RE: Anger & submissives (Full Version)

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DMFParadox -> RE: Anger & submissives (9/23/2008 8:07:38 AM)

Criticism is going to happen. We all do it. We all need to hear it. But the language we use to do so is paramount.

It's not as easy as just telling someone that they're "Too critical" or "too sensitive." What is dessert to one person is poison to another.

One important consideration for a Dom is to pick someone who can grok your style of leadership without feeling put down by it. If you notice warning signs that show your words and deeds are coming across as too critical, talk it out. Make sure--absolutely sure--that your sub understands the need to roll with the punches, and is willing and able to communicate with you on your level. Especially in a serious Master/slave relationship, because that cuts off a lot of the normal avenues of relief for a sub that's feeling put down.  Make sure that they understand and accept your style of play, and take it slow. If that doesn't work, walk away fast, or disaster approaches.

For example, let's say that weeks go by, and I never once criticize my submissive. Some--a lot--of submissives will love that, especially if I mix things up with humor and praise, and request service without putting them down for mistakes. But as wonderful as that sounds, it's not always the right idea, and I've been in situations where the sub had a meltdown because I wasn't 'talking' to them. (Made me tear my goddamned hair out, that did, but I adapted.) Some submissives might need a put-down or five. Sometimes the Dom needs to get some aggression out; and ripping your sub a new one is just the ticket. Sometimes there are other factors, like your sense of humor can come across as mean or thoughtless, or the sub's humor can.  And with all these if's and maybe's, there's one very, very important rule that has to be established early. That is forgiveness. Shit happens, we do "risk-aware-play" and it's very important to make your partner aware of the risks. Even if you feel they should know just by common sense, talk it out. And when things go wrong, as they will--a poorly chosen word, a spanking the sub feels they don't deserve--make sure you've laid the groundwork already to work things out. The alternative is a fucking nightmare, as I can attest.



ranja -> RE: Anger & submissives (9/24/2008 8:10:46 AM)

The thing is; as a sub the more angry and resentful you are at your Dom/me, the less respect you will have for Him or Her; the less likely it is you can get things 'your' way....best take your anger out by exercising your body to exertion and then find a very pleasing way to get your Dom/me to see things more 'your' way...try to avoid obvious topping from the bottom as most Dom/mes do not like this...pamper them, serve them and always ask polite... if nothing works and you are still angry ...oh what a bummer, maybe beat yourself up?



scarlethiney -> RE: Anger & submissives (9/24/2008 9:56:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx

I have my girl to keep a journal where she writes, and then brings it to me, this gives her a chance to get it out, and get it all out, and then for me to read all of it, and then make comments. We of course have sit down talks when it comes down to it, and we work things out, and we tweak things as we need to.

Communication is the key, will always be the key, to any relationship. If a Dominant is not willing to listen, even if they veto the opinions, then it is a serious set back for the relationship.


That's an excellent idea! What a great way to express one's feelings without having mis-communication interrupt a thought or statement. I applaud you for having the insight to help your lady tell you how she's feeling in a non-combative way. Thanks!

scarlet



cloudboy -> RE: Anger & submissives (9/26/2008 9:32:11 PM)


When I get mad, I no longer look at my Mistress as anything else but a normal person. We don't have many issues of substance because our relationship is a secondary one, so we're never debating money, children, or housing. If there is anything I've learned about myself, its that I bring a strong deck of cards into a relationship, and in many ways I'm not submissive at all. I think its more important to be interesting and engaging.



boytoyinatlanta -> RE: Anger & submissives (9/30/2008 7:55:12 PM)

be honest and open...if you keep it inside eventually it come out in a bad way...that anger will turn to resentment and sooner than later you will stop feeling submissive



Tapestry -> RE: Anger & submissives (10/1/2008 3:05:36 PM)

I can relate to a lot of what has been shared, good stuff.

I know that even if I would do something differently, I willingly yield to Master's will.
Yes, He takes my point of view into account, and then makes His decision.
If it's what I thought fine, and if it's a different choice, that's fine too.

Someone mentioned feeling angry if they felt threatened or unsafe or insecure, and I think that's pretty accurate.
The other time (and perhaps it is related) is that I know I feel upset of some type (anger or something else)
when I don't feel Master is actually in charge.

I'm a pretty submissive person, and I think He's accustomed to the routine of me just submitting to everything in general.
But sometimes, I actually need something concrete to submit to - I need Him to actively take charge and give orders.

That doesn't always happen, because let's face it, I don't make the rules, He does.
So it's up to me to work through my feelings at that time.
And they can be hefty feelings too. Big stuff like rage (as opposed to anger), lack of respect,
fear and worry for sure, abandonment, and more besides.

As far as the whole being angry over a decision He makes, that I can't really recall
I like yielding my will to His, so in some ways, any decision/order/instruction/direction on His part is a good one.
It is just when I perceive a lack of that leadership that I get crazy.



MostlySubMale -> RE: Anger & submissives (10/1/2008 3:40:03 PM)

Well i know it's not always the healthiest way, but unless it's something that's a deal breaker i just keep it to myself when i'm troubled or angry.  Next time i see Her afterward hopefully i will have forgotten about it, and be on my knees again ready and anxious to please, unless i just can't let it go anymore and have to bring it up.  More often, I'll mention something unrelated, like about somebody else, that might get her to make the connection and empathize at least a bit.

When i do bring it up directly, She'll take it into consideration, and maybe make a change, but there is usually some sort of penalty to go with it, the kind of penalty that teaches me not to mention such things.  But then that's usually something she's been wanting to change anyhow, so it works out in the end.  i get a modicum of what is bothering me resolved if it's not too important to Her to stay as is, and She gets exactly as She wants.

She never gets angry, at least not with me.  She just tells me how it's going to be and that is that.  If i don't like it i can always leave.




VivaciousSub -> RE: Anger & submissives (10/1/2008 10:03:21 PM)

quote:

When i do bring it up directly, She'll take it into consideration, and maybe make a change, but there is usually some sort of penalty to go with it, the kind of penalty that teaches me not to mention such things.


MSM,

I'm happy this works for you, but I have to say - FOR ME - this would be a killer. Literally. I am someone that absolutely needs to be able to bring up something that's bothering me, and not get punished for it. Keeping things in, FOR ME, leads to severe depressive episodes.



girlygurl -> RE: Anger & submissives (10/1/2008 10:19:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pixelslave

My question is, how are those feelings safely expressed and dealt with in your relationship? [&:] 
 


Over the last year and a half I have found that taking time to think before I speak will avoid any disrespectful comments on my part.  I've actually excused myself from conversation when I felt I was going to "blow" and revisit the topic at hand at a later time.  Speaking from emotion is a fine line for me, but I'm learning.... I'm learning every day with a loving wonderful man.

girly (so sticky sweet in love)



pixelslave -> RE: Anger & submissives (10/2/2008 11:45:11 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MostlySubMale

Well i know it's not always the healthiest way, but unless it's something that's a deal breaker i just keep it to myself when i'm troubled or angry.  Next time i see Her afterward hopefully i will have forgotten about it, and be on my knees again ready and anxious to please, unless i just can't let it go anymore and have to bring it up.  More often, I'll mention something unrelated, like about somebody else, that might get her to make the connection and empathize at least a bit.


I'd agree with you that what you describe isn't what I'd call healthy communication either.  In fact, I'd refer to it as passive-agressive behavior and wouldn't be happy if someone approached me using that sort of tactic.
 

quote:


When i do bring it up directly, She'll take it into consideration, and maybe make a change, but there is usually some sort of penalty to go with it, the kind of penalty that teaches me not to mention such things. 



All I can say is "ouch"!  This wouldn't work for me at all unless it had previously been agreed that it was time to drop the subject, move-on, and let go of it.  Mistress is always open to my bringin anything I need to discuss to her and I couldn't possibly imagine having a relationship with anyone who didn't have that kind of attitude as well! [image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m23.gif[/image]
 
 
quote:


But then that's usually something she's been wanting to change anyhow, so it works out in the end.  i get a modicum of what is bothering me resolved if it's not too important to Her to stay as is, and She gets exactly as She wants.


So you get to express yourself, but at a price?  And she changes what?  Somehow that's not clear to me.  It almost sounds as though she changes your sense of freedom to be open with her about your feelings, or am I misinterpreting your post? [8|]

quote:


She never gets angry, at least not with me.  She just tells me how it's going to be and that is that.  If i don't like it i can always leave.



Yes, leaving is always an option and I've done that before when things became unbearable for my emotional health.  My hope for you would be that you'd be in a relationship where your Dominant was also equally invested in the relationship as well; providing you with a sense of security that you've not conveyed in your post.  I couldn't be in a relationship where I felt as disposable as it sounds to me as though you seem to feel. [image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m23.gif[/image]
 
My apologies if I've projected something of my own and have misinterpreted your words.
 
 - pixel
 
 Lady Pact's bleaux ...
 ...still under consideration with each other [;)]
 



MostlySubMale -> RE: Anger & submissives (10/3/2008 4:00:26 PM)

Thanks for the input Vivacious and pixel!  Lots of good insight there and I do appreciate it.




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