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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 1:45:09 PM

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quote:

Precisely... ... so now we are getting to the crux of it. Someone who calls themselves a slave is living a fantasy then, that ends at orgasm.

?

Ah. Now I see what the problem is. You're offended by my phrase "ends at orgasm." You think I am dissing your own relationship which doesn't end at orgasm (I presume). Well, I'm not. I was thinking in terms of newbies who come on here (or where ever) and say "I want no limits." Such naivete, I am quite certain, is the result of excited hormones.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 2:04:03 PM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b

quote:

Precisely... ... so now we are getting to the crux of it. Someone who calls themselves a slave is living a fantasy then, that ends at orgasm.

?

Ah. Now I see what the problem is. You're offended by my phrase "ends at orgasm." You think I am dissing your own relationship which doesn't end at orgasm (I presume). Well, I'm not. I was thinking in terms of newbies who come on here (or where ever) and say "I want no limits." Such naivete, I am quite certain, is the result of excited hormones.

Heh... no worries Marc... I'm not offend by it because I haven't stated in this thread that I have no limits, that was another who assumed to label my preference.
And I do know and perfectly aware about the whole new persons approach who make the claim no limits without thinking about discussing what limits actually mean to them or the person the are talking to. But then, that isn't just confined to new people... hence this thread.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 2:21:29 PM

SomethingCatchy

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quote:

A hypothetical question, if you will. What if, one day, C said "I've had enough of this, I'm leaving"?

I would be angry with myself that I'd been too stupid and blind to see things he had issue with, or too stubborn to listen and care about what he needed me to know in order to fix things.

C is a methodical thinker, and takes his time making serious decisions. If he suddenly decided one day that he was leaving, I'd try to urge him to get help if I thought he was having an emotional or mental problem that I couldn't 'fix' myself.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 2:25:45 PM

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No limit relationships do exist, and I can say that with certainty because I'm in one. And what I mean by that is that I have no allowed limits. Alpha has plenty, and makes use of them whenever he likes. You like to go for extreme examples, and I am happy to refute them. Alpha could cut off a limb if he wanted to, but thankfully he doesn't. Alpha could order me to eat shit, or a bucket of pig guts, but he's not into those things. Alpha could lock me in the basement, but we don't have one. Alpha could impose anything he likes on me. Would I submit and just do whatever he wants? Not likely, in those cases, but he can and could force me if that's what he was into. And no, I am not allowed to just up and leave the relationship. If I tried, he would come and bring me back. And then maybe the basement.

I understand your point about newbies and fantasy, and I agree. Being a no limit slave really sucks sometimes, even though Alpha's limits are perfectly reasonable and eliminate a lot of the really terrible stuff. It's definitely not for most. But there really are those of us who willing enter into this kind of life and live it every day. It's not always just a fantasy.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:14:07 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MaxsGirl
No limit relationships do exist, and I can say that with certainty because I'm in one. And what I mean by that is that I have no allowed limits.

No, you two like to act as if you have no limits. You have limits, and we can find them a-plenty if we take the time. I'll say it again: no limits = non-consensual, which is impossible in most countries these days.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SomethingCatchy
I have lots of examples of when C did something he didn't want to do, but because he gave his pledge and word, he did it anyway.

No amount of slave contracts, tattoos, registration numbers or brands make the person your slave in anything other than the D/s sense, and as Marc2b states, that's a consensual relationship. You can say he has no choice all you want, but that doesn't affect reality, just the nature of your relationship.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:16:27 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

quote:

ORIGINAL: MaxsGirl
No limit relationships do exist, and I can say that with certainty because I'm in one. And what I mean by that is that I have no allowed limits.

No, you two like to act as if you have no limits. You have limits, and we can find them a-plenty if we take the time. I'll say it again: no limits = non-consensual, which is impossible in most countries these days.

/Disagree. We are not privy to her dynamic atal. There may be no limits, living or dying for Alpha could easily be within her.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:19:44 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll
/Disagree. We are not privy to her dynamic atal.

I don't have to be privy to her dynamic to know how people work.

quote:

There may be no limits, living or dying for Alpha could easily be within her.

Doubt it. If she were that extreme, she would probably not be posting here, she'd be in a cage waiting for her daily bucket of swill

quote:

ORIGINAL: SomethingCatchy
C is a methodical thinker, and takes his time making serious decisions. If he suddenly decided one day that he was leaving, I'd try to urge him to get help if I thought he was having an emotional or mental problem that I couldn't 'fix' myself.

What? You seem to be implying that if he said he wanted to leave, that would be an indication of some sort of emotional problem.

< Message edited by Chulain -- 1/27/2011 3:29:18 PM >

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:27:56 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll
/Disagree. We are not privy to her dynamic atal.

I don't have to be privy to her dynamic to know how people work.

quote:

There may be no limits, living or dying for Alpha could easily be within her.

Doubt it. If she were that extreme, she would probably not be posting here, she'd be in a cage waiting for her daily bucket of swill.

You are absolutely entitled to your opinion and must shoulder the burden of how you're perceived on your own. However, for me, people are not so transparent or I am not so arrogant to presume to pigeonhole them.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:31:50 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

No limits period? I'd be stocking up on tampons.....

Chortle. I was thinking of a joke on those lines myself.

Wouldnt a tampon be a limit?

~like others werent thinking the same thing

I think technically, that would be a barrier, but my mind is still spinning over reading "I'd set you up for a mind fuck that would scare you so bad that you'd never contemplate taking such a risk ever again." That I am probably not thinking too clearly yet. Strange the things that can make you tingle all over.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:36:09 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll
You are absolutely entitled to your opinion and must shoulder the burden of how you're perceived on your own. However, for me, people are not so transparent or I am not so arrogant to presume to pigeonhole them.

I have seen a lifetime's worth of slaves who claim to have no limits and owners who claim their slaves are incapable of disobeying them. The targets of my comments here are no different from all the those others.

Post-modernist thought notwithstanding, not all opinions are equally worthy of being taken seriously. "I have no limits" and "My slave cannot disobey me" are two examples.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:39:35 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll
/Disagree. We are not privy to her dynamic atal.

I don't have to be privy to her dynamic to know how people work.

quote:

There may be no limits, living or dying for Alpha could easily be within her.

Doubt it. If she were that extreme, she would probably not be posting here, she'd be in a cage waiting for her daily bucket of swill

quote:

ORIGINAL: SomethingCatchy
C is a methodical thinker, and takes his time making serious decisions. If he suddenly decided one day that he was leaving, I'd try to urge him to get help if I thought he was having an emotional or mental problem that I couldn't 'fix' myself.

What? You seem to be implying that if he said he wanted to leave, that would be an indication of some sort of emotional problem.

Responding to the colored phrase above...

not really ... no limits doesn't always mean that life is about extremes, and it does not mean that someone is going to act out things way way far to the extreme... that said, I don't truely believe in a no limits relationship. Any one that I've been privy to has actually proven to have limits at some point...

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 3:40:03 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll
You are absolutely entitled to your opinion and must shoulder the burden of how you're perceived on your own. However, for me, people are not so transparent or I am not so arrogant to presume to pigeonhole them.

I have seen a lifetime's worth of slaves who claim to have no limits and owners who claim their slaves are incapable of disobeying them. The targets of my comments here are no different from all the those others.

Post-modernist thought notwithstanding, not all opinions are equally worthy of being taken seriously. "I have no limits" and "My slave cannot disobey me" are two examples.

It's the broad strokes that do net set with me. Sure it is easy to say the the majority WILL have limits, however until I see the limit I'll jus take his/her D/s word for it.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 4:33:53 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MaxsGirl

No limit relationships do exist, and I can say that with certainty because I'm in one. And what I mean by that is that I have no allowed limits. Alpha has plenty, and makes use of them whenever he likes. You like to go for extreme examples, and I am happy to refute them. Alpha could cut off a limb if he wanted to, but thankfully he doesn't. Alpha could order me to eat shit, or a bucket of pig guts, but he's not into those things. Alpha could lock me in the basement, but we don't have one. Alpha could impose anything he likes on me. Would I submit and just do whatever he wants? Not likely, in those cases, but he can and could force me if that's what he was into. And no, I am not allowed to just up and leave the relationship. If I tried, he would come and bring me back. And then maybe the basement.

I understand your point about newbies and fantasy, and I agree. Being a no limit slave really sucks sometimes, even though Alpha's limits are perfectly reasonable and eliminate a lot of the really terrible stuff. It's definitely not for most. But there really are those of us who willing enter into this kind of life and live it every day. It's not always just a fantasy.

I like you. Please stay.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 4:38:26 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

Post-modernist thought notwithstanding, not all opinions are equally worthy of being taken seriously. "I have no limits" and "My slave cannot disobey me" are two examples.

Incredulity as the sole basis for an "opinion" is a better one.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 4:53:47 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll
You are absolutely entitled to your opinion and must shoulder the burden of how you're perceived on your own. However, for me, people are not so transparent or I am not so arrogant to presume to pigeonhole them.

I have seen a lifetime's worth of slaves who claim to have no limits and owners who claim their slaves are incapable of disobeying them. The targets of my comments here are no different from all the those others.

Post-modernist thought notwithstanding, not all opinions are equally worthy of being taken seriously. "I have no limits" and "My slave cannot disobey me" are two examples.

You're living in an illusion then; or trying to pretend that all people necessarily feel the same way on all accounts than you do.

All that's needed to proof that no-limit relationships are possible is ONE case in which it's proven that a person didn't have limits and actually died for their kink, and their obedience to the dominant.
And as it so happens to be... there is such a case: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armin_Meiwes

Seeing that there is at least one example of somebody that died out of obedience and for their kink, it is perfectly possible and plausible that there are others who would and have done so.

In fact, it would be highly unlikely that this is the only person in the world who would go this far for their kink.

Therefore, it is absolutely ridiculous that you claim to know enough about "how people work" to state as a fact that what MaxsGirl is saying isn't true.
I'm going to bet that you would have said that exact same thing if Bernd Brandes would have posted here saying that he had no limits and would be okay with dominant amputating his body parts and force feeding them to him... yet, that's exactly what happened.

No-limits people DO exist.

I agree that they're most likely much more rare then the over-flow of subs here on CM who claim to have no-limits.

But if you're saying they don't exist, you're living as much in an illusion as the guy in hausboy's story.

Ishtar

< Message edited by Ishtarr -- 1/27/2011 4:56:20 PM >

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 5:04:28 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

Post-modernist thought notwithstanding, not all opinions are equally worthy of being taken seriously. "I have no limits" and "My slave cannot disobey me" are two examples.

Greetings Chulain,

I believe there's a big difference between expressing an opinion and being driven by an innate need to defend our way of relating. Supporters and detractors each offer a response that will be taken with the appropriate grain of salt as determined by the audience. Clinging to the notion that what is false for one must apply to all is rather one dimensional and fails to acknowledge the experiences and individual nuances we each possess. There are valid perspectives on both sides of the argument.

Namaste,

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 5:39:19 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: asubsydneymale

quote:

I have been asked to take part in a play session that will have a period where there will be no limits, no permanent marks or injuries will occur, nothing illegal, no scat. During the no limits period, I will be bound, blindfolded and have been informed that excessive screaming will result in my mouth being taped,

I want to and don't want to - what do you think ?

you could end up screwing a skunk....so NOT my kink But you ROCK on with your no limits stuff

BadOne

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 5:57:58 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

I have seen a lifetime's worth of slaves who claim to have no limits and owners who claim their slaves are incapable of disobeying them. The targets of my comments here are no different from all the those others.

Post-modernist thought notwithstanding, not all opinions are equally worthy of being taken seriously. "I have no limits" and "My slave cannot disobey me" are two examples.

And I have a degree in Social Psychology, so I know very well that there is no "never" or "always" in human interaction. Just because you have seen "a lifetime's worth of slaves" that fit your perception of how slaves behave (and I'll point out here that you haven't, because your life isn't over yet) doesn't mean that you have encountered every kind of M/s dynamic that exists. Alpha and I don't go to munches and meetings and proclaim our no-limit status to anyone who will listen. We don't even discuss it privately, for the most part. It exists and we both know it, so why would we feel the need to publicize it left and right?

To claim complete knowledge of the minds and dynamic of every M/s pair in existence is ridiculous and arrogant. You clearly have no clue what goes on in my relationship. I'm not in a cage eating swill because that isn't what he wants (though the cage has come up, so my status on that count might be changing soon). Believe me, he does plenty of things to me that I hate, and that I have begged him to stop doing. Those things would be my hard limits, if I were allowed to have them. Sometimes I'd like to have limits, but that's not going to happen in this relationship. You'll also never hear Alpha claiming that I never disobey him. I disobey him plenty, and suffer the consequences - often those aforementioned hated things that he likes to do from time to time. But the rest of the time our relationship is pretty ordinary. As a previous poster said, it's not about extremes. If Alpha wants to to maim me, he will. But usually he just wants me to cook him some dinner and then cuddle on the couch and watch a movie.

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 6:17:13 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ishtarr
You're living in an illusion then; or trying to pretend that all people necessarily feel the same way on all accounts than you do.

It has nothing to do with my feelings. For someone to say "I have no limits" is nonsensical, as nonsensical as "I can predict the future with my dreams."

quote:

All that's needed to proof that no-limit relationships are possible is ONE case in which it's proven that a person didn't have limits and actually died for their kink, and their obedience to the dominant.
And as it so happens to be... there is such a case: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armin_Meiwes

That's the German guy who wanted to be killed and eaten, right? I think we can safely say that someone who wants to be killed and eaten is insane. The insane are as legally incapable of consenting as children are. A sane person has no limits only to the extent they agree they have no limits, just as someone is a slave, in the D/s meaning, only to the extent they agree. If it requires their agreement (i.e., their consent), that implies they can withdraw that agreement (i.e., that consent) at any time. If they cannot withdraw consent, then it's an illegal relationship in he U.S. and other countries.

And Mr. Meiwes could have said at any time "Oops, changed my mind. Don't wanna be killed and eaten after all. Catch ya later." Your mention of this case is what we in the biz call a red herring, because while you think it scores some sort of point for your position, it does not.

What is so hard to grasp about the phrase "consensual non-consent?" All D/s master/slave relationships (legal ones) are based on the idea of consensual non-consent. As Marc2b stated a while back, if you want to play that you have no limits or that your slave cannot disobey you, more power to you. But if you're going to claim in a public discussion forum that such is the case, you're in the same realm as someone who seriously posts "I've been kidnapped by aliens."

quote:

ORIGINAL: Madame4a
no limits doesn't always mean that life is about extremes

You're right, "no limits" means "no limits." It does not mean what some posters seem to say it means: "I have no limits. Well, other than these, you know, limits over here."

< Message edited by Chulain -- 1/27/2011 6:24:53 PM >

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RE: no limits period - 1/27/2011 6:26:09 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain
A sane person has no limits only to the extent they agree they have no limits, just as someone is a slave, in the D/s meaning, only to the extent they agree. If it requires their agreement (i.e., their consent), that implies they can withdraw that agreement (i.e., that consent) at any time. If they cannot withdraw consent, then it's an illegal relationship in he U.S. and other countries.

I did agree, from the time we changed from D/s to 24/7 M/s, that I would be allowed no limits and that this relationship would not end unless he ended it. I cannot withdraw consent, or leave. Yes, this is technically illegal, if you think about it that way. So is sodomy, in some states. So is smoking pot, and plenty of people do that as well. For that matter, speeding is illegal, and if you claim you never speed you're full of it. The legal status of my relationship has nothing to do with the reality of the way it runs. In some parts of the world it is illegal to be gay, but there are plenty of gay couples out there that live every day in violation of the law.

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