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Breath Play - 8/24/2005 5:30:33 AM

golden1

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I have over 15 years in BDSM, I recently crossed over a line in Breath Play and well I was wondering if anyone else can give me some more infomation. As i am finding very little on line.

I was doing a light hands around the neck type of play. Something we have done before, it is how i get centered back into the correct headspace as a sub. This last time when it was done. I passed out. Just sort of slide to the floor. I at the time could not figure out why my legs where flapping nor why it felt like my ear was feeling like it had been bitten off.

He as always had his hands around my neck, lightly biting my ear and speaking to me in a low tone of voice. When he brought me around again, i was shaken did not remeber what had just happened and was confused.

I have never had this happen to me before. In fact if i had to say we have been very careful not to cross the line of going to far in breath play.

Here is what was going on, we where having aserious discussion on some rules we where changing, finished that up and moved onto making dinner. He walked up behind me and placed his hands on my neck. I of course lockedmy arms and meet his eyes square on (like i always do). Nothing this time was any differant then any other time except i was in my "work/determined mode"

Which means i am in control till i am able to let go. He had no intent of taking it so far. If anything it was a light teasing mood we had.

We BOTH where scared at how quickly i went out.

SO any thoughts on how to avoid this result again?
Or how about how we got to it so quickly as this happened in a matter of mins.

Be safe,
Golden

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 6:17:41 AM

MrThorns

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Make sure that he isn't cutting off your blood supply via the carotid arteries. That is what I think the most probably reason is for your passing out.... The choke hold you described could easily put pressure on the carotid.

~Thorns

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 6:31:01 AM

EmeraldSlave2

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Well you don't go so far by stopping before you get to that point again. It's a matter of control.

And I agree, that sort of hold can take you down pretty fast. Perhaps try simply covering the airholes which allows quick cover and release with no risk at least of crushing other parts.

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 7:04:59 AM

JohnWarren

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From: Delray Beach, FL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: golden1

I have over 15 years in BDSM, I recently crossed over a line in Breath Play and well I was wondering if anyone else can give me some more infomation. As i am finding very little on line.

Here is an excellent essay by the author of SM101 and The Erotic Bondage Manual.

http://members.aol.com/Oldrope/breath.htm

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 9:17:18 AM

Lordandmaster

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That's a good reference, and there have been several threads about breath play in the past. My rule of thumb is that the only thing preventing airflow has to be a part of my body. Using a noose, gibbet, etc., is too dangerous. I don't want to face homicide charges.

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 10:25:46 AM

MissA

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrThorns

Make sure that he isn't cutting off your blood supply via the carotid arteries. That is what I think the most probably reason is for your passing out.... The choke hold you described could easily put pressure on the carotid.

~Thorns

And it doesn't take much pressure either if you compress them on both sides.
~Ms. A~

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 2:16:37 PM

BlkTallFullfig

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrThorns
That is what I think the most probably reason is for your passing out.... The choke hold you described could easily put pressure on the carotid.
~Thorns

Aside from cutting off blood supply which would be about too much pressure,
even without too much pressure stimulating the carotic area (see something called Carotid Massage http://www.mercksource.com/pp/us/cns/cns_search_results.jsp) can decrease the heart rate and cause a person to pass out, which I suspect was more the culprit than his tight choke hold... Of course I could be wrong; just thinking based on it happening quickly under what she described was similar hold as she'd done previously. M

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 5:46:07 PM

golden1

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Well, it was not a tight hold, just a light preasure, almost stroking like. We have done it many times. But this time i went out like a light. I love breath play, most times the touch can barely be felt asmore then hands on the neck. I wear necklaces tighter then the hold that was placed around my neck.

So I am not sure, but I am doing research to find out more info. I also called my doctor who knows i am kinky and has asked for his thoughts. He seems to think 1st off it is not safe. (as many of you knew he would) 2nd if i am going to contion down this path then he wants a fell work up of tests and such to make sure it was not something else medically wrong with me. (dam nosie guy, bet he just wants to see the marks) [joke] *grins*

But seriously, I have been doing it a long time. Granted it is not condisered safe by many but i do enjoy it. I highly doubt it will stop me from doing it. I am in my scene life considered a extreme edge player.

Thank you all for the great info.

Be safe,
Golden

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 9:30:07 PM

FangsNfeet

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Well you are looking at all sorts of reasons as to why this could have happen. Infact the posibilities are so endless that they may not have had anything to do with the session at all. If you would like to hear them all, just send me a message on my CM account.

My off the top hand theory is that you may have had a lack of blood flow to your brain due to pressure on your carotid arteries. Or as you laid down, it may have been more quickly that you realized and caused a fast rush to your brain.

Other than those theories, another quick thought envolves the idea of your sugar level. When was the last time you ate before you started playing around?

Without knowing your medical history, there are many possibilities as to your situation. Once again, feel free to message me if you need more explanations. I'm not going to type a 5 page reply for this thread.

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RE: Breath Play - 8/24/2005 9:42:10 PM

BlkTallFullfig

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quote:

just a light preasure, almost stroking like. We have done it many times. But this time i went out like a light. I love breath play, most times the touch can barely be felt asmore then hands on the neck. I wear necklaces tighter then the hold that was placed around my neck.

That's why I thought vasovagal response to what felt like carotid massage

quote:

http://www.chclibrary.org/micromed/00041610.html
Carotid sinus massage involves rubbing the large part of the arterial wall at the point where the common carotid artery, located in the neck, divides into its two main branches.

Purpose

Sinus, in this case, means an area in a blood vessel that is bigger than the rest of the vessel. This is a normal dilation of the vessel. Located in the neck just below the angle of the jaw, the carotid sinus sits above the point where the carotid artery divides into its two main branches. Rubbing the carotid sinus stimulates an area in the artery wall that contains nerve endings. These nerves respond to changes in blood pressure and are capable of slowing the heart rate. The response to this simple procedure often slows a rapid heart rate

It is dangerous; does your Master know basic life support if you stay out like a light?? M

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RE: Breath Play - 8/25/2005 3:36:32 AM

golden1

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Well, I was not laying down this was a standing position, as to the last time i ate.. the day before. I almost always only eat 1 meal a day as my life is just so rushed. I live off coffee with milk in it. Yeah i know not a good thing, but such is life.

Yes, we know basic first aid and resutati

But thank you all for the infomation.

Be safe,
Golden

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RE: Breath Play - 8/25/2005 8:40:08 PM

wednesday

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I don't know if this will help you at all, buuuuut...

Due to numerous different factors, I faint very easily. Our solution was to incorporate verbal breath control. If we're playing that way, I only get to breathe when I'm told to. That way... if I'm reaching a danger point, I can take an unencumbered breath. He knows that if I breathe when I wasn't given permission that it is a medical issue, and he stops all play at that point until I get myself back together.

I don't know if it would leave a hole in your play to try it that way, but it's a somewhat safer way to go...

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RE: Breath Play - 9/20/2005 7:29:07 AM

alapin

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This is something that I have come across from having been addicted to domination wrestling.

First of all: sleeper holds - restricting the blood supply to the brain. In my opinion this extremely dangerous. The only time this tends to happen in nature is when a cat has hold of its prey and its next move is to eat it. I have seen too many instances of people in judo who have refused to tap out in a sleep hold and then come round totally disoriented - this kind of manouevre can cause brain damage, let's not mince words here.

Second: breath control/asphyxiation. Can come in 2 forms. The form where you are preventing from breathing in, e.g. with someone's hand over the mouth and the nose being pinched. Personally, I don't see the thrill in this, the later stages lead inevitably to panic and the feeling is very unpleasant. note that the brain can be damaged even without oxygen for less than one minute. If anyone is going to play at this, I would suggest that they are asphyxiated by body parts only and that the smotherer has their hands gripped by the victim - that way they know instantly the point of unconsciousness. Any *healthy* person should start breathing again spontaneously once air is restored, but the whole process places a consderable strain on the heart (but then I guess many BDSM activities do this).

The second form of asphyxiation is more insiduous and occurs when, for example extended facesitting takes place. Here the victim is slowly deprived of oxygen and drifts into unconsciousness. Note that an extended period of asphyxiation play - e.g. smother - allow one breath, smother again etc. can strain the heart considerably, but it can also cause a serious pH imbalance in the blood due to retained CO2. If the pH varies too much from normal, this can cause serious organ damage and can be fatal.

In my opinion, something of the form of facesit - smother - submit - allow to breathe - facesit again - smother etc. is perfectly safe if the victim is allowed to breathe sufficiently between smothers. I have practised this with a lady wrestler (now retired) who was considered a real expert at this kind of stuff.

Just my tuppence worth.

PS if anyone knows about the forensic side of smothering I would lvoe to hear from them. I am currently writing a book that features a facesitter killing people by slow smothering and wanted to know what kind of results would show up in forensic tests.

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RE: Breath Play - 10/3/2005 5:39:22 PM

daddylilgirl

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This is something i need to address. I have recenlty been diagnosed with thyroid cancer. It is all ok, no pitty. This is one of the most easily treatable cancers around.
The point is, through the testing i was asked many many times if i had experienced any trauma to my throat. i answered no, i never really thought about breath play as trauma. This question was repeatedly asked. The reason it was asked, was that due to vascular damage around my thyroid, this is most likely the cause of the cancer. I have also had my voice box damaged due to all of this. Even after knowing this and being in the healthcare field myself, i continued to practice breath play, until recently when after a breath play session i lost my ability to swallow for nearly an entire day. I know a physician in the lifestyle and he explained due to the irreversable damage that as been caused and the damage that can continue. I now have to say, no more breath play. If my cancer had not been caught early, it could have been worse.

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