Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor?

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Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 9:24:49 AM

AAkasha

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Has the Internet allowed some people to get into a ego contest regarding what the most extreme thing is they want to do to someone or have done to them?

A lot of the times, I can't even figure the desire for the act is at all related to any fetish per se; it's just an arbirtrary act pulled out because it pushes the limits of safe, sane, consentual but carries with it some sort of edgy "wow" factor. Things like using pepper spray, insertion of questionable item into ass or vagina, sewing clothes onto the body, etc.

This is not meant to be a "your kink is not okay" debate -- I personally don't care what other people enjoy doing. But I wonder if some of the acts are elevating in extremity not because of the nature of the fetish or kink, but simply for the desire of one or both partners to have bragging rights or "outdo" what has been done. With the Internet now, people are constantly comparing notes and some big egos get involved.

It seems like 15 years ago the kinks written about or demonstrated in smut were fairly standard, and could be connected with a repeated fetish. The obvious ones like bondage for those that like feeling out of control, flogging/whipping for those into pain endorphins, various clamping and whatnot of nipples and genitals for sexual stimulation, fetishes related to items (shoes, a kind of fabric, etc.), toilet/scat for humiliation, etc. Even more obscure fetishes were recognized and named because they were re-appearing - clowns, pie in face, balloons, etc.

If people really are developing fetishes for these more obscure, extreme things that's of interest. But are these emerging fetishes, or is it just someone trying to outdo someone else? How far would that go? If there is a fetish simply for "doing something more extreme than any one else does," will it eventually include breaking bones (consentually), etc?

Here's a more clear example. Some people are into burning, and that's extreme, most of us would agree. But the reason is that they have a fetish for fire; they have had this fetish a long time, recognize it, get sexual arousal from it, and are trying to figure out a way to explore it (probably a big challenge). But are there acts people are wanting to explore not for any kink or fetish or desire, but simply to impress people?

Or, are people just getting more extreme?

Akasha

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 9:34:06 AM

Faramir

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No. The internet shortens distance - it makes people across the globe "close" in terms of the ability to communicate, so that they can then in turn create associations by interest.

The pool of kinky people in given city who want to be a club/munch/association is limited by goegraphy - it can only be so big as it draws from a small pool. The pool of people who wan to be ina club called "BDSM sites" is pretty damn big. The internet doesn't make things more - it just allows us to associate across distance.

So the person who thought they were the only one who liked "X" now finds a universe of people who are into "X," and whereas before you settled for "y" because it was close, maybe even got to "x," now you can get full on "X" baby!, because there is a wide pool out there you can draw from, talk to, communicate with, etc.

The submissive who 20 years ago might have been lucky enough to find a guy to spank her, and never thought of having her cunt sutured shut, now gets to see pics of it and realize that's what she needs (and plenty of them are like, "No thanks, spanking is al I need.")

The interent doesn't make us "more" something - it lets us get together and talk so we can have a broader range of everything: from people to interact with to a broader palette of ideas.

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 9:41:10 AM

Kinkypupper

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No people are NOT getting more extreme.
We are escentially who we were 500 or 2000 years ago its our technology that has changed.
We have a broader reach now.
You also have a lot of people who like to "talk" but not "DO"

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 9:43:25 AM

MrThorns

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Honestly, I think edge play came about as people within the community became more and more jaded by intense experiences and needed more to find fulfillment.

An example from my own experiences would be that when I first started out, I was more of a sensual dominant. I liked using wax and ice because of the sensations it would produce. I enjoyed the aspects of physical and mental bondage, orgasm denial and light verbal humiliation due to the effects it had on my submissive as well as the sense of power it gave me.

After awhile, I found that I needed more. I needed to experience more intensity, so I moved up to light floggers until that wasn't enough anymore. Heavy floggers found their way into my toybox after a time. Then canes, quirts, paddles, vampire gloves, violet wands, blades, needles, singletails, etc. It has been quite an evolution and an evolution that has been based in a desire to experience more intensity.

Initially, I never considered myself to be a sadist....but nowadays, it's part of who I am and something I don't think I would want to live without.

~Thorns

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 10:20:55 AM

stormsfate

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Mmmm...sometimes I think this is the case. You always have the exhibitionists. On the other hand, I think there are a lot of extreme things done in private that are never discussed publicly. Edge play is generally very private for us, and you will never see us doing it in public because my owner feels it isn't for public consumption. It would be rare for us to even discuss it publicly in any detail.

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fate

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 10:34:14 AM

Gemeni

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I agree with MrThorns totally.

It's a progression that comes from being jaded. And let's face it,some people just enjoy the reactions that drama and extremes create.

I generally refer to these sorts as "showboat exhibitionists". I tend to ignore this type unless they are demonstrating a particular technique that intertests me. But I'm not that sort-I quit playing in public three years ago. I like the intimacy of things that I do-I have no need to seek validation from a crowd.

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 10:58:38 AM

MsIncognito

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Maybe their fetish is having bragging rights about what they've done? Maybe it isn't about fetishes at all - not everyone has a fetish or four. Maybe it's about pain, maybe it's about creative expression, maybe it's about getting off on being weirder than everyone else. *shrug*

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 11:06:14 AM

sub4hire

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quote:

Here's a more clear example. Some people are into burning, and that's extreme, most of us would agree. But the reason is that they have a fetish for fire; they have had this fetish a long time, recognize it, get sexual arousal from it, and are trying to figure out a way to explore it (probably a big challenge). But are there acts people are wanting to explore not for any kink or fetish or desire, but simply to impress people?

Or, are people just getting more extreme?

I think the opposite is true actually. People were doing this same type of activities before you and I were born. Just because you didn't know about it didn't mean it didn't happen.

The internet does play a part. With the people who woke up and found themselves in a chat room. Not wanting to admit whom they really are, new and exploring they create online personas. Add this and that to it without even having any clue of how to do it. This person passes it on to that one, so on and so forth. Now all of the sudden 10 million people have heard and the original mouth has never even tried it yet.

In the past most slaves were marked. How often does that occur today? Yes, people brand but how often in reality?

That is only one example.

I do riskier scenes with my current dom than my ex dom. Although that is because we are now out in the open. There are demonstrations we attend and learn from. In the past we knew of nothing. So, in that aspect people are doing more.

Yet, at the same time sure there are sensationalists out there. Who do it just for the glory of it. You just have to hope those people are at a minimum.

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 4:09:05 PM

junecleaver

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I partially agree with MrThorns.

I think the kind of mentality you are talking about is rampant in chatrooms and on the internet. I remember first discovering D/s via the internet. All the things I had been feeling earlier started to make more sense to me. But I felt rather excluded by internet cliques partially because I wasn't on the internet enough..but mainly because I wasn't a painslut and I didn't have weird extreme fantasies. It's like they bragged about who could get beat the most and idolized their own bruises. That just wasn't me, still isn't. But I think it's much more calm on this site.

The few people I've met RL involved in BDSM weren't like that thankfully.

I guess you take the good with the bad. But it is definitely a disturbing trend.

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 4:29:33 PM

AAkasha

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quote:

ORIGINAL: junecleaver

I partially agree with MrThorns.

I think the kind of mentality you are talking about is rampant in chatrooms and on the internet. I remember first discovering D/s via the internet. All the things I had been feeling earlier started to make more sense to me. But I felt rather excluded by internet cliques partially because I wasn't on the internet enough..but mainly because I wasn't a painslut and I didn't have weird extreme fantasies. It's like they bragged about who could get beat the most and idolized their own bruises. That just wasn't me, still isn't. But I think it's much more calm on this site.

The few people I've met RL involved in BDSM weren't like that thankfully.

I guess you take the good with the bad. But it is definitely a disturbing trend.

What's going to be the reality when these fringe/extreme/ego kinks become more maintream and are lumped regulary into the category "S&M"? If you think a vanilla partner introduced today to kink gets freaked out, imagine what they'd do when their perceptions of the kink include a more widespread range of activities that are done solely for shock value and really aren't a part of any sensual fetish to begin with?

I guess that was the point I was getting at. I don't mind what anyone does for BDSM purposes to satisfy their kinky desires or deep fetishes; however, what about the people that aren't doing it for any other reason than for ego and attention? It shouldn't be a "your kink is not ok" issue anyway, because it's not a kink. It's as much as kink as doing something arbitrarily to get lots of attention.

And what happens as these extreme-kinks become more commonplace, emerging/new/curious subs and dominants read, learn and incorporate them into their range of knowledge and they become recognized kinks that are imitated again and again?

Akasha

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 6:06:00 PM

MsIncognito

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha

What's going to be the reality when these fringe/extreme/ego kinks become more maintream and are lumped regulary into the category "S&M"?

Umm...people get the idea that BDSM incorporates a very broad range of activities and intensities? Is this bad?

quote:

If you think a vanilla partner introduced today to kink gets freaked out, imagine what they'd do when their perceptions of the kink include a more widespread range of activities that are done solely for shock value and really aren't a part of any sensual fetish to begin with?

So we should all water down our kink in order to appeal to the vanilla masses? To me this reeks of the "let's sanitize and bubble wrap the whole world for the children" mentality. And what is this obsession with fetishes? If I like being suspended by my breasts is that only ok if it's done because its' a fetish? If it's not a fetish then it's bad and detrimental to BDSM as a whole? Let's be honest here - what most people call a fetish most definitely is not - it's just an extreme like for something. A real, diagnosable fetish is when someone cannot become sexually aroused with a certain something happening. I've only ever known ONE person who needed a certain type of stimulation to become aroused. Without it his willy was flaccid no matter what else I did. THAT is a fetish. Really, really, really liking feet or boots or balloons or stuffed animals is not a fetish unless one cannot get aroused without that as stimulation.

quote:

I guess that was the point I was getting at. I don't mind what anyone does for BDSM purposes to satisfy their kinky desires or deep fetishes; however, what about the people that aren't doing it for any other reason than for ego and attention? It shouldn't be a "your kink is not ok" issue anyway, because it's not a kink. It's as much as kink as doing something arbitrarily to get lots of attention.

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth here. On one hand you don't care what people do for kink (uhh...ok, then why post?). On the other you seem inordinantly concerned that all these non-fetishy attention seekers will scare all the vanillas off and sully the good name of BDSM. News flash: vanillas already think we're freaks. And since when is exhibitionism NOT a kink or fetish? Who decided this and why didn't I get the memo?

quote:

And what happens as these extreme-kinks become more commonplace,

Then they're not extreme anymore, are they? When everybody's doing it, it becomes mediocre and is no long extreme. Pretty simple, huh?

quote:

Emerging/new/curious subs and dominants read, learn and incorporate them into their range of knowledge and they become recognized kinks that are imitated again and again?

Again, so what? Are you sure you just aren't projecting your own insecurities about not being extreme enough? Maybe all these 'out there' types make you feel a tad too vanilla? What's your damage on this issue? I'm really at a loss as to what it might be. Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

< Message edited by MsIncognito -- 7/18/2005 6:08:37 PM >

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 8:15:03 PM

mantis65

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I believe people that truly have the very dark extreme fantasies and fetishes are more discreet about sharing them. People with truly extreme fantasies tend to stick to their own small groups to discuss their fantasies.
The internet has made it easier for people with darker or more fringe fetishes to find each other. At the same time I believe most the extreme posts you are seeing AAkasha are just people seeing shock value and attention.

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RE: Extreme S&m just for "wow" factor? - 7/18/2005 8:25:48 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

Or, are people just getting more extreme?

Funny, I actually thought that our society has become so very civilized and tame compared to say... the days of crucifixion, lion’s den, the iron maiden, being drawn & quartered…

In all honesty, what I see is a lot more gratuitous S&M. I saw some boys smacking each other around in a play house and it looked like boys bratting in the school yard. They were essentially trying to see who could take the most. I didn’t enter that room. That isn’t what it is about for me. I believe it is about building up sensations and how far I go all depends on how far I need to go to get the desired result. I’m not looking to break threshold records each time.

- LA

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