Collarchat.com

Create a
Free Account		 As the Collar Turns:
 Collarchat.com - BDSM Forum

Home  Login  Search 
Espanol  Deutsch  Francais  Italiano  Portugues 

RE: What defines a gorean framework?


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Gorean Lifestyles >> RE: What defines a gorean framework? Page: <<   < prev  2 3 [4] 5 6   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 1:17:45 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 8294
Joined: 1/12/2006
Status: offline 		fr

1} What defines a gorean framework?

The books.


3} How does a gorean framework become integrated into the daily life of the Household of the Free?

Via application of the framework as defined by the books.

6} How does the a defined gorean framework lends itself to the welfare of society?

As any other framework would - by giving it's proponents/adherents a common starting place. Once the framework is set, as in a house, the individual tastes will supply the decor.







_____________________________

۩ "The mind, once expanded to the dimensions of larger ideas, never returns to its original size." ۩
~Oliver Wendell Holmes~

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 1:48:28 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 26032
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Master Zevar

why are my questions so hard to answer?

These are terms you have used, no one else. i asked for a simple explanation of each. not only have you twisted and changed your posts, you then accused me of being less than professional because i didnt agree with your new girl. it seems to me you have had an ulterior motive with this thread from the get go... a slave.

tazzy

_____________________________

No body dies a virgin... life fucks everyone.

RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11

"There are no atheists getting blowjobs" ~Master Ron

+20 Heresy Points - Hard earned!

Duchess of Dissent 1

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 2:10:28 PM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7228
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		Some questions will never have answer spoken out loud.

"Truth, you see, has reality on its side. Truth's problems do not derive primarily from the complexity of nature but from the simplicity of people. It is always more convenient to adopt a slogan than conduct an inquiry. Too, the often cold and flinty nature of truth may, to many people, understandably, constitute a poor substitute for the comforts of self-deception. Harmless lies, perhaps, improve the quality of human life. They do not, of course, improve its nobility or grandeur.
Blood Brothers of Gor - Page 264 "

_____________________________

Die die glauben fordern keinen Beweis. Denen die zweifeln genuegt kein Beweis.


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 2:29:59 PM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7228
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Zevar

I am presenting the following for discussion. I welcome discussion about any or all of the following questions.


 
You welcome it only if you believe it fits into the discussion?
 
quote:
1} What defines a gorean framework?

 
The series is pretty thorough on this. Some of the one's that seem to run throughout all the cultures are:
 
1) Natural stratification and development.
2)Continued survival and improvement of our environment.
3)Be good sovereigns.
 
I think I may have re-created a simple list from other postings and thoughts. At least I got something out of all this.
 
quote:


2} Is a gorean framework something that is defined individually for those who are Free or is it defined in another manner and if so how and by whom?

 
Do not understand this question. We live by codes and principles, but what I wrote is determined by nature and the environment.
 
quote:


3} How does a gorean framework become integrated into the daily life of the Household of the Free?


It integrates very easily as it is how we live. Some may deny these truths, but truth does not need someone's acceptance to exist.
quote:


4} What about or rather within a gorean framework separates from a non-gorean framework?
[quote/]

This one could be quite lengthy. Denial of the truths that I listed would put one outside the area of being Gorean.

quote:


5} What role does gorean morality have to do with defining a gorean framework?


Morality would spring from it, not the opposite. It would go in many different directions, just as on Gor they had many different cultures and traditions, and we have the same here as humans. That natural progression of humanity would bring about diversity, while still maintaining the three components I listed.

quote:


6} How does the a defined gorean framework lends itself to the welfare of society?


This is also a very massive question. The seperation of a social structure based upon deeds and the effects they have upon the environment, society. That meritocracy would better define society. An acceptance of each persons place within the whole, would show that each component would also be necessary. From the scribe to serf, both are necessary for a fully functioning society. Being good sovereigns along these lines would lead to each person taking responsibility for their actions, and banding together for survival (cities, towns, villages) while maintaining all of this.

quote:


7} What contributing factors of defined gorean framework contribute to the daily living as a gorean?


“Society everywhere is in conspiracy against the manhood of every one of its members. The virtue in most request is conformity. Self-reliance is its aversion. It loves not realities and creators, but names and customs.”
Ralph Waldo Emerson


I wish you well,
~Zevar~




Not sure how 3 and 7 are that much different. Looks like the same question. Further explanation would be in order. Things are not that difficult to understand, and I believe that part of the simplicity in understanding and application, is also part of being Gorean.

Emerson quote is nice, but a Norman one would be more appropriate:

"Culture decides what is truth, but truth, unfortunately for culture, is unaware of this. Cultures, mad and blind, can die upon the rocks of truth. Why can truth not be the foundation of culture, rather than its nemesis? Can one not build upon the stone cliffs of reality rather than dash one's head against them? But how few human beings can think, how few dare to inquire, how few can honestly question. How can one know the answer to a question which one fears to ask?
Explorers of Gor - Page 11 "

Orion

_____________________________

Die die glauben fordern keinen Beweis. Denen die zweifeln genuegt kein Beweis.


(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 2:45:52 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 8294
Joined: 1/12/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Live. Just live. Fully and fiercely, honestly and purposefully.




_____________________________

۩ "The mind, once expanded to the dimensions of larger ideas, never returns to its original size." ۩
~Oliver Wendell Holmes~

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 3:30:49 PM   
Zevar


Posts: 786
Status: offline 		FR~

It is unfortunate when the ability to articulate oneself is lacking thus electing to resort to behaving in a manner that is disproportionately bankrupt when it comes to reflecting self control. Ongoing character assassination attempts are inappropriate and serve only to thwart a constructive exchange.

When one does not possess what is required to demonstrate a level of rational thinking an individual becomes weakened in their intellectual qualities, which is contrasted against an unwillingness to conduct oneself that is indicative of self control.

It is truly unfortunate to witness anyone conduct themselves in way that they become egregious when asked to contribute their understanding of how they define a gorean framework. In order to have a fruitful discussion there are ground rules, requirements and standards. When self control is lacking therein is a breeding ground for unforeseen communication problems to arise which prohibit a fruitful discussion from occurring.

The question “What defines a gorean framework?” regrettably has resulted in more than not volatile demeaning conduct evident in various entries which is not justifiable. This type of conduct being counterproductive produces the result of nothing further to communicate about.

“What defines a gorean framework?” is indeed a topic worthy of discussion with those would conduct themselves in a manner which reflects self control and respect one to another. A common ground for a fruitful discussion is not required when each individual man has willingly mastered himself in order that he can demonstrate self control over himself first and foremost thus agree to disagree if it is merited. This characteristic trait of self control surely is an element that is a part of a functional gorean framework.

Wisdom demands much of a man. Honor oft-times is self determined. Steel encompasses the sword of each man and the swords of others while Truth reigns and rules in the character of a man who practices self control in word and deed. Lest we forget also in a functional gorean framework. Nothing less, nothing more.

I wish you well,
~Zevar~

_____________________________

Beagán agus a rá go maith.
Gaelic saying

Broken Irish is better than clever English.
Irish proverb

House of Livingston
A Gaelic Irish gentleman master
Finte na hÉireann

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 4:01:45 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 781
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Zevar
Perhaps you might consider answering the points you proposed if you are really serious about having a fruitful discussion and not just replying with assertions found to be meaningless calculated depraved remarks designed to result in mental and moral deficiency on your behalf.
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2748772


My "depraved" self has outlined the principles of Gorean philosophy as I see them, delineated the Gorean morality ("ideals of right conduct") as I see it, & even discussed at length the various possible ethical codes as I see them on multiple threads here & elsewhere over the years. Much of that can be found on my journals linked to my profiles on this site, yahoo's site & FL's site.

Shall I email you the links, or c/p them all here....since you've clearly not read them? Or should I take my "meaningless assertions" on these subjects & my "mental & moral deficiency" & just leave you to discuss with all your friends?

....you do know what "ad hominem" means, right?

~Kimveri

< Message edited by Kimveri -- 8/8/2009 4:08:54 PM >

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 4:20:54 PM   
Zevar


Posts: 786
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Master Zevar

why are my questions so hard to answer?

These are terms you have used, no one else. i asked for a simple explanation of each. not only have you twisted and changed your posts, you then accused me of being less than professional because i didnt agree with your new girl. it seems to me you have had an ulterior motive with this thread from the get go... a slave.

tazzy



Greetings tazzy:

To begin your questions are not at all what could be defined as “hard.” Instead your questions were addressed in the manner that I chose to address them. I might add I have conducted myself in a way that acknowledged your questions with answers. My position remains that it would serve you best to find your own answers that you seek from myself. In considering my reply I then offered you links which I sent to your email. I then reiterated my efforts toward answering your questions as my position remained the same.

I encouraged you to find your own answers to the questions that you struggle with. There is no obligation for myself to answer your questions in the way you are demanding. It is unfortunate that you have continued to not respect my forthrightness in maintaining my position regarding your blatant disrespect toward my conclusion.

Further your accusation of my motive in beginning this thread is altogether false with no foundation. In regards to My kiani it is most important that note the following:

Clearly you do not know myself or kiani. Nor do either myself or kiani know yourself or your master. This being a correct fact. As I stated this thread was not presented as you falsely accused myself of in your recent posted entry. I am the type of man who is forthright and has nothing to do with manipulative tactics.

As I indicated in my last posted entry http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2749049 it would be most wise for you to adhere to your position which you made clear in one of your posted entries. I might add that you might consider demonstrating common decency and refrain from falsely accusing me in a public forum of my motivating factor in beginning this thread or otherwsie, cease from your blatant disrespect and false assumptions and finally remember that due to the fact that you do NOT know myself or My kiani you have NO tangible facts regarding my personal life or hers to support your false assumptions. My personal and private life is none of your business.

Therefore I would suggest you cease and desist from any further posting of that which is merely baseless assumptions in a public forum or otherwise. However it remains if you or anyone would like to contribute to this thread and discuss “What defines a gorean framework?” then by all means present your understanding for discussion. I ask nothing more and will consider nothing less.

Thank you.

I wish you well,
~Zevar~

_____________________________

Beagán agus a rá go maith.
Gaelic saying

Broken Irish is better than clever English.
Irish proverb

House of Livingston
A Gaelic Irish gentleman master
Finte na hÉireann

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 4:20:59 PM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7228
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		Oh go whine about it. You got opinions on your post that you do not like. Boo fucking hoo. You also got a serious response, but your high and mighty attitude does not allow you to engage in that portion, ebcause your delicate sense of appropriateness was hurt.

You got a very thoughtful reply in my last response, one that was serious and based in the series.

"The mean old Goreans won't play the way I want them to play."

Man up Zevar, and engage the responses. Or use an excuse to remain silent.

"Let those who can climb mountains climb them; let those who cannot climb them console themselves with denying their existence.
Rogue of Gor - Page 19 "

_____________________________

Die die glauben fordern keinen Beweis. Denen die zweifeln genuegt kein Beweis.


(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 4:28:35 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 26032
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		greetings Master Zevar

without definitions that all can understand and agree too, discussions as you are posing become meaningless. if i am speaking of apples, and you are defining oranges, the discussion that ensues will be filled with misundersgandings. i have attempted to understand where you were coming from. your personal relationship is none of my business. kiani made it open to public scrutiny, not me. my relationship with Master is none of yiour business, nor have i mentioned him here beyond saying his definition of a "gorean franework" is the only one i have a need to adhere too.

i agree i made a mistake in attempting to understand and encourage your dicussion, Master.

well wishes

tazzy

_____________________________

No body dies a virgin... life fucks everyone.

RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11

"There are no atheists getting blowjobs" ~Master Ron

+20 Heresy Points - Hard earned!

Duchess of Dissent 1

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 4:54:20 PM   
Zevar


Posts: 786
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kimveri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zevar
Perhaps you might consider answering the points you proposed if you are really serious about having a fruitful discussion and not just replying with assertions found to be meaningless calculated depraved remarks designed to result in mental and moral deficiency on your behalf.
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2748772


My "depraved" self has outlined the principles of Gorean philosophy as I see them, delineated the Gorean morality ("ideals of right conduct") as I see it, & even discussed at length the various possible ethical codes as I see them on multiple threads here & elsewhere over the years. Much of that can be found on my journals linked to my profiles on this site, yahoo's site & FL's site.

Shall I email you the links, or c/p them all here....since you've clearly not read them? Or should I take my "meaningless assertions" on these subjects & my "mental & moral deficiency" & just leave you to discuss with all your friends?

....you do know what "ad hominem" means, right?

~Kimveri




I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to. ~Author Unknown

I wish you well,
~Zevar~

_____________________________

Beagán agus a rá go maith.
Gaelic saying

Broken Irish is better than clever English.
Irish proverb

House of Livingston
A Gaelic Irish gentleman master
Finte na hÉireann

(in reply to Kimveri)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:04:47 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 781
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Ya know, I agree with Kimveri on this.


Hell hath frozen over....pigs are flying!

:-D

~K

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:17:32 PM   
Zevar


Posts: 786
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kimveri


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Ya know, I agree with Kimveri on this.


Hell hath frozen over....pigs are flying!

:-D

~K



Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful.
Samuel Johnson (1709-1784) British author

_____________________________

Beagán agus a rá go maith.
Gaelic saying

Broken Irish is better than clever English.
Irish proverb

House of Livingston
A Gaelic Irish gentleman master
Finte na hÉireann

(in reply to Kimveri)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:22:02 PM   
Dinnardin


Posts: 368
Joined: 1/9/2007
Status: offline 		The problem here is that what zevar posed as a question, he meant as a statement...he has no interest in anyone's answers, analysis or response, unless it is "Oh wow, you are correct on everything and big and muscular and don't live in your mommy's basement!"...The problem being that what he has posed is, in fact, a topic worthy of discussion, and while his point of view might be valid in the eyes of, well, him and his girl, there are other points of view, such as those in the books, those held by those who have done this for decades, those who have lived it, those who have studied it, those who have intelligence, information, education, a working knowledge of the english language, opinions, thoughts and personalities.
Perhaps, if he were to actually READ the responses he has received, read and try to understand the books, or, at the very least, try and learn from those who came before him, he might, someday, become worthy of some tiny shread of respect.
Or not.
Only time will tell.

John, AKA Dinnardin


< Message edited by Dinnardin -- 8/8/2009 5:24:53 PM >

(in reply to Kimveri)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:23:20 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 781
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline 		It is better to be silent, and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.~Silvan Engel

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:25:22 PM   
Dinnardin


Posts: 368
Joined: 1/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kimveri

It is better to be silent, and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.~Silvan Engel





or what she said


John, AKA Dinnardin


< Message edited by Dinnardin -- 8/8/2009 5:26:26 PM >

(in reply to Kimveri)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:28:50 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 781
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline 		No man is so foolish but he may sometimes give another good counsel, and no man so wise that he may not easily err if he takes no other counsel than his own. He that is taught only by himself has a fool for a master.~Ben Johnson

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:29:58 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 781
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline 		Consult your friend on all things, especially on those which respect yourself. His counsel may then be useful where your own self-love might impair your judgment.~Seneca

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:32:49 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 781
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline 		The people to fear are not those who disagree with you, but those who disagree with you and are too cowardly to let you know.~Napoleon Bonaparte

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: What defines a gorean framework? - 8/8/2009 5:37:00 PM   
Zevar


Posts: 786
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Oh go whine about it. You got opinions on your post that you do not like. Boo fucking hoo. You also got a serious response, but your high and mighty attitude does not allow you to engage in that portion, ebcause your delicate sense of appropriateness was hurt.

You got a very thoughtful reply in my last response, one that was serious and based in the series.

"The mean old Goreans won't play the way I want them to play."

Man up Zevar, and engage the responses. Or use an excuse to remain silent.

"Let those who can climb mountains climb them; let those who cannot climb them console themselves with denying their existence.
Rogue of Gor - Page 19 "



A hundred years cannot repair a moment's loss of honor.
Proverb



_____________________________

Beagán agus a rá go maith.
Gaelic saying

Broken Irish is better than clever English.
Irish proverb

House of Livingston
A Gaelic Irish gentleman master
Finte na hÉireann

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)
Profile   Post #: 80
Page:   <<   < prev  2 3 [4] 5 6   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Gorean Lifestyles >> RE: What defines a gorean framework? Page: <<   < prev  2 3 [4] 5 6   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2012
Collarchat.com is a member of the Free Speech Coalition
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

1.590