RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype

RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (Full Version)

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HunterS -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 5:43:38 PM)
quote: So what, your post doesnt invalidate anything i said to Stella. Kuwait existed long before Britain got involved in the region. If you would have given the link I posted a look you would have seen that Kuwait was part of Iraq and that it was Britain who partitioned it from Iraq. It was Britain who murdered the king of Iraq(one of the assissans was Sodamned Insane) and installed their own boy and maintained the partition of Iraq from Kuwait. Please read the link you will find it interesting and it is only one page long so it is not a terribly tedious read. quote: Your assertion about what Britain wanted prior to WW2 is just that, your theory unbacked by evidence. In the interests of not getting Mod spanked for hijacking a thread we should save this for a thread dedicated to that topic...and yes I have sufficient evidence to back up my assertions. H.

celticlord2112 -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 5:52:37 PM)
quote: Wrong: You sign up to protect the U.S. from all enemies both foriegn and domestic. Wrong again. U.S. military personnel in all branches sign up to protect the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic.

Sanity -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 6:18:21 PM)
You remind me a hell of a lot of another poster, who used to call himself thompsonx. Same type of font, same general type of philosophy... same posting style. Probably just a coincidence... [sm=brush.gif]

HunterS -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 6:19:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: celticlord2112 quote: Wrong: You sign up to protect the U.S. from all enemies both foriegn and domestic. Wrong again. U.S. military personnel in all branches sign up to protect the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic. If you choose to pick fly shit out of pepper: I, [name], do solemnly swear, (or affirm,) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. (So help me God.)

Musicmystery -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 6:22:20 PM)
[sm=applause.gif]

HunterS -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 8:27:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity You remind me a hell of a lot of another poster, who used to call himself thompsonx. Same type of font, same general type of philosophy... same posting style. Probably just a coincidence... [sm=brush.gif] I took the opportunity to read up on your friend thompsonx. Dang he used to spank you pretty regular. I did find his posting style a bit more "assertive" than mine and his opinions seemed to get a little personal from time to time. I am afraid that I am not your long lost friend ...but... if you enjoy that sort of regular spanking I will make an effort to chide you when your posts approach the ridiculous and as alwayse I will disagree with the posts which are mearly illogical, illinformed or irrational. H.

Dad4Lovin -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/18/2008 8:50:12 PM)
In world history, its always been about oil. It is the main reason why the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor because of the embargo the US had placed on oil imports into Japan, http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_did_the_Japanese_attack_Pearl_Harbor. Its also how we defeated Germany in WWII, http://www.oil150.com/essays/2007/08/oil-strategy-in-world-war-ii We are in Iraq to protect our national security interest, which is OIL. Dont lose sight of the fact that Iran is surrounded by Afghanistan on the west and Iraq on the eastern border. We are positioned to keep our interests in the area. So, get over it everyone. People in the cold climates would freeze without it, our electric plants couldnt function without it. Everyone blamed the President when gas prices were $4.60 a gallon, so should everyone give him credit now that gas is $2.80 ? Even when we were paying $4.60 a gallon, they were paying twice that in Europe and the Far East. We are so spoiled in this country, we dont even have a clue. So we took out a bad guy named Saddam Hussein, we have always done that. We took out Hitler in WWII. Nobody complained when Clinton spent $170 billion dollars bombing the shit out of Bosnia to get rid of a bad guy named Milosevic. Our bombs killed thousands of Bosnians and Serbians. The rest of the world relies on the US, and now our economy is down and the rest of the world is in deep shit. The Democrats have been in control of the house and senate since Bush has been in office, and everyone voted to go to war in Iraq based on CIA information. The President doesnt have the power to send the country to war, the rest of the governing committee has to vote on it as a majority. If you want a good laugh, google "The guy from Boston" and see what he has to say about our congressmen. Out of 535 united states congressmen, 82% have been in some kind of trouble, from spousal abuse to felony crime. We have a bunch of clowns running the country, its our own fault.

ModeratorEleven -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 12:56:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HunterS I took the opportunity to read up on your friend thompsonx. Dang he used to spank you pretty regular. I did find his posting style a bit more "assertive" than mine and his opinions seemed to get a little personal from time to time. I am afraid that I am not your long lost friend Actually, you are, and you're gone. Again. XI

sirsholly -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 4:35:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ModeratorEleven quote: ORIGINAL: HunterS I took the opportunity to read up on your friend thompsonx. Dang he used to spank you pretty regular. I did find his posting style a bit more "assertive" than mine and his opinions seemed to get a little personal from time to time. I am afraid that I am not your long lost friend Actually, you are, and you're gone. Again. XI you have to love it when she does this...[:)]

stella41b -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 6:07:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 quote: ORIGINAL: stella41b How come there was no mention in the OP of Margaret Thatcher, who started the conflict with Saddam Hussein in Iraq? Your ignorance of history is showing again. Saddam invaded Kuwait, the UN authorised his removal. Dozens of nations sent troops to take part. By your logic, we started WW2 because Hitler invaded Poland. Yes, exactly. I meant started as in declaring war on someone, not who was responsible for the war. You see all wars take place in accordance with something known as international law. International war says that you cannot have a war with anybody unless you've declared war on them first. Therefore you are right, using my logic Great Britain started WW2 by declaring war on Hitler's Germany on September 1st 1939, the same day as France did. Hitler was responsible for the war. All I can say is the wine gums sold in your area must be bloody strong.

CreativeDominant -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 7:27:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HunterS quote: Ahhhhhhhhhh but you see, Hunter...I am not contradicting myself. The UCMJ...as already noted by one writer and ignored by you...states clearly what sorts of orders are considered to be illegal. No it does not. It is you and not me who has ignored the post by CL. ART. 92. FAILURE TO OBEY ORDER OR REGULATION Any person subject to this chapter who-- (1) violates or fails to obey any lawful general order or regulation; (2) having knowledge of any other lawful order issued by any member of the armed forces, which it is his duty to obey, fails to obey the order; or (3) is derelict in the performance of his duties; shall be punished as a court-martial may direct. The UCMJ does not list what is not a lawful order. Please do your homework quote: No, but the personnel from the AGs office are certainly willing to explain it to you during several days in Basic. Perhaps you'd consider doing some homework of your own to find out in the same manner I did? quote: Being ordered to do the job you signed up for is not one of them, even if you decide it is. Wrong: You sign up to protect the U.S. from all enemies both foriegn and domestic. You do not sign up to make the world more profitable for Exxon/Moble,United Fruit or Chase Manhattan. No. I am not wrong, Hunter. I've been there and had it explained to me. Have you? Or does your knowledge come through the words of disgruntled soldiers and your own interpretation of what is written down? Though you and many others like to state that the above is what the military is doing, that is your perception. Try taking anyone in the military chain of command that you feel is actually making war to do this, and this alone, to court and see whether or not you win in the long run. quote: The individual soldier gets to make his decison based on what the UCMJ says, not what he thinks it should say nor what he thinks the military should be doing with him instead of what they are doing now. Before you try to teach me about the UCMJ don't you think it prudent to learn what it says and does not say? I don't need to try to teach you Hunter since you seem to know all there is to know about it. Tell me, what branch of the service were you in, for how long, and how well did you understand it as it was explained to you? How long did you follow it before you broke it, if you did?

CreativeDominant -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 7:29:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant And who has the truth, Hunter? You? Every man, within himself? That's a unproveable premise and you know it. Believe me, I remember that the left voted for this war. I also know that now they would like to disavow it and state that they were led down a path by a someone craftier on the right. Hmmmmmmmmm...all these great minds on the left were all fooled? No, at the time they voted for the war, it was politically expedient to do so. Politically expedient? No, and you know it. It wasn't that long ago that you could have forgotten the mood in the country. Bush and his administration, in my opinion, exploited that mood of self-defense and patriotism to achieve a goal they had in mind entering office. Regardless of whether that is true, the administration propagandized their efforts to the point that you were considered a traitor if you did not support the war. Again...differing perceptions. From my point of view, it is those politicians on the left who've correctly read the changing mood of the country and have stepped away from their initial support to statements decrying the Bush's administration continuation of the war while loudly proclaiming their "uncertainty" at voting for it in the first place.

CreativeDominant -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 7:32:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HunterS quote: ORIGINAL: celticlord2112 quote: Wrong: You sign up to protect the U.S. from all enemies both foriegn and domestic. Wrong again. U.S. military personnel in all branches sign up to protect the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic. If you choose to pick fly shit out of pepper: I, [name], do solemnly swear, (or affirm,) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. (So help me God.) Please note the bold portion above and tell me how desertion from your post complies with that statement.

CreativeDominant -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 7:34:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ModeratorEleven quote: ORIGINAL: HunterS I took the opportunity to read up on your friend thompsonx. Dang he used to spank you pretty regular. I did find his posting style a bit more "assertive" than mine and his opinions seemed to get a little personal from time to time. I am afraid that I am not your long lost friend Actually, you are, and you're gone. Again. XI Damn, I missed this. And here I spent time replying to his arrogance.

Politesub53 -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 9:59:01 AM)
Stella, correct me if I am wrong. Would you rather the UK had ignored Polands plight, just to prove your point on a message board ? You meant "started the war" as exactly that, despite your protests of innocence. Your initial post stated Thatcher started the war with Iraq, despite the fact there was a UN resolution authorising action.

stella41b -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 10:15:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 Stella, correct me if I am wrong. Would you rather the UK had ignored Polands plight, just to prove your point on a message board ? You meant "started the war" as exactly that, despite your protests of innocence. Your initial post stated Thatcher started the war with Iraq, despite the fact there was a UN resolution authorising action. The UK did ignore Poland's plight for about a year, in what I believe was known as the Phony War. However Hitler had territorial claims to Poland over Gdansk and the Silesian region whereas Saddam didn't have the same territorial claims to Kuwait, evidenced by his withdrawal and burning of the Kuwaiti oilfields. Starting a war to me means the declaration, a mere reference point, and I'm not giving an opinion either way as to whether Margaret Thatcher was right to declare war or not, because we have the benefit of hindsight which she didn't have when she did declare war with George Bush Snr's support. Even if she did make a mistake it's nothing compared with the 180 degree U turn performed by Tony Blair over terrorism after the Good Friday Agreement at Stormont and then his stance on this 'war on terrorism' and the whole WMD thing. However I'm sure you are going to see this differently. This is just for clarification.

Raechard -> RE: The Iraq War - Know the History, Not Just the Hype (12/19/2008 2:16:14 PM)
From Iraq war to Bosnia to WW2 in record time.[:D]

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