RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders

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All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Gorean Lifestyles >> RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 5:39:07 AM

Raphael

Posts: 263
Joined: 5/10/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas

quote:

However I am a very tribal person who, not by choice but by economic reasons for the present is forced to live in a city.

What do you mean by that? When I think of someone being a "tribal person", I think of someone who lives in a tribe, and for whom membership in the tribe and their place within it is a very big part of how they define themselves. Are you saying that you had to leave your tribe and go live in a city?

I've read this exchange with much interest. I feel it applies quite a bit to myself.

I've never had much affinity for caste codes, because I am not a caste person.

I did grow up in the wilderness, among my clan, with a rifle in my hand and a knife on my belt. Maybe you don't believe that still happens, but it does, though less and less.

Yes, economic pressure has dissolved the world of my childhood, so that there is little left but my memory of it and a bit or piece here or there. But it lives on within me, and will never die so long as I live.

Yes, I've lived in cities. Half my life or more, although I'm back in the wilderness again at the moment. But even when I lived in the city and wore a shirt and tie and worked in an office, I was still a clansman, a 'savage' underneath my camoflage. The city, to me, is a hunting-ground. One I don't particularly like, but one I've learned to harvest of necessity, because it sucks the opportunity out of the surrounding land. A hunter has to go where the game is at times. He has to learn the customs and paths of the new place. A hunter is always ready to learn and adapt and do what must be done. But he does not, as those of the city seem to, become his occupation. He has an identity before any occupation, and it will persist after.

He carries the place of his origin, the teachings and the memories of his own people within him, wherever he goes and whatever people he finds himself living among. He knows the value of camoflage, and may use it often, but he remains a distinctly different type of person, underneath it, to those that are born to the city.

That is who I am.

>R

(in reply to Leonidas)

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 9:17:17 AM

Angrylibrarian

Posts: 214
Joined: 8/10/2005
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unbelievable. Lilly is that you I wonder?

as I was saying before I was interrupted, What your saying LaM is that you have every right to come in and "question" the "philosophy" as long as you don't put down the kink. But what Im trying to say is that that philosophy is in some ways the kink for goreans. Regardless of the fact it doesn't always involve the sexual aspect it goes against some modern cultural bias' concerning gender equality.(are non sexual 'kinks' all that unusual in wiitwd? IU dont think so) By not tolerating that bias and insinuating its in fact an intolerance that bdsm wont tolerate that's when it becomes insulting to some degree. I dont have time to rewrite the other stuff but you get what Im saying.

< Message edited by Angrylibrarian -- 10/19/2005 9:25:03 AM >

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 9:48:45 AM

Lordandmaster

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Joined: 6/22/2004
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That's not exactly what I said, but I agree that you've touched on the core issue. What I said is that the section guidelines are written in language that is apt to be interpreted differently by BDSM people and by Gor people. For BDSM people, a kink is not necessarily the same thing as a philosophy; for Goreans, it is.

Just imagine a "kink" that involves racist themes. These kinks exist, and when they are practiced privately, no one objects. But suppose there were a public forum for racist-humiliation kink, and people started making racist comments. Don't you think there would be at least SOME response from people who aren't racists? Goreans in this forum that have often taken the line that outsiders are barging in and imposing our standards on them, but go back and read through the threads from the beginning--you'll find plenty of Goreans asserting that their way is the best and most natural way for the whole world. (The "what's with the hostility from without" thread is a good example of this.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Angrylibrarian

What your saying LaM is that you have every right to come in and "question" the "philosophy" as long as you don't put down the kink. But what Im trying to say is that that philosophy is in some ways the kink for goreans.

< Message edited by Lordandmaster -- 10/20/2005 4:18:19 AM >

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 10:07:29 AM

Oumae

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Joined: 1/4/2005
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Without questions how do people learn?

I've read this thread with interest, when people dont succumb to becoming defensive and see curiosity for what it is and not as disrespect or scorn they can impart knowledge. Ty to those for sharing and those for questioning.

Oumae

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Is cuma le fear na mbrog ca leagann se a chos.
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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 1:11:36 PM

starshineowned

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
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Greetings..~smiles~

Totally off the topic here but if can get a quicky answer please?...What does wiitwd stand for?

thankyou in advance

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to Oumae)

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Post #: 65

RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 1:48:40 PM

frenchpet

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quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned

Totally off the topic here but if can get a quicky answer please?...What does wiitwd stand for?

What it is that we do.
Google is my friend. So is wiki

(in reply to starshineowned)

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Post #: 66

RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 2:22:28 PM

Angrylibrarian

Posts: 214
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hmmmm

good point , except there ARE forums like that and they basically boot everyone who questions their kink. And I don't mean the free republic :)

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 5:45:37 PM

pinkpleasures

Posts: 1114
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quote:

My only other comment is that just because you or one or two others refuse to accept me as Gorean doesn't mean that others with a comperable knowledge and experience such as yourself accept me as such... basically my son, you can always place me on ignore. that choice is always yours and it will not effect me in the least. I know who my friends and peers are. they I respect.

IronBear

Actually IronBear earned my trust and friendship long before i knew He was Gor; it doesn't change my opinion of Him, just adds a dimension. And i feel confident He'd answer any question i had without all the fa-da-la some people put on. In my opinion, IronBear is secure enough in who He is to teach; and some people are into excluding people who do not follow Gor or who disagree with them...not an attractive quality in anyone.

pinkpleasures

< Message edited by pinkpleasures -- 10/19/2005 5:46:46 PM >

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/19/2005 9:12:09 PM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkpleasures

quote:

My only other comment is that just because you or one or two others refuse to accept me as Gorean doesn't mean that others with a comperable knowledge and experience such as yourself accept me as such... basically my son, you can always place me on ignore. that choice is always yours and it will not effect me in the least. I know who my friends and peers are. they I respect.

IronBear

Actually IronBear earned my trust and friendship long before i knew He was Gor; it doesn't change my opinion of Him, just adds a dimension. And i feel confident He'd answer any question i had without all the fa-da-la some people put on. In my opinion, IronBear is secure enough in who He is to teach; and some people are into excluding people who do not follow Gor or who disagree with them...not an attractive quality in anyone.

pinkpleasures

Thank you pink. The matter you quoted is, I believe resolved. I enjoy some of the head banging I do with Leonidas as although we may not always agree, it does give me different perspectives or insites in what I believe in and allows me to better understand him. It is a good basis for perhaps some respect at some point. It nothing else it does keep me honest especially when I haven't been reading for a while and give a top of the head responce which is not correct (My comments on First and Second knowledge is a good example.)

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/21/2005 8:03:38 PM

SirSix72

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Joined: 7/14/2005
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Tal Leonidas,

This is where I have found some shaky ground in where I stand in the Caste system...I by profession am a Master Electrician......I do build alot of things and give many estimates for the installation of electronic devices.......but as well I am a highly traind black belt in Konguin Ninjitsu........I vowed much as a samuri would about living and dying by the sword I hold......... I have great honor inside of my professional life and a code of ethics I must adhere to and a National Electrical Code that I must follow upon the installation of any electronic devices that I or the men below me may install............I suppose that Iam a bit of both Castes, A Warrior and a builder..........

Master Six

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/21/2005 8:14:11 PM

Raphael

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That could get very complicated for you, since a Ninjaka is not a warrior, but a warrior-wizard. You might have to try to juggle three-castes. ;)

Be a man, first and before all. After that, set priorities.

>R

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RE: The 17th Aphorism of the Code of the Builders - 10/21/2005 8:33:03 PM

SirSix72

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actaully to be blunt if I was to assign myself a Caste by my training it would be a assassin..........but in the first book of the series Pa-Kur was an evil man using his Caste to take over a city.....I would like very much not to be regarded as to be like him because of my training.......I did however learn the art of bushido in my studies and I live by this code and my honor..........and I have earned my first Don which the japenese word for it is musha...meaning warrior......

Master six

< Message edited by SirSix72 -- 10/21/2005 8:35:59 PM >

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