RE: so new and so confused...as a sub

RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (Full Version)

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HeavansKeeper -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/16/2007 7:14:30 PM)
As a human, regardless of if you are sub or not, you have the RIGHT to say no. No Dom, Owner, Master can take that away from you. The worst a Dom can do is cast you from his service. As soon as you begin to object, it becomes battery and/or rape to touch you. A good Master makes his (or her) sub want to be there. It should bring a wracking physical agony to remove the collar. A sub is not a prisoner. Simply stop being his sub. If you want him to still be your friend, treat his as such. Since it's online only it's much easier. Next time he says "Get on your knees" respond with "No, you get on your knees. I bought a strap-on today. Go upstairs and put on the orange sundress. If you do your make-up nice and pretty I'll let you suck it." ... Maybe he's a closet online sub.

MagiksSlave -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/16/2007 7:16:07 PM)
Wait everyone is missing something that jumped out at me!!!!! She is IN LOVE with him?? a man that she has never met who she knows is cheating on his girlfriand to be with her.. lets not even look at the fact that nothing about her is what he wants as he is insisting she lose waight and even have plastic sergery!!!! But come on where are HER morals how can she be the other woman and be ok with the fact that she knows he is just useing his now girlfriend and that as far as she know he will leave this girl friend as soon as she is what he wants that doesnt make her a hell of a lot better then this jerk!!!! Come on as soon as I heard that I was gunna be the other women and that he was thinking of leaving her for me.. eventually Id be so out of there Id want no part of causeing this other women pain.. I mean its not like he is leaving her and she is the next one he wants to be with, no he is waiting till the op is good enough useing this other girl to have someone untill she is if she ever is, if he was ever really going to leave her in the first place.. and as others have said if he is lieing soo much to his g/f what in the world would make her think he is beeing at all honest with her. What makes her special that he would lie to the girl he lives with and has a busyness with risking all of that and isnt lieing to the OP who he has never even met!!! You need to wake up and smell the coffee dear and think of how your actions effect others, get over the sub frenzy and start beeing an adult!! Sorry i know that was mean but I dont like cheaters and I dont like the ones that help them cheat much better. Magik's slave

TemptingNviceSub -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/16/2007 7:22:03 PM)
You are looking at it from a Polyamorous Masters point of view..many are looking at it from a "NEW" submissives point of view..which do you think would be the better point of view to consider?.....Tempting

FelinePersuasion -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/16/2007 7:28:02 PM)
Actually they can. Some dominants do not allow their property or girls to say no to them ever, and if you go into that setting in agreement to that, then you don't have those rights any more, according to the contact you signed understanding that saying no and refusing is not allowed. If you however did not agree that saying no wouldn't ever be allowed that's differnt. quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper As a human, regardless of if you are sub or not, you have the RIGHT to say no. No Dom, Owner, Master can take that away from you.

Valyraen -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/16/2007 7:50:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FelinePersuasion Actually they can. Some dominants do not allow their property or girls to say no to them ever, and if you go into that setting in agreement to that, then you don't have those rights any more, according to the contact you signed understanding that saying no and refusing is not allowed. If you however did not agree that saying no wouldn't ever be allowed that's differnt. quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper As a human, regardless of if you are sub or not, you have the RIGHT to say no. No Dom, Owner, Master can take that away from you. There ain't a court in the whole of the States that recognizes one of those contracts as a binding legal document... so, I'm sorry to say, those contracts are only valid so long as both of the participant parties choose to abide by them. They're no more "real" than the price quoted to you by a sleazy used-car salesman.

MstrssPassion -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/16/2007 7:52:01 PM)
those contracts aren't worth the paper & ink used to create them.... if one human being tells another human being no & this no is ignored.... the one doing the ignoring will have hell to pay

MrDiscipline44 -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 5:46:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TemptingNviceSub You are looking at it from a Polyamorous Masters point of view..many are looking at it from a "NEW" submissives point of view..which do you think would be the better point of view to consider?.....Tempting All of them. But most seem to think along narrow lines of my view is the only view and he must be a bad, bad man. There are variables to this that are unseen, so I'm looking at all possibilities.

imthatacheyouhav -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 5:54:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave Wait everyone is missing something that jumped out at me!!!!! She is IN LOVE with him?? a man that she has never met who she knows is cheating on his girlfriand to be with her.. lets not even look at the fact that nothing about her is what he wants as he is insisting she lose waight and even have plastic sergery!!!! But come on where are HER morals how can she be the other woman and be ok with the fact that she knows he is just useing his now girlfriend and that as far as she know he will leave this girl friend as soon as she is what he wants that doesnt make her a hell of a lot better then this jerk!!!! Come on as soon as I heard that I was gunna be the other women and that he was thinking of leaving her for me.. eventually Id be so out of there Id want no part of causeing this other women pain.. I mean its not like he is leaving her and she is the next one he wants to be with, no he is waiting till the op is good enough useing this other girl to have someone untill she is if she ever is, if he was ever really going to leave her in the first place.. and as others have said if he is lieing soo much to his g/f what in the world would make her think he is beeing at all honest with her. What makes her special that he would lie to the girl he lives with and has a busyness with risking all of that and isnt lieing to the OP who he has never even met!!! You need to wake up and smell the coffee dear and think of how your actions effect others, get over the sub frenzy and start beeing an adult!! Sorry i know that was mean but I dont like cheaters and I dont like the ones that help them cheat much better. Magik's slave Well said and very good point.

eyesopened -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 5:58:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MrDiscipline44 Great work people!! To think, this girl might have actually had a relationship with someone. Fuck the fact that she may have been happy or that these are may have been changes that he saw she wanted and was willing to push her to. Fuck the fact that not everyone wants someone off the shelf and that some actually do like to mold a person into what they see they can be. Fuck all that shit. Well done, well done indeed!! Good way to hussle!! i didn't read any genuine happiness in her post. Really...plastic surgery? Hmmm.... if i want to build my own customized Corvette should i start with a Kia because they are so cheap and then i can rebuild everything? i'm trying to think of one single thing this so-called Master likes about this dear woman besides her being a newbie, being online and her thinking an hour's drive is "distant". i understand that for many people that online only is still a relationship but the OP deserves better than being told she needs to be a totally different person by someone who isn't honest in His primary relationship.

SimplyMichael -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 8:16:07 AM)
Mr Discipliner, I hate to break into your fantasy but I don't think you are even qualified to teach. Poly my ass! Fucking over multiple people isn't poly, having informed consenting partners is poly and this asshole you seem to support isn't informing his partners and since you think that is hunky dory, I would run your ass out of any bdsm group I belong to, lucky I don't have that power here.

MrDiscipline44 -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 9:32:33 AM)
LOL Test subject A becomes extremely agitated when presented with plausable alternatives. Beating his chest in a mock display of dominance, he believes that bullying others is a show of his twue manhood. He still holds on to fictional statements, unwilling to see that they have no real basis.

SimplyMichael -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 9:49:44 AM)
I know that lying and cheating are plausible and that people like yourself and most cops think that it is perfectly acceptable for them to do so. Others of us try and set our standards of behavior a bit higher. What's next, you going to start talking about mentoring and training submissives?

MadRabbit -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 9:51:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MrDiscipline44 All of them. But most seem to think along narrow lines of my view is the only view and he must be a bad, bad man. There are variables to this that are unseen, so I'm looking at all possibilities. Actually, I tend to agree with your line of thinking and its why I never make threads asking for advice regarding my own personal life or relationships and rarely ever post in reply to such a thread. I am not very comfortable with offering advice threw such a limited and innacurate communication tool, based solely on the even more limted information provided. However, when I do, I base my reply as solely my opinion and respond based on the information given and dont try to speculate past what is present, because this unfortanely all anyone CAN do. Insulting people because they provided advice that is always subjective to opinion when someone asks for advice on a situation is pretty unfair. When it comes to the Internet, its the responsibility of anyone who reads these threads to realize the limitations of the system and that it is solely opinion. It could be possible that I am, in fact, not a human being but a self aware bunny rabbit with exceptional typing skills. But based on the information provided, most people can comfortably rule out that possibility and make opinions accordingly. I dont see anyone here doing anything different. Personally, I dont think your malicous as many people here are trying to make you out to be. Just bored.

OsideGirl -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 9:56:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit Insulting people because they provided advice that is always subjective to opinion when someone asks for advice on a situation is pretty unfair. When it comes to the Internet, its the responsibility of anyone who reads these threads to realize the limitations of the system and that it is solely opinion. That was very well said.

MadRabbit -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 10:36:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OsideGirl quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit Insulting people because they provided advice that is always subjective to opinion when someone asks for advice on a situation is pretty unfair. When it comes to the Internet, its the responsibility of anyone who reads these threads to realize the limitations of the system and that it is solely opinion. That was very well said. Thank you for the compliment =). Unfortanely now I cant post anymore as I have to go eat some carrots and drink water from the large bottle hanging on my cage wall.

FelinePersuasion -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 11:27:14 AM)
Of course their not legal, but if you agree to abide by a rule of the Master's, then that master can indeed tell you that you have no right to say no. Not legally, but in your dynamic He can. If you then refuse to abide by the dynamic you agreed to, then that usualy means the disolving of the relationship. not always, but if I agreed to abide by certain rules then refused to we wouldn't have the dynamic we both agreed on. quote: ORIGINAL: Valyraen There ain't a court in the whole of the States that recognizes one of those contracts as a binding legal document... so, I'm sorry to say, those contracts are only valid so long as both of the participant parties choose to abide by them. They're no more "real" than the price quoted to you by a sleazy used-car salesman.

MagiksSlave -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 1:44:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: imthatacheyouhav quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave Wait everyone is missing something that jumped out at me!!!!! She is IN LOVE with him?? a man that she has never met who she knows is cheating on his girlfriand to be with her.. lets not even look at the fact that nothing about her is what he wants as he is insisting she lose waight and even have plastic sergery!!!! But come on where are HER morals how can she be the other woman and be ok with the fact that she knows he is just useing his now girlfriend and that as far as she know he will leave this girl friend as soon as she is what he wants that doesnt make her a hell of a lot better then this jerk!!!! Come on as soon as I heard that I was gunna be the other women and that he was thinking of leaving her for me.. eventually Id be so out of there Id want no part of causeing this other women pain.. I mean its not like he is leaving her and she is the next one he wants to be with, no he is waiting till the op is good enough useing this other girl to have someone untill she is if she ever is, if he was ever really going to leave her in the first place.. and as others have said if he is lieing soo much to his g/f what in the world would make her think he is beeing at all honest with her. What makes her special that he would lie to the girl he lives with and has a busyness with risking all of that and isnt lieing to the OP who he has never even met!!! You need to wake up and smell the coffee dear and think of how your actions effect others, get over the sub frenzy and start beeing an adult!! Sorry i know that was mean but I dont like cheaters and I dont like the ones that help them cheat much better. Magik's slave Well said and very good point. ((nods)) and im failing to see why people havent said anything about that, they are all running to her aid telling her how bad this "Master" is but no one is saying that the Op isnt much better for her part in all of this or that the right and moral thing to do (In my opinion) would be to get out and tell him you arent interested in helping him cheat!! Magik's slave

celticlord2112 -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 2:18:43 PM)
Where there is doubt, there is no doubt. This "master" asks much but offers little in return. As for his always telling you the truth...unless you can independently verify what he tells you, you take him on faith. This was your first...learn from this experience, but realize that the time has come for you to find another. quote: ORIGINAL: subdie Hi i am totally new to this and have been seeking an outlet to discuss my current situation, I love my master to the end dearly i do & i am collared... he always tells me the truth (even things i wish i didnt know) and tells me he loves me...but i have hit a roadblock allowing me to move on emotionally tp be the best sub i could be he has always told me about his vanilla live in girlfriend all the time somuch so they own houses and run a business....he tells me he wants me to change alot about myself weight, fitness and name etc then he will leave her to be with me... however i am having trouble thinking around his vanilla girlfriend she has no idea i exist....this is my first time with a dominant , i know it is a latent need....as i havent met him yet due to his vanilla girlfriend and he lives in another city an hour away...i question am i setting myself up for failure.....and that this is only play for him....he has given me a fewgifts...but tells me only when i loose all my weight then we can and be 24/7....i am getting uncertain, communication is on his terms mostly i keep a journal to express such feelings but alwys it is turned back on me saying i knew this when he collared me...i am jsut so lost as i am so new to this if not feeling a little worthless....any ideas as i cant talk to my vanilla friends...he had other subs while being with his vanilla girlfriend...nothing ever eventuated in real time..i just worry maybe he only wants to keepit online/phone tilliam his idea of perfection.....

slaveish -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 3:09:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave ((nods)) and im failing to see why people havent said anything about that, they are all running to her aid telling her how bad this "Master" is but no one is saying that the Op isnt much better for her part in all of this or that the right and moral thing to do (In my opinion) would be to get out and tell him you arent interested in helping him cheat!! Because it's not an issue for everyone. We don't all have the same moral makeup. What's ok to me might well be poison to you, and vice versa. I, for example, don't know why you felt compelled to attack this girl from the pulpit. Such ... ~anger~ ... flung toward someone you do not know, speaking about a situation with which you are uninvolved, puzzles me. The girl is obviously in pain enough already. Truth (as you see it) spoken with compassion will further your cause with greater speed than will words of venemous disdain.

Valyraen -> RE: so new and so confused...as a sub (5/17/2007 4:16:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FelinePersuasion Of course their not legal, but if you agree to abide by a rule of the Master's, then that master can indeed tell you that you have no right to say no. Not legally, but in your dynamic He can. If you then refuse to abide by the dynamic you agreed to, then that usualy means the disolving of the relationship. not always, but if I agreed to abide by certain rules then refused to we wouldn't have the dynamic we both agreed on. quote: ORIGINAL: Valyraen There ain't a court in the whole of the States that recognizes one of those contracts as a binding legal document... so, I'm sorry to say, those contracts are only valid so long as both of the participant parties choose to abide by them. They're no more "real" than the price quoted to you by a sleazy used-car salesman. I completely agree... the point that I'm trying to make, however, is that those contracts only exist so long as both parties consent to keep them in existence. If Aqua really, really didn't feel like doing something, there's no way I can legally force her to do it. Short form of my argument - you're only a dom as long as your sub agrees with you. Short form as it applies to the post I originally quoted - you only don't have the right to say "no" to your dominant as long as you agree that you don't have the right, because of the consentual nature of a BDSM contract. Just to clarify - I don't mean to come off like I'm attacking, by any means. Just saw your post and felt like I had to raise a hand and say "Wait, that's not always true..."

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