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Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 3:13:42 PM

KittenWithaTwist

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If you're a submissive man, or a dominant woman who plays with submissive men, you might be aware of objectification and humiliation. They are two types of play that are most often seen in such pairings. Many submissive men seem to enjoy pet play (in which a person is treated like an animal), furniture play (in which a person is treated like a piece of furniture), and "use" play (in which a person is used for one part of the body, without regard to their feelings, or orgasm, or whatever else).

Humiliation and objectification have always been types of play that I enjoy the most. I have met very few women who have had the same or similiar reactions to objectification play. In fact, while speaking with Fetish Diva Midori (before she and I did an objectification demo together), I was informed that in all her years in the lifestyle, she had, like me, met very few women who were genuinely interested in and intrigued by objectification, particularly in the "inanimate object" division. In the class, I was given the task of being a bench for her to sit on. It remains one of my favorite scenes, and most of the people around me were concerned for my welfare and enjoyment.

I wonder why it is that women, in general, do not enjoy this type of play. Midori and I discussed that perhaps it has something to do with women getting away from being treated as objects in the past (being breeders, or wives, or cooks, or vaginas, without regard to us as people), and that, perhaps, the feminist movement has caused us to not see objectification as something sexual.

So, my question: As a woman, do you see objectification as sexually arousing, as curious, or as just plain unpleasant? If you like it, why do you like it? If you don't like it, why is it?

To be absolutely clear: I don't mean humiliation in the sense of being called "taboo" names like whore, slut, bitch, wench, or etc. I also do not mean humiliation in the sense of being dragged around naked in public, or anything that is "naughty" but exciting. I mean humiliation and objectification in the sense of being used without regard to you as a person, whether that involves being used as an object of furniture, or as a glory hole, or as a labor mule..., or what-have-you.

_____________________________

"Time travel: It's a cornocopia of disturbing concepts." ~Ron Stoppable

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 5:16:56 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KittenWithaTwist

If you're a submissive man, or a dominant woman who plays with submissive men, you might be aware of objectification and humiliation. They are two types of play that are most often seen in such pairings.

Not a big deal, but I don't buy that - at least my anecdotal experience makes me think there isn't a gender divide on objectification.

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 6:45:47 PM

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.

< Message edited by LadyJulieAnn -- 11/3/2005 4:27:11 AM >

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RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 6:48:31 PM

obis

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I'm with Faramir, not certain there's a gender difference. My subs usually do enjoy objectification, in particular pet play and use play (to a lesser degree furniture). It may be that female subs prefer objectification from male doms?

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 7:10:23 PM

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I'm down with including objectification as a subset of humiliation. That being said, while humiliation (along with domesic violence) is my main bag, I;m not into objectification at all.

I want it to be personal.

Objectification is a great way to humiliate, but if your sexuality hinges on personal intimacy, and the symbolism of personal intimacy, then it works counter to what you need. I want her to feel like low and humiliated, but in a face to face, personal way, so objectification isn't my road.

(in reply to obis)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 7:14:38 PM

KittenWithaTwist

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I'm not looking to objectify someone, which is what I infer from your comment. I'm speaking of female submissives who enjoy or do not enjoy objectification...period. I've noticed that female submissives or bottoms do not usually enjoy objectification play, specifically play where their pleasure is not intended nor thought of. The best example I can give of this sort of play is furniture play, which I do not see...at all...particularly among women in male dom/fem sub relationships.

What I'm wondering is...if the reason for this is because women do not like to be objectified in this manner for emotional reasons, historical reasons, or simple physical arousal reasons...

_____________________________

"Time travel: It's a cornocopia of disturbing concepts." ~Ron Stoppable

(in reply to obis)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 7:28:49 PM

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< Message edited by LadyJulieAnn -- 11/3/2005 4:27:46 AM >

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RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 8:05:01 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KittenWithaTwist

I'm not looking to objectify someone, which is what I infer from your comment. I'm speaking of female submissives who enjoy or do not enjoy objectification...period. I've noticed that female submissives or bottoms do not usually enjoy objectification play, specifically play where their pleasure is not intended nor thought of. The best example I can give of this sort of play is furniture play, which I do not see...at all...particularly among women in male dom/fem sub relationships.

What I'm wondering is...if the reason for this is because women do not like to be objectified in this manner for emotional reasons, historical reasons, or simple physical arousal reasons...

Right - I think what me and Obis is trying to say is that you are wrong - scads of female submissive women want to be objectified. Not my bag, but a lot of ladies want it.

Your anecdotal experience is the opposite of ours - it is a common female submissve desire.

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 8:39:12 PM

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I also have not seen objectification to be gender based. In My world it is pretty evenly distributed but not only as humiliation but also as a showing of pride in service. Recently I attended a house warming for a Domme friend of Mine...one of the situations she advised the submissives would occur was that they would be used as furniture...it did not occur for various unforseen reasons and the only submissive that realized it and missed the opportunity was a female.

The more experiences we are subjected to outside of formal events the more we discover how similar many of the desires are between male and female submissives.

www.mistressmarlene.com

(in reply to Faramir)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 8:41:02 PM

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As far as generalities, I'd have to into a long theory about social cultural values and personal breakthroughs which I don't much have the energy for.

But here is my personal essay on humiliation and objectification:

Part of it is BECAUSE of my academic background, I'm very smart and very well educated. I think a LOT, I work a LOT, I am a control freak, I have moderate OCD, I am the social planner for my group of friends.

Being an object means you don't have to think, you don't have to stress, you just have to BE that object. You are there, purely and passively, for service and use. There's no need for you to interpret anything, no need for you to react, only simply to BE there.

That's a pretty awesome state of being for me.

Another part, the shown off part, is because I am an exhibitionist, I get a huge charge out of people's energy when they enjoy looking and playing with me. They are giving ME lots of attention, they want to touch ME, they want to use ME for pleasure, I can provide them with a release, with a good time, a good memory.

The sexual usage part is just part of my universal sex fantasy life- it's just hot to be used, hot to be a hole to go in, do your thing and get out. I don't really know much about that other than what I've already stated. I can't tell you why it gets me so deep any more than I can tell you why bondage does.

Something most subs and slaves can understand- it takes away choice. You don't have to think, you don't get to say no, you are there to always say YES, an object, a trophy doesn't get to say stop or get to dictate how it is used.

I am somewhat materialistic in that I like to use my money and gifts to show people I care for them. It's a physical thing I can give to show I've been thinking of them and want to add to their lives. While I understand they don't NEED those things, it's a very powerful idea to me. So, to BE the object itself, to be given to someone else, has a distinct personal flavor to it.

You'll notice- all of these reasons are about ME, what I enjoy, what I get out of it.

The Owner will pass me around and use me in ways I don't necessarily enjoy directly. He will send me to people I don't have an affinity for, partly because he KNOWS I don't have an affinity for them. So I don't necessarily always love it, with anyone, anywhere. There are definitely circumstances in which I really hate it.

While I love attention, I am actually quite uncomfortable ASKING for attention, I am very uneasy when people actually look at me and say "Now, I'm going to give you all this attention, just for you, just to enjoy, and there's nothing you can do about it."

Part of it is because not too many people are actually really GOOD at giving me happy pleasure, part of it is that I've trained myself to adapt and become what the OTHER person needs for that session, which, if it's a good match, will also be what I need.

And part of it is just my innate shyness and discomfort with being a focal point of attention. I don't know what to do with it, I feel very exposed. Perhaps a paradox for someone who LOVES being exposed, but that's why I call humiliation a "burning."

So, the humiliation and objectification is a keen way for me to receive attention, which I love, while being passive about asking for it and simply being a pretty little butterfly that people are attracted to, rather than dealing with the harder ordeal for me of directly asking and directly being told to sit back and enjoy.

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 9:12:01 PM

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Have to say that I agree that love of humiliation and objectification play has not been sex specific in my experience, Just had this topic of discussion on a local yahoo group and the girls burned up the board about their favorite experiences or scenarios being the beast, or the furniture, or the cum object. On the other hand, am a little concerned by just how few submissive ladies here on Collar Me seem to be responding to this question. Like I said, on my local MSDB board they were posting all day on their experiences. So lets here from more ladies here.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 9:13:52 PM

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So far I only count Lucky Albatross as a respondent from the people Kitten is trying to poll.

(in reply to BlackRobe)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 9:52:28 PM

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I love objectification in the being a fuck hole sense. I also very much enjoy being "art". I do not so much enjoy being furniture and serving in the pack horse sense. perhaps that is because I work in a very physically demanding job... perhaps its just not my thing and thats all.

I also mentally demanding job so perhaps thats why I enjoy the objectification... so I suppose so much for my why I love it. I just do.

(in reply to BlackRobe)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 9:55:04 PM

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Isn't this funny. I adore objectification, but abhor humiliation. Does that then make humiliation relative? hm. Objectification and/or Use play, for me, brings things to the level of control that I need, meaning, there is a chance I might not particularly like the
act itself, but the control behind it is enough to send me skyrocketing. No choices. Got to love that. : )

Syn

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Is it kind? Is it true? Is it necessary?
Does it improve upon the silence?

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 10:36:54 PM

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Objectification is not something i have experienced, and quite frankly it is not an experience i look forward to having. However, i can not speak for other female subs who might not wish to a part of this type of scene, because i have my own reason to not participate in this type of play.

In a previous relationship, being ignored for long periods of time was used as a punishment. By the way, it was not a D/s relationship. I cracked the last time...went a bit...well more than a bit crazy while this punishment was being used. The kitchen will never be the same as i destroyed every glass, plate, refrigerator shelves, food item, etc. that were in that kitchen. Of course, i realize this was an extreme reaction, but then the punishment had continued for over 4 weeks without even knowing what i had done to anger him. And yes, i do realize that the relationship was mentally abusive and it is now a thing of the past.

So, i am not certain if i would not crack again if i were used as an object. I know what it feels like to not exist as a person to another....and i am afraid that emotionally this type of play is beyond me. I need to always know that my partner knows i am present. Intellectually i do realize that objectification is not the same as being ignored, however, it is too similar for me even to think of agreeing to do. One of my hard limits is to never have being ignored used as a punishment ever again.

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/2/2005 10:45:37 PM

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i have always been attracted to objectification and use and i'm pretty sure that i'm female :)
S & M were never really my thing but i find being treated like a thing to be a very freeing experience.
Footrest, puppy, cow, table, hole, whatever they all have specific uses and new ways of interacting where i can fall into my role and be property.
Even the most submissive behaviors are still active behaviors where my brain must think and react as a woman, when i am in other roles, i am his and it can be yummy.

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/3/2005 1:34:33 AM

ExistentialSteel

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As most of the others have said, this is so obviously a desire common to subs of both sexes, that I wonder why you would think women don't usually "enjoy" this?

It would be interesting to see exactly what makes you think this. For an objective view of women being used as objects, you can physically view it at public events...sub women as art objects, etc. So again do you think it is possible that you just happened to come across a few women subs that skewed your perception?

An interesting topic in any case and I enjoy reading the comments of others on their experiences with this.

_____________________________

For those who are like Roman Candles leaving bright trails in the night sky while the crowd watches until the dark blue center light bursts into magnificent colors and the crowd goes, ahhhhhhhhhh.

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/3/2005 2:34:16 AM

mossy

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Breakthrough time for me....i was shocked to discover i actually found healing through the humiliation. It was an amazing experience, and all i want is more. In the past my resisitance was so high, and the thoughts i had about people who engaged in it, that their self-esteem was low, in order to allow themselves to do those things....Now for me anyway i found it to be quite the opposite. The higher my self-esteem goes, the more humiliation i can handle. i just have to laugh now at the way i used to think,,i was so judgemental...i find myself doing so many things i said i "never would"...

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~~inner peace & mental clarity~~

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RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/3/2005 2:59:56 AM

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I disagree with the whole idea that more male than female submissive types are into objectification and humiliation. That just hasnt been my experience. I would suggest that it is relatively equal, even slightly more female orientated.

I also don't necessarily equate objectification with humiliation. I think that they can be totally opposite at times. Objectification can be used in a immensly positive way, as well as humiliating (which is also positive if thats your bag, but I think you get what I am saying).

I find being 'something else' immensly freeing. I have been anything from an inanimate point of view from a table to a tree and from an animate point of view, from a tree to mechanical - and in all ways it is an exceptional process to work through. Its an incredible journey of discovery on a 'selfish' level. At least at times for me it is. In other times its just a way to 'be'. It is incredibly close to bondage in ways to me. It can be freeing to step out of 'being me' and experiencing as something else. It teaches and corrupts which are both fantastic sensations. It can be a form of worship - idolisation and adoration - to be beheld and sanctified. And it can be a form of deviancy to be squandered and depleted - to be used and discarded. Expendable and ineffectual.

It might be that you havent met any women who are able to voice their love of objectification because it can still be seen in some circles more taboo than other subjects. (Even moreso than humiliation). I don't think its fair to twin the two together, but to see them as seperate subjects that can be combined. I also believe that people don't fully understand what objectification is - and they probably participate in it, and don't even realise it!(Both to be and to bless)

Objectification ROCKS!
(and humiliation ain't so bad either...)

Peace and Love

< Message edited by dark~angel -- 11/3/2005 3:02:26 AM >

_____________________________

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...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

RE: Erotic Humiliation and Objectification - 11/3/2005 6:26:50 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KittenWithaTwist
So, my question: As a woman, do you see objectification as sexually arousing, as curious, or as just plain unpleasant? If you like it, why do you like it? If you don't like it, why is it?

I am one that does not enjoy objectification or humiliation in any sense.

I really like my man to just be a "man" ...not anything more than person...not an animal or a thing. It's the fact that he IS a man...that is what I want. I'm just don't enjoy him being anything, but what and who he is, and if his own enjoyments are otherwise, then his search continues.

I know that both objectification and humiliation are huge draws for attention, to some, but I seriously doubt that I could ever gain enjoyment from it, let alone have it be a sexual turn on.

K

(in reply to KittenWithaTwist)

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