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RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 9:19:02 AM

julietsierra

Posts: 1841
Joined: 9/26/2004
Status: offline

Somewhere along the line in our relationship (and it was early on), as it pertained to a conversation we were having, I told him that I'd be here until he told me to go. I did not wind up with a collar, nor did I expect one. I just told him where I stood and left the rest up to him - no expectations although always a hope. But beyond that, I never wanted to ask him to collar me. The way I looked at it - and still look at it is that if he wanted to he would and I wasn't going to push for something he'd want to do in his time, in his way and when he had made the decision that that's where we were going.

Oh, and I never have wanted him to "need" me. I've always hoped he wanted me. And I knew then, as I know now, that if he didn't want me, he'd tell me to go.

The thing is, I never did this because I was afraid to risk rejection. I did this because what he wanted for himself was and is always his decision. I don't want to even get in the middle of that. In my mind, he was the dominant and I knew where I stood for me. I'd be here for him until he told me to go.

I wear his collar now. He didn't really ask me. He just formalized what he already knew. He made the decision for himself. I submitted - whether it was to wear his collar or not to wear his collar - as he saw fit.

And even today... when life hands out it's more difficult times and I get frustrated as people can get from time to time, when it all comes down to it...

I'm here for him until he tells me to go.

juliet

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 21

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 10:03:01 AM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl
I believe I am wanted, not needed. There's a security in that, too. I'd rather someone owned me out of want, rather than need. I rely on M, he does not rely on me. There's no way that I can measure his want against my need and gain a sense of security.

agirl

I relate to this. He wants me, he does not need me. That common phrase I see used a lot: "Never make someone your priority who considers you his option" (or something like that) doesn't wash with me at all. Of course I'm his option - he's the owner. But that's just me.

Here's a repost of what I wrote in a thread a couple of days ago about why I begged his collar. If he did not want me, he would not have accepted me as his:

"I begged for my collar, and then was sent off to think about some very serious questions he asked me with regard to being collared by him, before he granted it. A slave will always have to beg/petition him for his collar. This way both he and she are very clear about what it is she asking for, and about her desire and willingness to take that step with him. He does not want a slave who is not fully aware of what slavery to him requires, and who does not absolutely want to be there. This process makes both parties certain of that. I for one am grateful for that opportunity. If he had "asked" me to wear his collar, that would have put me (a) in the drivers seat as to what direction we were going in; and (b) in a position of possibly accepting it as an effort to give him what he wanted, even if I was uncertain. His process protected us from that. "

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 22

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 10:23:37 AM

DesertRat

Posts: 2774
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: NM/USA
Status: offline

I've been asked twice. In each case, the girl already knew she was wanted; the asking simply made the consensual submission more explicit.

Bob

_____________________________

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro--Hunter S. Thompson
It's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide!--Chief Dead St. Knockout, 1933, Liverpool
Damn the crops. I'll only find peace at the end of a rope.--Winston Van Loo, 1911

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 23

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 10:42:51 AM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline

Hi owned girlie,

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I believe I am wanted, not needed. There's a security in that, too. I'd rather someone owned me out of want, rather than need. I rely on M, he does not rely on me. There's no way that I can measure his want against my need and gain a sense of security.

agirl

I relate to this. He wants me, he does not need me. That common phrase I see used a lot: "Never make someone your priority who considers you his option" (or something like that) doesn't wash with me at all. Of course I'm his option - he's the owner. But that's just me.

Here's a repost of what I wrote in a thread a couple of days ago about why I begged his collar. If he did not want me, he would not have accepted me as his:

"I begged for my collar, and then was sent off to think about some very serious questions he asked me with regard to being collared by him, before he granted it. A slave will always have to beg/petition him for his collar. This way both he and she are very clear about what it is she asking for, and about her desire and willingness to take that step with him. He does not want a slave who is not fully aware of what slavery to him requires, and who does not absolutely want to be there. This process makes both parties certain of that. I for one am grateful for that opportunity. If he had "asked" me to wear his collar, that would have put me (a) in the drivers seat as to what direction we were going in; and (b) in a position of possibly accepting it as an effort to give him what he wanted, even if I was uncertain. His process protected us from that. "

If I'd hoped or wished for him to need me, I'd have waited a bloody long time and still be waiting now. Being needed isn't the measure of being special, unique or significant.

If I dropped out of existance, he would fare significantly better than I would, should the situation be reversed. I can't alter that fact.

agirl

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 24

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 11:30:23 AM

junecleaver

Posts: 1145
Joined: 4/6/2005
Status: offline

When he wanted to make it 'official,' he just asked me if I was ready because he knew that I had always wanted it. I think that counts as being asked. Lots of relationships are intiated by the Dominant---although to me they seem to be more D/s oriented than M/s oriented.

_____________________________

"No one will ever win the battle of the sexes; there's too much fraternizing with the enemy. "
--Henry A. Kissinger

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 25

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 1:32:26 PM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: littlespicyone

I think that it's kind of assumed that a submisive will ask to belong to a Dominant, but is it unreasonable for me to hope that someday a Dominant will ask me to be His?

I don't think so. There wasn't any asking involving in our relationship. We talked about it and agreed on it.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 26

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 2:53:46 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

You both have to say yes, whoever does the asking is nothing more than a matter of personal preference.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 27

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 5:46:10 PM

liljoy

Posts: 577
Joined: 3/25/2004
Status: offline

i am not allowed to ask for His collar. When He decides that i have earned the right to wear His collar He will place it on my neck.
That is our relationship. Others have a different set up

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 28

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/13/2007 11:57:25 PM

hawkwolf7

Posts: 85
Joined: 10/24/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: littlespicyone

I think that it's kind of assumed that a submisive will ask to belong to a Dominant, but is it unreasonable for me to hope that someday a Dominant will ask me to be His?

littlespicyone,

This is probably going to seem overly harsh to you, and for that I apologize. Nonetheless, I think it needs to be said.

To me, your desire to be asked stems from one (or a combination) of three sources; 1) the desire for security, 2) the desire for validation that you are wanted, or 3) a desire to act out some fairy-tale romance. I'll address each one of these separately.

First, the desire for security, whether it be financial, or emotional, or both means that you are not yet secure enough within yourself to meet those needs for yourself. Which would mean that you are dependent upon your Dominant to meet those needs. So, instead of serving him and enriching his life, you may simply become another burden. In my experience, this is a setup for failure. On the other hand, if you are financially and emotionally secure within yourself, then you are truly able to enrich his life.

Second, the desire for validation that you are wanted, while terribly human, puts your Dominant in the position of being responsible for your self esteem. And while many of us share that desire, there is no more cruel act than to lay that burden on someone else. It doesn't allow them to be human, it doesn't allow them to have bad days, it doesn't allow them to be insecure about their own desirability. They have to be superman to meet your needs. This is also a setup for failure in a relationship, and leads to resentment by both.

Third, a desire to act out a fairy-tale romance shows me someone who doesn't have their feet on the ground. They are not seeing the often harsh realities of relationships: paying bills, going to work, trying to connect when one or both are tired and grumpy. These are people who are likely to become disillusioned when life gets hard. And the hard times are exactly the times when a clear-eyed partner is most needed.

I believe the ideal case occurs when neither partner needs the other, but rather when both want the other in their lives, and choose every day to make that happen. And each knows that the choice is made totally of their own free will... not out of obligation, not out of need, not out of convenience, not out of a fantasy image in their heads, and not because it is more comfortable to stay. And that knowledge is truly the only security or validation there is. If they are still there in the morning, it's because being with you is what they choose even when they don't have to.

So, for all of the reasons mentioned above, if I had a submissive who wanted or needed me to ask her to be mine, all my alarm bells would go off, and I would walk away.

This is not to say I would never ask someone to wear my collar, but it would be because it was what I wanted, and would happen when I thought the relationship was strong enough, and close enough to the ideal case to succeed.

Look for your answers and the ability to meet your needs inside yourself. Learn to validate yourself and provide your own security. Become the best whole person you can. It will mean that you have much much more to offer your partner.

HW

< Message edited by hawkwolf7 -- 5/14/2007 12:03:25 AM >

_____________________________

p.s. Everything I write is simply one person's opinion: mine. Feel free to take what is useful and blow off the rest.

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost.

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 29

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/14/2007 12:08:47 AM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

Hi owned girlie,

Hi back atcha :)

quote:

If I'd hoped or wished for him to need me, I'd have waited a bloody long time and still be waiting now. Being needed isn't the measure of being special, unique or significant.

I hear you. Him needing me would not work for us. And him not needing me does not mean, as you put it so well, that I am not special, unique or significant to him.

quote:

If I dropped out of existance, he would fare significantly better than I would, should the situation be reversed. I can't alter that fact.

agirl

Again we relate, although he is preparing me to fare in his absence. But my need doesn't go away, nor do I want it to.

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 30

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/14/2007 4:26:37 AM

HeavansKeeper

Posts: 1254
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline

I collared My Pet once she made it clear she wanted it. It was her last decision truely free of "What would Master want?" I urged (forced) her to accept or deny me purely of her own accord. It would seem likely that a dominant personality would ask the submissive personality to be his slave/pet/sub... MUCH stranger things have happened than a sub asking to be his.

Is it unreasonable to hope that he will ask you? No, it isn't.

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 31

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/14/2007 10:40:31 PM

Kinkypupper

Posts: 713
Joined: 9/26/2004
From: Portland oregon
Status: offline

Not unreasonable at all in any way.

_____________________________

Phil Moulton
A Sensual Touch
Locopony Racing
Portland Oregon

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 32

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/14/2007 10:44:08 PM

ownedandcollared

Posts: 217
Joined: 1/21/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MellowSir

"Hope is that thing with feathers, that perches in the soul"~Emily Dickinson

Beautiful

(in reply to MellowSir)

Post #: 33

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/14/2007 10:46:50 PM

ownedandcollared

Posts: 217
Joined: 1/21/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: littlespicyone

I think that it's kind of assumed that a submisive will ask to belong to a Dominant, but is it unreasonable for me to hope that someday a Dominant will ask me to be His?

it is my opinion that a Dominant should ask. Mine did. I thnk that its kind of a mutual asking thing. in my experience (which is the only thing i can give you) was that i asked to be His slave, and He asked if i would accept His collar (a couple years down the road)

Basically, though, i think that if you want your dominant to ask you to be his, then that is what you should get.

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 34

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/15/2007 7:31:12 AM

Archer

Posts: 3207
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

Different folks expect different things.
Personally I let folks know up front that I expect to be petitioned for service.
I have my reasons for it, they apply to the way I view things.

There is no question in someone's mind that reads my profile/ talks with me for any length of time about D/s, that I work this way.

In the end what you have to figure out is how the person/ people you are relating to expect things to happen.

"So how do you view collars, collaring, asking, offering, etc?" That is a meaningfull question that might give you insight into if your expectation is reasonable or not (for that person).

(in reply to ownedandcollared)

Post #: 35

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/15/2007 12:16:16 PM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

I don't know why it's assumed that dom/mes can't ask. He wanted me, he knew I was the right one for me, he told me he wanted to collar me. I liked the fact that he was assertive enough to go after what he wanted. If he had waited for me to ask he would still be waiting, I don't go around courting rejection. But then again, he knew this about me.

(in reply to Archer)

Post #: 36

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 5/16/2007 5:05:09 AM

MissOchistic

Posts: 315
Joined: 4/30/2007
Status: offline

i very subtly (or so i like to think ^^) courted Master's collar.

When was/is His decision.

It's like telling a guy you like him...you don't have to ask, but you've put it out on the table that should he want to ask you to dinner, you'd say yes...then no one has to get rejected.

_____________________________

"The amount i care for Thee
is more than two, but less than three."

"Submission is a potlatch."

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 37

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 6/7/2007 7:41:52 AM

colouredin

Posts: 4279
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mstrjx

I should think it's like getting married. At some point, 'someone' has to ask, and it probably doesn't matter who.

I understand your point, though. If you ask for a collar, you are taking the risk of rejection and making your feelings known. If you are asked, then you know you are desired.

Jeff

But if its accepted then you know you are desired!! I think it doesnt matter either way, one would have thought for most if you get to that stage you will both have an awareness of the others feelings

(in reply to mstrjx)

Post #: 38

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 6/7/2007 9:04:53 AM

CitizenCane

Posts: 349
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: littlespicyone

Which begs another question. Is it unreasonable to want the One I give myself to to need me? Certainly not in the way that I need Him, but still need what I can offer Him.

A lot depends on what you mean by 'need'. The usual way of interpreting this term in relationships suggests dependency, emotional or otherwise, that may not fit very well with the idea of dominance. A sense of being 'needed' may give you a sense of security, but it may also give you a sense of 'control' and become a place from which to resist authority. While I think that it's hard to clearly delineate the differences between passions and emotional needs, I think it's clear that to be effective a dominant must have control over, rather than be controlled by, these 'needs'.

(in reply to littlespicyone)

Post #: 39

RE: Am I being unreasonable? - 6/7/2007 9:52:25 AM

slaverosebeauty

Posts: 1941
Joined: 12/12/2004
From: Cali
Status: offline

I'm old fashioned, if a man asks me to wear his 'collar' is also asking me to marry him, would I ask, probably not. For me, marriage and collaring go together in seperate 'ceremonies' and for different cultures, but the same result and reason, an eternal bond of love and trust.

I let a Master take the lead on where things go, I may try to move things along a bit fasters at times, but for the most part, I will defer to him; he an I maybe thinking the same thing, he just wants to know if its mutual, without asking. Tricky tricky.

_____________________________

http://slaverosebeauty.livejournal.com/

"Friends live on in our hearts, regardless if they are here or not."

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 40

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