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Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 9:25:43 AM

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A question for subs/slaves that consider themselves lifestyle, 24/7, or pick-your-own definition type relationship where the dominant does have ultimate say, final say, makes all the decisions.

I'll use femdom as an example, since that's the kind of relationship I'm in, and most familiar with. I don't have a 24/7 dynamic, but if I did, I could see some potential troubles -- and I wonder how people in this kind of relationship deal with it. I can be pretty impulsive and make snap decisions -- it's part of my nature. What happens is that I get passionate about an idea, and I am not someone who can wait. When I want something, I want it *now*. I've always been that way.

If I were in a 24/7 type relationship where I truly was the one in control, I'm wondering how my submissive would deal with me. It seems like it would be impossible -- without defying me outright -- to do so. And, while I am impulsive at times, I don't consider myself dysfunctional or anything -- it's just a flaw (and I'm sure other flaws also might create this same type of decision). I would love to have a man that did everything I said, and gave me everything I wanted. What woman wouldn't want that?

What if the femdom woke up one day and decided she wanted a new car -- she decided after seeing one she loved, and so she tells her sub. Her sub know of their mutual financials, and in his opinion it's an impulsive purchase -- while they can afford it, it's probably not the best financial decision. But, to her, it is suddenly VERY important. She has the reasons why, but really, it's not a prudent use of their joint income.

What does the sub do? Does he give in -- and let her do what she wants, because to say no would defy her? What if she says "I'm the dominant, you know that. I'm not asking your opinion, I'm just telling you what I'm going to do."?

What if he gives in, but this is a pattern, and ultimately will result in financial ruin?

Or turn it around to another example -- what if your dominant picks up an unhealthy habit? What if this habit is ruining the person, or the relationship. Does the 24/7 lifestyle slave just tolerate it?

Akasha

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RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 9:40:22 AM

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on the financial matters.... money and possessions are not important to me at all as neither of those things has ever brought me happiness for more than a week or two....

the only possession i find essential for me is a computer hahaha......
when i handed my own financial reigns over to my Dom, i don't pay attention to what he is doing with them....

if he should make decisions that cause us to live in a tent in the woods.... as long as he can figure out how to keep my computer running, i'm fine....

matter of fact, i would take any financial disasters as an adventure.... lol

he is most important to me, not what type of house i live in, what type of car or even if we have a car, what type of clothes i wear, etc.

being that he is open to my opinions, i would tell him those if he requested it, but whatever he decides is fine with me.

unhealthy habits.... we both smoke and i worry constantly about his health with that... if he did drugs (which he does not) i would be so distressed and sick over it, he would not do it just by watching how distressed i would be about it.....

_____________________________

zaynab[DM]

quote:

i used to care... but now i take a pill for that

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 9:50:17 AM

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It would be my place to remind him of things he may have forgotten, things he might not know, even my personal feelings on the topic if appropriate- and then obey.

This applies whether we're getting directions to a party, discussing medical treatments, making purchases, deciding to get married, or ANYTHING else in my life.

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 10:02:41 AM

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Joined: 3/23/2004
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quote:

What does the sub do? Does he give in -- and let her do what she wants, because to say no would defy her? What if she says "I'm the dominant, you know that. I'm not asking your opinion, I'm just telling you what I'm going to do."?

As her property and her slave, I would argue until arguing was all I had left if I knew the result was going to harm her in some way. If she finally decided that further arguing was no longer allowed on the issue, I would turn quiet, convinced I have done everything possible to convince her that she might be making a serious mistake.

There are two important points here that seem to be missing:

1. As her slave, my existence is to serve to make hers better. I can't do that without being able to be blunt in my relationship with her, especially if I realize something she's doing will eventually hurt her.

2. There seems to be an assumption that my Mistress is some kind of flighty woman that is going to make rash decisions about financial matters out of the blue without warning. I've rarely been in a relationship with a woman where she suddenly had to have a brand new car, even though she realized the finances weren't going to back up the ability to have one. When I turn over financial control to her, it's because I trust her to do what is right for us. There is a logical expectation that she's not nuts to begin with, that she's actually going to be thinking about the fact that the amount of income coming in is not going to be able to exceed the amount of spending going out. I wouldn't be turning over my financial affairs to a teenage girl with a brand new credit card who has just discovered the concept of "malls".

A lot of the criticism of 24/7 relationships historically (and believe me, I've been the brunt of A LOT of the criticism over the years back when there weren't a lot of us submissives talking in public about submissiveness and 24/7 relationships) has been over very ridiculous, out of control argumentation. An example: "What if your Mistress decided to kill you? Would you go along with it?" After awhile, you start to just filter out these mindsets of really nit-picky people because they're no more grounded in reality than they claim 24/7ers must not be as well.

When you get into a 24/7 relationship, there's a certain amount of expectation that you're involving yourself with someone who is mature, intelligent and thinking about both of you as part of the relationship dynamic. Granted, the importance of who achieves the superiority in the relationship is the woman (I'm speaking for myself here...feel free to fill in whatever gender you desire), but that doesn't mean that such a relationship is one of those dire circumstances that people who criticize us seem so interested in creating. We get enough of that kind of stuff in the real world, that is just as ridiculous there as it is in a bdsm relationship (my recent favorite: "Researchers have discovered that drinking bottled water to avoid bacteria in tap water MAY KILL YOU." That was a real news broadcast the other night). That's the kind of stuff that creates wonderful strawman arguments that are so easy to knock down because people have stopped dealing with reality and are now dealing in this fear tactic environment of "what if.... happened?"

_____________________________

Give a man a fish, he eats for a day...
...teach a man to fish, he steals your fishing hole and then charges you for the fish.

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 10:08:18 AM

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I suppose my Master and I have a...different<?> relationship, than most of what Ive seen on here. In the day to day operations of life, with a large family that we have(6 kids), the finances are something that, while he does have final yae or nay power, he always asks my oppinions on things first. I tend to have a more thrifty side, and he...Well....He can go to WalMart and wipe out the checking out. Ive learned to hate the sporting good section there!

If something arose that would put a strain on oru already stressed finances, I would feel it very much my place to bring this to him. I wouldnt feel I was being disobedient, since the running of the household has been given to me.

We also both smoke, and have been agonizing and procrastinating about quitting, since we both know it would be best healthwise if we did. Other things....I would definately have to say something if he went down a destructive path(drugs, extreme drinking, etc), simply because I love him too much to see him ruin himself in that manner

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 12:16:00 PM

sudja

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Joined: 2/8/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha

A question for subs/slaves that consider themselves lifestyle, 24/7, or pick-your-own definition type relationship where the dominant does have ultimate say, final say, makes all the decisions.

I'll use femdom as an example, since that's the kind of relationship I'm in, and most familiar with. I don't have a 24/7 dynamic, but if I did, I could see some potential troubles -- and I wonder how people in this kind of relationship deal with it. I can be pretty impulsive and make snap decisions -- it's part of my nature. What happens is that I get passionate about an idea, and I am not someone who can wait. When I want something, I want it *now*. I've always been that way.

If I were in a 24/7 type relationship where I truly was the one in control, I'm wondering how my submissive would deal with me. It seems like it would be impossible -- without defying me outright -- to do so. And, while I am impulsive at times, I don't consider myself dysfunctional or anything -- it's just a flaw (and I'm sure other flaws also might create this same type of decision). I would love to have a man that did everything I said, and gave me everything I wanted. What woman wouldn't want that?

What if the femdom woke up one day and decided she wanted a new car -- she decided after seeing one she loved, and so she tells her sub. Her sub know of their mutual financials, and in his opinion it's an impulsive purchase -- while they can afford it, it's probably not the best financial decision. But, to her, it is suddenly VERY important. She has the reasons why, but really, it's not a prudent use of their joint income.

What does the sub do? Does he give in -- and let her do what she wants, because to say no would defy her? What if she says "I'm the dominant, you know that. I'm not asking your opinion, I'm just telling you what I'm going to do."?

I've always "given in" with my prior relationships - the "want them to be happy/avoid trouble" bits and pieces that were the puzzle bits for who I am today. ::grin::

But those people actually had less respect for me as a person than does my Mistress - and She would *want* to know, in fact She seeks out my opinion on things where She knows, or suspects, I may have "additional" information or superior knowledge.

That said, I could say, "I don't think it's a good idea [insert reasons]" and if She said, "I know, but I want to do it anyway," that would be it. No ifs, ands, or buts.

quote:

What if he gives in, but this is a pattern, and ultimately will result in financial ruin?

Been there, done that, in a very major way. It is definitely a tendency I have, wanting to fulfill every whim, every wish, forget the bills, "she wants it."

Part of what attracted me to my Mistress is that I know that will not happen with Her because of how She feels about money and money issues.

I would never have ever put myself in that position again.

(Nor could I see living with somebody where I didn't know whether I would be in that position.)

quote:

Or turn it around to another example -- what if your dominant picks up an unhealthy habit? What if this habit is ruining the person, or the relationship. Does the 24/7 lifestyle slave just tolerate it?

Drinking? Drugs? Gambling?

Part of my responbility is to take care of Her. That might include submissive like nagging about prescriptions, etc.

It's a difficult question though - there are some "habits" that transform the person into somebody different from the one to whom you pledged, or fell in love. Can you "reclaim" that person?

Sometimes you can't go back again, and I've been there, done that, too - not with a "habit" but an undiagnosed illness ended up irrevocably harming my previous relationship. I would have stayed forever, which I know now would have been a bad idea, but I do attribute the changes from the aftermath of the (her) illness to have played a very large part in the dissolution of that relationship.

I think today I would also do whatever I could to care for, nurture, "fix," my Woman. I can't see not being able to get through to Her.

sudja

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 12:22:27 PM

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In a vanilla relationship the couple talk and discuss maybe argue and someone has to make a decision. Sometimes it is the right one sometimes not. Hopefully your dom will not be to far from doing what is right. If the person were single you wouldn't be there to even offer your input. All you can do is state you thoughts but by being the sub that means they are in the drivers seat.

Of course this is different for different doms. Hopefully you will find one who respects your opinion enough to listen.

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 12:23:42 PM

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I think there are times that the sub/slave must ask to express their concerns. As long as permission has been granted to speak freely and the concerns have been respectfully submitted then the sub/slave must trust the Dominant to make the right decision. If he/she doesn't then it becomes something that has to be accepted without agreement. Should things of this nature continue to happen then the sub/slave must make a decision as to what is right for her/him.

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slave jan

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 1:27:33 PM

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Master and I are not ina 24/7 , but ...I have been concerned about MY compulsive nature. I also want things yesterday(lol). and it has been very hard to not just jump in the car and go shopping whenever I feel like it .however.. as Master keeps telling me "the sign out frontt says,"under new management". and when I gave my submissiveness to Him that meant i do what He says.so i won't jump in the car and go shopping on a whim...on the same hand if I saw Master doing something that I thought would hurt Him or damage our relationship in some way of course I would say something about it.. it is also part of my job as His sub to look out for Him and His happiness .If I neglected to bring something up just because He might not like to hear it then I have done Him a diservice. So yes I think a sub should say somethng espesically if the Dom/me is wrong. If the Dom/me trust His/Her subs opinion whether they take the advice or not at least it was put on the table

(in reply to SftTigress)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 6:29:34 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha
If I were in a 24/7 type relationship where I truly was the one in control, I'm wondering how my submissive would deal with me.
Akasha

If you owned a slave you would have complete control over yourself and complete authority over your slave. Your slave would interact with you in whatever way you found most pleasing and deemed acceptable. You set the rules, the slave lives by them. If
a slave loses faith in the Owners decision making abilities , the relationship will fail. If the slave has been granted permission to do so , the slave may discuss concerns with the owner.

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/3/2005 7:53:58 PM

Mylee

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I obey completley in my relationship, though I am not always in agreement with Him, He let's me state my worries or concerns then we talk but ultimatley He has final say...

That said, I feel I must ask, and please dont take this as me trying to talk back but I wonder, if your submissive totally puts himself into your hands, and tursts YOU to make the dicisions for both of you, no matter how impulsive you feel or the Dom feels , isn't it the Doninates responsibiblity to make wise choices for the both of you, if it's the sub's place to trust, isn't it the Dominates place to handle their sub and their choises with responsibility with the good of both of you?

~my'lee

(in reply to kisshou)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/4/2005 6:56:03 AM

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Joined: 6/21/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha

A question for subs/slaves that consider themselves lifestyle, 24/7, or pick-your-own definition type relationship where the dominant does have ultimate say, final say, makes all the decisions.

I'll use femdom as an example, since that's the kind of relationship I'm in, and most familiar with. I don't have a 24/7 dynamic, but if I did, I could see some potential troubles -- and I wonder how people in this kind of relationship deal with it. I can be pretty impulsive and make snap decisions -- it's part of my nature. What happens is that I get passionate about an idea, and I am not someone who can wait. When I want something, I want it *now*. I've always been that way.

If I were in a 24/7 type relationship where I truly was the one in control, I'm wondering how my submissive would deal with me. It seems like it would be impossible -- without defying me outright -- to do so. And, while I am impulsive at times, I don't consider myself dysfunctional or anything -- it's just a flaw (and I'm sure other flaws also might create this same type of decision). I would love to have a man that did everything I said, and gave me everything I wanted. What woman wouldn't want that?

What if the femdom woke up one day and decided she wanted a new car -- she decided after seeing one she loved, and so she tells her sub. Her sub know of their mutual financials, and in his opinion it's an impulsive purchase -- while they can afford it, it's probably not the best financial decision. But, to her, it is suddenly VERY important. She has the reasons why, but really, it's not a prudent use of their joint income.

What does the sub do? Does he give in -- and let her do what she wants, because to say no would defy her? What if she says "I'm the dominant, you know that. I'm not asking your opinion, I'm just telling you what I'm going to do."?

What if he gives in, but this is a pattern, and ultimately will result in financial ruin?

Or turn it around to another example -- what if your dominant picks up an unhealthy habit? What if this habit is ruining the person, or the relationship. Does the 24/7 lifestyle slave just tolerate it?

Akasha

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:

What if the femdom woke up one day and decided she wanted a new car -- she decided after seeing one she loved, and so she tells her sub. Her sub know of their mutual financials, and in his opinion it's an impulsive purchase -- while they can afford it, it's probably not the best financial decision. But, to her, it is suddenly VERY important. She has the reasons why, but really, it's not a prudent use of their joint income.

What does the sub do? Does he give in -- and let her do what she wants, because to say no would defy her? What if she says "I'm the dominant, you know that. I'm not asking your opinion, I'm just telling you what I'm going to do."?

What if he gives in, but this is a pattern, and ultimately will result in financial ruin?

Or turn it around to another example -- what if your dominant picks up an unhealthy habit? What if this habit is ruining the person, or the relationship. Does the 24/7 lifestyle slave just tolerate it?

Akasha

-------------------------------
okay, realizing this is not going to look right in type, as many of my posts are, being experienced in 1 full time real time 24/7.........yes. i would have no say so, in what She wants. and if She did cause financial ruin, it is on Her shoulders, not mine. there is nothing i can do about it. nor did She in that instance, of my 1st Mistress, ever, consult ME about anything.
so i am the slave that let's Her do as SHE pleases. not like i have a choice anyway.
whether i would stay is another matter.
it would cause much dismay and She would lose 98% of my trust and faith.

thanks.
the wolf

_____________________________

"there is no gravity, life sucks!"

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/5/2005 6:05:06 AM

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ive had one relationship where illness and ensuing personality changes and alcohol ruined our family life. I kept quiet, but when it got to the point of non consenting people getting hurt by his woeful inadequacies, ie. the children, then it was no longer sane to stay put, i left.

Now, if he's behaving in a way i KNOW is not right, coz im not stupid, i have a safe word. This has the same affect in life, as it does in play, it stops it dead, we talk outside of the dynamic. Thats the theory anyhow.

(in reply to lonewolf05)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/6/2005 12:35:39 PM

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Joined: 7/20/2004
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This is something this girl can speak at length about. In this house, service is all encompassing...and as S/someone else said serving one's Owner's best interests does not necessarily mean just saying "Yes, Sir" to everything He says. Unless ofcourse that is the way your house's dynamic exists.
Here, this girl knows if she is approached to be asked about a financial decision then her counsel is what is being requested, not her blanketted agreement. Master is deployed exstensively, so she is "in charge" of the finances. Not because He is incapable, or because she keeps Him from making any purchases neither is true. As example:There is a nice shiney truck sitting in Our driveway she said We could not afford when asked, but was overruled.
Therein lies the rub...in the end He has final say. And all she can do as servant is to juggle the finances to make it work.
Does she cringe everytime she sees the electronic funds transfer for the huge truck payment..yes...does she let Him see her...no. Does she occassionally think aloud when running Quicken "mother f*&^%ng truck, if He didn't buy that truck We could've went to Cabo again" ...yes...does she let Him hear her...no. she knows Master would never keep her basic human needs from ebing met for any selfish wants of His ones. And so long as she has limited amounts of food, water and air she is cared for.

oi vei....such is the life. she thinks too often people want to pretend that Dominants are all knowing all seing demigods...and They aren't They are human beings....capable of making financial, personal, professional etc mistakes...on our end it is just our responsibility in service to be Their "pinch hitter" as it were....sometimes it may feel as if your Owner is a juggler...a bad juggler and your job is to run around catching all the dropped balls...but that is just the life...THE REAL LIFE.

sabrina King

< Message edited by bottominwa -- 7/6/2005 12:39:33 PM >

(in reply to pandoravampire)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/6/2005 6:57:58 PM

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Joined: 2/11/2005
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Im very good with money and have helped people make budgets. There is no way I could not say something. I do not belive one partner should be in-control off all the finances. As someone has said people tend to think Dominants are all seeing, all knowing.

This also comes to the bigger picture. The reposses people wont care you had no say. Or the banks when they black flag your name wont think "oh they had no say".

Obeying is one thing but becoming bankrupt is another.

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/6/2005 11:28:19 PM

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Joined: 6/21/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bottominwa

This is something this girl can speak at length about. In this house, service is all encompassing...and as S/someone else said serving one's Owner's best interests does not necessarily mean just saying "Yes, Sir" to everything He says. Unless ofcourse that is the way your house's dynamic exists.
Here, this girl knows if she is approached to be asked about a financial decision then her counsel is what is being requested, not her blanketted agreement. Master is deployed exstensively, so she is "in charge" of the finances. Not because He is incapable, or because she keeps Him from making any purchases neither is true. As example:There is a nice shiney truck sitting in Our driveway she said We could not afford when asked, but was overruled.
Therein lies the rub...in the end He has final say. And all she can do as servant is to juggle the finances to make it work.
Does she cringe everytime she sees the electronic funds transfer for the huge truck payment..yes...does she let Him see her...no. Does she occassionally think aloud when running Quicken "mother f*&^%ng truck, if He didn't buy that truck We could've went to Cabo again" ...yes...does she let Him hear her...no. she knows Master would never keep her basic human needs from ebing met for any selfish wants of His ones. And so long as she has limited amounts of food, water and air she is cared for.

oi vei....such is the life. she thinks too often people want to pretend that Dominants are all knowing all seing demigods...and They aren't They are human beings....capable of making financial, personal, professional etc mistakes...on our end it is just our responsibility in service to be Their "pinch hitter" as it were....sometimes it may feel as if your Owner is a juggler...a bad juggler and your job is to run around catching all the dropped balls...but that is just the life...THE REAL LIFE.

sabrina King

==========

quote:

does not necessarily mean just saying "Yes, Sir" to everything He says. Unless ofcourse that is the way your house's dynamic exists.

==========
so far it HAS been yes. i have NO say so over nothing, nor was it ever appreciated if i were to say something.
i hope this new Ms i have is going to be different.
thanks
wolf

_____________________________

"there is no gravity, life sucks!"

(in reply to bottominwa)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/6/2005 11:31:22 PM

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As usual, ES is absolutely right.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

It would be my place to remind him of things he may have forgotten, things he might not know, even my personal feelings on the topic if appropriate- and then obey.

This applies whether we're getting directions to a party, discussing medical treatments, making purchases, deciding to get married, or ANYTHING else in my life.

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/7/2005 5:52:45 AM

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Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

As usual, ES is absolutely right.

Awwww :) I love when you make non-trolly posts.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/7/2005 11:53:36 PM

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Joined: 6/21/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kisshou

quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha
If I were in a 24/7 type relationship where I truly was the one in control, I'm wondering how my submissive would deal with me.
Akasha

If you owned a slave you would have complete control over yourself and complete authority over your slave. Your slave would interact with you in whatever way you found most pleasing and deemed acceptable. You set the rules, the slave lives by them. If
a slave loses faith in the Owners decision making abilities , the relationship will fail. If the slave has been granted permission to do so , the slave may discuss concerns with the owner.

-----------------
a slave loses faith in the Owners decision making abilities , the relationship will fail. If the slave has been granted permission to do so , the slave may discuss concerns with the owner.

*******and when push comes to shove, ya walk out the door! it's not like there are any ties here. it's all business. no love n no sex. strictly in it for the service.

the wolf

< Message edited by lonewolf05 -- 7/7/2005 11:54:34 PM >

_____________________________

"there is no gravity, life sucks!"

(in reply to kisshou)

RE: Obeying your dominant - even if they are wrong - 7/11/2005 10:27:47 AM

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Joined: 6/23/2005
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its not they have the ultimate say. yes you should do as they say but you should also go to them after your punishment if you think it was unjustand ask to speak to them about a problem you ahve and explain your findign a real Sir to me would hear you out because i real Sir is there to teach you and be a honest and fair Dom

(in reply to AAkasha)

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