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RE: Yes, they really are monitoring all internet traffi... - 6/20/2007 5:14:51 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That's why taps are on the core routers?



Kinda breaks down here.  I am assuming you are talking about the "nameservers" that determine network bubbles like .com and .net and .gov and .org and...

While these do sit at the top of the network cloud, they actually do very little routing by themselves.

I send a message from

mailserver.earthlink.net

to somebody at aol.com

Earthlinks mailserver sends it to earthlink's routers.  The routers go "Oh, I know how to address it to go to aol" and then sends the message directly to aol, who sends it out to the aol mailservers.

If the routers dont know, then they send it upline to the bigger isp they relate to.  Same thing happens.

Eventually, it might get to the root nameserver for .net, but all they would do is pass out the appropriate router address to the one querying it.  Tapping a root nameserver would simply provide you the information about what isp sent the message to another isp.  They dont actually deal with network traffic; they are a phone book for routers.

Now, having said that...

The way I view the "internet" actually is to visualize a big giant cloud containing the digital representation of you, me, them, etc.

This cloud runs over the telephone infrastructure which manages digital switching technology.  The telephone company, as part of their digital infrastructure, performs the recording in order to maintain quality.  They actually maintain a sufficient amount of digital storage to maintain things for quite some time.  They have to, internet traffic is not a steady flow, it spikes and has lulls.  The storage is here, there, everywhere.

I worked for Qwest software when ATT was sued for turning over their digital information to AnencephalyBoy.  Qwest refused to do so, citing constitutional guarantees and privacy of their users, and demanded a search warrant before they would turn anything over.

This is not technically a "wiretap."  This is a business that normally records things for their own purposes turning it over to a Government agency to perform illegal search and seizures and privacy violations on that companies customers.  That is why ATT is being sued, and the Federal Government is not up on criminal charges.  ATT did not have to provide the information that the law states they are required to not provide it to the Federal Government.

The Federal government does not have the storage capability to keep much of this information, and they lack the computing power to do much more than a superficial scan of the information.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Yes, they really are monitoring all internet traffi... - 6/20/2007 6:04:14 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That's why taps are on the core routers?



Kinda breaks down here. I am assuming you are talking about the "nameservers" that determine network bubbles like .com and .net and .gov and .org and...



Nope. I'm talking about the data pulled from the routers throughout the network. Optical Splitters right on the fiber.

The Mark Klein deposition has copies of the procedure and cross connection.

quote:



I send a message from

mailserver.earthlink.net

to somebody at aol.com

Earthlinks mailserver sends it to earthlink's routers. The routers go "Oh, I know how to address it to go to aol" and then sends the message directly to aol, who sends it out to the aol mailservers.


And a copy of it goes into the secured NSA room.

I suspect they archive it. There was no application for a warrant to check against.

I disagree that there isn't sufficient storage, or processing to classify it.

I also suspect the NSA has a realtime SSL cracker, but that's just me.

http://www.narus.com/products/intercept.html

Narus uniquely provides insight into the entire network, ensuring that all targeted data is captured regardless of the size, speed, or asymmetric topology of the network. Any number of links, at any speed, with any routing architecture, can be simultaneously monitored.

< Message edited by farglebargle -- 6/20/2007 6:08:03 PM >


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Yes, they really are monitoring all internet traffi... - 6/21/2007 6:48:13 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
http://news.monstersandcritics.com/intelandterror/article_1320410.php/The_privacy_of_Internet_e-mail

"A U.S. appeals court in Ohio has ruled that e-mail messages stored on Internet servers are protected by the Constitution as are telephone conversations and that a federal law permitting warrantless secret searches of e-mail violates the Fourth Amendment. 'The Stored Communications Act is very important,' former federal prosecutor and counter-terrorism specialist Andrew McCarthy told United Press International. But the future of the law now hangs in the balance."

"They held that the 1986 Stored Communications Act, which allows the government to obtain an ex-parte order requiring ISPs to turn over e-mail stored on their servers, violated the Fourth Amendment prohibition on unreasonable search and seizures."

So, putting an optical splitter on the network backbones, and then sending *EVERY* email carried over that backbone to the NSA for their inspection, analysis and retention is prima facie, a violation of the 4th Amendment.

Now, for those who say AT&T isn't the Government, I offer that AT&T is a CREATION of the Government by virtue of being an Artificial Legal Entity, formed under the Laws of the Government.

As such, can a CREATION of the Government have any Privileges the Government doesn't enjoy itself?



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 23
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