... a labor union, women's club or any other group could organize under the basis that they would all vote the same way....  I see nothing unethical about voting blocks, or a Gorean Man using his personal voting block how he wishes.