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RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 3:39:36 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
Hah, score!  An answer to the question before a response.  :P  Alright, so you think that this policy unequally applies, so the rich shouldn't be part of the conversation?  Or that they should have differnet laws for themselves?


Uh, no. Please reread the thread. I'm not here to clarify things for you when you can read them for yourself. You are hilariously ignorant, and it shows.


You're so ready to insult instead of actually talking.  =/

quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
...I would like to point out the fact that embitterment is a word


Yes, and it was the wrong word in context. Your phrase is this:
"I sense some embitterment towards the rich in you."

What you mean to say:
"I sense some bitterness toward the rich in you."

I leave it to you to figure out the difference - your version is at least awkward if not an outright incorrect usage. My version may not be perfect but it is allowable as common speech (vernacular).


..its' perfectly fine.. it says what I meant it to.. I'm really sorry you didn't realize it was- if you need help reading, fine.. but, seriously..

[Edit]  Actually, since I know you're too proud to ask for help..
quote:

ORIGINAL:  [link=http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/embitterment]"embitterment", Dictionary.com
the state of being embittered


Thus, the statement, "I sense some embitterment towards the rich in you" is approximated by, "I sense some [of the state of being embittered] towards the rich in you."

Anyhow.  While I'm sure such logic isn't going to reach you.. well.. have fun?  =/   [/Edit]

quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

You have to be careful CuriousLord, I am quite close to blocking you because I find you almost incomprehensible. It's not that we disagree, I disagree with others here all the time. The problem with you is trying to first unpack what you are trying to say, and then possibly replying to what I think you are trying to say. I admit that no one is perfect and that a forum posting is a fairly casual type of writing, but then it's not my job to read anything you write nor to reply to you either.


I can understand my language often deviates from more idiomatic usage.  Nonetheless, it is, in fact, English used in the proper.  If you have difficulty reading it, you may request more simplistic speach used in its stead.  Or, you may ask me to restate things, or explain them, if you either desire to learn such English or simply to understand a particular element of such in its usage.

< Message edited by CuriousLord -- 7/21/2007 3:49:16 PM >

(in reply to SugarMyChurro)
Profile   Post #: 301
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 3:54:19 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

I can understand my language often deviates from more idiomatic usage.  Nonetheless, it is, in fact, English used in the proper.  If you have difficulty reading it, you may request more simplistic speach used in its stead.  Or, you may ask me to restate things, or explain them, if you either desire to learn such English or simply to understand a particular element of such in its usage.



I only wish you were able to appreciate that language isn't your forte and that it could do with some degree of improvement. Your use of English is not proper, and it's certainly not kind on your audience. Once again, someone dares criticise your style, and you insult them by telling them they cannot read English. This is a forum board that uses the written word for communication. The written word is a beautiful thing.

You claim to be stupefyingly intelligent: then you will understand that it isn't because a sentence is circumvoluted and inelligible that it's more worthy of respect - or that it conveys more meaning. Actually, the leaner the better.

I have one tip for you: adverbs suck.

_____________________________



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RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 3:56:08 PM   
SugarMyChurro


Posts: 1912
Joined: 4/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
"I sense some [of the state of being embittered] towards the rich in you."


Yeah, that's not too awkward. And it's not what you wrote before either.

And yes, good writing is using simple words well. Try it, you'll like it.

(in reply to CuriousLord)
Profile   Post #: 303
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:01:15 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
"I sense some [of the state of being embittered] towards the rich in you."


Yeah, that's not too awkward. And it's not what you wrote before either.

And yes, good writing is using simple words well. Try it, you'll like it.


It's exactly what I wrote before.. it's a copy/paste, with the dictionary-provided definition of the word substituted in..

While I'm a bit concerned about your difficulty in realizing this, I'm moreso concerned that you're trying to critique my writing style..   I'll try to write more simply for you, k?  Jeeze.

(in reply to SugarMyChurro)
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RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:28:37 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

How is citing mortality a point against them?



Because morality is a choice, not something that a random individual, raised outside of society, will show evidence of possessing.

Any argument which starts off by claiming to hold some sort of moral high ground is flawed.   There really is no difference logically between a person claiming a child's soul will be lost if aborted and the idea that being a suicide bomber will allow somebody 7 virgins in heaven. 

If a person feels that getting an abortion is murder, wrong, whatever, I say to that person to not get one.

I am uncomfortable about partial birth abortions, since these are generally done after the age a fetus could survive if born.  I would love to see some empirical evidence showing that women will be pregnant for 6 months and get an abortion of convenience.  I suspect that particular abortion is only used when the mother is in danger or the child will die (anencephaly, for example) anyway.

What concerns me is the Religious Right's assault on Roe vs. Wade since it's inception, and their issues which caused Roe vs. Wade to be originally considered a court precedent.  Outlawing partial birth abortions is simply the first in a calculated attempt to get rid of Roe vs. Wade.

As I have pointed out before, Roe vs. Wade simply assures doctor patient confidentiality and prevents government interference in medicine.  Be careful what you anti-abortionists wish for, you might not enjoy it if you end up getting it.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to CuriousLord)
Profile   Post #: 305
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:33:57 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		That's pretty much what I was saying all along, Sinergy, except your command of English is far, far superior to mine. I feel suitably diminished now.



_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 306
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:35:19 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

That's pretty much what I was saying all along, Sinergy, except your command of English is far, far superior to mine. I feel suitably diminished now.




Thank you for the lovely compliment, but you are quite the wordsmith yourself.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 307
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:36:51 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

If a person feels that getting an abortion is murder, wrong, whatever, I say to that person to not get one.


Sinergy


Wouldn't that be similar to saying if a person thinks shooting someone in the head is wrong, don't do it, and don't impose your belief on anyone else?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 308
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:47:05 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

That's pretty much what I was saying all along, Sinergy, except your command of English is far, far superior to mine. I feel suitably diminished now.




Thank you for the lovely compliment, but you are quite the wordsmith yourself.

Sinergy



Could your kindness cast a cloud over your judgement?

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 309
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 4:52:13 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

If a person feels that getting an abortion is murder, wrong, whatever, I say to that person to not get one.


Sinergy


Wouldn't that be similar to saying if a person thinks shooting someone in the head is wrong, don't do it, and don't impose your belief on anyone else?



Of course not, because shooting a person is quite different from ending a life that is nested within a woman's womb.

A person exists out of another's body (unless it's domiguy ensconced within one of his local beef jerkies  ). A fetus depends on the life of the woman for survival.

Level, can you accept that sometimes, wrong is necessary for right to happen? And if not, why not?

_____________________________



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RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:02:38 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

If a person feels that getting an abortion is murder, wrong, whatever, I say to that person to not get one.


Sinergy


Wouldn't that be similar to saying if a person thinks shooting someone in the head is wrong, don't do it, and don't impose your belief on anyone else?


Not really.

Shooting somebody in the head is against the law in the United States.

Feel free to make the point to AnencephalyBoy that shooting people is wrong.  I am sure he will pay close attention and bring our troops home so they dont have to kill any more Iraqis.

As far as a fetus, it is some point between an unfertilized egg and a sperm cell, and a human being.  It is implanted into the mother (from a medical perspective) as a parasitic life form.  The mother's immune system has to be shut off (well, yes and no, it also goes into hyperdrive to repel everything else) to not repel the "intruder."

I have already posted this, but since it apparently went in one eye and out the other, the way the proposed amendment is written, a woman who spontaneously miscarries can be brought up on criminal charges.

If you choose to take the logic that killing a fetus is wrong, what is to stop people from saying that killing unfertilized eggs is wrong?  Unused sperm cells is wrong?  Killing snowflake embryos is wrong.  Etc.  Not to derail the thread, but the Religious Right who wants to do away with abortion ALSO refuses to allow any aid to third world countries to be used for sex education or provide birth control.  Make of that what you want, I tend to think there is an agenda to keep women barefoot and pregnant behind the Religious Right's activities.

My point is that a choice is made where to draw the line of (for lack of a better word) badness.  The problem the anti-abortion crowd has is they are hell-bent to inflict their choice on everybody else.

Hope that clarifies things.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 311
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:04:59 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

If a person feels that getting an abortion is murder, wrong, whatever, I say to that person to not get one.


Sinergy


Wouldn't that be similar to saying if a person thinks shooting someone in the head is wrong, don't do it, and don't impose your belief on anyone else?



Of course not, because shooting a person is quite different from ending a life that is nested within a woman's womb.

Yes, but my point is that for some, that difference is far, far less than it is for you, and to some, there is no difference. So, to tell them to "not have one" is an exercise in futility. And many of those people that see little or no difference are not all a bunch of hateful kooks, they're decent human beings that have a genuine concern for the life of others. I'm not saying you called them kooks, by the way.

A person exists out of another's body (unless it's domiguy ensconced within one of his local beef jerkies  ). A fetus depends on the life of the woman for survival.

I would ask you the question that went unanswered by Churro:  until the baby is actually outside the mother's body, it isn't alive, or a "human being"?

Level, can you accept that sometimes, wrong is necessary for right to happen? And if not, why not?

Yes, I can.


_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 312
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:09:50 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy


Shooting somebody in the head is against the law in the United States.

Feel free to make the point to AnencephalyBoy that shooting people is wrong.  I am sure he will pay close attention and bring our troops home so they dont have to kill any more Iraqis.

As far as a fetus, it is some point between an unfertilized egg and a sperm cell, and a human being.  It is implanted into the mother (from a medical perspective) as a parasitic life form.  The mother's immune system has to be shut off (well, yes and no, it also goes into hyperdrive to repel everything else) to not repel the "intruder."

I have already posted this, but since it apparently went in one eye and out the other, the way the proposed amendment is written, a woman who spontaneously miscarries can be brought up on criminal charges.

And to do so would be wrong, as I've already said

If you choose to take the logic that killing a fetus is wrong, what is to stop people from saying that killing unfertilized eggs is wrong?  Unused sperm cells is wrong?  Killing snowflake embryos is wrong.  Etc.  Not to derail the thread, but the Religious Right who wants to do away with abortion ALSO refuses to allow any aid to third world countries to be used for sex education or provide birth control.  Make of that what you want, I tend to think there is an agenda to keep women barefoot and pregnant behind the Religious Right's activities.

Of course, there are some knuckle-draggers like that, unfortunately.

My point is that a choice is made where to draw the line of (for lack of a better word) badness.  The problem the anti-abortion crowd has is they are hell-bent to inflict their choice on everybody else.

Hope that clarifies things.

Sinergy


_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 313
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:11:05 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		Hell, the FUNDAMENTALIST NUTS won't even let the tv stations run condom ads without their boycott hysterics.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:16:32 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

I would ask you the question that went unanswered by Churro:  until the baby is actually outside the mother's body, it isn't alive, or a "human being"?



Of course it is alive.

In the same sense that a tumor is alive.  An appendix about to burst is alive.  Spermatazoa are alive.

There, your question is asked and answered.

Sinergy

p.s.  Are you really asking about the viability (ability to live outside the mother) of the fetus?


_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 315
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:19:08 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		Some would suggest you don't get PROTECTION FROM THE LAW until you can show a receipt for taxes paid.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 316
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:19:56 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

If a person feels that getting an abortion is murder, wrong, whatever, I say to that person to not get one.


Sinergy


Wouldn't that be similar to saying if a person thinks shooting someone in the head is wrong, don't do it, and don't impose your belief on anyone else?



Of course not, because shooting a person is quite different from ending a life that is nested within a woman's womb.

Yes, but my point is that for some, that difference is far, far less than it is for you, and to some, there is no difference. So, to tell them to "not have one" is an exercise in futility. And many of those people that see little or no difference are not all a bunch of hateful kooks, they're decent human beings that have a genuine concern for the life of others. I'm not saying you called them kooks, by the way.

A person exists out of another's body (unless it's domiguy ensconced within one of his local beef jerkies  ). A fetus depends on the life of the woman for survival.

I would ask you the question that went unanswered by Churro:  until the baby is actually outside the mother's body, it isn't alive, or a "human being"?

Level, can you accept that sometimes, wrong is necessary for right to happen? And if not, why not?

Yes, I can.



Until  a fetus has been born by a woman, I don't consider 'it' to be a human being. It takes a lot out of me to say this, because I am a mother (1998) as well as a recent aborter. I would like to point out to you that the English language calls a baby an 'it' until it has proven it is able to stay alive: the phrase "So, what did you call 'it'?" following a birth stems to mind.

It is alive, of course. It is the beginning of a "human being". But it isn't finished, and I know we can disagree over this until we are blue in the face.

Sometimes, strength demands of us that we leave sentimentalism to the sidewalk. I'm afraid that's very true with abortion.


_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 317
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:23:49 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Could your kindness cast a cloud over your judgement?



Been there, done that.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 318
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:26:03 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

It is alive, of course. It is the beginning of a "human being". But it isn't finished, and I know we can disagree over this until we are blue in the face.



And in the final analysis, the argument is about our personal CHOICE.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 319
RE: Louisiana bans partial birth abortion - 7/21/2007 5:28:33 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Could your kindness cast a cloud over your judgement?



Been there, done that.

Sinergy


Done a lot... never been much.  

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 320
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