Paying To Be Handicapped

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MistressOfGa -> Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 10:11:41 PM)
As most of you know, I am blind. When searching for an apt. for the past several weeks, I ran into this: Me: I need a bottom floor, (As I am standing there with a red and white guide cane) because I can't see. Manager: Oh we have those! Me: Cool how much are your one bedrooms? Manager: Well, if you were to move into a second floor one bedroom it would be 600.00 but since you are moving into a bottom floor, the rent will be 650.00 Me: You have got to be kidding, yes? I am expected to pay a higher price because I am handicapped? Manager: Oh no, not because you are handicapped, everyone pays higher rent to live on the bottom floor. Me: But I have no choice but to live on the bottom floor, since I can't see! So I am left with no option but to rent a bottom level floor and I am being forced to pay higher rent. Manager: Pause..no answer Me: OK, I am getting a guide dog soon. I understand from Arizona School for the Blind and Hearing Impaired, that they are considered service animals and as such you can not charge me pet fees. Is this correct? Manager: Oh, let me just check something. Manager leaves. Manager comes back. Manager: Miss ___, I'm terribly sorry, but I seem to have made a mistake, there are no one bedroom first floor apts. available. But keep us in mind in the future. <Sigh> I have never been handicapped before, but I am finding out really fast how discriminatory people are being toward me. This is not a pity post. I would like some ideas on how to deal with apartment managers who act this way. (Other than knocking the shit out of them)[:D] MoGa

FangsNfeet -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 10:33:55 PM)
If you want to be treated as an equal, then you're going to have to pay as an equal. When another floor cost more, it has to do with something special such as more floor space, a better balcony, or a nicer celing. As for dealing with apartments, just call in advance and only ask what there rates are for first floor apartments. Don't ask about second and higher floor cost. That way, you'll never know if higher floors go for a cheaper rate. No matter what, never expect to pay cheeper just because you're forced to choose something that's more expensive. Regardless of the circumstance, price is what it is.

AxilX -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 10:34:58 PM)
The manager is correct, you are not being charged more because you are handicapped, you are being charged more because a bottom floor is preferable to a top floor. I'm somewhat suprised that there is no handicapped access to the second floor, in most states that is a requirmeent under most conditions. Would you also have the pet store provide you free dogfood?

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 10:46:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AxilX The manager is correct, you are not being charged more because you are handicapped, you are being charged more because a bottom floor is preferable to a top floor. I'm somewhat suprised that there is no handicapped access to the second floor, in most states that is a requirmeent under most conditions. Would you also have the pet store provide you free dogfood? No of course not. I was not/am not asking for special rates due to my handicap. I am the first person to say that I am NOT handicapped because I am still able to do a lot of things. I have never come across this, as a sighted person. I just lost my sight in Sept. of last year. This is my first time dealing with apt finding and such. No way would I want to be viewed as anything but what I am. A person who can not see, but is smart enough to see when I am being taken for a ride. I will check around and I will ask before going. As it turns out, I called one apartment and was told that they did not charge higher for a bottom floor apartment. When I went there, I was told the opposite. Go figure. But I was also told that I would have to pay 40.00 more for tile flooring. I would rather take a carpet any day of the week, than to pay for their remodeling costs. Thank you for responding :) MoGa

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 10:53:09 PM)
ORIGINAL: FangsNfeet quote: If you want to be treated as an equal, then you're going to have to pay as an equal. I have absolutely no problem with paying what everyone else pays. I expect no special treatment. As I said, I just lost my sight in Sept. 07, so this is all new to me. quote: When another floor cost more, it has to do with something special such as more floor space, a better balcony, or a nicer celing. In this case, the reason for the higher rate as she put it, is because of the easier access to the parking lot. quote: As for dealing with apartments, just call in advance and only ask what there rates are for first floor apartments. Don't ask about second and higher floor cost. That way, you'll never know if higher floors go for a cheaper rate. I did this. Surprisingly enough, the answer I got was not the same answer when I actually went to the apartment office. quote: No matter what, never expect to pay cheeper just because you're forced to choose something that's more expensive. Regardless of the circumstance, price is what it is. I never expect anything more or less than what I believe is entitled to me. Not as a handicapped person, but as a consumer. Thank you for responding :) MoGa

AxilX -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 10:54:08 PM)
The reason i mentioned dog food was because the fact you need a guide dog is also a direct result of your condition. I do feel for you (strangely enough, must be that damned empathy surfacing again) but also understand the manager's situation. He can get more money for those rooms because people in general don't like to walk up stairs whether they are handicapped or not. You say you are not asking for a special rate, but want the price of a bottom floor apartment for the price of the inferior top-floor apartment. This confuses me. I do think it's rediculous that you can't get a straight answer out of people, and can see how that would be very frustrating. Best of luck finding your apartment.

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 11:00:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AxilX The reason i mentioned dog food was because the fact you need a guide dog is also a direct result of your condition. I do feel for you (strangely enough, must be that damned empathy surfacing again) but also understand the manager's situation. He can get more money for those rooms because people in general don't like to walk up stairs whether they are handicapped or not. You say you are not asking for a special rate, but want the price of a bottom floor apartment for the price of the inferior top-floor apartment. This confuses me. I do think it's rediculous that you can't get a straight answer out of people, and can see how that would be very frustrating. Best of luck finding your apartment. Actually, although the service dog will be free, I do have to feed it and maintain it at my cost. I have no problem with that, since he/she will help me so much :) What I am saying, is that I think that the extra cost was thrown on there because of my needing a bottom floor. I doubt that the other people on the bottom floor have to pay extra for living on the bottom. And by her attitude regarding a service animal, which btw, is against the law to discriminate against, I think that she did not want me or my guide dog living there. Oh well, there are other places to look at. What I was asking here was some advice or suggestions on how to deal with people who IMO are clearly being discriminating. I'm glad that you feel for me, it shows that you are human. Nothing wrong with that <s> MoGa PS: Kind of funny that you would respond, as I had just got through pervin' ya! I've not seen you before.

Termyn8or -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 11:33:36 PM)
Is this for real ? I will address that and move on, you are typing, if you can't see you can't type. Is there a new program called typospeak, or speakotype or something ? I am not trying to be antagonistic here, I really want to know. I don't know about you, but if I were an aparetment manger I would love to rent to blind people. By necessity they are more stable, if they have a job they are likely to keep it, if not, they are living on some sort of assistance which is pretty steady. Hiwever I fail to see why a bliund person must live on the ground floor. When sighted people are on steps they do not constantly look down. They get a feel for it and adjust their stride to match. Then it is by feel. Front of the foot falling off the step, back it up, ankle hitting the other step, move along. Anyway, I really don't see the reason for this discrimination you described. These days the color is green, why would they turn down money ? Realistically it might be because they thing they will have to put in a bunch of Braille elevators or some shit. I would love to rent a whole floor to blind people. Remember that gawdy green paint, and the white carpet rom the penthouse that we sent to Arslanian Bros three times and the can't get the stain out ? Well take your shoes off and sink you feet into this $90 a yard carpet. You'll write the check. I don't see why anyone, even Somon LeGree would not want to rent to the handicapped. Money is money. Even the occasional minor inconvenieance, like "Hey, could you look over there and see if ..........". I truly cannot see any reason for this type of discrimination, unless there is some sort of government involved. The fucking government is so aloof they might have a mandate to have more lights in the hallways because a blind person is renting there. Or they might require Braille on all the elevators to get you to the first floor from the parking garage. That's the gov forya. Let me ask you this, just what are you parking that you were driving around while you were BLIND ? But anyone who knows how the world works knows that the government does not accept reason as an argument or an excuse for legal or illegal activity. Let's just call it a post and get. The gov and shit, let's not go there. I know where it's headed and I don't want to give everybody a bad day. I will go play guitar now. Thank you for reading. T

AxilX -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/3/2008 11:39:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressOfGa Actually, although the service dog will be free, I do have to feed it and maintain it at my cost. I have no problem with that, since he/she will help me so much :) What I am saying, is that I think that the extra cost was thrown on there because of my needing a bottom floor. I doubt that the other people on the bottom floor have to pay extra for living on the bottom. And by her attitude regarding a service animal, which btw, is against the law to discriminate against, I think that she did not want me or my guide dog living there. Oh well, there are other places to look at. What I was asking here was some advice or suggestions on how to deal with people who IMO are clearly being discriminating. I'm glad that you feel for me, it shows that you are human. Nothing wrong with that <s> MoGa PS: Kind of funny that you would respond, as I had just got through pervin' ya! I've not seen you before. Ah, well perhaps i misunderstood you, and if so i do apologize. If the apartment manager is indeed trying to charge you more than he would someone else for a ground floor apartment, he is indeed being a jackass, and discriminitory. Do understand though that it is not unheard of for ground floor apartments to cost extra. I see your located in Arizona, i'm not sure what the laws are about recording phone converations there, but if you're not required to obtain consent (in NJ where i live, and in many states you do not) get a cheap tape recorder, and document them telling you the cost of the apartment is the same across all floors, then threaten to go to the better business bureau if they give you the run around.

YourhandMyAss -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 12:32:23 AM)
You come across as incredibly rude in this post. You're basically implying that she can't honestly be blind if she's on the computer. You ever heard of brail? She may have a brail keyboard. quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or Is this for real ? I will address that and move on, you are typing, if you can't see you can't type. Is there a new program called typospeak, or speakotype or something ? I am not trying to be antagonistic here, I really want to know. T

MissMorrigan -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 12:54:58 AM)
I do not believe that T's intention was to be rude. I think his comment was one of curiosity b/c a person that states they are blind is actively posting in a forum, so enquiring minds want to know how this is possible. I used to correspond with a lovely guy in the US who is severely visually impaired, he has a special program he uses to enable him to read emails/compose articles, etc... He was advertising for readers who would record themselves reading books, then send him a copy. I applied and given that one of his interests was the psychological processes of D/s BDSM I recorded a copy of one of the books he had listed. While he had the program installed, he still had increasing difficulty in accessing emails/writing articles as it would cause him considerable pain. There are also voice-recognition programs but as far as I'm aware, the basic versions are not that accurate and are problematic, the more expensive versions are out of most persons' basic remit. Back to my original point though. When I first saw the person that was stating they were blind posting on a forum, I incorrectly assumed they had someone do this for them... I had little idea of their capabilities, nor the aids they used and asked him. He didn't think me ignorant nor rude, he answered me politely and gave me an invaluable insight into his world, which was the same as mine but with minor alterations [;)]

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 2:48:33 AM)
quote: Is this for real ? I will address that and move on, you are typing, if you can't see you can't type. Is there a new program called typospeak, or speakotype or something ? I am not trying to be antagonistic here, I really want to know. Yes. I have a program called JAWS. It reads the screen to me as well as reads what I type. My sister drives me around.

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 3:46:59 AM)
quote: Hiwever I fail to see why a bliund person must live on the ground floor. When sighted people are on steps they do not constantly look down. They get a feel for it and adjust their stride to match. Then it is by feel. Front of the foot falling off the step, back it up, ankle hitting the other step, move along. If I were blind for the better part of my life, I would agree with you. However, as I have been a sighted person for 49 years, and I have just lost my sight, I am scared to death to climb stairs. For months after I lost my sight, I refused to leave my sisters house. I have fallen just by walking across the floor because someone left a toy in the middle of the room. I have fallen in the bath tub because my nephew left his shampoo on the tub floor and I tripped on it. Can you imagine walking downstairs and falling over some small thing that someone had left on the steps? Maybe a newspaper? I hope they don't put braille up, I don't know braille! quote: Let me ask you this, just what are you parking that you were driving around while you were BLIND ? My sister takes me to all of my appointments. I am now in the process of learning Mobility, so that I can get a service dog. I can't have one till I go through months of Mobility classes. Once I get my guide dog, I will be able to travel by city bus. I will have more freedom to do the things I used to do. I can go to the mall. Many stores now put up a censer device that tells the blind what store they are in front of. Many street lights now have a blinking sound that lets the blind know that the light is green and it is safe to cross. I am looking forward to learning all of this, so that I can get on a plane and go visit my good friend Lady Hathor and her daughter. But the first step toward independence is to get my own apartment. Which brings me back to this thread <s> By the way, I wasn't able to be on line or to communicate with my friends and family, because I didn't have anyone who was willing to read these threads to me. I barely got someone to read Lady Hathors words when we would talk on YIM. Now I have http://www.freedomscientific.com/fs_products/software_jaws.asp JAWS, a true gift, for sure! [:D] T..I understand your doubts and confusion. It's OK. I suppose I would be the same way if someone said they were blind and here they are typing on a msg. forum. I had a forum, I had to give up because of my health last year. I am happy I have a place like this to continue my education and growth. MoGa

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:02:16 AM)
YhMa, It's ok. I didn't take T's comments to be anything but curiosity. I have read his postings and I find him to be very intelligent and blunt, but not rude. Thank you for the defense, but it is unwarranted [:)] MoGa

angelikaJ -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:02:40 AM)
Have you contacted your local "disability office" to find out what your rights are? I might suggest also trying to network with someone who has gone through what you are going through...find out how they handled that kind of thing... Best of luck!

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:04:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MissMorrigan I do not believe that T's intention was to be rude. I think his comment was one of curiosity b/c a person that states they are blind is actively posting in a forum, so enquiring minds want to know how this is possible. I used to correspond with a lovely guy in the US who is severely visually impaired, he has a special program he uses to enable him to read emails/compose articles, etc... He was advertising for readers who would record themselves reading books, then send him a copy. I applied and given that one of his interests was the psychological processes of D/s BDSM I recorded a copy of one of the books he had listed. While he had the program installed, he still had increasing difficulty in accessing emails/writing articles as it would cause him considerable pain. There are also voice-recognition programs but as far as I'm aware, the basic versions are not that accurate and are problematic, the more expensive versions are out of most persons' basic remit. Back to my original point though. When I first saw the person that was stating they were blind posting on a forum, I incorrectly assumed they had someone do this for them... I had little idea of their capabilities, nor the aids they used and asked him. He didn't think me ignorant nor rude, he answered me politely and gave me an invaluable insight into his world, which was the same as mine but with minor alterations [;)] MissMorrigan, You always have such nice things to say. I appreciate your response. I am glad that your friend opened the door to allow you to see what it is that the blind see. Thank you for responding :) MoGa

MistressOfGa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:08:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: angelikaJ Have you contacted your local "disability office" to find out what your rights are? I might suggest also trying to network with someone who has gone through what you are going through...find out how they handled that kind of thing... Best of luck! Thank you angelikaj, yes I have contacted disability. My sister works for DES so she has helped me tremendously. I go to the Arizona School for the Blind and Hearing Impaired. They have been a great asset too. I am like a sponge lately lol I thirst for knowledge. Thank you for responding :) MoGa

angelikaJ -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:13:21 AM)
I know at times this is scary and frustrating for you... Look at how far you have come since september.... On your worst days try not to lose track of that.

LadyHathor -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:49:41 AM)
ahh Dear MoGa---My heart goes to you----actually( at least in North Carolina)--the higher rent is for the upper floor---in a two story apartment building as that gets you away from the noise in the ceiling of the floor above---though I will tell you---even that is uncommon---- As for handicap access--- that is not required as it is a private residence, not a public building, so one has the choice to be there or not--although they ARE mandated to take a guide dog--yet you are there at " your own risk" as they say. Now given thay, ( from My experience with Mom)---many complexes have 1-2 apartments fitted to the handicap or they CAN do the fitting at no extra cost--( its good for their community rating)-- she was a tad stooped and could not always stand balanced---so she got a nice ground floor with lowered counters, double rails in the master bathroom and a few other handicap ammenities--- *btw---you can as for tub rails and they have to supply those free-regardless----* however, no complex is obligated to rent to the handicap of they think their facility could be held liable for something---the more reputable ones ( and reputable does not always mean expensive)---do---I suggest like FangsnFeet---and I am sure yoiu did this--call and ask about handicap accessible for blind--but sadly as well--a dollar is a dollar and I doubt that rent will be lesss----- *I am sorry Dear Lady---*

LaMistressa -> RE: Paying To Be Handicapped (2/4/2008 4:53:11 AM)
I sent you an email on the other side of the site. I work with some of these issues, so I wanted to offer my help. Based on what you have written, the apartment management is being discriminatory.

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