alienation as punishment

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

alienation as punishment

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> alienation as punishment

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

alienation as punishment - 12/7/2005 4:07:19 AM

knotnilla

Posts: 47
Joined: 12/5/2004
Status: offline

abandonment as punishment...

looking for an article on this from a Master here from Atlanta. Not sure of the name. Need info on this subject.

Profile

Post #: 1

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/7/2005 6:16:37 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: knotnilla
abandonment as punishment...

looking for an article on this from a Master here from Atlanta. Not sure of the name. Need info on this subject.

I don't know of any specific articles on this, but in general it's a bad idea.

Putting someone in the corner for awhile is one thing. Pushing them away is another. When you punish someone your goal is to change their behavior, not make them scared or feel abandoned.

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 2

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/7/2005 6:21:06 AM

fyreredsub

Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

it is the worst thing possible

and i seriously doubt if it EVER has the intended affect .....i would rather beg the whip and i hate pain....but something of this nature can destroy a relationship if it goes on for too long.it is not good for the subs emotional well-being at all.it can turn devotion into hate very easily

in a stong woman and make a weaker one break!

< Message edited by fyreredsub -- 12/7/2005 6:24:08 AM >

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 3

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/7/2005 9:11:53 PM

B1gbear

Posts: 81
Joined: 5/7/2004
Status: offline

Abandonment is just that, abandonment, not punishment. If you abandon a sub or slave you have walked away from your problem or issue and NOT dealt with it. Not a very Domly action. Now withholding Master's attention from the sub or slave is often effective if done correctly and commonly considered the worst form of punishment you can give a true sub or slave. A Dom should know well the mind of the one they deny their attetion to and the result it will have on them before doing so. They should also know the lines between punishment and mental abuse that will have a negative effect on the relationship. If the Dom wants to deny attention he/she can easily do little things like make the sub sleep on the floor instead of in the bed with the Dom that night for instance. The sub is punished and separated from the Dom's affection and closeness for one very long night, but still remains in proximity and shown she is not being abandoned and her presence in service is still desired, but simply denied closeness during the punishment. Stood in the corner and left there to consider her actions is another effective tool for some. Some subs may be a bit hot headed and "NEED" the time alone to gather themselves and avoid more problems in the future. Again, like every other tool, it has its place if used properly.....and can cause serious damage and problems if mis-used. Not much different than a paddle or whip when it comes to punishment. The key thing to remember here is the word punishment. It is meant to correct behavior, and cleanse the sub or slave of the wrong doing. If it was fun it wouldn't be punishment. If the sub or slave didn't dread it coming to pass, it would not be very effective punishment now would it?

One last thought to leave you with. If a Master uses this as punishment, he usually has a good reason and believes it will be effective. (If it's NOT abandonment of course). After all, is he not denying himself of your service as well? What Master leaves himself sub/slaveless for any period of time for no good reason? One that feels this is the best way to effect change in his sub or slave, and through this grows her....thus making her a better slave, thus improving and growing the dynamic of the relationship they both rely on for their happiness and security. No one ever said Master's job was all fun and games. There are far more hard choices than easy ones when it comes to taking responsibility for the growth and well being of another human being.

(This response is based on the assumption that Master and sub are engaged in a healthy and mutually caring if not loving dynamic. There is certainly the purely sadistic angle that can certainly be used here, which has far less to do with correcting behavior than giving the Dom and excuse to get a thrill at your expense.)

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 4

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/7/2005 10:24:38 PM

AkaMystery

Posts: 10
Joined: 11/1/2005
Status: offline

quote:

your goal is to change their behavior, not make them scared or feel abandoned.

I believe this sums up the topic best as well

As for the article, never saw anything on this before.

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 5

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/8/2005 2:56:28 AM

sweetpettjenny

Posts: 674
Joined: 11/7/2004
Status: offline

abandonment is not punishment , its mental scarring

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 6

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/8/2005 12:04:45 PM

amayos

Posts: 1553
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: New England
Status: offline

What is and what is not punishment is entirely subjective, outside of its general definition.

Good ol' Webster defines punishment as:

1. To subject to pain, loss, confinement, death, etc.
2. To inflict a penalty for (an offense, fault, etc.)

Discarding a slave can be a horrible form of punishment, but the abandonment needn't be permanent; its term need only be enough to make them wail and shiver in the cold. Evil, perhaps—but it can be effective.

< Message edited by amayos -- 12/8/2005 12:05:30 PM >

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 7

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/12/2005 1:05:26 PM

jamesthehumanrug

Posts: 668
Joined: 10/21/2005
Status: offline

GREETING NOT V-NILLA
I hate to suggest that
in the volumes of science
it is not recommended to use any type of suggested abandonment
to an abused person
or they will likely
BLOW UP
good luck
top or bottom.....
same goes
try packing leaving suitcases
and saying nothing
you will get attacked if not dead
so bon-voyage
how far you think you'll get
babe

_____________________________

I REMAIN RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED
,LOVEles,
jamesthehumanrug

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 8

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/12/2005 7:09:54 PM

amayos

Posts: 1553
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: New England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jamesthehumanrug

GREETING NOT V-NILLA
I hate to suggest that
in the volumes of science
it is not recommended to use any type of suggested abandonment
to an abused person
or they will likely
BLOW UP
good luck
top or bottom.....
same goes
try packing leaving suitcases
and saying nothing
you will get attacked if not dead
so bon-voyage
how far you think you'll get
babe

The ones I keep aren't in any danger of spontaneous combustion, I assure you.

(in reply to jamesthehumanrug)

Profile

Post #: 9

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/12/2005 7:15:03 PM

Wolf1020

Posts: 447
Joined: 11/7/2005
From: Anderson, SC
Status: offline

Abandonment no, it doesn't do anything. But denying attention and such for a certian amount of time can be effective. Not an excessive amount of time, but like all punishments it goes to the individual for what works best.

_____________________________

"The less people know about how sausages and laws are made, the better they'll sleep at night."~ Otto von Bismarck

"Fish and visitors smell in three days"~Benjamin Franklin

(in reply to amayos)

Profile

Post #: 10

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/18/2005 7:20:46 AM

willing2serve

Posts: 385
Joined: 4/6/2004
Status: offline

quote:

abandonment as punishment...

Not quite sure of what your definition of abandonment here...

But, when my Master withdraws attention from me it is VERY effective. I am a masochist so physical punishment is generally a last resort.

When my Master does withdraw His attention, I completely understand why and its not for a lengthy time period.

During these times, I do not feel my Master left me or walked away from me, but it does feel like he turned his back and eyes away from me in disappointment. Now that is punishment!

Respectfully,
BTs willing

_____________________________

Definitely A Journey!

(in reply to Wolf1020)

Profile

Post #: 11

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/18/2005 7:58:35 AM

krikket

Posts: 1183
Joined: 11/17/2004
From: Washington, DC Metro Area
Status: offline

quote:

Abandonment is just that, abandonment, not punishment.

This is said so well by BigBear, there's nothing more to it, other than perhaps a few words from a submissive perspective and one who's experienced it.

Like a lot of people i have abandonment issues -- sometimes those are worse than other times, but for the most part i've learned to deal with them. Early on i thought the two meant the same thing -- they always had in the past. However, my first Master used "withdrawal" as punishment, and it took a lot of talking on his part to help me see the difference. The other big difference is that he ALWAYS explained why the punishment was being carried out, how i could keep it from happening again, and after it was all over he'd ask me what i had learned. He also never let the "withdrawal" last very long, in part because he knew what i could do in my own head - that my own self-imposed punishments were far harsher than his were, and he loved me, wanted to be with me, and as he said "As your Master, self-denial isn't often on my list of things I want."

i found his punishment quite effective. While i never mistook a punishment spanking for a discipline spanking (he was quite good at showing me the difference..lol), his words, his judicious use of silence, and his teachings made me a much better submissive, for him and for myself.

regards
jimini

_____________________________

"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to bloom."

by A. Nin

When your heart speaks take good notes.

(in reply to B1gbear)

Profile

Post #: 12

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/18/2005 1:08:32 PM

sudja

Posts: 155
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: knotnilla

abandonment as punishment...

looking for an article on this from a Master here from Atlanta. Not sure of the name. Need info on this subject.

It's irresponsible.

sudja

(in reply to knotnilla)

Profile

Post #: 13

RE: alienation as punishment - 12/18/2005 1:30:33 PM

nephandi

Posts: 4470
Joined: 9/23/2005
From: Cold and magickal Norway in a town near Bergen!
Status: offline

i belive in most cases it is not effective, and is not somthing one can do, to deny atention as sugjested sure, but to abandon the sub for a period of time, unless the relationshop is so strong that the slave will know he will come back it is unresponsible, if it is that strong it can still be damaging. There is a difference between punishment and terror.

(in reply to sudja)

Profile

Post #: 14