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RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/18/2005 4:28:56 PM

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...i don't have anything to contribute.. but i wanted to say that i really appreciate some of the responses here.. i'm someone who has thought about polyamorous relationships... or... having one.. or wanting to be apart of one... and... a lot of your responses here (and the discussions both here and elsewhere on Collarme) have really helped me learn and understand more about it.

..so thanks for discussing things here. ^_^

(in reply to LRODANDMASTER)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/19/2005 3:17:56 AM

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::chuckles:: you're welcome. I may have come late to the dance, but I can still step when needed to.

After going tback through the thread, it makes me grit my teeth a little bit when someone comes in who isn't poly, and basically says some inflammatory things and then runs away when presented with sound logic and reasoning about polyamory. If you don;t understand it, fine. Ask questions, and open your mind. If not, why even waste your time and ours??

_____________________________

If you want to know, then ask. If you to want to heal, then speak. If you want to learn, then listen. If you want to submit, then surrender. If you truly want to love, then you must do all four.

(in reply to ragdoll)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/19/2005 10:34:29 AM

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Reading through this thread, I get a good idea about the prejudices surrounding polyamory and, for want of a better term, ethical sluttery. It's true that polyamory does not necessarily involve an interest in casual play, but it also shouldn't involve judgment against those who are looking for casual play.

I'm poly, but am only currently in one relationship, and don't think I have the energy to put into another right now. However, the fact that we're poly, and the fact that my girlfriend has been poly for many years (even had Dossie Easton as a relationship counselor for her and her wife), helps her be understanding of my interest in pursuing casual play (especially since we're long distance, for the time being).

So I'm looking for friends to play with, and I'm also trying to be as up front and honest about the fact that my relationship resources are limited. I think communication here is key. I expect a lot of people have been burned, when trying to pursue non-mainstream style relationships, simply because they weren't all on the same page about their needs and wants. There's no default to fall back on, so you actually have to talk to people before forming expectations.

(in reply to blackwolf99)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/19/2005 1:40:52 PM

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In response to the original question, I've personally found more of an issue having potential doms run away when they hear the word poly! I admit I am brand spanking new (pun intended) to this site, and this is my experience thus far.

Although I think it's fairly clear in my profile that I am polyamorous and married, people seemed shocked when I mention it in chat. IRL, however, most of our friends are poly but just not into BDSM the way I'd want them to be. So finding the right person(s) is difficult... perhaps people - as we've seen here - steretype and don't take the time to ask a potential sub (me) how my lifestyle would affect a relationship.

Joy&Peace to all of us polypeople,
XXOO

_____________________________

"We all live with the objective of being happy; our lives are all different and yet the same."
Anne Frank

(in reply to night101owl)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/19/2005 3:55:58 PM

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The problem that I see in poly relationships, alot of the the time the participates are not getting the same amount of satisfaction. When that happens, believe me, the relationship can unravel so quickly. The other point I wanted to make is alot of people are very jealous/possessive of their significant other. That is a recipe for disaster in this type of relationship. It takes very special people to participate in a poly relationship. You have to be willing to share and put your partners needs before your own.

(in reply to night101owl)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/20/2005 7:30:52 AM

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i guess the issue for me about poly is that i just don't share well. i know this is not a popular opinion coming from a sub's mouth but it is just me being totally honest. i also know i will take some heat on this but i am honest and that is just how i feel. i guess i feel when i meet the right Dom for me, i need love involved and maybe i am just insecure but i just don't want to share the person i love.

_____________________________

the green eyed angel

"For it was not into my ear you whispered, but into my heart. It was not my lips you kissed, but my soul."

(in reply to blackwolf99)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/20/2005 7:58:20 AM

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It's called: Social conditioning

I think as being a little girl, my parents taught me how to grow and learn as i aged. They said: one day you will get married and live happily ever after............with one person. I think that is how most people are raised in our society. If you do something different....it's against the(gawwd i hate this word)norm.

I still believe in marriage, i still believe in being with one Man. He is poly....i am not. I also believe that two people can live as we do and make it work.....you know the best thing about it? It does!
I fully understand His needs/wants/desires....there comes a place of acceptance...........with that...............comes much peace.

My suggestion to others has been: Don't close the door just yet..there may be an answer on the other side.

Happy Saturday y'all!!

~smilezz~

< Message edited by smilezz -- 8/20/2005 9:38:37 AM >

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(in reply to blackwolf99)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/20/2005 8:20:34 PM

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My main problem with poly is that for MANY, it means "I have a girlfriend/sub/slave/wife, but I can still behave like a single man and play/date/sex whoever else I want."

That's not really poly.

(in reply to pineapplesub)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/20/2005 9:22:46 PM

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Why use the words "poly", "polyamorous", "polyamory", etc. when describing to a prospective submissive partner what sort of relationship you want. Once you use any of these words, you have to enforce YOUR definition of it, and if there is a definition already in place in the other person's mind, you are adding work to your struggle.

These terms have been truly abused by abusive men -- for example, those who build a harem via secrets, the women do not know of each other. The woman you want is going to be afraid of such involvements, of course.

I suggest you say how much time you have available to your new commitment. Specifiy how available you are -- and are not. Honoring your existing commitments, whatever they are, simply makes you ... honorable.

Many assume you are going to fall in love with them and have divided loyalties once that happens. Why would a good woman want to come to a marraige and bring it instability? So, those who are inexperienced at ethical non-monogamy can easily see the pitfalls but not the path around them.

It has been my observation that some young women who think they are submissive hope to learn alongside a young man who thinks he is dominant. Why should I persuade her otherwise? Others see some value in dating an older dominant man for a season, in order to learn, or even walking a mile or two with a couple. To each their own.

Tim

(in reply to pineapplesub)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/21/2005 12:24:17 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AbstractSavant
My main problem with poly is that for MANY, it means "I have a girlfriend/sub/slave/wife, but I can still behave like a single man and play/date/sex whoever else I want."

That's not really poly.

Unfortunately, that lack of understanding and the misuse of the terminology does us a lot of disservice. There are those of us who believe in integrity, honor and responsibility in our relationships, yet the word makes the insecure and uninformed scurry away before they learn any better.

Most people who hear the word first are on guard. Most that meet my family and interact with all of the love and nurturing we provide each other, barely blink when they hear the word. We tend to use "polyfidelity" rather than simply the shortened term "poly" to indicate that there is much more to our version than what they think they know about non-monogamy.
Just like any other labels, stereotyping only leads to miscommunications.

Good luck in your search, AbstractSavant. I love the name, too.

Purr

(in reply to AbstractSavant)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/21/2005 5:32:23 AM

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quote:

Why use the words "poly", "polyamorous", "polyamory", etc. when describing to a prospective submissive partner what sort of relationship you want. Once you use any of these words, you have to enforce YOUR definition of it, and if there is a definition already in place in the other person's mind, you are adding work to your struggle.

Why use those to describe us? Because thats what we are.... and I don't mind explaining my "definition" of it and if I have to "enforce" my definition and if it is THAT much of a struggle then, IMNSHO, perhaps that isn't a person we need in our family anyway.

quote:

These terms have been truly abused by abusive men -- for example, those who build a harem via secrets, the women do not know of each other. The woman you want is going to be afraid of such involvements, of course.

All the more reason to be totally upfront about it.... as so many have already stated that the term has been "abused" and because of that I believe that it needs to be brought out into the light... I personally feel that if you make an attempt to "hide" or "disquise" something it's because a part of you feels it's wrong. So to not be totally upfront from the start is, again, IMO, dishonest. Those that "build a harem via secrets...." well, that's cheating, period, and has nothing to do with poly whatsoever.

quote:

I suggest you say how much time you have available to your new commitment. Specifiy how available you are -- and are not. Honoring your existing commitments, whatever they are, simply makes you ... honorable.

That may work for some but I don't see it having any bearing on a closed poly family, the commitment would have to be 24/7 even if living together wasn't possible. See, that is one of the biggest frustrations I have... people talk about divided loyalties and bringing instability to a marriage, and the list goes on and on... The point is really very simple... COMMUNICATION... and when you are done with that.... do it more. Be open, be honest, be respectful and on top of everything else... be realistic. If you can do all of those things then you shouldn't have to beguile someone into your life by "beautifying" the term poly. They either understand it, don't understand it but want to, have been burned by someone that claimed it (but then again who among us hasn't been burned by someone claiming to be a dominant/submissive as well?) or they have no desire what so ever to be a part of it... I honestly don't see how avoiding the word "poly" in any way changes that dynamic. So call it poly, call it swinging, call it an open marriage.... but by not calling SOMETHING then you leave it to the other person to put their own definition on it... the one thing you were trying to avoid to begin with.

Jewel

_____________________________

Don't ask, trust me, you won't like the answer... no one ever does.

(in reply to NotVanilla1)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/22/2005 8:47:17 PM

WilliamMasterson

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I am sorry if someone else already said this in an earlier post, but I did not have the time to read everything in detail.

Polyamoury is not having an open relationship, just as an open relationship is not swinging.

To me, being poly means you only get intimate with someone if you love that person first. Having an open relationship is different in that you will also sleep with people who are only friends. While swinging is all about screwing strangers or casual acquaintances.

Then you can have open and closed poly relationships. And there are poly fidelity relationships, where everyone involved knows everyone else's partners and anyone new for any member of the family has to be approved first.

Being poly is not a simple thing. It is the complexity of a monogamous relationship magnified 100 fold, and that is without even adding in the bdsm and D/s factors.

(in reply to ShiftedJewel)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 8/23/2005 11:49:08 AM

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to the OP you asked why do female subs run when they hear the word poly. Quite frankly i think it comes down to preferences. They want a one on one relationship without having to deal with the other factors. There is nothing wrong with that. Its the same as if someone said to me they wanted someone who would do blood play. Not my thing, i have no desire to try it. I understand blood play, i just don't want to do it. Just as i understand poly, the concepts behind it, but its not something i desire to try at this time. Doesn't make me right or wrong, just my preference.

(in reply to ragdoll)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 10/16/2005 9:18:20 PM

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I agree with and will add to Mstrhellsfury comment. Anyone that can not handle themselves will not make a good polypartner. Always thinking of how others see you or their perspectives is key in communication. The more you keep their perspective in mind the better you can communicate.

Communication is key.

(in reply to MstrHellsFury)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 10/19/2005 7:01:14 PM

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Hey after reading your posting I had to respond because I myself as a Dominant female also go through the same thing slaves asking questions like: what is it that you want a stable? I simply respond IF you did all that I require at all the times I require it then there would be no need for another BUT since you can't then shut up and sit back and enjoy the time we have to spend together.

(in reply to blackwolf99)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 10/20/2005 4:48:01 PM

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I actually have several close friends involved in poly relationships that are not at all involved in BDSM. A few are polysexual and a few are polyamorous. However, I wouldn't call them "vanilla" myself as that is how they refer to traditional one-on-one relationships. By that definition, they are not vanilla even if they are not involved with the bdsm lifestyle. I would call these "vanilla" people typical or traditional, rather than normal.

(in reply to Ilsekoch)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 10/28/2005 10:51:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrHellsFury
if you can't handle yourself..you can't handle another....

Master... you can handle me.... *little smile

< Message edited by phoenixMF -- 10/28/2005 10:55:16 PM >

(in reply to MstrHellsFury)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 11/1/2005 3:45:44 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsPurrmeow

quote:

ORIGINAL: glassdoll
if i am in love, i just don't want to have sex with anyone else.

Glassdoll,

Can you elaborate on any experiences that taught you that poly is about being forced to have sex with more than one person? These are two completely different concepts from my viewpoint.

They are?!! BUMMER!! lol

(in reply to MsPurrmeow)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 11/2/2005 8:50:18 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsPurrmeow

I'll try not to elaborate too much on the extremely wide range of definitions that people use for poly, none of which being the one above (That would be either Polyfidelity or simply PolyFAMILY, but most users of the umbrella term Polyamory outside of this site do run it like an open relationship or swingers.)

For me, it's a stable, long-term fidelitous family, not one that swings or has one-nighters with strangers, and we catch all kinds of hell from the Polyamory community for being so darned odd. There are extremes on both ends of the Poly umbrella, they will always be mistaken for the other until the terminology is set at some point.

Not all swingers have one night stands many of them are life long playmates....the terms for engagement are much like those associated within the BDSM play/scene community......everyone has to get to know each other and agree upon all of the terms for playtime.....I am a Gorean Master and there are times that I do swing with other couples at the Nightclub I manage with similar interests.........poly sometimes is open play with several Masters and submissives engaging in lots of play together and seperate of one another as long as everyone has a clear understanding what 1. the rules are and 2. where each persons loyalities lie...

Master Six

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I wish you well

(in reply to MsPurrmeow)

RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 11/3/2005 7:56:43 AM

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:) Master stated it simply....but from a slaves point...Poly means more then one....alot of "submissives and slaves" are not emotionaly stable enough for this. The other night at the club Master Mananges i was able to talk to a couple who have been married for 11 yrs yet only about a yr ago began to swing.From her stand point it was difficult at first cause she had been emotionaly unstable and was secure enough with their bond...she always thought the other women were after her husband because he was good looking,hardworking...and well...great in bed.She later relized that her husband wasnt going to leave her for anyone one else and swinging became a fav thing for her to do.Poly is the same way......the first must relize her place with the Master she serves and then accept as long as she behaves she will always have a home...while Master enjoys the hehe company of others....she is at his side....The second(or third etc) must relize that Master cares for her and accepts her and will help her be the best she can be......
i used to hate poly...because i was scared Master would grow tired of me and get rid of me.....yet if the Master is a good poly Master he always makes sure that ALL parties involved are emotionaly secure before steping into this life choice.

_____________________________

Blessed be!

(in reply to SirSix72)

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