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Top space - 12/6/2007 4:45:43 AM

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Ok. I did a search so no one would get mad. Someone did ask about this in august but there was very few replies. Lucky ALbatross answered well but thats it( you dont have to post). From a Dominants perspective is there a Top space and is it an out of body experience like subspace?

RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 5:34:58 AM

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In My experience.......

Top space does exist. I think that I am flying with eagles and I am swooping down on a poor little mouse....... just kidding.

Yes, it is real, at least for me. But what it is to me is an elated feeling, somewhat of a "high". I feel like I am "SuperDom", like my dick is 12" long and big as a baseball bat ( metaphorically speaking ). I don't have an out of body experience.

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RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 9:11:10 AM

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Yes I experience 'dom space' too.

For me it feels like everything but the sub I'm playing with and myself fades to grey and my 'arc of vision' narrows right down to just her. I'm aware of things outside that arc, however they are very low key. They are a bit like shadowy/ghostly images moving around. The sub and even the toys I'm using are in very sharp focus.
Imagine a wide angled shot, softened and faded a bit and turned black and white, but with myself and sub in colour and very sharp and you'l get an idea of what I mean.
My sound perception changes also, again I'm aware of the music and background noise, but it's only on the periphery of my conciousness. I have 'missed' a favourite track being played!!

Unfortunately, if someone speaks to me, it does snap me out of it!

(in reply to OldBastardly1)

RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 11:40:55 AM

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Yes, I agree with the "area of focus" you descibe. But the music is sometimes an important part for me, i.e., I like to keep rythym with the music. Aside from me liking it, I have also been told by some subs, that by keeping in sync with the musical rythym, that the sound of the music becomes part of the play and actually helps in finding subspace.

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"You cannot make footprints in the sands of time if you're sitting on your butt. And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" -- Bob Moawad

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RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 12:36:30 PM

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I do have "topspace" times, but they are different, mainly (IMO, I have no histology to back this up) because top and bottom space come from different brain chemicals. I feel sharp, focused, stronger, like an adrenaline high without the twitch. It seems to me to be the opposite of the floaty subspace-y stuff where the bottom loses contact with the outside world.

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RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 1:04:57 PM

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I get it and I love it and its prety much what they describle. Its definatly not an out of body thing but it does have that power and focus feeling. It kind of pushes everything else away as if I did a weeks worth of vacation inside of four hours.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 1:51:02 PM

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For me, Top space is a trance like space similar to active meditation. My focus has narrowed down to me, the other person and what we're doing. I experience the same thing during sex, except that I'll slip off into non-ordinary reality there, too. I don't do that as a Top...it's dangerous.

Master Fire

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RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 3:35:27 PM

SirJohnMandevill

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

For me, Top space is a trance like space similar to active meditation. My focus has narrowed down to me, the other person and what we're doing. I experience the same thing during sex, except that I'll slip off into non-ordinary reality there, too. I don't do that as a Top...it's dangerous.

Master Fire

I experienced what might be called "top space" a couple times with my former sub, but it was only after we had played and were having rough, uninhibited sex. I'll spare everyone the details, but it was as if my mind and body were fused with hers in some orgasmic Never Never Land. Is that the sort of thing everyone means?

In fairness, I experienced that once or twice in vanilla sex, too...but not for a long, long time and not with the same intensity. The D/s-BDSM dynamic was definitely the key

Les (Purveyor of Fine, Handcrafted Kink)

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RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 3:57:02 PM

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I agree with some of what has already been said. I get very focused and grounded, though usually in very playful way. It is the opposite of the floating, ecstatic experience I get in subspace.

(in reply to SirJohnMandevill)

RE: Top space - 12/6/2007 4:43:55 PM

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lol people don't really get mad at multiple postings. It's a lot of different variables- how long has it been since we last discussed this, how often has this exact question been asked, how volatile a question is it, how sincere is the OP perceived to be. It's when they all converge on the wrong side that people will actually get irked and not respond positively- and even then you get some people who have a different perception (it's new the THEM, they had their happy pills that day, they have mercy, whatever) who will still give an honest positive answer.

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RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 12:23:18 PM

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The problem with this question is the continuing confusion over the term sub-space. There are at least two distinct meanings for this term. The first meaning is what I will call intense arousal (hot monkey love). The second I will call for purposes of this post - an altered state of consiousness.

Sub-space in the arousal sense may be seen in the eyes of the sub when her Dom or Master first exerts control or expresses Dominance. For many, her eyes will literally roll up into her head. Her eyelids may flutter. She will feel "weak in the knees". She will become sexually receptive and accepting of commands. Women who have become familiar with this state find it very exciting and pleasurable. They act a little like an automoton or zombie but internally they have plenty of feeling. Vanilla women or women in a vanilla encounter virtually never get to feel like this outside of a character in a Romance Novel. This state is often called sub-space and it defines what we mean when we say a woman is submissive - she gets a strong arousal reaction in a D/s setting.

Dom/Masters also get this kind of reaction. They too get swept up and carried away with their Dom role. There is however a fundamental difference. A subbie can surrender and just go on automatic pilot (assuming she knows and trusts the Dom). A Dom/Master however cannot surrender wholly to his emotions because he must remain in control and continue to be responsible. Personally I always try to partition off a part of myself and that part acts sanely and logically. The rest of my personality indulges in the exultation of Dominance.

This kind of sub-space and Dom-space we, no doubt, get from our primate ancestors who lived in dominance hierarchies. Female orangs for example are very excited and accepting in the presence of large dominant males. These same females will not accept sex at all from lower ranking males.

The second meaning of sub-space is the altered state of consciousness that some women experience when subjected to intense pain. This state is often attributed to endorphins but that is almost certainly wrong for reasons to numerous to mention here. Nevertheless this kind of sub-space is very real and quite different from the "weak in the knees" phenomenon.

When robustly caned or whipped some women "go away". Typically they describe this as floating or being transcendent. They don't feel pain in any normal sense. They have something like an Out-of-Body experience. Ususally they can't talk. They may mumble or moan but they can't really talk and thus can't utter a safe word.

Women who can go into this state almost always feel the other kind of sub-space too. The "weak-in-the-knees" state gets them into the D/s scene but once there they may or may not go into the altered consciousness sub-space state.

The altered consciousness sub-space is almost certainly an artifact of temporal lobe and limbic system action. It is akin to Petit Mal Epilepsy and all sorts of religious experience. St. Paul and Mohammed both probably had a temporal lobe experience. Many religions try to induce such a state through meditation, fasting, and self flagellation. Great revelations and "Out of Body" experiences also involve the temporal lobe. There is a machine that can induce the feeling of being in God's presence though magnetic stimulation of the limbic system.

Men have learned millenia ago how to evoke these kinds of experiences - drugs, meditation, and whips.

So the first kind of sub-space is part of our primate heritage of hierarchy. The second comes from a manipulation of subs who are susceptable to certain sub-cortical states of consciousness. Masters feel the first sort (actually a mirror image feeling) but in the "normal" course of BDSM don't feel the second kind.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 12:29:01 PM

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OH Top Space how heavenly it is. For me its not a floaty feeling not really. My arms feel no pain. Im no longer tired. im no longer drained. I focus on the person in front of me and my vision narrows. I dance to the music that is playing yet I do not hear it any more. I swing faster and slower with the beat of her heart. My heart no longer races from the work out. My mouth is no longer dry and parched. I can go on for hours like this. I hear no voices I see no color. I can only focus on the movements of her body and must rely on that to tell me to stop or go on, slow down or speed up. At this stage when I get there and how I get there is a mystery. But I want to stay as long as I can. I dont want to talk because I dont think words can form from my lips. I let my body speek and the tools in my hands be my voice. This is my Top Space sweeter then life and when its over more draining then..................

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RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:07:29 PM

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SensibleSam, I had to try real hard not to laugh while reading that ......essay. Was that something you contrived or do you have a real reference point?

When you are stating "facts" as you seemed to be trying to....please excuse me from the list of humanity that you tried to group together.

I am still unsure wether to laugh or shake my head in amazement

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"You cannot make footprints in the sands of time if you're sitting on your butt. And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" -- Bob Moawad

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RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:24:49 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: OldBastardly1

SensibleSam, I had to try real hard not to laugh while reading that ......essay. Was that something you contrived or do you have a real reference point?

When you are stating "facts" as you seemed to be trying to....please excuse me from the list of humanity that you tried to group together.

I am still unsure wether to laugh or shake my head in amazement

Respectfully sir, I disagree. I found what he said about subspace to be very accurate. With this accuracy, i then can believe that his info on Topspace is accurate too.

(in reply to OldBastardly1)

RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:30:54 PM

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Sam, your description of top space is interesting, but too generic.

I specifically disagree that a top can never wholly surrender his/her emotions. I agree that the top needs to be "aware" at all times of the sub's safety, but it is quite possible for both partners to surrender their emotions quite fully, thank you.

I know, I have been with my own partners who topped me who certainly seemed to be emotionally "there" while retaining control.

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:32:08 PM

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I know some of the underlying facts to be true.

Man has often used pain, drugs, rythmic dance, sleep deprivation, fasting and music mixed or seperatly to get a trancendant experience and "See The Face of God". But I can tell you that Dominants can reach the altered state as well, they usually just don't surrender to it because then nobody is stearing the ship and you might run aground.
I tend to hear and in my own case feel it's much more an narrowing of focus than an expanssion.
Submissives tend to talk about going outside themselves, I most often hear Dominants talking about going inside themselves.

Then again I also get the kind of focus and delussions of grandure that OB talks about.
I talk about it sometimes as I start the scene off, owning and controling just me and my girl, expand that to controling the play space, but by the time I'm through with the physical scene I not only own the room but the building and the whole world, when I come out of the play space.
Sometimes it takes all the effort I have not to grab the next thing that looks pretty to me and start up a new scene with them.
Of course often that next thing that looks pretty is a Domme or a slave belonging to someone else and that would likely not turn out too good, LOL.
So I keep the fact that everything in sight belongs to ME my little secret until the feeling subsides, LOL.

(in reply to OldBastardly1)

RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:33:21 PM

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That is fine, as I have no personal reference of subspace, I can only go from what I have experienced of Topspace. Possibly what put me off on it so much was the way, it seemed to me, that it left no room for variables.

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"You cannot make footprints in the sands of time if you're sitting on your butt. And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" -- Bob Moawad

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:36:35 PM

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quote:

The second meaning of sub-space is the altered state of consciousness that some women experience when subjected to intense pain. This state is often attributed to endorphins but that is almost certainly wrong for reasons to numerous to mention here. Nevertheless this kind of sub-space is very real and quite different from the "weak in the knees" phenomenon.

I would like to hear your thoughts on this, as an exercise junkie and a masochist that adores the subspace phenomena, I can tell you that my exercise states have some things in common with my subspace states... the difference is in the degree to which they are experienced and the addition of adrenaline to the biochemical neurological mix. I have also noted that hypnotic states may also be a factor...

The last time I had a very deep subspace reaction my eye whites turned blue... which is indicative of adrenal overload... but I believe that subspace is not easy to quantify biochemically and I wish it were studied in a lab setting... but until it is I do not think we have the answers... just ideas related to our own personal experiences which are exceedingly vast

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(in reply to SensibleSam)

RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:36:43 PM

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LMAO. Very well said, Archer.

One of my many shortcomings is not being as articulate as I would like.

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"You cannot make footprints in the sands of time if you're sitting on your butt. And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" -- Bob Moawad

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RE: Top space - 12/7/2007 1:38:01 PM

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Isn’t Top space the region between the ears in a blondes body? OK That wasn’t helpful forget it and move on....

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