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RE: simple...right? - 6/17/2004 9:32:41 PM

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IMO it is never our position to determine or decide what someone else deserves. We are responsible for our actions, and our feelings. According to what I've read here, which I'm sure is by no means "all" of the story, you manipulated the situation and therefore you are responsible for the fact that you were hurt. Therefore if someone "deserves" to account to him because you were hurt, it would be you. In fact, while you are accounting, you could account for the fact that you initiated this "affair" with her in the first place.

quote:

but it's also not good to give your sub false promises or lead her to thinking you want more than you do.

You might heed your own advice here. We all have lessons to learn in life. This is one of yours.

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to confusetheswede)

RE: simple...right? - 6/17/2004 10:19:36 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: confusetheswede

quote:

ORIGINAL: inyouagain

You started out being lied to by one, your Master? (or was it a poly relationship?)

Now in a diabolical manner (over 6 months) you have also assumed the position of liar (unless you've come clean with the other girl, but you inferred otherwise).

Is this other girl the only member of your triangle who is being truthful? If so, she deserves better than either you or your/her Master.

If you are all lying to each other, then you all deserve what you get as players.

Inyouagain

----------------
it started out me and him only.
and then she came along.
so i decided to destory both of them, they had been seeing eachother for at least 8 months before i got angry.
it's funny that you condemm me, but not him or her.
i am more insane than just being a common liar, besides, if they would ask were i am or who i am with, i would be honest, they both just never ask. xoxomarinas

Please re-read my post and show me where I condemned you alone. It says 2 of 3 (you and the master), and that "if" she were also lying (which you now reveal that she was/is), make it 3 of three... you all deserve one another, and that only means I hit the nail on the head.

"Her" kids don't deserve any of you, as your actions and motives are way too extreme for adolescents to be exposed to. Hatred and destructive motives are some of the worst qualities of mankind. You profess to be more insane than untruthful, and I would tend to agree... but recognize that simply to be your built-in copout... a rationalizer to allow you to operate with intent to destroy. You are willing to mentally justify your means using the insanity card in your play, and subject innocent children to your diabolical plans to destroy their own mother. If your vindictiveness becomes paramount to common sense and decency, you are potentially dangerous... and need to come down.

What he is doing is wrong... what she is doing is wrong... what you are doing is wrong. A really happy triangle of wrong doers, with one bent on destroying the other two, nice!

I can't think of a better way to waste my only life than hating someone bad enough that I wanted to devote myself to a diabolical plan to destroy them. Is that your goal for wasting your only life (you don't get to pass GO and collect $200 with a new life)?

Life isn't always fair, and your destroying both of them won't make it fair either. Chill out on the Charles Manson trip... make the best of your "one life".

Inyouagain

_____________________________

Careful with that axe, Eugene

(in reply to confusetheswede)

RE: simple...right? - 6/17/2004 11:08:35 PM

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I came late, but I have some questions:

Did you and your dominant ever discuss (and agree) on monogomy?
Did you talk to her to find out that she *knows* the person she is being submissive to not only has a submissive but is lying to her?
Do you know for a fact that she is not allowed to have sex with anyone other than the person who is both of your dominant? After all, if he is looking for a poly relationship there is no reaso to believe he wouldn't accept she would have one also.

I am going to speak from personal experience. One of the first people who ever offered me a collar had a submissive that I knew also. I knew she was bi-sexual, and though I do not consider myself bi-sexual, I consider sex sex, and the sex of the person I am playing with is irrelevant if it is pleasing to my dominant. I knew she knew he wanted to add someone to their relationship, and that she planned on moving to where he was. She knew I was going to be introducing him around MY town (about 2 hours from his) and spending a lot of time with him.

What neither of knew is that he would ask me to move into his home before she came to town, and that he would lie about her knowing I was going to do it. He also wanted it to be a *surprise* for when she came 2 weeks later. But, I don't lie for anyone, and when she questioned me online that day, I told her. He told me he never wanted to talk to me again, and lied again about what happened. She moved to his place 2 weeks later. In the next 6 months she caught him planning 2 different meetings with 2 different slaves and lying about it.

My own personal need for honesty meant I had to make sure the other woman was aware of what was happening. Hers was to deny it could be possible, though she did apologize in the end. My point is, no matter that he hurt me, as did she (I considered her a friend), in the end *I* had to live with how *I* handled things. His lack of honor and integrity did not *IMO* give me the right to show an equal or greater lack of honor or integrity.

_____________________________

Sandy

Don't take life too seriously, no one gets out alive anyway...

(in reply to inyouagain)

RE: simple...right? - 6/18/2004 5:55:49 AM

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quote:

I can't think of a better way to waste my only life than hating someone bad enough that I wanted to devote myself to a diabolical plan to destroy them. Is that your goal for wasting your only life (you don't get to pass GO and collect $200 with a new life)?

IMHO many people define themselves and their reality by the things they oppose and the methods they use to oppose these things.

When you look at yourself in the mirror and think about the situation you are currently in, is involving yourself in this sort of relationship mess really how you wish to be remembered for the precious time you are given in this place?

Sinergy

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"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to EStrict)

RE: simple...right? - 6/18/2004 8:41:05 AM

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From: Santiago, Chile
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Ummmm a few things?

First, I really don't see enough information to condemn anyone's behavior without making some suppositions. One of these suppositions is that the man involved made a promise of fidelity to confusetheswede - but we don't know this for a fact. Another supposition was that the other woman has a promise of fidelity to the man - again, not a clear fact.

The only thing we know for a fact is that the girl confusetheswede set out to hurt her owner/boyfriend/whateverheis because he had another submissive, and ended up learning she liked more then just being his sub. I would offer the same advice as given earlier: Split from the couple entirely, and find new playmates. If problems occur, instead of trying to inflict maximum damage, try being honest and discussing the situation. Had you been honest in the first place with your owner and the other woman, instead of lying to them for six months you might have been having kinky three way sex the whole time: or at the very least, you wouldn't end up looking like a jackass when the truth finally comes out (and be assured it eventually will.) Or, like Jan suggested: take some time away from relationships as a whole, and try to figure out who you are first.

Stephan[/b]

_____________________________

http://www.vv3b.com/

"There is always some madness in love, but there is always some reason in madness." - F. Nietzsche

(in reply to Sinergy)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 7:49:38 AM

confusetheswede

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From: THE DIRTY DIRTY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: inyouagain

quote:

ORIGINAL: confusetheswede

quote:

ORIGINAL: inyouagain

You started out being lied to by one, your Master? (or was it a poly relationship?)

Now in a diabolical manner (over 6 months) you have also assumed the position of liar (unless you've come clean with the other girl, but you inferred otherwise).

Is this other girl the only member of your triangle who is being truthful? If so, she deserves better than either you or your/her Master.

If you are all lying to each other, then you all deserve what you get as players.

Inyouagain

----------------
it started out me and him only.
and then she came along.
so i decided to destory both of them, they had been seeing eachother for at least 8 months before i got angry.
it's funny that you condemm me, but not him or her.
i am more insane than just being a common liar, besides, if they would ask were i am or who i am with, i would be honest, they both just never ask. xoxomarinas

Please re-read my post and show me where I condemned you alone. It says 2 of 3 (you and the master), and that "if" she were also lying (which you now reveal that she was/is), make it 3 of three... you all deserve one another, and that only means I hit the nail on the head.

"Her" kids don't deserve any of you, as your actions and motives are way too extreme for adolescents to be exposed to. Hatred and destructive motives are some of the worst qualities of mankind. You profess to be more insane than untruthful, and I would tend to agree... but recognize that simply to be your built-in copout... a rationalizer to allow you to operate with intent to destroy. You are willing to mentally justify your means using the insanity card in your play, and subject innocent children to your diabolical plans to destroy their own mother. If your vindictiveness becomes paramount to common sense and decency, you are potentially dangerous... and need to come down.

What he is doing is wrong... what she is doing is wrong... what you are doing is wrong. A really happy triangle of wrong doers, with one bent on destroying the other two, nice!

I can't think of a better way to waste my only life than hating someone bad enough that I wanted to devote myself to a diabolical plan to destroy them. Is that your goal for wasting your only life (you don't get to pass GO and collect $200 with a new life)?

Life isn't always fair, and your destroying both of them won't make it fair either. Chill out on the Charles Manson trip... make the best of your "one life".

Inyouagain

Charles Mason is a fool.
Look, grampy, i'm not destoring thier mother, they are better off without her anyway. i'm not going to play this dogma anymore, just to be insulted.good day.

_____________________________

The Scorpio with hazel eyes.

(in reply to inyouagain)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 7:57:27 AM

confusetheswede

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quote:

I was going to do it. He also wanted it to be a *surprise* for when she came 2 weeks later. But, I don't lie for anyone, and when she questioned me online that day, I told her. He told me he never wanted to talk to me again, and lied again about what happened. She moved to his place 2 weeks later. In the next 6 months she caught him planning 2 different meetings with 2 different slaves and lying about it.

My own personal need for honesty meant I had to make sure the other woman was aware of what was happening. Hers was to deny it could be possible, though she did apologize in the end. My point is, no matter that he hurt me, as did she (I considered her a friend), in the end *I* had to live with how *I* handled things. His lack of honor and integrity did not *IMO* give me the right to show an equal or greater lack of honor or integrity.

_____________________________

the realtionship i'm in was supposed to be monogamus, but it's hard to countinue to keep it that way when only one out of two is monogamus. we agreed on it before we became sexual, otherwise i'd have never given anything to him. you're basically telling me to be a bigger person, and i respect that, but once i've been hurt, there's just no return.

as for the semantics of thier realtionship, most likely it's got the same lock on it as ours. he claims he doesn't want poly and he denies seeing other girls. thank you for keeping a nuetral tone.xoxomarinas

(in reply to EStrict)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 7:58:54 AM

confusetheswede

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From: THE DIRTY DIRTY
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good advice. thanks.xoxomarinas

(in reply to January)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 8:04:46 AM

confusetheswede

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From: THE DIRTY DIRTY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyBeckett

IMO it is never our position to determine or decide what someone else deserves. We are responsible for our actions, and our feelings. According to what I've read here, which I'm sure is by no means "all" of the story, you manipulated the situation and therefore you are responsible for the fact that you were hurt. Therefore if someone "deserves" to account to him because you were hurt, it would be you. In fact, while you are accounting, you could account for the fact that you initiated this "affair" with her in the first place.

quote:

but it's also not good to give your sub false promises or lead her to thinking you want more than you do.

You might heed your own advice here. We all have lessons to learn in life. This is one of yours.

in every human is god. therefore we are "godlike" and have the right to judge. you obivously have had no emotional worries, or you wouldn't be so cold. being vengeful is just as valid as being in love. you might have expressed something valid, but your tone is so sour, the words are lost.
xoxoxmarinas

_____________________________

The Scorpio with hazel eyes.

(in reply to LadyBeckett)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 8:06:04 AM

confusetheswede

Posts: 48
Joined: 4/5/2004
From: THE DIRTY DIRTY
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he may

dominate me in bed, but that's as far as it goes. there's no reason to worry but thanks for the concern.

_____________________________

The Scorpio with hazel eyes.

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 8:20:37 AM

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Ok, I've read the entire thread.

confusetheswede,

From where I stand it would seem that you are hurt and subsequently angry. Very valid emotions, particularly due to the circumstances. You have been wronged by people who are without integrity.

However, you have allowed your emotion (hurt and anger) to be the driving force of your own behavior; and that behavior has turned you into that which you hate. You now are a woman without integrity, vengence has taken its place.

You do, however, have the power to be the person you would like to be. Just as you have chosen to be someone without integrity in this situation you can choose to be the only one of the three who has any. But it's your choice.

The propensity to allow our emotion of the moment to be justification for ill behavior is supposed to be something that we learn about in our adolescence. Unfortunately, many of us don't learn the inappropriateness of emotion based action until late in life, some of us never learn. My experience is that for those who have not learned this lesson their life tends to be one drama and painful experience after another. Many seem addicted to the emotion and therefore keep the dramas going for the illusion of power that anger and wrath seem to bring.

Are you addicted to your drama? Do you wish to win at the cost of your integrity? Do you believe that your anger and wrath are justifications for any behavior?

If you never learn the lesson then you will never see yourself clearly and know yourself well enough to properly respect yourself. That means you bring an empty hand to the table for future relationships. If you do learn the lessen then you will have to look in the mirror and see the person who became what she hated.

When you get to the other side of this, and neither of these people mean enough to you for it to be painful to you anymore, I fear you are going to not like what you see in the mirror.

That means that you inevitably hurt yourself more than the other parties. It just takes a while for the pain to sink in. However, the hurts that you perpetrate upon yourself by abandoning your integrity will be infinitely longer lasting than any hurt anyone else can ever place upon you.

Are you a drama queen or are you a woman of integrity? Only you can decide that.

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to confusetheswede)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 9:47:01 AM

confusetheswede

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From: THE DIRTY DIRTY
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the funny thing is, i always have the upperhand regaurdless. they both deserve what they got, so they can be quite happy together.
thanks for imput.xoxomarinas

quote:

ORIGINAL: MizSuz

Ok, I've read the entire thread.

confusetheswede,

From where I stand it would seem that you are hurt and subsequently angry. Very valid emotions, particularly due to the circumstances. You have been wronged by people who are without integrity.

However, you have allowed your emotion (hurt and anger) to be the driving force of your own behavior; and that behavior has turned you into that which you hate. You now are a woman without integrity, vengence has taken its place.

You do, however, have the power to be the person you would like to be. Just as you have chosen to be someone without integrity in this situation you can choose to be the only one of the three who has any. But it's your choice.

The propensity to allow our emotion of the moment to be justification for ill behavior is supposed to be something that we learn about in our adolescence. Unfortunately, many of us don't learn the inappropriateness of emotion based action until late in life, some of us never learn. My experience is that for those who have not learned this lesson their life tends to be one drama and painful experience after another. Many seem addicted to the emotion and therefore keep the dramas going for the illusion of power that anger and wrath seem to bring.

Are you addicted to your drama? Do you wish to win at the cost of your integrity? Do you believe that your anger and wrath are justifications for any behavior?

If you never learn the lesson then you will never see yourself clearly and know yourself well enough to properly respect yourself. That means you bring an empty hand to the table for future relationships. If you do learn the lessen then you will have to look in the mirror and see the person who became what she hated.

When you get to the other side of this, and neither of these people mean enough to you for it to be painful to you anymore, I fear you are going to not like what you see in the mirror.

That means that you inevitably hurt yourself more than the other parties. It just takes a while for the pain to sink in. However, the hurts that you perpetrate upon yourself by abandoning your integrity will be infinitely longer lasting than any hurt anyone else can ever place upon you.

Are you a drama queen or are you a woman of integrity? Only you can decide that.

_____________________________

The Scorpio with hazel eyes.

(in reply to MizSuz)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 10:29:21 AM

perverseangelic

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here's what i want to know, and have been unable to find in the thread--
did your owner's other girl know that your owner was supposed to be monogamous with you? from my reading, she sounds like an innocent party in this. that is, she became invovled with someone, not knowing he was attached or monogamous with the person he was attached to. did she know about you? did she know that he was expected to be with you alone? otherwise, she simply became invovled with someone she was interested in. the fact that he was cheating on you has nothing to do with her, unless she's expected to be psychic and know he was lying to her.

it bothers me that you're "getting back" at someone who quite poissibly had no idea she was doing anything wrong.

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 11:02:07 AM

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This story becomes more interesting as it evolves, rather like an orb weavers web. She is involving the audience, she has those she likes, and those she doesn't...the second sub was at first unknowing, clearly a victim...now later she knows everything, and now confusetheswede is on the outside looking back with some as yet unidentified feelings. We know about the revenge, but what is she actually feeling now?

I can absolutely appreciate Suz and Shade for having that impeccable judge of character, even online. I'm curious to see Shade's take on this.

< Message edited by LadyBeckett -- 6/19/2004 11:04:41 AM >

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to perverseangelic)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 11:22:00 AM

Posts: 841
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From: Santiago, Chile
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A story comes to mind about a sandbox after the rain on a Sunday. All the children and their parents are standing there looking at the sandbox, and one of the little boys in his nice clothes picks up a handful of the mud and throws it at his sister. The sister shrieks and picks up a handful, throwing it back. She misses and hits a little boy behind her brother. The little boy picks up a handful, and pitches it at the girl, and hits her brother instead. Minutes later, the parents are screaming at the children to stop throwing mud, and everyone is covered head to toe in it.

The -easiest- way to end these messes are to not throw mud. Unfortunately, people seem to take far greater pleasure out of wallowing in the mud just to see someone else covered in mud.

Confuse - hopefully one day you'll stop playing in the mud.

Stephan

_____________________________

http://www.vv3b.com/

"There is always some madness in love, but there is always some reason in madness." - F. Nietzsche

(in reply to LadyBeckett)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 11:47:12 AM

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confusetheswede you have lost the very essence of what O/our lifestyle is about . . . honesty . . . above and beyond everything else. both you and your master(not typos) need to confront your individual issues...your Master for His inability to be who he really is with you and your need to hurt an innocent sub/slave/sister that has no idea what is going on with either of you. that you would want to dominate her in any way brings more questions to mind than I chose to explore in this comment. find your own honesty NOW . . . become bigger than him . . . leave both of them and start anew . . . your integrity is all that you have in this community and once that integrity is compromised you will never find or experience the life that you sought when you decided to persue this lifestyle.

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 11:53:18 AM

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Truthfully, Stephen, I am not throwing mud at all! I am honestly fascinated by the whole thing. Normally I would just read something like this and never say a single word. However, I believe everything she is saying. I believe this has actually happened, and probably (without much variation) just as she says it has. So no mud can be thrown there! When I said what I did in regard to Suz and Shade, it wasn't to suggest that either one of them would say something negative. They rarely do, as a matter of fact. They are two of the most positive women I have had the pleasure of reading online. What I said was, that I believe they have an impeccable judge of character, even online, and that I was curious to read what Shade had to say about "this", being this thread. Because I always enjoy her "take" on things.

(Stephen...just saw that you probably hit "fast reply", but rather than edit this whole post I'll just add this into it

)

< Message edited by LadyBeckett -- 6/19/2004 11:56:06 AM >

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to Voltare)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 12:14:12 PM

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From: Santiago, Chile
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Lady Beckett,

honestly I wasn't commenting on the postings in this thread, but rather on the subject that the thread addresses. The 'Dom' splattered mud on her - and instead of just wiping her face and walking away, she spent six months trying to fill a dump truck with mud so she could bury the rest of the kids. In several instances, she acknowleges that she 'could' have walked away - only to either thinly justify or outright deny any concern for the consequences.

quote:

ORIGINAL: confusetheswede

you're basically telling me to be a bigger person, and i respect that, but once i've been hurt, there's just no return.

<snip>

being vengeful is just as valid as being in love.

The human mind is quite capable of rationalizing anything and everything. The only reason I even posted was to possibly cause her (or someone in a similar situation) to possibly stop and realize that if they don't wish to get muddy, they shouldn't play with children who throw mud, two wrongs don't make a right - just more mud, etc etc. And maybe to have the chance to make a joke about what to expect from dirty tramps. (grins.)

Stephan

_____________________________

http://www.vv3b.com/

"There is always some madness in love, but there is always some reason in madness." - F. Nietzsche

(in reply to LadyBeckett)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 12:51:48 PM

Posts: 865
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I knew it after I read the closing line of your post (after the fact, lol), Stephen, which is the reason for my edit, although, I appreciate your point here, absolutely! Well said!

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to Voltare)

RE: simple...right? - 6/19/2004 1:05:18 PM

Posts: 1881
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quote:

ORIGINAL: confusetheswede

the funny thing is, i always have the upperhand regaurdless. they both deserve what they got, so they can be quite happy together.
thanks for imput.xoxomarinas

Actually, by compromising your integrity you have already lost. As I said, by compromising your integrity you have become the dreck that you despise. Now you too deserve this treatment that you can't seem to let go of. It would appear that you are unable to see what is abundantly obvious.

You may, in the end, cross the finish line first; but from where I am standing it has already significantly diminished you and promises to continue to do so long after the race is ended.

What were you looking for when you made the original post, and why do you suppose you are not answering anyone's questions?

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to confusetheswede)

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