Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration

Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (Full Version)

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SpaceForMore -> Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (3/31/2006 7:29:49 PM)
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12102319/

johari -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (3/31/2006 7:58:11 PM)
OMG! Im sorry but that quote from the sheriff is just funny. ("This right here beats anything I have ever seen," Alexander told) And to think this is all happening right down the road from me. !!! HORRORS!!!!

Royalton -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (3/31/2006 10:37:20 PM)
I was about to post the same news. Here is from Fox: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190137,00.html

TheHungryTiger -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (3/31/2006 10:40:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: johari OMG! Im sorry but that quote from the sheriff is just funny. ("This right here beats anything I have ever seen," Alexander told) And to think this is all happening right down the road from me. !!! HORRORS!!!! Actualy I think it was probably closer to being "Dis' right her' done beat anythin' I'd ever did seen" ..... this is north carolina after all

Daddysredhead -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (3/31/2006 11:16:00 PM)
wow... I'm not sure if I am more surprised at this article, or finding out from my veterinarian friend that some people use Neuticles to make their male dogs appear "intact" so the dogs won't miss their balls after being fixed. Bizarre...

carolsea -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (3/31/2006 11:24:16 PM)
The sad thing is that those who don't know better thing this is an example of what sadomasochism really is - that this is what BDSM is all about. There are some very sick people in this world.

TallDarkAndWitty -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 5:28:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: carolsea The sad thing is that those who don't know better thing this is an example of what sadomasochism really is - that this is what BDSM is all about. There are some very sick people in this world. Ok, this kind of attitude really disturbs me, and when it comes from someone who is on the board of a BDSM lifestyle group, it simply leaves me speechless (well, not really speechless, I always have something to say). This is an example of BDSM. This may not be what it is all about, but it certainly is part of, at least what I consider, the scene. Everything going on here was with consent, and as a community, we should be defending these guys, not calling them "sick". If anything, your attitude is what is wrong with the BDSM community as a whole. What you do is perfectly acceptable, but what others do that you don't understand or appreciate, that is "sick". I hope, for the sake of your own BDSM community, you will re-read what you have written and, perhaps, re-read the article. Figure out if you really mean what you said. There is enough scorn, and criticism, heaped upon those who live what we live without having it come from others in the community. Taggard

MizSuz -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 6:58:40 AM)
I wish I had a dollar for every time someone has asked me to do that to them.

MadamShy -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 7:21:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty quote: ORIGINAL: carolsea The sad thing is that those who don't know better thing this is an example of what sadomasochism really is - that this is what BDSM is all about. There are some very sick people in this world. Ok, this kind of attitude really disturbs me, and when it comes from someone who is on the board of a BDSM lifestyle group, it simply leaves me speechless (well, not really speechless, I always have something to say). This is an example of BDSM. This may not be what it is all about, but it certainly is part of, at least what I consider, the scene. Everything going on here was with consent, and as a community, we should be defending these guys, not calling them "sick". If anything, your attitude is what is wrong with the BDSM community as a whole. What you do is perfectly acceptable, but what others do that you don't understand or appreciate, that is "sick". I hope, for the sake of your own BDSM community, you will re-read what you have written and, perhaps, re-read the article. Figure out if you really mean what you said. There is enough scorn, and criticism, heaped upon those who live what we live without having it come from others in the community. Taggard NO sorry this is NOT what BDSM is all about ... they did not have Medical training to Do this ... if it was a Doctor with a fetish to do this OK but not just some Men [or Woman but Men in this case] deciding to play surgical Doctor.... this is sick even if it is agreed upon because These Men did not have proper lisense's to do this and is true sadomasicism .... serious Medical play should be done by Medical people ... that is why they spend so much time in School ... NO I give NO moral support to them.. the idea that someone with NO training can pick up a scapel and castrate another just because they want it is foolish .... I get asked to do this constantly ... the answer is alway NO .. not because its a hard limit but because its totaly unsafe and I am not trained to do such procedures...

TallDarkAndWitty -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 8:07:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadamShy this is sick even if it is agreed upon because These Men did not have proper lisense's to do this and is true sadomasicism .... So true sadomasochism is a sick thing? Glad to know where you stand on the issue... quote: serious Medical play should be done by Medical people ... Complete and utter bullshit. The crappy state of healthcare today is directly related to this kind of attitude. Doctors are just people. They have not been blessed by the almighty with some magical gift. What they did is no more complex then changing a transmission (though it may carry significantly more risk). People should be allowed to get their medical treatment where they want and we should not punish the people who do a good job in treating them. quote: that is why they spend so much time in School ... NO I give NO moral support to them.. That really is a naive outlook you have there. Doctors are required to spend so much time in school to keep the supply of doctors very low. Since the demand is constant, a lower supply leads to a greater price. quote: the idea that someone with NO training can pick up a scapel and castrate another just because they want it is foolish .... The idea that it takes years of training to perform a castration is even more foolish. Ranchers perform them all the time! quote: I get asked to do this constantly ... the answer is alway NO .. not because its a hard limit but because its totaly unsafe and I am not trained to do such procedures... That, of course, is your prerogative...but what if some group of people came along and told you that you needed 4 years of schooling, another 2 of of residence, and a cropping license before you could use that crop in your mouth on anyone else? What if they arrested you when you refused to listen to the law? Would you expect the BDSM community to support you, or would you expect them to call you sick? Taggard

MadamShy -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 8:17:47 AM)
True sadomasicism was not a consentual thing it was medevil torchure cruel and sick ... was not what MOST BDSMers do ... when I say I am a sadist...or My pet sez he is a masochist ...does not mean that he wants to be marked perminately without permisson nor does it mean that subs/slaves need to fear for there lives .... a real sadist ... you should fear .I am sorry I should not have used word Real BUT should have said criminal.. and sorry I will always say Medical personal and Medical procedures should be left to the professionals... its MY opinion and I'm sticking to it ... and were not talking about a bull where talking about Humans here oh sorry it seems you were talking bull oops My bad

TallDarkAndWitty -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 8:24:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadamShy and were not talking about a bull where talking about Humans here Human beings are no more physically complex than bulls. You might want to do some research into the word sadomasochism and see how it is used on these forums. Most do not use it the way you do. Taggard

BrutalAntipathy -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 8:35:59 AM)
These were, according to the article, consenting individuals. Are we in D/s not also consenting individuals? These people made a choice which concerned their own bodies, and should be allowed that choice regardless of the opinion of others. Would you care for someone else to tell you that you could not have a body piercing or tattoo? Perhaps their choice was more extreme than one you would make, but does that give you any right to condemn them for their choice? As for legality, bear in mind that anyone that engages in knife play is comitting assault with a deadly weapon as it is defined by law. This is true regardless of consensuality. And despite the legal implications, many of us continue to practice this particular form of play. As for the medical implications, how many of you engage in the quackery of homeopathic medicine and turn your backs on centruries of medical progress? And yet you have the audacity to condemn these people for not going to a physician while you swill green tea and pop your Saint Johns Wort capsules? I suppose that hypocracy has many faces, but I hate to see it don the guise of BDSM.

TheHungryTiger -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 2:38:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BrutalAntipathy These were, according to the article, consenting individuals. Are we in D/s not also consenting individuals? These people made a choice which concerned their own bodies, and should be allowed that choice regardless of the opinion of others. Would you care for someone else to tell you that you could not have a body piercing or tattoo? Perhaps their choice was more extreme than one you would make, but does that give you any right to condemn them for their choice? absolutely I am going to condemn their “choice”. How about bulimia? If someone make themselves throw up, thats their own personal choice. Aint it? Its their own body? Ain't it? Call me close minded I guess, but Im simply not going to lovingly embrace that “choice” and say that bulimia is totally ok. How about cutters? I was once very close to a woman who suffered from self-injurious behavior and I urged them to stop. Was I being judgmental when I did that? Should I have instead just sat back doing nothing and let them continue to cut themselves under the notion that what they were doing was a “choice” and they have the right to do with their own body whatever they want? Now that being said, I have no problem with people who do roman-showers. I also have no hangups over bladeplay that breaks the skin. There is a difference between roman showers one the one hand and bulimia on the other. There is a difference between self-inflection one the one hand and erotic-cutting on the other. In a similar way, there is a difference between what these dipshits in the news article did on the one hand, and castration fantasy / gender reassignment surgery. There are some activities that I do believe are wrong. And wraping those acts up inside the word “choice” doesn't make them right.

Slipstreme -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 4:55:49 PM)
I believe people should have the right to do whatever they want to their bodies. After all it is thier body, however, I do wish some effort would be made to educate them on what they are going to do. Ie: given time to resolve why they are getting it done, and given time to come to terms with the fact the change is permanent. What I don't like is that the guys performing the operations weren't legally licensed, or, according to the article, really trained in what they were doing. Other than that, I have no problem with what they did. However, I know that if a real doctor who is legally licensed did the same thing, and his job caught word of it, he would be without a job. Why? Because such surgeries, done without medical reason are considered immoral. Major body modifications can rarely be done by a doctor, not because there aren't any that do it, but because so many would lose their job. In fact, Cat, a man who has devoted his life to becoming more and more like the tiger, has to get his surgeries in Mexico, because they are illegal in the United States. Although, Cat, a perfectly cognizent, consenting adult, who knows why he is doing what he doing and understands the permanancy of his decisions, should be able to get what he wishes here in his home.

angelic -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 6:12:16 PM)
i'm truly in shock that there are people in this life that think that this is ok... how can this be ok??? would it be ok if i went to a dungeon and said, i want you to take my heart out... and just because i am a consenting adult this is ok, why?

BrutalAntipathy -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 6:21:29 PM)
I am not concerned so much with what is ' ok ' as with what right one person has to tell another what they can do with their body. If a person desires death, why does society think it has the right to deny that person their wishes? If I die in service to my country, ie, for the ideals of others, I am a hero. If I die as a a fireman fighting a housefire, ie in the service of others, I am also considered a hero. But should I decide that I simply no longer have a desire to live, and choose to take my own life, I am labled a selfish coward. Why is that? At what point in our development did society decide that it had the privilege to enforce it's collective will upon the choices that individuals made concerning their own bodies? Why do people agree with individual freedoms only so long as they involve decisions that they would make, but jump on the condemnation bandwagon the second that someone else exercises that freedom in a way that they personally would not care to see? Please, do consult a dictionary for the word hypocrite. Or better yet, look in a mirror for a more accurate definition of the word.

MrThorns -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 6:23:25 PM)
Yeah...I read this in the paper this morning. I thought it was a bit odd that the DA and the Sherriff referred to those who had been castrated as "victims" without anyone ever coming forward and saying that they had been non-consentually castrated. According to the Apr 1st article in the Arizona Republic, (pg A-11) The house had been investigated before for sadomasochistic acts, but after an investigation, it was found that there was no illegal activity happening. The renewed investigation came from a "citizen who made strange statements". Does this sound like a nosey neighbor to you? The charges are performing castration without malice and conspiracy to commit castration without malice. Each charge has a maximum sentence of 3 years, but each suspect is facing 10 felony charges each....so that's 30 years a piece. I agree with Taggard on this one. Ranchers have been performing castrations for years. There is little difference between the skills necessary to remove a bull's testicles and the skills necessary to remove a man's. ~Thorns

angelic -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 6:58:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BrutalAntipathy I am not concerned so much with what is ' ok ' as with what right one person has to tell another what they can do with their body. If a person desires death, why does society think it has the right to deny that person their wishes? If I die in service to my country, ie, for the ideals of others, I am a hero. If I die as a a fireman fighting a housefire, ie in the service of others, I am also considered a hero. But should I decide that I simply no longer have a desire to live, and choose to take my own life, I am labled a selfish coward. Why is that? At what point in our development did society decide that it had the privilege to enforce it's collective will upon the choices that individuals made concerning their own bodies? Why do people agree with individual freedoms only so long as they involve decisions that they would make, but jump on the condemnation bandwagon the second that someone else exercises that freedom in a way that they personally would not care to see? Please, do consult a dictionary for the word hypocrite. Or better yet, look in a mirror for a more accurate definition of the word. You make very good points, i wasn't thinking of it in that way. Thank You.

sweetpleaser -> RE: Three men charged in 'dungeon' castration (4/1/2006 7:43:12 PM)
Hi Taggard, it's been a long time. I love these debates. But can I ask one itty bitty naive question? Why do these men want to be castrated? Is it to feminize themselves? Just curious.

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