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They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 5:49:02 PM   
xBullx


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Joined: 10/8/2005
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Tal Goreans,

Proceed with CAUTION, Bull had some extra time and you are the victims of this predicament.

Ok………….. Lately I have witnessed a few threads develop and as they did I noted the struggle and desire to coin the concept of slave and or kajira, this set me to thinking; I drive all day and have a good bit of time for such worldly pursuits. This can be confusing unless you pay close attention as you are about to enter the internal thinkings of the wily ole Tuchuk’s mindly concentrations. ( I may also be making up some of these words as we go; after all I am out for some entertainment value folks.)

My friend Orion pointed out that he is starting to think along a similar line as me when it comes to the Earthly kajira population. This lack of stock has been a long term position of mine and I would bet if you dig into the context of the storyline you might discover it is very consistent with the writings of one John Norman. Yes, yes I know that Norman said Earth women are best suited to be kajira on Gor; blah, blah I happen to say that about Gorean women for me the Earthman as well.

Note I said me and not Earth men. Oh, I’m not too arrogant, there are a good number of men that I would surmise are every bit as capable as handling a kajira as I am; but never the less I am using myself as the source and example. Perhaps to be bias; but to also draw on my experiences as reference. Most people being honest with themselves won’t find most of my claims all that far off the mark.

Since our forums are supposed to be about true to life dialogue between  actual “Living” Goreans (Goreans being those persons that apply the Gorean philosophies, applicable cultural virtues as well as individually selected customs to their daily existence)  I’m doing a personal comparison and synopsis of my supposed reasons for what I see in my daily travels as well as my perception of what has transpired on our lovely little globe in the not so distant past that may have produced much of the cause and effects that are seen through the eyes of this solitary male as the societal demise of the kajira.

I’m going to use the word kajira because of its exact distinction of the female slave. Kajira is not a term that represents slavery as a whole much like the word slave itself does, the term slavery circa pre 1865 and even to most in present day England would mean all those that were held in a forced bondage. The fact is this term within the English language has grown to become something very derogatory versus the term kajira which as Norman would perceive it as, for the most part a beautiful thing.

Why are there so few kajira you ask? I will tell you, men. Men are their own enemy in the scheme of life. It is in fact a man’s world to maintain or surrender. Women for the most part are willing participants with the destiny we have directed; for a great many ions they had no choice. I know the Femdoms will be along shortly to rebuke my manly claims, but cry as they might they can thank ancestral men for their right to such lofty feats. They can think it was their vaginally inspired struggles that garnered them the right to vote, the right to become part of the process, the right to fair and equal treatment, but the fact is men allowed this to happen; and my bet is if you were a mouse sitting back witnessing the calamity we call humanity you would have seen the countless motives (good and bad) for doing so. I’ll interject this quickly, don’t you find it ironic that the leap forward by the female persuasion is most dramatic during the democracies of mankind; when one party or another might have needed to garner significant voters to override the opposition. Hey I didn’t say this would be easy to hear, it’s after all simply one man’s opinions and in this opinion there lie the hushed motives of a society in love with power corruption and greed. How seldom it has been that man has made underhanded alliances in order to achieve short term gain only to in the end spawn more chaos and confusion than it was ever worth. Well let’s not beat this pony to death, I’m only alluding to possible scenarios that I’m sure the more liberal members of our female audience are by now enraged with. Do remember this point though; it has, in part to do with the absence of those cute cuddly kajira.

Ever want something real bad, get it and then hate how it tastes. Now examine what all those women with “equal say” are dining on in the present day hubby; that man that is always permissive and asking her where she wants to eat and wanting her to make more and more of the decisions in the household. Poor excessively divorced women that at an advanced age have little to love and nothing for passion. We see them searching more vigorously for that “Gorean Man” or in more increasing cases, another woman because typical men seem to be useless. {BELLLLLLLLLCH) Oh the younger girls take a shot at the “prefect” man that they intend to change and improve after they get married. (lol)

Hey, I’m not blaming you girls; I’m blaming the dumb fucker that sits down at the club having a beer with his buddies that is bitching that he never gets good sex anymore. He isn’t even smart enough to realize that he and his woman are both using that pussy as a weapon against the other. Let a kajira, if they existed try and do that with her master. Let a kajira claim she has cramps and she hates that you make her gag when you grab her hair.

Now come on fellas, I’m not saying go out and start abusing your sluts, hell not even all women are sluts, though the ones that are certainly don’t hide their lust. What I am saying is do as Orion is doing struggle to discover your rights, responsibilities, role and indeed privileges as a man ( I to am learning O so be sure to note I am not assuming myself advanced of your position). Learn to control your emotions, your lust, your urges and greed. At that we should all hold one another accountable to advance our society, not our checkbook or egos. We have begun to surrender the world to people designed to support us and the confusion it has produced has left us all wanting. The sad part is that the biggest culprit in this upheaval is laziness. Man’s determination to have that perfect job, you know, the one where someone pays you to do absolutely nothing. Hey let’s get the women to do it, they will buy anything to protect those damn babies.

So where in all this has the kajira gone? The way of the Dodo. Women can’t have her because she represents what they fear is still buried within their souls. Men can’t have her because she actually requires effort to manage and a sense of accountability and responsibility will be required. There went that easy job. Kajira might do the labor, but they are not automatic. I was talking to a friend just today and she reminded me of how I am with my slutlings, they aren’t allowed to have their breakfast or drink or shower or work or rest or go somewhere, wear something or even say something if it is not granted by me. I’m not a prick that’s my duty in the process, and the girl that embraces that though rare is a gem and what I call a kajira.

I get many offers to take a girl as a slave (the romantic notion of this creature anyway). Oh they love my arms, my fierce exterior, my manly demeanor and then they discover the truth of my expectations; no conditions are allowed, they will be held to their commitment and they are not prized for anything other than what they have earned. All those things a kajira would understand and embrace scares the shit out of these overly protected and internally bewildered females. Oh they have great intentions, they ask me to make them a slave and then when I hold them to it and push the buttons I know will make them run, they do, they can’t face the truth inside them and as long as we allow them the legal means to escape their nature, they will.

Some frequent questions I get are, “why don’t you have a kajira? Why did you get rid of the ones you had?” First, because if there was a market filled with ten thousand kajira, I would have trouble finding that right one for me, but in actuality, I hope simply to find a market filled with even ten that can measure up to the concept of kajira. The answer is, why settle and have a fraud, I’ll have a kajira or I’ll have nothing at all. Well, I do have a free companion I am fond of. But that is a different beast all to her own.

And why is this you ask that women would deny their nature? Because it’s easier; it is easier to coast through the emotions and deny personal accountability. Men do it to them first and they are left with no alternative. I mean if they surrender to their nature and men are denying their own, who will ensure our prosperity or even our survival?

The kajira disappeared sometime shortly after man.

Believe it or not I still have much more to say on this, but this should stir the pot some, if any of you are still awake or sane.

Oh take note that this information applies to other things “man” has lost since he started excusing himself of his personal responsibilities. Another note is that if you are watching close you'll see this thread may not even be about slavery.

Remember it is still not a certainty that within all women lays the heart of the kajira, in fact looking around in any given day, I suspect this is not the case. But that is another discussion altogether.

Edited to add one last tidbit....Disregard the chatroom link at the top of the page, I didn't put that fuckin' thing there!

< Message edited by xBullx -- 5/1/2008 5:52:25 PM >


_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 6:04:56 PM   
Leatherist


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You do have to make them.
 
And you do have to balance a creed with reality to get there. Go too heavy too soon-and they will be frightened away. Too slowly, and they will lose interest.
 
 Above all it take patience,and a degree of mental flexibility on both sides-since the reality will never exactly match your internal constructs. And if that thought is too much to bear-you will probably fail.
 
 *Humility is not just a virtue in these instances,it's a neccesity.*

< Message edited by Leatherist -- 5/1/2008 6:05:52 PM >


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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 6:16:40 PM   
CraZYWiLLiE


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From: HD NM
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Well said !
Some have chosen to train, teach or inspire to ignite the fire that burns in a slavegirls heart.
There are some out there, the search is half the battle.

(in reply to xBullx)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 6:21:32 PM   
xBullx


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Joined: 10/8/2005
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-fast reply-

I someday hope to be able to transcribe my thoughts succintly onto the written page, and to make them comprehendible to others.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to CraZYWiLLiE)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 6:24:13 PM   
Leatherist


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That would be nice. I look forward to you running a girl through the process, and relating how it worked out for you.

It should prove interesting.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 6:50:49 PM   
xBullx


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Like I said.........

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to Leatherist)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 7:19:31 PM   
Kimveri


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Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
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~FR~

Ok, I may have utterly missed the point, & this may be mighty damn close to an 'illegal hijack', but I just HAD to say that this....

quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx
We have begun to surrender the world to people designed to support us and the confusion it has produced has left us all wanting.


...is one of the most brilliant, poignant, bittersweet & perceptive comments I've read in a long time!

Thank you for the cranial sustenance that will last for days!

~Kimveri



_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 7:48:28 PM   
OrionTheWolf


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Tal Bull,

To some you communicate loud and clear. So now the question remains, what do we settle for if there are no kajira?

Live well,
Orion


quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

-fast reply-

I someday hope to be able to transcribe my thoughts succintly onto the written page, and to make them comprehendible to others.


_____________________________

Die die glauben fordern keinen Beweis. Denen die zweifeln genuegt kein Beweis.


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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 8:03:09 PM   
xBullx


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Thanks Kim........

I'm quite sure you captured the point...

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to Kimveri)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 8:31:54 PM   
xBullx


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Tal Orion,

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Tal Bull,

To some you communicate loud and clear. So now the question remains, what do we settle for if there are no kajira?

Live well,
Orion



My friend you are much the same as I and we both know that we will never settle, it as a concept is much to familiar with the idea of surrender.

We as free men must refine and define ourselves, become men that inspire within eachother mutual respect, admiration; and in our girls that delicious ingredient of feminine need(even lust). To these beasts(little sluts) we must remove the doubt and insecurity that has overcome in their hearts. As is surmised perhaps not all women are intend to serve as kajira, hell Norman pointed that out much better than I. But for those that are born to kneel in the absolute freedom of a man's chains we must (re)discover our nature as men, our courage and conviction to not be denied our own nature. To regain the honor, ability and wisdom to first respect ourselves and in turn then, find beautiful women on bare belly at our feet.

No need to settle, we only need to Recon the the depths of our humanity, first for ourselves as men and then we will find our kajira. She will be the one trembling with rich excitement.

Perhaps we may never find personal resolution or satisfaction within our lives but self discovery, understanding and acceptance of all natural conditions and the truth of man for our posterity and their success must be our goal.

Is the kajira life's (nature's) ultimate reward for our success as men? Perhaps for both men and women...

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 9:05:37 PM   
Leatherist


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A Master learns to overcome fears. All roads open from there.

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I'm not taking custom orders.

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 9:23:37 PM   
ryssa


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And Master Bull sings...

Once I rose above the noise and confusion
Just to get a glimpse beyond this illusion
I was soaring ever higher
But I flew too high

Though my eyes could see I still was a blind man
Though my mind could think I still was a mad man
I hear the voices when I'm dreaming
I can hear them say.......ah hell, what's the use? ;)

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 9:27:11 PM   
amelliagrace


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The man who honestly searches out and embraces himself will eventually find a counterpart that is a reasonably close fit.....  The woman who honestly searches out and embraces herself will eventually find a counterpart that is a reasonably close fit.......
 
In a perfect world, that is. 
 
While what we have at present is far from perfect, and the chances of finding a well matched counterpart are not what I'd call great, or even good, it remains that without first addressing the afore mentioned with regard to self, it becomes about like hitting the lottery.
 
But.....
Does it really matter that there are not many women that meet the description of "natural kajira" or"true slaves"?  Yes, and no.
 
It matters to the extent that men quit being men, so that women couldn't be women.  It matters to the extent that both sexes seem bent and determined to ignore the spectrum of the natural.  It matters to the extent that people obsess over the .05 percent on each extreme end of the human continueum.
 
It doesn't matter so much once men and women begin to explore and embrace themselves.  It doesn't matter so much once they get to that place of not settling for something in name only, just to have something in hand.
 
Once a man takes a good look around at our screwed up world, our deeply troubled societies...
Once he says, I'm going to find out just exactly who and what I am, and live accordingly.....He begins to attract women.  One major hurdle is in discerning which of those are truly willing and able to look inside, and embrace who they are.  There is a far greater one, however.
 
And that is in setting aside all those lovely, romantic, fantastic and exciting illusions surrounding the words "master" and "slave/kajira".  It seems as though a huge segment of the male population pines away for those women so far out on the tail end of the free-subbie-slave continueum, while failing to see where they are on the other end of that spectrum, that something vital is missed.  If you are 10% from the extreme end yourself, then perhaps a counterpart at .05% on the complimentrary scale of the opposite sex, or 20%, might not be the best match for you anyway - even if you did find her.
 
And might it be like the Olympics?  A few hundreths of a second makes a difference at the tape...but for all practical purposes, and to the naked eye...it means virtually nothing.
 
I definitely agree with Bull that when men quit being men - being their best selves, IOW - women began to have a great deal of difficulty being their best selves.  Being a "real man" does not equate to being "alpha male" or "uber dom", just as being a "real woman" does not equate to being 'ultra slave" or "frigid freewoman".
 
Being the best self, the most honest with yourself, self, is the only thing that will calm the chaos of anyone's immediate circle.  It is also the only thing that will truly allow any of us to find our counterbalance partner.  We can't be honest about what we truly need in a partner, until we are honest with ourselves about who and what we are.
 
Once we do that......what difference does any of the rest of it make, anyway?
 
Regards-
Grace

(in reply to xBullx)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 9:35:53 PM   
Leatherist


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Nodding..........When you find the honest core, it can begin. And if it's in you, you can then proceed.  If it is not, wonder why that is. But don't bullshit yourself about something you are not really capable of pulling off. You need to be honest. You can think you are something you are not.  You can have fantasies about people you may never meet. You can creat entire worlds in your mind.....that are only cloud castles.

But stubborness is one of both the most charming, and annoying things with humans. You can have a vision and pursue that vision. But not by lying to oneself. That which is unseen, is not overcome. That which is denied-our chains.

Only by embracing ALL of oneself-including the faults and weaknesses-do we learn to become stronger. Fly higher, and what was seen in yards now becomes miles.

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 10:01:57 PM   
SixFootMaster


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Man sacrificed freedom for security and ease, that much is certain.

Submitting to the specifications of what is acceptable, what constitutes excellence, and what evaluates to worth, as conjured by the minds and imaginations of other people. Denial of what we want, what we are, and what drives us to avoid uncomfortable reality.

Stop for a moment and feel that line wavering in the back of our minds that borders between what we want and what we feel safe to have. A self limitation defined by what we are prepared to risk, and what we can and will settle for in lieu. Negotiating for the best outcome from a set that does not contain any that could be truly fulfilling. Yet we do settle, men in general, silencing our thoughts, oppressing our disquiet. It is any wonder when it eventually errupts in frustation, seething and seeking expression through violence or sexual conquest, neither of which can sate that gnawing hunger?

Men fearing to lift their hand against their woman unless it's been explicitly negotiated he can do so.

Pfef.

A man cannot master a woman if he doesn't first respect himself, and his heritage.


< Message edited by SixFootMaster -- 5/1/2008 10:04:28 PM >


_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 10:07:20 PM   
Leatherist


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And all because too many men are afraid to learn how to seduce what they desire with wit and willpower. There are slaves in waiting out there-but it takes some finesse and patience to bring them out.

"Captain caveman" went out of style in the neolithic age. One has to be a bit more cultured to pull this off now.

_____________________________

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I'm not taking custom orders.

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 10:35:16 PM   
SixFootMaster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

And all because too many men are afraid to learn how to seduce what they desire with wit and willpower. There are slaves in waiting out there-but it takes some finesse and patience to bring them out.

"Captain caveman" went out of style in the neolithic age. One has to be a bit more cultured to pull this off now.


I disagree. "One" merely needs to be confident, and to know and accept the risks inherent in the task.

Edited to add: In as much as there is any "one size fits all" method.


< Message edited by SixFootMaster -- 5/1/2008 10:36:12 PM >


_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to Leatherist)
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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 10:43:46 PM   
Leatherist


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Farting around on a message board and boasting and whining isn't going to cut it dude. You have to get a chick interested enough to actually meet you first. I think we can both agree on that part.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

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RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 10:52:46 PM   
SixFootMaster


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Joined: 9/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Farting around on a message board and boasting and whining isn't going to cut it dude. You have to get a chick interested enough to actually meet you first. I think we can both agree on that part.


Definitely. Living vicariously through text is no substitute - it's the mock-cream of deserts.


_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to Leatherist)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: They went the way of the Dodo... - 5/1/2008 11:31:55 PM   
ShreveportMaster


Posts: 898
Joined: 10/6/2004
From: Dallas, Tx
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist
"Captain caveman" went out of style in the neolithic age. One has to be a bit more cultured to pull this off now.


"Unga Bunga, that not right, Captain Caveman still around!...Even if teen angels all in menopause now "

_____________________________

"And to sooth the Bosk, there was found a Singing Cowboy. To soothe the Cowboy, a kajira is needed."

Riders of Gor
Book 37, Pg 298 ;-)

(in reply to Leatherist)
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