RE: Sub or Slave (Full Version)

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gmsangel75 -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/14/2005 6:51:26 PM)

What do subs call the person in charge? is it Master or Dom? Is there a difference? I call him Master. Can Subs have Masters and Doms? Or can slaves only have Masters? And Subs only have Doms?
I have a lot of questions and I thank you very much for answering them. I am very curious about this lifestyle. I know it is for me, I just have things I have to sort out and understand, and I would like some ideas before I go to Master and aske questions there. I would like him to be happy that I have done research and looked up some answers for myself. That would make him very happy. Thank you for your help.



gmsangel75 -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/14/2005 7:02:57 PM)

I like your answers. You are blunt and to the point. Thank you. I take what is told to me and evaluate it and decide what fits my style. I then communicate with my Master and he is happy that i ask questions. He says I am learning. We have known each other for 5 years and the whole time he was slowly pushing me towards this becasue he knew it was right for me. I was the one confused. Just recently (about a month ago) I told him that this was what I wanted. I know it is right. Now I am trying to learn. I know I wont learn it in a month or maybe not even a year, but I do like to hear what others think. Maybe they think different than me since I am new to this. But most of all I take what I evaluate and find true for me, and talk with him about it. This way I dont appear stupid. I dont like to frustrate people or upset them...Especially when it is Master. (i really do that when I ask the same question twice. I forget easily) I dont mean to frustrate you.



justlkn -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/14/2005 9:20:22 PM)

A master/ dom is the same thing. I n the past if I have played with a sub that is fairly new to me, I ask that she call me sir during the scene and by my real name after it or before it. Now on the other hand if I collar her I would expect her to call me master during the scene. This is my definition, and may not reflect others. I do draw a line between the two. If I have a slave it will always be master unless in public, then all I request is that her collar be on.



Aivana -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/15/2005 1:20:09 AM)

quote:

know this may be a stupid question, but I am new to all of this. What is the real difference between a sub and a slave and how do you know which one is meant for you


The difference *to me* is that a submissive submits while a slave is enslaved. A D/s dynamic is more about an emotional connection while an M/s dynamic is more a mental connection. Some have said that a sub "gives over power" while a slave is subjugated (A word I like better is thrall). A slave is not a deeper form of submission. He or she is owned property. A slave is not always submissive. Infact many slaves love to top. With a slave it is all about obedience.

Heres another way of looking at it:
I know that with the right man I could be a slave but *I am not submissive*. I like control, I am task orientated and I have a sadistic streak. But I have this deep seated need to give up that control....but only to one I feel that is stronger than me. It is not enough for me to simply submit. I can't do that......I want my control ripped from my body. I don't know if this makes sense to you or not. I am still trying to make sense of it myself.

There is no way I can tell you how you decide which one is for you. That is something only you can know. It comes with time and knowing your wants and desires.

quote:

what does it take to keep a master happy?.


I will go out on a ledge here and assume that you are talking about inspiring Dominance. No one can tell you what will make your "master" happy except him. All I can do is give you little tips that I have found along the way. Be alert. Listen instead of always asking questions. Learn to anticipate his needs. Start off with that and learn as you go. You will not always know the hows and whys but trust him to lead you.

quote:

Do all the collars have to be the thick black leather collar?


Your collar will be whatever he chooses it to be. There is no right and wrong answer here.

quote:

What do subs call the person in charge?


I would imagine that you would call him whatever he wants you to call him. Is there a difference between a Dom and master? I believe there is a difference but I am not going into that today. You have enough to concentrate on.

Rememeber to Breath and try to relax. All the answers aren't going to come at once.



OsideGirl -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/15/2005 7:39:07 AM)

I'm so tired of the discussions of sub vs slave.

1) When I first came into the realm of D/s BDSM there were basically 2 designations sub/slave and bottom. Sub and slave were interchangeable. The exceptions being structured societies and Gorean.

2) What many use as the definition of sub, is actually my definition for bottom.

3) I was brought up through a structured society, where submissives rank above slaves. You literally had to be more highly trained and pass approval by the council to reach the rank of submissive.


So, here we go.....I am a collared and owned submissive in a 24/7 relationship with Master. I have a lifelong contract. I had hard limits which are no longer necessary since he and share the same views on those limits. I do not renogotiate my submission on an ongoing basis. We are a combination of service and BDSM. Pretty much destroys a lot of people's definition of the difference between submissive and slave.

So, the best bet is to not get caught up in the titles.



HeavenlyCeleste -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/15/2005 8:36:33 AM)

Subs voluntarily give their submission each time they are with their Domme/Dom. A slave gives it once and becomes property.



OsideGirl -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/15/2005 8:54:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavenlyCeleste

Subs voluntarily give their submission each time they are with their Domme/Dom. A slave gives it once and becomes property.



I'm a collared and owned submissive who has submitted for life and is considered property, so your definition does not fit.



plantlady64 -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/15/2005 10:05:33 AM)

Hello There,
To me both sub and slave mean so many varied things to different people they are mostly synonamous.
I think saying you are someones slave is a preference of showing your Master fully owns you. Saying you're a sub says you're submitting your will under your Master, but own yourself.

Sincerely,
sub suzanne



Dracironsgirl -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/22/2005 12:58:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: gmsangel75

I know this may be a stupid question, but I am new to all of this. What is the real difference between a sub and a slave and how do you know which one is meant for you?
I am still learning how to please my Master(who is also my husband now), but he said I have to learn this one on my own or from someone else. I really need help. I make sure he is happy at all times. I question him at time because I have a lot of curiosity not because I am being disrespectful. Help me in learning the difference and what is right or wrong. I really want to make Him happy......

a sub is usuallty for playtime and a slave is full time. it's also a matter of degree of control givern up in the relationship too.
i find it a bit odd your Master would want yuo to seek the answers from otrhers than Himself on this but know that i am here for you as i have been there before myself.



darkthunder -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/26/2005 7:40:14 PM)

I have a new slave as you are,and I have been in the lifestyle for over 30+ years. I am the one that has to teach her My way and what I expect from her. No one come into this lifestyle fully a slave there are many things unknow to them and that thay don't understand. Sit down with him and ask for some understanding and teaching of His ways. Make no differnce what you call your self it's what you become to Him. We all here can help only so much,in the end your answer must come from Him.

DT



starshineowned -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/26/2005 8:00:29 PM)

Greetings..~smiles~


Agree on the most part with the other posts. This labeling of yourself, what your Master wishes to call you will come in time, be nothing more or less than a reflection of you both.

While one persons definition of the same term you may ultimately use may or may not be the same..it in no way means your is wrong or right..and likewise of their use of it.

It destroys nothing, it changes nothing if persons differ in their use and understanding of it ..but it is good to be open and accepting that this will most likely be the case.

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin



Simian -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/26/2005 8:24:20 PM)

This is interesting gmangel75!

I understand what you are saying. You are looking at the deeper aspects of your own psychie thats remain wild and you yourself are unable to control. Hopefully in time you will feel comfrotable enough with him and be able to surrender more and more. Time is the biggest healer, and trust also extremely important for the walking wounded.

I myself have parts that react strongly to certain peoples attitudes. I had to find a Dom that I could trust and we have been taking it very slowly. I find that in the quite times I learn the most from her devine guidence, mostly in silence do I see the picture reveiled.

I tend to take back my will instinctively like the animals fight or flight syndrome. This is my biggest challenge and probably the biggest challenge for my Domme. One day I hope to have gained enough trust in the Domme to surrender for longer periods of time, not just during sessions.

She does encourage me to talk about anything that may be bothering me, I am allowed to question etc etc as we begin this process. One day she may know my limits without me having to declare them but that too comes with time.

With long term abuse during rearing often Post traumatic stress syndrome creates irrational mental processes. I had to see a councellor to have those uncovered for a few years. That was before I realised that I like to be Sub, before I thought I was Domme. Often PTSS can cause the self will to rebel and react instinctively..... talkj talk and more talk is the best remedy in my personal experience.
All the best
simian.



liljoy -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/27/2005 2:42:24 AM)

Simian,
wow what a wonderful post. What you wrote touched my heart in a big way. You have a much better understanding than i do but you could have been descriubing me. i like walking wounded too. It's much better than damaged good wgich is what i used to call myself.
thanks for sharing
lil_joy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Simian

This is interesting gmangel75!

I understand what you are saying. You are looking at the deeper aspects of your own psychie thats remain wild and you yourself are unable to control. Hopefully in time you will feel comfrotable enough with him and be able to surrender more and more. Time is the biggest healer, and trust also extremely important for the walking wounded.

I myself have parts that react strongly to certain peoples attitudes. I had to find a Dom that I could trust and we have been taking it very slowly. I find that in the quite times I learn the most from her devine guidence, mostly in silence do I see the picture reveiled.

I tend to take back my will instinctively like the animals fight or flight syndrome. This is my biggest challenge and probably the biggest challenge for my Domme. One day I hope to have gained enough trust in the Domme to surrender for longer periods of time, not just during sessions.

She does encourage me to talk about anything that may be bothering me, I am allowed to question etc etc as we begin this process. One day she may know my limits without me having to declare them but that too comes with time.

With long term abuse during rearing often Post traumatic stress syndrome creates irrational mental processes. I had to see a councellor to have those uncovered for a few years. That was before I realised that I like to be Sub, before I thought I was Domme. Often PTSS can cause the self will to rebel and react instinctively..... talkj talk and more talk is the best remedy in my personal experience.
All the best
simian.




swtnsparkling -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/27/2005 3:51:56 AM)

Where did you come up with this?
quote:

a sub is usuallty for playtime and a slave is full time.



When i am in a relationship with my Dom, it is not playtime. i do not put on my sub suit when He or i are in the mood to play i am His submissive at all times full time ( minus of course at work and other daily life issues that need attention)

i do have limits in the beginning, but we focus working towards a stronger relationship. i do not accept a collar unless i know we both agree and have the same ideals and morals and so called limits. Once we are there at that point of collaring my trust in Him and His in me. i have grown to the position some would call slave. i do not however call myself slave i am submissive.

[q]I'm a collared and owned submissive who has submitted for life and is considered property, so your definition does not fit. [/q]

exactly


edit: for spelling



OsideGirl -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/27/2005 6:23:34 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dracironsgirl

a sub is usuallty for playtime
This is the definition of a bottom, not a submissive. A submissive can be owned, collared, have a lifetime contract, have given up limits, have complete trust and submission. Hence the name "submissive".



ararka -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/28/2005 10:28:32 AM)

Lucky the Master who has (Lucky)Albatross.Those lips are just waiting



LilWhiteWolf -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/28/2005 11:17:34 AM)

i equate the collar to something like a ring in the nilla lifestyle. it is all a choice of preference. i have worn a leather collar with small rhinestones in it but i know others wear a simple chain to symbolize ownership. as i said, to me it is a symbol of your relationship and not all require that symbol. sometimes an invisible bond can be stronger than any tangible bond.
lil wolf



LilWhiteWolf -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/28/2005 11:32:04 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Simian

quote:

I tend to take back my will instinctively like the animals fight or flight syndrome. This is my biggest challenge and probably the biggest challenge for my Domme. One day I hope to have gained enough trust in the Domme to surrender for longer periods of time, not just during sessions.


Thank you for sharing that Simian. What you have said has opened up my eyes to why i am like i am right now. i spent 4 years of being mentally abused by my ex Dom and now i have a very hard time trusting and when i start to trust, i take flight within myself.



LilWhiteWolf -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/28/2005 11:38:56 AM)

i never did care much for "labels". whether you consider yourself a sub or slave, you are still a "free person" . it is up to you how much you choose to surrender to your Master/Dominant. don't worry so much about what you are ...a sub or slave. look in your heart and you will feel what you are and how much you want to surrender to your Master/Dominant. it is you who determines this. it must be given willingly by you. it cannot be forced. just be happy and communicate with each other.



RiotGirl -> RE: Sub or Slave (11/28/2005 3:36:39 PM)

quote:

I know this may be a stupid question, but I am new to all of this. What is the real difference between a sub and a slave and how do you know which one is meant for you?


it all depends on the person



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