RE: Courtship and "pursuit"

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RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/24/2005 11:07:10 PM

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From: Philadelphia, PA
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I will do a considerable amount of the courting. That being said, I too have to believe that the individual is truly interested in ME and not simply in what I might do to him. He has to take interest in learning more about me (I provide a great deal of reference material) and I expect him to show interest, passion, manners and good sense when it comes to communicating with me. If he's offered the opportunity to speak with me on the phone, does he make good use of my time (and his)? Does he waste my time with idle chatter or does he ask questions and get to know me? Same with an in person meeting...if they get that far. I'm finding, sadly, as of late, that most don't even make that mile marker because they're too focused on jabbering/oversharing about their own needs/wants/desires/fetishes. I do see a strong link to those who consider their "submission" a role in their life or a part that they play, rather than a part that makes them complete.

< Message edited by MisPandora -- 7/24/2005 11:09:51 PM >

_____________________________

Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to SadisticPrincess)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 9:33:44 AM

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Joined: 6/25/2004
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quote:

In order for a submissive to get my attention, he has to show that he is interested in me. Talk! Pay attention! Entertain me! Do all the things that I expect from my vanilla dates, essentially.

I have had men come to Club Fem parties to meet me, and had them spend virtually no time with me, then gotten emails later saying wow, let's do that again! Ummm......okay.

I suspect that most of you ladies expect to be seriously courted, I have read it time and again.

These seem like simple enough concepts to me, but I wonder how more subs feel about this courtship thing... Natural thing for you or you need more specific intructions from a lady (weather vanilla or in D/s). M

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to SadisticPrincess)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 10:04:51 AM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
Joined: 4/24/2005
From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
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quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger
I've never met a woman yet that doesn't like drive - And I'd much rather pay attention to her than the road.

Obviously, you've never met me.

I do not like to drive. I do not like to be in a car. I do not own a car. I never have. My parents never owned a car either.

If I can't go somewhere via public transportation, then I have little to no desire to be at said location. Call it my Big Apple mentality. People who do not live on the Eastern Seaboard have a great deal of difficulty grasping what it means to think nothing of using public transportation to zip up and down the coast and go anywhere one pleases without a car. (Yes, I recall that you have New York roots. You clearly lost that mindset by virtue of your current location.)

I even live in a neighborhood that's parking hostile.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to UtopianRanger)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 11:14:02 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy
Obviously, you've never met me.

I do not like to drive. I do not like to be in a car. I do not own a car. I never have. My parents never owned a car either.

If I can't go somewhere via public transportation, then I have little to no desire to be at said location. Call it my Big Apple mentality. People who do not live on the Eastern Seaboard have a great deal of difficulty grasping what it means to think nothing of using public transportation to zip up and down the coast and go anywhere one pleases without a car. (Yes, I recall that you have New York roots. You clearly lost that mindset by virtue of your current location.)

I even live in a neighborhood that's parking hostile.

~ Ti ~

Honestly, this is part of why I hate large cities. I like to drive (I also like to ride in a car while someone else drives), but I don't like other people being on *my* road LOL. I am thrilled to have found a house out in the country to live in so that I don't have to worry about traffic too much, and I don't have to worry about parking or anything. If all else fails, I can park in my 2.86 acre yard.

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 11:19:08 AM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
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From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig

I have Never met a woman in any country/continent (I've been to several countries and 3 continents thus far) who loves cheap men.

I don't concern myself with generosity of a guy's wallet. It's generosity of spirit that makes all the difference for me. You don't need tons of cash to be generous.

Consider a guy's facial expression while looking at me. For example, I have an ex-boyfriend, who remains my friend -- for over 30 years. (Why we never married is a long, sad tale. Suffice it to say some people are uber emotional masochists -- unable to allow themselves lives of true happiness. He's one such person. Rather than be with me, he's wrecked his life with two horrific marriages, precipitating negative physical, professional, and financial consequences -- above and beyond his chronic misery.) There's this expression on his face whenever he's with me, even after all these years. You can tell that he's immersed in joy when we're together. It even carries over to the tone in his voice when we speak on the phone.

It's remaining vigilant to my needs at any given moment. For example, if I walk into the apartment from a solo trip to the grocery store, help me unload the groceries into the kitchen.... not because I request it, but because of a desire to make my life easier.

I could keep up an endless list like this regarding generosity that never costs a dime. IMO, if a guy is slave-wired/service-oriented, he does not need to be told to remain attentive to and learn a dominant's needs. It's an inherent attribute that comes naturally to him.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 11:34:29 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig

I have Never met a woman in any country/continent (I've been to several countries and 3 continents thus far) who loves cheap men.

I don't concern myself with generosity of a guy's wallet. It's generosity of spirit that makes all the difference for me. You don't need tons of cash to be generous.

Consider a guy's facial expression while looking at me. For example, I have an ex-boyfriend, who remains my friend -- for over 30 years. (Why we never married is a long, sad tale. Suffice it to say some people are uber emotional masochists -- unable to allow themselves lives of true happiness. He's one such person. Rather than be with me, he's wrecked his life with two horrific marriages, precipitating negative physical, professional, and financial consequences -- above and beyond his chronic misery.) There's this expression on his face whenever he's with me, even after all these years. You can tell that he's immersed in joy when we're together. It even carries over to the tone in his voice when we speak on the phone.

It's remaining vigilant to my needs at any given moment. For example, if I walk into the apartment from a solo trip to the grocery store, help me unload the groceries into the kitchen.... not because I request it, but because of a desire to make my life easier.

I could keep up an endless list like this regarding generosity that never costs a dime. IMO, if a guy is slave-wired/service-oriented, he does not need to be told to remain attentive to and learn a dominant's needs. It's an inherent attribute that comes naturally to him.

~ Ti ~

It really is a "big picture" kind of thing. Ti has nailed it though regarding generosity not being only about money -- it's when a man is willing to give of himself (including money) when appropriate.

Keep in mind, a man who is TOO generous can be a worse thing. What good is a man who spends frivolously, needlessly, to try to prove his love, and is constantly in financial drama? Is that a good relationship partner for the long term?

Akasha

_____________________________

Akasha's Web - All original Femdom content since 1995
Don't email me here, email me at [email protected]

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 12:15:39 PM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
Joined: 4/24/2005
From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SweetDommes
Honestly, this is part of why I hate large cities. I like to drive (I also like to ride in a car while someone else drives), but I don't like other people being on *my* road LOL. I am thrilled to have found a house out in the country to live in so that I don't have to worry about traffic too much, and I don't have to worry about parking or anything. If all else fails, I can park in my 2.86 acre yard.

Good thing I don't have to serve or Domme you! I'd die of terminal boredom in environments like that. That boredom would suck my creative juices dry.

I need to be able to step outside my door and have immediate access -- translation: walking distance -- to anything I need. Even so, Chicago is nothing but an oversized hick town compared to New York City. Be that as it may, that's too far off topic to bang one of my pet peeve drums here. (Did youz guyz think my only gripe is faux submissives???? ROTFLMAO.)

Speaking of off topic....That reminds me.... Aren't you the one with the partner who's having medical problems and unresponsive physicians? (My apologies if I'm confusing you with someone else's post.) Add that to the roster of issues associated with living outside larger cities with major teaching hospitals. If you continue to have problems, perhaps you should ponder a trip to Chicago for a consult. I recommend checking out these guys, with orthopedic medical specialists up the yin-yang.

http://www.midwestortho.com/

They're full-service, know what they're talking about, accommodating, respond to questions, and don't think they're mounted onto pedestals (at least not the four I've met there ... different problem = different specialist.... like when I had a wrist injury, I saw a hand specialist). Everyone I know who's used them has been extremely satisfied. If you have questions, feel free to send a note to my CollarMe e-mail.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to SweetDommes)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 12:20:16 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy
I don't concern myself with generosity of a guy's wallet. It's generosity of spirit that makes all the difference for me. You don't need tons of cash to be generous.

I consider all types of generosity to show ability to be benevolent to another.
It's true you don't need tons of cash, but if you have tons of cash, than certainly don't penny pinch when in my company, so in that regard I do concern myself with his wallet. If I want a practical roomate, I'll find one; otherwise I want a man I can love... If a guy has a part time job that pays minimum wage, he can pick a flower or a pound of coffee on his way as a gesture that says "I'm excited about you, and hope you like me."
Perhaps my examples made one think of only money, but if a guy has it, that is one way he can express his care; if he doesn't he will perhaps need to have a better imagination. I don't become interested in just anyone...
I like men that go above and beyond to show me they feel I'm special... Yes high expectations, but I can afford to have them since I'm self sufficient, and for sex I don't need to put out much effort. I would date a guy if he has something ultra hot about him I want. Let's face it, different men enchant us for different reasons, but as no one is perfect, good manners and sweetness (not weakness) will help along the way.

For the record, I've never expected anyone to do anything for me I could not do for myself (well except sexually), or give me anything I could not give to myself or give to him if he became the object of my affection.. M

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 12:57:20 PM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
Joined: 4/24/2005
From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha
Keep in mind, a man who is TOO generous can be a worse thing. What good is a man who spends frivolously, needlessly, to try to prove his love, and is constantly in financial drama? Is that a good relationship partner for the long term?

Golly, Akasha! I never had me one-a those! Think I should give it a whirl?

Given my temperament and preferences, if a guy is such a loser that he feels compelled to buy his way into my life, I'd sooner toss the dolt out onto the street with the garbage. If I'm well matched with a person, there's no need for him to buy "stuff" as bribes. In fact, it's never "stuff" that woos me. It's always the brain and heart. I'm a sucker for those two attributes.

If another person -- any person -- Platonic or libidinal -- can't make my brain cells fire with inspired glee, that person will not find his/her way into my life. In fact, I have an ongoing temp houseboy position that I posted. Figured that if I can't find a long-term/perm houseboy, I'd attempt "filler material." At the rate my houseboy search is moving, the temp slot will be endlessly open-ended.

Amazingly, despite an array of guys who claim they're interested in the temp position, they're not motivated to put forth the effort to impress me that they're "the man" for the job -- especially when I tell them that they must be able to amuse me on an intellectual level. Apparently, my expectations are too challenging and beyond their abilities.... or they're just seeking any open Domme door, with no effort to enter. In other words, we have yet another example of "woo willingness impediments" and pursuit failure.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to AAkasha)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 1:27:59 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy
If another person -- any person -- Platonic or libidinal -- can't make my brain cells fire with inspired glee
I can't find a long-term/perm houseboy, I'd attempt "filler material." At the rate my houseboy search is moving, the temp slot will be endlessly open-ended.

~ Ti ~

I might know someone for you...
I'll ask him to read your profile, since he seems to be your type.

M

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 1:40:14 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha
Keep in mind, a man who is TOO generous can be a worse thing. What good is a man who spends frivolously, needlessly, to try to prove his love, and is constantly in financial drama? Is that a good relationship partner for the long term?

Golly, Akasha! I never had me one-a those! Think I should give it a whirl?

~ Ti ~

P.S. I read your profile; we're not exactly looking for the same things in a relationship.. M

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 2:10:39 PM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
Joined: 4/24/2005
From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha
Keep in mind, a man who is TOO generous can be a worse thing. What good is a man who spends frivolously, needlessly, to try to prove his love, and is constantly in financial drama? Is that a good relationship partner for the long term?

quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy
Golly, Akasha! I never had me one-a those! Think I should give it a whirl?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfigP.S. I read your profile; we're not exactly looking for the same things in a relationship.. M

OK! You've lost me. What does your profile have to do with my profile -- let alone me having some fun regarding Akasha's question?

I thought Akasha raised a cogent issue -- as some people do allow guys to buy their attention. There are all sorts of reasons why this happens, from poor self-concepts, to gold diggers -- IMO. (Save your flaming rotten tomatoes!)

I have no tolerance for it. I'm not that mercenary and I have more self-respect than to let someone into my life who isn't actually worth my time.

On a totally unrelated note, I see you hang your hat in Rhode Island. Coincidentally, the very first guy I dated after moving to Chicago was originally from Rhode Island. He was wonderful in bed, and a total bust in every other aspect of a relationship. (Apparently, he was healing from getting burned in a LTR.) When I dumped him -- nicely, tastefully, carefully -- after roughly a month to six weeks -- he wrote me a note, begging to continue what we'd begun to build. To this day, I have no clue what it was that he thought we were building, as by his own admission, he was in no emotional condition to handle a meaningful relationship. His note must have translated into wanting to continue as my fuck buddy, which was all he ever was. I can't even really say he was a friend with benefits.

On a further unrelated association about him.... It drove me insane every time he said he needed to "pahk" his "cah." That regional dialect grated on my nerves like chalk squeaking on a blackboard.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 2:14:04 PM

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We have had trouble with doctors, but it's been taken care of now. And in the experiences of our friends who do live in big cities - the same problems exist.

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 2:19:30 PM

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I haven't flamed you.
I disagreed with you, and I read your profile to see if perhaps we were on a similar wavelength as relationship goals go, and found that we were not, so for that reason (among others), we disagree.

quote:

as some people do allow guys to buy their attention. There are all sorts of reasons why this happens, from poor self-concepts, to gold diggers -- IMO. (Save your flaming rotten tomatoes!)

When I start to worry about what you think of me, my feelings will be hurt. Don't hold your breath.. M

< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 7/25/2005 3:58:28 PM >

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 3:51:20 PM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
Joined: 4/24/2005
From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig
I haven't flamed you.
I disagreed with you, and I read your profile to see if perhaps we were on a similar wavelength as relationship goals go, and found that we were not, so for that reason (among others), we disagree.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TiNeedsHouseboy
as some people do allow guys to buy their attention. There are all sorts of reasons why this happens, from poor self-concepts, to gold diggers -- IMO. (Save your flaming rotten tomatoes!)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig
When I sart to worry about what you think of me, my feelings will be hurt. Don't hold your breath.. M

Now you've totally lost me! The OUTER LIMITS seems to have overtaken this thread. I have no clue what it is that's the subject of disagreement. I'm hypothesizing it has something to do with my total disregard for the importance of finances and buying "stuff" as a reflection of devotion and sincerity.

So, let me phrase this as "in your face" as possible to avoid continued misperceptions (and pardon my French): I DON'T GIVE A FLYING FUCK WHETHER A GUY HAS A DIME TO HIS NAME OR WHETHER HE BUYS ME ONE SINGLE THING. Anyone can buy "stuff." It's a no brainer, with no effort -- at least not what gets defined as "effort" in Ti-Land! In fact, a guy who's truly wealthy likely has a secretary or personal assistant handling such purchases. That's far from a reflection that he's ready, willing, and able to give me his all -- from his heart and soul.

Let's say he's super rich and hands me money to pay my rent every month. Where's the heart and soul in that? The only effort was to reach into his pocket and hand it to me. Big, fat, hairy, MEANINGLESS deal!

You're apparently residing amid an alternate interpretation dimension from where I live and misconstrued my content. These things happen on bulletin boards where one doesn't know other people from a hole in the wall, exacerbated by lack of body language and vocal intonation to facilitate dialogue.

For the record, remarks like, "Don't hold your breath" are one step away from intent to flame.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 4:38:28 PM

Posts: 2117
Joined: 1/4/2005
From: Iowa
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quote:

You're apparently residing amid an alternate interpretation dimension from where I live and misconstrued my content.

I think there has been some misunderstanding, to which message boards are prone. You both seem to be smart, together women and if you could meet to talk about this you'd probably both wind up laughing and smiling.

But I am wondering - how do we get sub guys more involved in approaching dommes as women instead of as kinky partners? Is it simply a matter of talking about it and hope guys read these messages or is there another way?

(in reply to TiNeedsHouseboy)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 4:41:00 PM

TiNeedsHouseboy

Posts: 145
Joined: 4/24/2005
From: Big Apple blossom blown to The Windy City
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig
I might know someone for you...
I'll ask him to read your profile, since he seems to be your type. M

I appreciate the thought. Not to be overly pessimistic, I can't imagine anything will come of it. Referrals and fix-ups have bombed miserably through the years.

Perhaps that’s because people misread me as having a "type." If you look at the string of significant others I've had through the years, they share little overlap. Indeed, they’ve all been very different people.... except for being in the super range of intelligence and creative. By significant others, I’m not just talking about lovers and friends with benefits; Platonic friends are in that blend, too.

On the flip side, intelligence and ingenuity are not a guarantee of compatibility. As an example: No one on the planet is more brilliant and inventive than Cliff Stoll. His books are amazing reads. He’s a joy to watch at author appearances, and thought provoking on TV appearances. I’d welcome him with open arms to join me for coffee any day of the week. The notion of having him living in my apartment, day in and day out, however, gives me the heebie-jeebies. (BTW, if you need a unique gift, try one of Cliff’s Acme Klein Bottles -- blown glass, one-sided surface, Moebius vessels [www.kleinbottle.com] -- "the finest closed, non-orientable, boundary-free manifolds sold anywhere in our three spatial dimensions," as Cliff describes them).

Whenever someone has fallen into my life who rocks my world, it's always been when I'm least expecting it. Ain’t that always the way it goes?

Thanks for offering to keep me in mind.

~ Ti ~

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 4:49:20 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned

quote:

You're apparently residing amid an alternate interpretation dimension from where I live and misconstrued my content.

I think there has been some misunderstanding, to which message boards are prone. You both seem to be smart, together women and if you could meet to talk about this you'd probably both wind up laughing and smiling.

But I am wondering - how do we get sub guys more involved in approaching dommes as women instead of as kinky partners? Is it simply a matter of talking about it and hope guys read these messages or is there another way?

The bigger question is: Do subs care? If a guy wanted to submit to a woman that he connected with on a variety of levels, wouldn't it be a requirement that he asked some non kinky questions? It makes me wonder if the reason they don't ask the questions is simple -- they don't care, they just want to submit, and what's most important is what she will do and how she does it.

Akasha

_____________________________

Akasha's Web - All original Femdom content since 1995
Don't email me here, email me at [email protected]

(in reply to onceburned)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 5:03:21 PM

GoddessDustyGold

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From: Arizona
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quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned

But I am wondering - how do we get sub guys more involved in approaching dommes as women instead of as kinky partners? Is it simply a matter of talking about it and hope guys read these messages or is there another way?

LOL...Unfortunately most of the boys who are writing to Me are never at these message boards. I am seriously considering a very brief reply that includes a couple of links to these boards. If and when they read that material and can approach Me with a reasonable intro, then I will take some time with them.
I hardly ever have a boy ask Me a single question about any activities other than BDSM. When they do, I have to say, it is a quick way to impress Me. Often I have to find a way to subtly volunteer something, and then I wait to see if I get a reaction or any interest. Often, I don't. That will leave Me cold in a hurry. Here I am offering a way to get some further insight into Me, and it is ignored!
I understand that this is a *personals* site with a view to the idea that the people searching have a common alternative lifestyle choice. That lifestyle includes certain sexual preferences. But if two lesbians meet, or if two gay boys meet, is sex the first thing they talk about? Or do they take the time to get to know each other first? In some cases, they may just be looking for a pick-up. But most people are seeking relationships. Dating or courting is the route of choice to a permanent partner or partners.
I am a female and I seek a male. WE ALREADY KNOW THIS!
I am a Dominant and I seek a submissive boy to be My slave. WE ALREADY KNOW THIS!
So although these things can be discussed as part of the getting to know you phase, and should be since we seek an alternative lifestyle, it is not the end all and be all. It takes a lot more to keep My interest. I want to talk about a lot of things, including My expections in the submission department. And I don't mean the submitting of an ass to be flogged, or a cock to be tortured. I can get all of that anytime I want it or need it. I mean *submission*
HELLO! Living, breathing person here! Not a cutie in black PVC holding your favorite whip! (Ok, I am very cute and I do wear some black PVC once in a while... *W*)
But if that is all the boy is really interested in, then I will be happy to consider him for a Pro session. *Sigh* I think that is what they really don't get.

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom

(in reply to onceburned)

RE: Courtship and "pursuit" - 7/25/2005 5:26:01 PM

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Joined: 10/30/2004
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I would be absolutely tickled if a potential submissive would correspond with me about such mundane things as rock hounding, home remodels, gardening and computer games. What could have more potential for geeky-romance than to have someone offer to play online Diablo II or Starcraft with me? If they are local, I could be thrilled that they show up and barbecue a steak on the grill for me (that I purchased.)

See? It's so very, very simple to thrill me with such things, and yet they are determined to try to mold me into a plaything for them. It would take so much less effort and time to just be a real person.

Boys, court me with reality and you'll find my heart a lot sooner, not to mention having a lot more opportunities to stretch those submissive wings.

(*sigh* I had to say it. )

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)

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