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RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/15/2007 10:42:31 PM   
touchthesky


Posts: 121
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: offline
i just never make the assumption that if i want something that it means other people need to satisfy my desire. 

(in reply to pineapplesub)
Profile   Post #: 141
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/16/2007 3:15:43 PM   
Jeniluscious


Posts: 53
Joined: 9/11/2005
From: Detroit metro
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ilsekoch

I know no vanilla or NORMAL people who would put up with this.


I know four triads right off the top that are not involved in bdsm in any way.  I'm sure you'd manage to find some way to consider them not "normal", whatever that might mean to you.  Perhaps you should just get out more?  *polite smile*


_____________________________

Jeni

An axe and a scalpel both draw blood. For me, I prefer the scalpel; I like my bloodletting up close and personal.

(in reply to Ilsekoch)
Profile   Post #: 142
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/16/2007 5:41:32 PM   
azzmaster


Posts: 864
Joined: 2/15/2007
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u have to develope extra sexual perception. If u look in a subs eyes u can read what they kinks is. U also gotta know how to make em realize u know they special

(in reply to Jeniluscious)
Profile   Post #: 143
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/17/2007 1:49:30 PM   
JerryInTampa


Posts: 138
Joined: 2/19/2004
Status: offline
OP: The same reason many 'nilla people run when their hear "BDSM"

(in reply to pineapplesub)
Profile   Post #: 144
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/19/2007 12:12:29 AM   
koimizu


Posts: 64
Status: offline
To the OP, i truly wish Sir that i could explain why littles and potentials flee at the mention of the word Poly in any context or variation of its definition.  Social grooming and mental equations  of poly with cheating, infidelity, harems and other things that were puffed up to 'truth' status in highschool bathrooms and bible classes like the one about getting pregnant from kissing.

i can only speak for myself since i perk up and get very happy when poly is mentioned, but if it follows as polygamy, yeah, i flee.  Polyamory is my ideal, even polyfidelity but anything denoting the requirement for a ceremony beyond collaring to cement my place in the family, makes me break out in a chill.

Oddly because i see it as marriage in a way that i don't see polyamory or polyfidelity.  Mental hangup about marriage period.  Does it mean the commitment to both Family, Sir, Miss and House are any less?  Not at all.  Just...pavlovian reaction thanks to ex for anything that hints at marriage.  lol.

i admit i like the viewpoint you give of a tribal arrangement and honestly hope you find a suitable girl to bring into the fold.

Safe Journeys!


_____________________________

It Is Not A Question Of Honor, But That Honor Is Questioned


(in reply to beltainefaerie)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 2:06:08 AM   
ftmouse


Posts: 16
Joined: 2/16/2007
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mmm interesting reading.  i live with my Mistress and her hubby and their two kids, (both over 20)  and well i guess you could call it poly, never really thought of it as such but in a way it is.  Communication is the key in this house and yes this sub gets to put his two cents worth in.  It takes time and patience.  mmmm but i do sometimes get funny when other subs try to muscel in without the respect of my situation.  What can i suggest?  Try a different way of bringing to the conversation table, as many good suggestions here have made.

(in reply to pineapplesub)
Profile   Post #: 146
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 8:45:27 AM   
gemy


Posts: 107
Joined: 4/6/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Let's face it though- a grand majority of people (doms) out there THINK poly would be a great idea, and have absolutely no skills to do it well.


LA, i agree with you totally ,,,, i recently became involved with a Dom who knew i was open to poly.  He met a girl, started spending lots of time with her and lots less with me. when he told me of her, i had not met her or known of her, but He had already been with her for a week, and He specifically mentioned my being open to poly so let's work it out ~~

He may have wanted it, but went about it not quite rightly, and did not have the skills for it, at least at this point

as to the OP's question of why they run? could be anything ~ fantasy of poly vs. reality; their own jealous issues; not wanting to take the time to learn what is really going on; not "wired" for it *shrugs* too many things could get in the way

i guess patience isn't only for bottoms *grinz

gemmie

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)
Profile   Post #: 147
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 11:29:33 AM   
Missokyst


Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline
Perhaps because they just aren't wired to be poly?  It doesn't always have to be explained away by saying someone just doesn't understand the practice.  Some people just are not comfortable sharing their time with someone who is not as focused on them, as they are in their (one) mate.
And there are a lot of people like myself, who just don't like women (let alone other women) in their personal space.
You should put POLY, and seeking like minded poly people in your profile.  At least it gives everyone a heads up on whether or not they wish to respond.
Good luck.
Kyst

_____________________________

pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

“The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for.”
― Bob Marley


(in reply to blackwolf99)
Profile   Post #: 148
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 4:36:03 PM   
curiouspet55


Posts: 133
Joined: 10/13/2006
From: Indiana
Status: offline
I haven't read all the responses, but my two cents...

I am one who runs at the word poly. I won't be in a relationship with someone who is interested in poly lifestyles, or has other play partners. I want a long term, potential for marriage, relationship. I want to belong to my Master, and I want him to belong to me. I don't want to share my man, I'm posessive, and I'd hope he would be too. I want him to love me, and I will love him in return. If there was someone else involved, I'd always be questioning if he was going to leave me for that person, if he thought the other person more attractive, if I disappointed him would he compare me to her, etc. It won't work for me.

For some people, poly works out just fine. With my personality, it does not. These subs that run more than likely just do not have a personality that works well with a poly lifestyle.

cp55

_____________________________

Question everything, try anything, do something.

(in reply to blackwolf99)
Profile   Post #: 149
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 4:42:45 PM   
honeywhite66


Posts: 1
Joined: 1/1/2007
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It's just human nature...there's someone for everyone out there.
We all need to be true to ourselves!
honey

(in reply to curiouspet55)
Profile   Post #: 150
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 4:52:57 PM   
slaveish


Posts: 1086
Joined: 2/19/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: curiouspet55

I don't want to share my man, I'm posessive, and I'd hope he would be too. I want him to love me, and I will love him in return. If there was someone else involved, I'd always be questioning if he was going to leave me for that person, if he thought the other person more attractive, if I disappointed him would he compare me to her, etc. It won't work for me.


Someone once told me that loyalty and fidelity are two very different animals. It took me awhile to think about it, to really chew it ... and it made sense to me. I'm not trying to convert you but it was a definite turning point for me.

_____________________________

You only lose what you cling to. ~~Gautama Sidharta

If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other. ~~Mother Teresa

(in reply to curiouspet55)
Profile   Post #: 151
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 5:23:15 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
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I haven't read the whole thread, but here is my answer to the original poster as a monogamous woman who recently ran from a man the minute he mentioned poly.

Short Answer: I'm a spoiled only child and I don't fricking play well with others. End of story. I don't like other people petting my dog or riding my horse...let alone touching my dominant.

That said, I have numerous poly friends, and they all have very happy and healthy relationships for them. I'm happy for them.

I simply recognize though that poly does not work for me. I tried it once and it made me utterly miserable (I'm talking damn near suicidally depressed.)

Long answer: I am jealous, possessive, and have enormous self esteem issues. Therefore, I know now not to waste a poly man's time. I could never make him happy. Even if I consented to it, it would be "to make him happy" and I myself would be miserable.

Call it insecure, call it selfish and immature, etc. All that is probably true. However, I believe in being honest about my personality faults and I'm not going to sugar coat the truth. I don't like to see my partner even hug a platonic female friend, let alone do anything else with her.

I also have an immense dislike for females in general and do not even have female friends/close aquaintances. I just don't trust them. Being involved in a "family" with another female would never work for me because I would not be able to form any kind of bond or friendship with another female. I'm just not the kind of person. She would always be "the competition," "the enemy" " the interloper" etc. I do think I might enjoy a one-time threesome type thing, just purely for the sexual thrilll....but I'd have to put her butt on a plane to china afterwards and hope I never saw her again cause if I did,  I'd probably shoot her.

You know it's kind of like when my stepbrother stayed with my family for a few years. I was already firmly sitting on the "only child" throne of honor and when he came to stay with us, I was livid. I did not see it as "gaining a brother." I saw it as losing half my mom and stepdad's attention, half their love, half my living space, half my christmas presents, etc. I HATED my stepbrother, and even kind of beat him up a few times before he got bigger than me (we were both kids at the time so I guess I can admit that now).. Here we are adults now, all that is said and done, and you know what? I still hate the little turd. Never did forgive him for ruining a few years of my childhood by his presence. When I found out he'd gotten arrested, gone to prison, and been written out of the will, I damn near threw a party. Does that make me a selfish bitch? Probably. But hell, I'm not going to lie about it.

The point of that whole story is this: I'm selfish and I don't share well.

I will freely admit that true poly familys are usually comprised of people more mature and secure than I am. That's great for them that they have found happiness. Who knows? Perhaps with time the right man could get me over my issues. But it would take a LONG time I think (probably YEARS of earning my trust and being faithful to me.)

Now the big question is why am I this way? I don't know...I'm not a psychiatrist. But my therapist says I have absolutely huge abandonment issues due to my father leaving me when I was small. I don't know if that's a reason or an excuse, but I think it colors my behavior. I just know that even seeing my dominant look at another woman the wrong way can either make my blood boil with rage or send me into a bawling fit of hysteria.

It's just how I am...therefore, when a man mentions poly, I run. It wouldn't be fair to ask him to take on my issues.

(in reply to beltainefaerie)
Profile   Post #: 152
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 5:58:04 PM   
ladiehawk


Posts: 2
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra

quote:

ORIGINAL: blackwolf99

If I say "I love my partner" and I say, "I love my mother." and I say " I love cats." does the same definition apply? (yeah I know there some of you thinking 'maybe'. *wink*)




Probably not, but I'm wondering what your mother would say if you told her you had another mother that you loved just as much and it wouldn't mean you loved that one mother less, but all the holidays and special events of your life would be spent with the other mother since obviously, the first mother had other children that you didn't want involved with the second mother..

Yes, I know those situations exist, but here's the thing...if you have to convince someone that your way is best, then why bother? If they're going to run, then that's a decision they've made for themselves, and why in the world would you want to try to convince someone that they could live in a manner they didn't want to live in? It doesn't mean your life is wrong and it doesn't mean theirs is either. It just means your life is wrong for them.

There's a sociology book I read often and in it they talk about relationships. The  book states that the most unstable relationship is that of a pair. However, while it is the most unstable, it is also the most intense - sociologically speaking - of the other choices. According to the book, as a new person joins the existing relationship, stability increases but at the cost of intensity between its members.

And it could just be that there are some submissives who at some level, recognize this and don't want that in their lives. And then too, the people you're talking to might really not want an entire other family to join...perhaps they're looking for just one at this time.

And that's not saying one bad thing about them or those who choose polyamorous lifestyles.

juliet


jullietsiera, I love you!

(in reply to julietsierra)
Profile   Post #: 153
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 6:08:05 PM   
ladiehawk


Posts: 2
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: venusdiva429

I've never been involved in a poly relationship, mind, but I've been interested- slightly.

A little of what might go through someone's head when they're approached by a couple/poly Dom (I'm not saying that any of these are right or fair, but these can possibly be present in their heads)...keep in mind, this is your run-of-the-mill person responding to an ad or email on the site. Some are going to be highly insulting and offensive, but I'm just reporting back reactions that I've heard through my life:
  • They've fucked around, and therefore risk factors for things like herpes (which can be transmitted even with a condom) are higher.
  • By becoming a partner with this poly person, I'd be just another notch on the belt until someone better comes along, no matter what sort of platitudes they may spout.
  • Can't be depended on to be there for you, because they'll be spending their time with someone else.
  • I wonder how many kids are running about. I wonder who the parents are. THEY probably wonder who the parents are.
  • I see lots of women in these families, but what if I wanted another guy? And not a sub guy? What then?
  • I would only be one third (or whatever percentage) of their hearts. Great.
  • This is just an excuse to jump around from bed to bed.
  • You're committment-phobic, and have probably hurt many wo/men in the past.
  • They want an easy out when the time comes, and they need a fancy name for it.
  • I wonder how many women went through the revolving door after they had their fun with her.
  • Ah. Yes, the man as seed spreader. The "National Geographic" excuse. Nice.

So on, and so forth...

I may not think this way, but others do. If the majority of what people see of these relationships is that they come to bad ends, with many women involved and one very sated man, what do you expect of them? I'm glad for all of you that are able to make something lasting, loving, and beautiful out of what you've found. But, at the same time, do you think that people are going to rush to the forums and read the whole poly section to educate themselves on the great relationships of 50 people when you send an email? Probably not.

I don't like the fact that people who happen to favor monogamy as their preferred committment are being demonized, though, or made to sound like they're somehow mentally deficient. Would you call me weak or insecure? I'm not. I'm very confident and strong. I don't want a poly relationship. It's not for me. That's it. I'm not overrun with crazy scads of social conditioning that are driving me to want to be with one partner. I just like my focus on one person. I want their focus on me. You don't live that way. Fine.

Saying that people are just brainwashed into fidelity with one person is ignoring the fact that people, historically, tried to mate with just one person to guarantee blood lines for matters of premogeniture and inheritance, title, and legacy. That's the conditioning you're fighting against. It's not fly-by-night. It's historic. No one's knocking poly because it's wrong, but because it seems very unstable. The book that was referenced (title?) says that poly families are more stable, but that the focus is diffused. Of course there's more stability. If you're spending only half your time with a person, that's half the opportunities for strife.

I guess what I'm saying is that the "new" poly that leaves the swinging era of the 70s behind needs to be more out and proud. It has to be honest. That means being upfront in profiles, perhaps having both parties contact one candidate whose profile you both enjoy (or apply this to whoever is in your family). You have to reason with those beliefs, but not in a way that pushes or belittles. The man of the bunch may have to do some explaining about why he's the only man, whether that's a changeable option, and his reasons for it not being changeable if that's the case. But know that many subs want the attention of a single man or woman. It's not a defect to want healthy attention and focus, and you're not a spineless, insecure person for desiring this singular attention.

Poly people may be wired differently. That's fine. Your homes and hearts are filled with love. However, the face of poly, especially in recent times, hasn't been one of evenly shared love, but one of selfishness and gluttony. What ideas do you have to change this?




I love you too!
(Hey, does that mean I am poly-loves after all?
Nay, just bi-loves    )

(in reply to venusdiva429)
Profile   Post #: 154
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 6:11:03 PM   
GSD


Posts: 2
Joined: 6/21/2005
Status: offline
In my not so humble opinion, I feel that most run because they do not understand what poly means to you or have a true meaning for themselves.  I have writen in my blog/journal about Wants VS Needs, which I truely feel is the real crux of the issue. I see so many great submissives sitting waiting for their one to come along, when most of the time they have been in front of them for a long time, but they feel that sharing is beyond them or not in thier abilities.

Let's look at some definitions from the American Heritage Dictionary:
  • Submissive - adj - Inclined or willing to submit
  • Submission - n - the act of submitting to the power of another
  • Polyamory - n - participation in multiple and simultaneous loving or sexual relationships
  • Polyamorous - adj - pertaining to partipation in multiple and simultaneous loving or sexual relationships

There are so many ways to view Poly relationships and each person has a different view of it.  I personally am Poly, and in my profile it states "I am not seeking someone who is interested in a polyamorous relationship, although I will consider a woman who is bisexual and interested in one man as her Master and willing to be with other women to please her Master. I am not interested in women who are disobedient and rebellient, nor am I interested  in a woman who claims to be submissive only when she wants to be."

That is what I consider Poly for me. Nature created me this way and I think that by following my instincts I am being what I was created to be. 


(in reply to blackwolf99)
Profile   Post #: 155
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 8:02:18 PM   
justfortheforums


Posts: 40
Joined: 1/31/2007
Status: offline
the only time that i have been approached with poly is from the sex viewpoint...we need a third or wouldn't you enjoy having another join us or i sure would enjoy doing you and then doing her and then doing you and then doing her...i've never been approached by anyone who seemed to have gotten past the sex and into the real "guts" of a relationship and everyday life. 
that's why we run.

(in reply to pineapplesub)
Profile   Post #: 156
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/22/2007 9:33:28 PM   
curiouspet55


Posts: 133
Joined: 10/13/2006
From: Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveish

quote:

ORIGINAL: curiouspet55

I don't want to share my man, I'm posessive, and I'd hope he would be too. I want him to love me, and I will love him in return. If there was someone else involved, I'd always be questioning if he was going to leave me for that person, if he thought the other person more attractive, if I disappointed him would he compare me to her, etc. It won't work for me.


Someone once told me that loyalty and fidelity are two very different animals. It took me awhile to think about it, to really chew it ... and it made sense to me. I'm not trying to convert you but it was a definite turning point for me.


I can understand where you are coming from, but the fact of the matter is I can barely trust that a man truly cares for me and finds me beautiful when I'm the only one. If he had other people he was with, even if only sexually, I would judge myself more harshly than I already do and it wouldn't work for me.

_____________________________

Question everything, try anything, do something.

(in reply to slaveish)
Profile   Post #: 157
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/23/2007 1:43:00 AM   
venusdiva429


Posts: 44
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ladiehawk

quote:

ORIGINAL: venusdiva429

I've never been involved in a poly relationship, mind, but I've been interested- slightly.

A little of what might go through someone's head when they're approached by a couple/poly Dom (I'm not saying that any of these are right or fair, but these can possibly be present in their heads)...keep in mind, this is your run-of-the-mill person responding to an ad or email on the site. Some are going to be highly insulting and offensive, but I'm just reporting back reactions that I've heard through my life:
  • They've fucked around, and therefore risk factors for things like herpes (which can be transmitted even with a condom) are higher.
  • By becoming a partner with this poly person, I'd be just another notch on the belt until someone better comes along, no matter what sort of platitudes they may spout.
  • Can't be depended on to be there for you, because they'll be spending their time with someone else.
  • I wonder how many kids are running about. I wonder who the parents are. THEY probably wonder who the parents are.
  • I see lots of women in these families, but what if I wanted another guy? And not a sub guy? What then?
  • I would only be one third (or whatever percentage) of their hearts. Great.
  • This is just an excuse to jump around from bed to bed.
  • You're committment-phobic, and have probably hurt many wo/men in the past.
  • They want an easy out when the time comes, and they need a fancy name for it.
  • I wonder how many women went through the revolving door after they had their fun with her.
  • Ah. Yes, the man as seed spreader. The "National Geographic" excuse. Nice.

So on, and so forth...

I may not think this way, but others do. If the majority of what people see of these relationships is that they come to bad ends, with many women involved and one very sated man, what do you expect of them? I'm glad for all of you that are able to make something lasting, loving, and beautiful out of what you've found. But, at the same time, do you think that people are going to rush to the forums and read the whole poly section to educate themselves on the great relationships of 50 people when you send an email? Probably not.

I don't like the fact that people who happen to favor monogamy as their preferred committment are being demonized, though, or made to sound like they're somehow mentally deficient. Would you call me weak or insecure? I'm not. I'm very confident and strong. I don't want a poly relationship. It's not for me. That's it. I'm not overrun with crazy scads of social conditioning that are driving me to want to be with one partner. I just like my focus on one person. I want their focus on me. You don't live that way. Fine.

Saying that people are just brainwashed into fidelity with one person is ignoring the fact that people, historically, tried to mate with just one person to guarantee blood lines for matters of premogeniture and inheritance, title, and legacy. That's the conditioning you're fighting against. It's not fly-by-night. It's historic. No one's knocking poly because it's wrong, but because it seems very unstable. The book that was referenced (title?) says that poly families are more stable, but that the focus is diffused. Of course there's more stability. If you're spending only half your time with a person, that's half the opportunities for strife.

I guess what I'm saying is that the "new" poly that leaves the swinging era of the 70s behind needs to be more out and proud. It has to be honest. That means being upfront in profiles, perhaps having both parties contact one candidate whose profile you both enjoy (or apply this to whoever is in your family). You have to reason with those beliefs, but not in a way that pushes or belittles. The man of the bunch may have to do some explaining about why he's the only man, whether that's a changeable option, and his reasons for it not being changeable if that's the case. But know that many subs want the attention of a single man or woman. It's not a defect to want healthy attention and focus, and you're not a spineless, insecure person for desiring this singular attention.

Poly people may be wired differently. That's fine. Your homes and hearts are filled with love. However, the face of poly, especially in recent times, hasn't been one of evenly shared love, but one of selfishness and gluttony. What ideas do you have to change this?




I love you too!
(Hey, does that mean I am poly-loves after all?
Nay, just bi-loves    )

Ooooh, baby !


_____________________________

Relationships, fiction, and personal development fabulousness at Luscious Life!

Never be an option when he's your priority. Just...don't. You are a true gem to a true man!

(in reply to ladiehawk)
Profile   Post #: 158
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/23/2007 8:23:56 AM   
TheLadyEliza


Posts: 13
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline
hey.
i have just slogged my way through almost all of this forum, except the bit where people were repeating other people who had spoken previously, and i don't think i saw anybody who has been thinking about this from my angle yet. I have never had a poly amarous relationship, and when i first popped up here (within the first couple of days) a triad contcted me looking for a forth, and i ran as fast as i could and the only coherent thought i can remember thinking was: i don't want to be in a new family!  
From my rather naieve point of view, Polyamory has a lot in commen with the situations that occour when divorced parents get married again. The kids (subs/slaves/partners) have been warned. The Parents (Dom/mes) have decided they are compatible. They have probably all been out on 'dates' together, had sleep overs and serious disscussions. But this is not the same as moving in/living with/adjusting to having more people permanently. Even if all the people are not actually living together, there is still an adjustment required to your headspace to always have to include the new member/s in your planning.
That is the reason i found/find poly to be very intimidating, and it also relates to my abhorrance of the "Daddy Dom". Whist i understand from my reading that incest is one of the most commen fantasys out there, i find it utterly squicks me, and polyamory has too many tones of the family situation for my head to adjust easily.

But the other thought that occors to me is that most Vannila people have experience at a version of Poly, in that in the past, most people have shared accomadation that was not their parents. When people slog through the day to day living issues that they have with the other people that inhabit their space, they are in a sense setting thems selves up for poly, because any household that can actually run and be harmonious,  should be able to carry that through. (maybe)


 

(in reply to venusdiva429)
Profile   Post #: 159
RE: Why subs run when they hear the word poly - 2/23/2007 9:09:25 AM   
puella


Posts: 2457
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline
Perhaps I am missing something, or oversimplifying the question....

but could it just be that those whom you have approached simply were not wired for or do not desire to be in a poly situation.

It is just as legitimate to be monogamous as to be polyamorous.  I seemed to sense in your question, and many replies, that they were running from you wish to acquire another parter in a poly dynamic because they were somehow less than 'evolved' as a '"kinkster" or otherwise.

I really think the answer to your question might be as simple as... because they do not desire to participate in a poly relationship.

(in reply to blackwolf99)
Profile   Post #: 160
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