quote:

ORIGINAL: NumberSix

Since this is so far afield already, I should point out to all you self-harmers that wish to become slaves, that you have given over to a man --- the right to harm you, if that is his wish.

That should be trouble sufficient enough for today.

Don't think about feeling and concentration and the reality of self inflicted harm.  That is so much fodder if you are unwilling to do what you have been charged with doing. 

I can hook a sister up with the ENTIRE lesson plan,  if you need it taught.

6

quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

quote:

ORIGINAL: NumberSix

Since this is so far afield already, I should point out to all you self-harmers that wish to become slaves, that you have given over to a man --- the right to harm you, if that is his wish.

That should be trouble sufficient enough for today.

Don't think about feeling and concentration and the reality of self inflicted harm.  That is so much fodder if you are unwilling to do what you have been charged with doing. 

I can hook a sister up with the ENTIRE lesson plan,  if you need it taught.

6

Let's take this a bit further afield, and consider something that Ron's post, quoted above, touches on.
 
Females, and males as well (yeah, yeah, I hear you, but live long enough, look hard enough and they are there - deal with it) seek slavery for more than one reason.  A signifigant portion of the ones I've met on or offline (not all) find stability, balance, and freedom there which they have not, or can not, find within themselves, as Free Persons (the ones Free by status of being, rather than state of current circumstances, that is) generally do.  In some of those cases, this is the results from instances of trauma physical or emotional trauma, at a young age, or later events which have left scars on the internal self.  Note:  I'm talking about slaves in general, not Gorean slaves in particular.
 
1.  A small fraction of those slaves are self harmers. (And yes, as stated repeatedly in this thread, self harmers are found throughout society, and "slaves" are not the majority of them, by any stretch).
 
2.  Anyone who has read in this forum for very long is acquainted with the debates of being Gorean and excellence, with discussions of excellent Mastery, and with debate of whether one can be a complete and utter ass, and a very not-nice person, and still be Gorean.  For the sake of this discussion, let assume that one can be Gorean, hold others enslaved to his will, and be a real nasty SOB, all at the same time.
 
Let's take a slave from #1, and a Master from #2.  We might well see a man who forbids his property to cut, pick, burn, pierce, bruise, or otherwise deliberately harm themselves.  We might also see a Master who's desire is to use up and toss away property, rather than increase its value and hold it long term.  One who uses verbal degradation and humilliation, as well as physical abuse to maintain control over the slave and keep them demoralized, insecure, and vulnerable enough to feel they have no choice but to stay.  We might see property that is bruised, battered, and possibly left with fresh scars on a reasonably regular basis - be they internal or external.
 
In such a case, has submitting to such a master become the slaves means of self injury?  Has the "Master" become the knife, serving the subconscious will  and desire of the slave?  Do his devaluing and undermining words and deeds serve to place a stamp of "truth" and approval upon the slaves injured and unhealthy way of seeing self, reinforcing those misconceptions of "I'm worthless", "I don't deserve anthing more in life than to be beaten, neglected, and slowly destroyed"?  Were he to behave otherwise, would he still be able to hold that particular piece of property?
 
More than one individual I've known in life comes to mind here.  Moving from master to master (be they actually called that or not), seeking someone to agree with their self loathing, and become the instrument by which they cause themselves to bleed, literally, figuratively, or both.
 
Obviously, there are plenty of Masters and slaves who do not fit what I've described.  What is sad to me, is that there are any at all.  M/s relationships, be they Gorean or not, are not immune to the diseases inherent in being human.
 
This particular tangent of thought has given me some sober moments of pondering, since the beginning of this thread, as I've read and remembered.
 
Any one else have comment here?
 
Grace

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nyxmyst

Tal Bull,

   I am trying to give the benefit of the doubt here. Perhaps I read this wrong. Did you say that coping mechanisms such as cutting are often copycatting or sympathy garnering issues? Or did you mean something else, perhaps?

   I'm having a real issue seeing cutting as the "new nifty thing to do!" that copycatting things are. Bullemia, perhaps... I watched that happen at my high school years ago.. there wasn't a girl in my grade that didn't have an eating disorder. Being pretty was paramount. However, cutting leaves some horrid scars. Most women don't pick scarification as a "cool new hobby". Too many questions.

-Nyxmyst

If one indeed has the mind to pick i would think maybe then they might also be able to stop. Or at least deflect the urge to hurt themselves into something more constructive. But i'm not a head shrinker so i don't have much knowledge on it.


_____________________________

Don't fight him. Embrace your inner asshole.

Tu fellas magnus penum meum...iterum

Genuine catnip/kryptonite.
Ego sum erus.

The capacity to learn is a gift, the ability to learn a skill, the willingness to learn a choice. Dune HH

(in reply to Nyxmyst)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mitzie

Tal and greetings
                        Last year there was a thread started which sickened me about a so called Master who had his slave cut herself and take pictures  to send to him but now I  have come across something and wish to talk on the matter.

Do you find its common that slaves owned and unowned self harm and if so how do you yourself deal with it.

I will not mention no names as to who but in the past 2 weeks  I now know of 3 girls who self harm and I might add these are real time slaves 1 owned 2 not owned.

What I am asking is have any of you noticed and come across self harming slaves and if so how do you address the problem, we all know a good percentage of self harmers do it for attention and some do it when frustrated and I know there might be some sharp and nasty comments but I ask that you remember that self harming is proven to be an illness.

I look forward to the replies from both Free and slaves

       Mitzie