RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves?

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/9/2007 8:46:40 PM

BossyShoeBitch

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Faramir

Plenty of M/s couples share eros love deeply, fully and reciprocally. Of course there are those people who have a model of love and power that is a single axis scale, where at one end we find authority, power, the willingness to exercise it, and at the other end love and intimacy. Given such a model, you can choose between fully wielding authority, fully loving, or some sort of partial solution that compromises both.

I think that is a pretty stupid model. A better model would be the one behind the Marshalk Interactive Method assesment tool (MIMS): love and discipline on seperate axes. In the middle of each axis is a healthy norm, and at the axis ends an unhealthy excess or an unhealthy abscence. So one might love in a healthy way (the midpoint), be coldly unattached at one end and smothering at the other end. On the discipline axis, one might be properly authoritative at the midpoint, weak at one end and arbitrarily or tyrannically weilding power at the other end.

Faramir,
Maybe you could be a bit less.. technical? I feel like I am reading a textbook
here!

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/11/2007 4:54:08 PM

aurora31

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Smiles....I have said this before and I will do so again here. I am in a poly M/s relationship. While I care for and love my Sir very much and my Sir cares for and loves me very much, We ARE NOT IN LOVE. My Sir feels very strongly that if he were to fall in love with us his emotions would stand in the way of our individual journeys into our submission. At first this was a very hard concept for me to understand. But the more time I spend in his house serving him the more I agree with him. To me it is very much like a parent child relationship. As a parent I love my children very much. But I do not allow my love for them to stand in the way of providing the discipline and structure necessary to grow a mature well balanced adult. After all that is the end goal of raising children. My Sir loves me and cares for me yet he does not fall in love with me and this allows him to grow a mature and well balanced slave. By doing this phrases like "if you really loved me" do not work. Just as they don't work when your child uses that same phrase to do something inappropriate that they very strongly want to do.

aurora

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/11/2007 6:45:16 PM

MasterSim

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Allow me to post a response to this question. Greeting All I am Master Sim, my slave is known here as mastersimspet. Personally I love the bitch deeply and she is very aware of it, though she is slave and cares for my needs to utmost of her ability she still has a place within my heart and I shall love with her. Though we live as Master/slave, we are still Man and woman. She has known many a lash from the sting of my whip upon the flesh of her back for her insolence, for her disobedience. She serves at my feet, she wears collar and leash and i walked as my pet, she experiences punishment and humiliation in the name of love for her Master. It is not a weakness upon my part to show her love, it is not a weakness to cradle her within my arms, to stroke her hair gently and kiss her passionate, for she lives for her Master and so to her Master bestows trust upon her and sleeps peacefully beside her at night as he knows that she shall protect him with her very life and no harm shall befall him. Yes, I have no weakness for i am Man, I have no fears, but yet i can confess without hesitation that I as Master am in Love with my slave and shall be until the very stars fall from the heavens above

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/13/2007 5:49:45 AM

TigerNINTails

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Without getting into why "Masters" in general don't fall in love with their slaves, I'll simply speak on why I don't "fall in love" with mine.

In my mind, to fall in love, is one of the largest epitomes of being in a lacking state of control. It's my firm belief, that in order to control someone else, to dominate them, to master them even, one must first strive for, continuously, control of themselves, their emotions, their physical health, well being, etc.

I find no weakness in love of another, but what I do find weakness in is falling in love without restraint. The reason behind this is pretty simple. If I can't control the rate at which my emotions grow, then how am I supposed to control my emotions at all? If that's the case, how can I control, guide, teach another? Again, that's not to say that I don't love.

In fact, I tend to love very deeply. Further, that same love helps me to push through on disciplines that my slaves require for their growth and learning.

So in so far as falling in love with any of my pets, I have to say, no... That isn't for me.

Loving my slaves... Of course. Being IN love with them... No. The whole being "in love" with someone is something I've experienced before, and just simply due to it's rampant and explosive growth and energy, it left me in a really weird head/heart space and the repercussions that resulted from that in my relationship were definitely less than ideal for me.

It fucks my head up. Things become not so clear. So I don't have a problem caring for and loving my slaves, but that whole falling in love thing... Who the hell needs it??

Anyway, there's my two cents... Or whatever it was worth.

Peace.

Tora Kuo

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/13/2007 6:09:16 AM

BOUNTYHUNTER

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While I myself also don't find weakness in love,I am totally committed to DIANE,while I care about the others I don't love them in a way I do her..after all"What does love have to do with this slave"..The world as this ol' masters views it..

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/13/2007 8:28:21 AM

Faramir

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyShoeBitch
Faramir,
Maybe you could be a bit less.. technical? I feel like I am reading a textbook
here!

Holy crap you're bossy!

Some people think that you have to choose between two states: being in control, or being in love, and that your choice reflects a compormise. If you're fully in control you can't love, if you're fully in love you can't control, and any compromise is just that: a little love and a lot of control, or an even mix, but some kind of either/or choice. It's a zero-sum model.

I, along wiht some developmental psychologists, believe that love and control (discipline) are not related, but seperate. So I can choose between loving in a healthy way or unhealthy ways, and having healthy (appropriate) discipline or not. But the two are unrelated--you can fully love and be fully in control.

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/13/2007 8:31:32 AM

SadisticMan

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Love is an absolute part of it for me. Friendship and casual play is one thing.
But if in a full blown relationship I fully expect the affection and love to be
an important part of O/our life.

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/13/2007 8:44:14 AM

silvermuse

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I can, of course, only speak for myself and what my Master has told me on this.

He does love me, deeply. It doesn't, however, prevent him from being able to discipline me. In fact I can say without a shadow of a doubt that hearing the words 'You've disappointed me' hits me far harder from him than it would anyone else, and that's partially because of the love he feels towards me.

And yes, I know there are some women who will use the 'but if you loved me'. The only time I've ever said that to Master was as a joke and was preceded with the sentence. 'This is a joke' as I didn't want any misunderstandings on that.

Maybe it's just us, but we don't believe love should ever be used as a weapon.

muse

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/14/2007 12:29:58 PM

MissOchistic

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Do you seriously think any question involving falling in love is a "yes or no question really"?

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/16/2007 8:05:31 AM

MercTech

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Define "love"....

I've always liked Heinlein's line that, "Love is when another person's happiness is necessary to your own."

Stefan

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/16/2007 4:04:11 PM

FLMaster1958

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I don't usually post much. But this is a very good question. One I have pondered for a long time. So I will share my thinking, whether anybody agrees or not. I will also take this from a more extreme focus.

I believe this goes back to the old questions of being property or a person. As far as I am concerned, you can not own a person. You own propertry. One can give control, but not ownership. Property is owned. A slave is property. I am not trying to judge others. This is my belief and I do not see any other way to see it.

When one asks a perspective Master/Mistress if they will love them, there is a certain amount of control they are asking for. This points to the also long running debate between loving and being "in-love". You can love a piece of property. Be a proud owner. A person may own a 4X4. You may drive it around and just show it off. But you paid a lot of money just to look like a rugged 4-wheeler. Or you can take it out into the rough country, bang around with it.. treat it very roughly.. and still be proud of it. Still love it. You can own a dog, and it can serve a purpose (guard dog, watchdog, etc) and that is it. Or you can own it, as a great pet, and love it. So to conclude this part, if you are a very obedient, submissive and loyal slave that Master can use for whatever purpose he desires, he can be very proud of you... and yes, love you. But likely if you are not, he also will not love you. If you ask about this, when first getting together, you are asking if he will love you, without proving your obedience, your submission or your loyalty.

Now we talk about being "in-love". This has some very powerful conotations. Usually, when this type of love is mentioned, it creates visions of "if you love me, you will (fill in the blank yourself) or If you love me, you will not (also fill in the blank yourself). This is a power, this is a limitation. You only want and need the slave. If Master/Mistress breaks this vision, by wanting another slave, then trust is threatened. Being "in-love" can very much get in the way of the relationship.

Most times being "in -love" leads to marriage. Look at the Marriage statistics. I believe now the divorce rate is over 56%. Ok, I am "in-love" with you and marry you. Now hand you a coin and flip it.. Not only that, but the coin is slightly weighted towards you losing.

If the foundation of the relationship is love or being "in -love", then when the slave does not feel "loved" the relationship is in peril. If the relationship is based on trust and true slavery, I do believe the foundation is more firm. If the slave does not feel loved, it does not matter.. it is owned property. The owner may love after all. The slave is there for the owners pleasure, not the slave's.

What about "chemistry"? This is a very valid point. Again, let's take it from the more extreme. Think of the slave as meat. Ever get a steak that had the ink inspection stamp embedded in it? I have. Not all slaves are attractive to all Owners. So yes, looks can be important. But do not dispair, it is a very subjective thing. You do not have to be a supermodel. just attractive to him. Attractive enough to bring out his desire to own and use you for his pleasure. Some meat is too tough ( I have had steaks that were near impossible to chew). Is it cooked right? (I have had shoe leather and have them nearly moo when I stuck a fork in.) Is it too soft? Is it flavorless? Is the slave an enjoyable cut that you want to enjoy again and again on a very long term basis? Is the owner one you can trust not to just use and toss? Yes, the chemistry must be right.

Now to trust. In my opinion, that is the only real measure to a M/s relationship. But what is meant by that? And what do you trust in? Many look for external symbols to prove that trust. A contract (legally null.. non-binding). A marriage (56% divorce rate and obviously the vows and license here can not be depended on). A person is no better then their word. If you are a slave, do not ask an owner to own you, unless you trust him totally. Trust is also a two way street. An owner trusts you will not run. You will not take his things. You likely have access. You will not get online and look for another. He trusts you take his ownership of you seriously.

What do you trust in? If you trust it will be as loving relationship, maybe you are better looking elsewhere. You want someone to love you, not own you. If you trust him to stay within your limitations, maybe you should be a submissive and keep that power unto yourself. Once you give it to an owner, it is his to do what he pleases with.

What do you trust in? I believe in the concept of hurt, not harm. He can cause great pain. Even damage (healable damage.) He will not scar or brand unless he feels sure he will keep you and make sure you are valuable to him always. But, if you have to go get stitches often, broken bones, punches., weapons. These are out. Things may happen, does he care? Is he willing to give up your services, just to be able to enjoy the momentary pleasure of breaking a finger? Has it happened, likely will happen again and again. Will he use and toss you away like a used tissue? Or again, keep you and make sure you stay of great value to him.

Can an Owner love the slave? Yes. Can an Owner be "in-love" with a slave? Yes. But if this is the foundation of the relationship, maybe you are better looking elsewhere.

Ok, let the slings and arrows fly. Any females slaves who believe as I do are encouraged to e-mail me for consideration.

< Message edited by FLMaster1958 -- 6/16/2007 4:09:24 PM >

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/16/2007 9:33:39 PM

WillowRain

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quote:

ORIGINAL: onmykneesforhim

Just print it here for all to see.
I have asked a few, and the most of the masters replies
were * I love her in my own way*
Its a yes or no question really.
Does a Master feel weak or threathened by this emotion? DO they tend not to *go all out* in fear of hurting their lover?
Im not asking married couples, They are in love.(or should be already)

omk

I do not know and could not guess why some Dominants/Masters do not want/choose/allow themselves, to love those who serve them. However, my gratitude is deep that not all of them feel this way.

Service would be an abyss of fear and pain for me without the trust and security of love.

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/17/2007 3:56:08 AM

Griffonknightrid

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Ok, I am going to way in on this subject. Slavery is a gift from the slave to the master. It should be a repsentation of that slaves true love for the master. If it is not and more a sexual devancy then I must say why not just go find a million fuck budys? Me I say it like this. I am truely "in love" with my slave. She picked to become my slave. She gave her self to me I control her body her actions but I refuse to make her do anything demeining or just plain stupid. I am in love with her why would I force her to act stupid. Its a gift and like any gift one must be willing to shape it and apreacate it. If you dont get out of the lifestyle.

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/17/2007 4:03:52 AM

mnottertail

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Some who have weighed in here may be in way over their head.

Weylu's Boston

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with their slaves? - 6/17/2007 6:17:29 AM

TankII7871

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Love well lets see here. Love has started wars. Love has caused people to step in front of bullets. Love has built lasting monuments or i should say has caused people to do such. Love is a funny thing i have seen people stay in flooding houses because they loved their dog and would not leave it so they risk their life for their animal. That is how powerful the emotion of love can be. now why don't Masters fall in love here is the little secret (and no you cant take my Master card for telling) We do fall in love. i have been blessed with having wonderful subs/slaves in my life some have made me happy one hurt my heart for awhile but when i found asha i found love. when i met her she was the wife of a friend who asked me to train her in certain things because he just couldn't go someplace's due to his love for her. Fast forward through time and asha has now been with me for 7 years and the funny thing is there is just somethings now i cant bring myself to due to her. I can do those things to others but i just cant do it to her. Now i know this is all me and she will do anything i require and honestly there are a few times where in the dark sadistic part of my mind i miss going to certain places but what i got in exchange for giving up a few dark twisted things was one of the best deals i ever made so the answer in my opinion is we do fall in Love if we are very very lucky

just a Country Boy with a little learnin

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/17/2007 8:03:27 AM

NControlofU

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Well, slavery may be a gift to you but as for me, I have to take exception with this statement. My slave's slavery is not a gift to me. My slave's slavery is her own and it is within her always. She doesn't give it to me or to anyone. I use it. Her sexuality isn't a gift to me, either. I use it. Her cooking skills aren't a gift to me. I use them. My slave's slavery, as she has said on various posts, is a need within her that requires her to serve as a slave in order to feel at peace with herself. I allow her the opportunity to use her slavery and that benefits both of us. I provide her with a place and a person to serve, with the ownership, command, control, and direction she needs in order to be the slave that she is. My slave is also a gardener. She has a need within her to grow things in order to feel at peace with herself. My slave's gardening isn't a gift to me. I allow her the opportunity to use her gardening and that benefits both of us. I provide her with the spot of dirt, the seeds or plantings and the water she needs to fulfill her need to be the gardener that she is. I chose my slave to belong to me and to serve me and she chose me to be her owner and master. As for love, I asked my slave, 2 months after bringing her to my home to serve me 24/7, if she loved me, she hesitated and then said to me that she wasn't really sure what love is but she did know that she respects me, trusts me, admires me, cares about me, and is loyal and devoted to me. In my book that means something far greater than anything else. Love can be fickle. Love can be fleeting. Love can bite you in the ass (when you don't like being bitten in the ass) but loyalty and devotion, I'll gladly take that any day over "true love". I appreciate my slave for all that she is and all that she does for me, for herself and for the other people in our lives. Slavery is much more to us than "sexual deviancy", although we do enjoy being sexually deviant with each other in our own ways and in our own lives. Some of the things I tell my slave to do may be considered, by some, to be forcing her to "act stupid". Oh well. She happens to enjoy feeling demeaned and humiliated. Public humiliation gets her so wet, it's worth it to her. As for getting "out of the lifestyle", well that would be pretty tough since the lifestyle we are in is our life. Our lifestyle is what we live. You have your lifestyle and we'll have ours. Whatever works for you, that's good for you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Griffonknightrid

Ok, I am going to way in on this subject. Slavery is a gift from the slave to the master. It should be a repsentation of that slaves true love for the master. If it is not and more a sexual devancy then I must say why not just go find a million fuck budys? Me I say it like this. I am truely "in love" with my slave. She picked to become my slave. She gave her self to me I control her body her actions but I refuse to make her do anything demeining or just plain stupid. I am in love with her why would I force her to act stupid. Its a gift and like any gift one must be willing to shape it and apreacate it. If you dont get out of the lifestyle.

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RE: Why do Masters NOT fall in love with thier slaves? - 6/17/2007 1:14:37 PM

FLMaster1958

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I noted earier the comment about falling in love. About now the Owner can not do some of the things he use to..because he loves her too much. This worries me. The slave came because she had needs that were not being fulfilled. Does she love you becaue you treat her so well? Or in spite of it? Does she have needs that are not being fulfilled now? Just not stated?

Reminds me of a couple I knew back in my home town. It had a strip club up the road aways. This guy met this stripper and they liked each other. She quit stripping and went to the bar with him.. Now this is "Good Time Charlie." Everyone knew him at the bar.. everyone liked him.. and he was a very active part of the party. She accomanies him always and they both have a good time. Now they get married. And life starts to creep in. Suddenly he starts showing up at the bar... without her. And has a great time. Not screwing around, but a good time. Now the wife.. bitches.. complains.. Why is he not at home with her? Why does he like to go to the bar so damn much?

What does she expect? She fell in love with "Good Time Charlie" and the fun they had together. Did she expect him to change? He is what she fell in love with.

Now back to the slave. She fell in love with a Master who used and abused her as he chose. He showed her a way of life. This is where love is dangerous. It can happen, but if it does, it had better be based on reality. If you fall in love with her while using and abusing her.. you had better be prepared to not only continue doing so, but maybe even escalate if needed. If your love puts you above ownership and use, maybe that was not the core in the first place. As far as I am concerned, there is nothing above ownership, control, obedience, submission and loyalty.

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