RE: Obama, ACORN, and more....

RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (Full Version)

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TheUtopian -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 6:55:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni I call it nonsense because no one ever backs anything up. And I looked in the mirror a while ago and thought, "What a handsome bastard you are!" Bla bla bla. bla bla He don't need to back anything up - he's the professor! His word / opinions are final - That's it! - Believe it! [:D] - R

Musicmystery -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 6:56:23 PM)
Utopian, I see you also have trouble following a thread. Here ya go. quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery rex, You ran after me for responding to a silly post--a post you clearly haven't read. Instead, you've been jumping down my throat about a topic we weren't even discussing, and aren't now. Let's review. quote: ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch The artificial 90s boom (not to mention the 9/11 damage) was unwound by 2005 or so (way before i had any hope for). Of course, government had to come along and mandate mortgages to those who couldn't pay. The idiots that signed those loans are now in foreclosure and whining about predatory lending. Initially, these programs had the effect of radically appreciating housing values, so as this bubble unwinds its going to catch responsible owners also. Ie. Those that lose jobs won't be able to sell their houses as they owe more than it's now worth. Of course, i'm a total asshat that put 20% down and added another 10% to my equity in the form of remodeling. My place 3 years later is now worth about what I owe on it. My 30% percent equity is vaporized. If I was irresponsible I could of got a zero down loan and stuck the bank with the whole damn thing. The government isn't subsidizing banks in order to reduce my interest rate or principal. The more irresponsible you are in this country the more you get to pick the taxpayers pocket. The current situation is a liberal politician's wet dream. The credit tightening that has to happen to unwind this housing bubble can cause a depression. Of course the last time we had a depression 99 percent of the population was law abiding and didn't believe anyone owed them anything. If we have depression now, there will be wide spread rioting, stealing and all kind of mayhem (after all, rich people suck and deserve to be stolen from). At least in urban areas they'll be a popular call for military presence. If this bail out fails we're looking at martial law. Good luck getting rid of it with a marxist like obama in power. Liberty will be lost in this nation and most of the population will be cheering when it happens. (Which is always the case when a country loses liberty from internal forces). I responded: quote: Yet we have a Republican president pushing these policies through. Has Bush become one of your fantasy liberal politicians having a wet dream? And before you tell me about the Democrats in Congress, Bush could simply have vetoed all this. Instead, he proposed it---and keeps going further, now nationalizing commercial banks as well as investment banks. This is absolutely socialist, marxism if you like, coming from the current President in power. You also predict "liberty will be lost in this nation" while the current administration and the then Republican Congress took away a host of rights under the Patriot Act. you chimed in: quote: Both parties are involved. Now please go ahead and spew partisan nonsense and I'll drink some more coffee. I call it nonsense because no one ever backs anything up. And I looked in the mirror a while ago and thought, "What a handsome bastard you are!" Bla bla bla. bla bla I rolled my eyes: quote: If you need me to back up that the current president is a Republican, and that Republicans controlled Congress during his administration until Jan. 2007, then this is indeed a pointless conversation. And your take: quote: Seriously, whats your problem? I can voice whatever damn opinion I want, even if you disagree because it doesnt fit your view. Oh wait, I am not talking about what you were. I never started an argument, I stated my opinion. And yes I am bitching about partisanism. Its pointless though, because everyone is stuck in their own little mindsets. The problem is that yes, you "can voice whatever damn opinion" you want, but as you're going on the attack and not addressing the actual issues on the table, but rather just swinging in random directions, and in a partisan manner at that, makes your claims, especially "everyone is stuck in their own little mindsets," look silly. Just saying. This is a non-conversation. Not as compelling as "bla bla bla," but it's what happened. Damn facts.

slvemike4u -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 6:58:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Seriously, I can't see qwertyui walking into a polling place and casting a vote. I'm voting by mail. Kirata Qwertyui Be sure to let us know how that works out for you.....p.s. please make sure to put a return address on the envelope( to ensure speedy processing,of course)

TheUtopian -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:04:18 PM)
No trouble partner.....I'm just having some fun with someone who loves do deal/play with semantics. Tell me brother.....when you take a lady out, do you play those semantics games with her /them? And do they then get turned off and slap you in that big ugly forehead of yours only for you never to hear from them again?!? [:D] I'm curious.... - R

rexrgisformidoni -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:13:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheUtopian No trouble partner.....I'm just having some fun with someone who loves do deal/play with semantics. Tell me brother.....when you take a lady out, do you play those semantics games with her /them? And do they then get turned off and slap you in that big ugly forehead of yours only for you never to hear from them again?!? [:D] I'm curious.... - R hahahahaha....If I had a professor like ole musicman here, I'd make a point to make his life a living nightmare. Good thing I have/had them who are professionals and are not condescending a-holes. oh and music before you attempt to make me look foolish, I have a 4.0 gpa, and find your snottiness amusing.

ModeratorEleven -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:20:48 PM)
Folks, please settle down. XI

DedicatedDom40 -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:25:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: corysub [sm=giveup.gif] Why should anyone dispair? Just because someone no one knows other than he is articulte, is ahead in the polls is no reason to assume the embryo position. I will dispair on November 4th should such an inexprienced and socialist/liberal person be put in a position of power...a person whose philosophy of government is 180 degrees opposite the founding principles of our country, and mine. Been here before andt we survived. Interesting time, eh! How come every time we undo that 180 and return to those who espouse the founding principles of our country, we always end up closer to the edge? Thats what this election is about. People simply cannot trust those who arent in the '180 position' anymore. How do you earn that trust back?

bestbabync -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:34:24 PM)
i believe most people in this country wants the basic freedoms. freedom from being taxed, freedom to practice our religion even if it is a belief in God/The Son & the Holy Ghost, freedom to start our own business and freedom to work hard and reap success from it. once we loose those freedoms, this country has turned 180! trust in our government and politicians has been long gone. regaining it is a mute point for either party. they have no desire to carry out the wishes of the american voter.

Hippiekinkster -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:41:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync quote: ORIGINAL: groundhogphil Ok so since 2007 Democrats are in control, So what have they done? What big change have they accomplished? and how with a Democrat President will it change things? Hell its just one person. Just what is this change that we are being told about? hi groundhogphil, i think the CHANGE they are speaking of is "Spread the Wealth" in other words if you work hard to earn your salary, you have to share it with others that don't want to work hard.......LOL! Yet I note that Germany, France, Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Belgium, Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Finland, et cetera have had social Democracies with strong social safety nets, free or inexpensive education, and functioning healthcare systems for decades and haven't self-destructed. If it weren't for the radical right (the corporate oligarchy which really controls the country), the US would be a civilized nation, too.

slvemike4u -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:45:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync i believe most people in this country wants the basic freedoms. freedom from being taxed, freedom to practice our religion even if it is a belief in God/The Son & the Holy Ghost, freedom to start our own business and freedom to work hard and reap success from it. once we loose those freedoms, this country has turned 180! trust in our government and politicians has been long gone. regaining it is a mute point for either party. they have no desire to carry out the wishes of the american voter. Freedom from being taxed,when did we ever have that...how do you suggest we pay for the National Defence amongst other things.

bestbabync -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 7:52:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync i believe most people in this country wants the basic freedoms. freedom from being taxed, freedom to practice our religion even if it is a belief in God/The Son & the Holy Ghost, freedom to start our own business and freedom to work hard and reap success from it. once we loose those freedoms, this country has turned 180! trust in our government and politicians has been long gone. regaining it is a mute point for either party. they have no desire to carry out the wishes of the american voter. Freedom from being taxed,when did we ever have that...how do you suggest we pay for the National Defence amongst other things. i left a word out....sorry!!! "freedom from being over taxed" is what i meant! how do we pay for the National Debt, well since you ask, i am an advocate for the Fair Tax. if every American citizen pays the same percentage (which would be much lower than the 30 to 40% some of us unlucky middle income people pay now) of taxes this country would eventually reduce the debt in our lifetime to 0 and then we would build a surplus of wealth.[:D]

Sanity -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 8:20:25 PM)
quote: The new plan, President Bush declared, is "not intended to take over the free market but to preserve it." <snip> <snip> "Government owning a stake in any private U.S. company is objectionable to most Americans -- me included," Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson said in announcing the initiative. "Yet the alternative of leaving businesses and consumers without access to financing is totally unacceptable." Whether the $250 billion will be sufficient to encourage banks to lend again is hard to tell, said Anil Kashyap, professor of economics and finance at the University of Chicago's Graduate School of Business. The Treasury Department arrived at the $250 billion figure after consulting with banking regulators. "This plan will work if we wind up with everybody pretty well capitalized," Kashyap said. "But if it doesn't reach that point, we'll be back in soup down the road." <snip><snip><snip> "The government's role will be limited and temporary," Bush pledged. "These measures are not intended to take over the free market but to preserve it." quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery And we're back to square one. Bush's administration asked for, pushed for, and has nationalized investment banking and now commercial banking. Those would be Republicans, no? That's socialism, no?

DedicatedDom40 -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 8:20:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch Of course, government had to come along and mandate mortgages to those who couldn't pay. The idiots that signed those loans are now in foreclosure and whining about predatory lending. Initially, these programs had the effect of radically appreciating housing values, so as this bubble unwinds its going to catch responsible owners also. The Community Reinvestment Act or other such mandates to equalize lending patterns weren't the trigger. When unqualified borrowers are receiving cash at the close of escrow (essentially getting paid to buy a house, any house), the motive is profit, not government mandate. Brokers and banks took fees on deals for which they didn’t have to retain any of the risk. It was a fee-based money making machine, operated down to a science. You dont have to pass legislation to force mandated lending to create such profit situations. The banks took any CRA clients and then asked to see their friends... So, no, the CRA wasn't any kind of gun being held to the banker's head. Banks went there on their own, above and beyond what the CRA required. There were more foreclosure starts last month among prime borrowers who are simply walking away from an upside down mortgage than foreclosures from subprime borrowers. You may believe that borrowers agreed to an iron-clad deal when they signed the mortgage papers, but many are within their rights to walk away from a bad deal and suffer the consequences, just as many corporations who write down billions of dollars of debt, lose money for their shareholders, and lay off people as a result of their bad decisions. Why should people view a business decision by a homeowner as a terrible moral lapse when large businesses exercise the same prerogative on a daily basis? What makes the homeowner different than the businessman in that he must stay put and endure the loss? Why can't he 'act like a business'? Why the difference in moral judgment? Yes, we used to have more responsibility in both business and individual actions. Today both are gone. I dont see where one loss is more critical than the other.

DedicatedDom40 -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/14/2008 8:51:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync i believe most people in this country wants the basic freedoms. freedom from being taxed, freedom to practice our religion even if it is a belief in God/The Son & the Holy Ghost, freedom to start our own business and freedom to work hard and reap success from it. I agree, but when the masses are faced with the choice of a) socialism or b) going over a financial cliff, the majority will choose socialism, especially when socialism has worked so well for capitalists who long ago privatized the profit but socialized the risk. That is the precipice which uninsured, outsourced, free trade, multiational corporation, taxcut-and-spend, Patriot Act, Monica Goodling, Iraq war, Walmart-type 'creative destruction' capitalism has brought the majority of people in this foreclosed country to. Capitalism on a tilted playing field where the little guy is designed to lose is what is leading people there. I wish we could get on to solving that, if its even deemed slavagable.

groundhogphil -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/15/2008 6:30:42 AM)
And what year did the Bush Admistration push to nationalize Investment Banking, And now Comercial Banking. Hmmmm me thinks the Democrats are in control so wouldn't they have to approve this?

bipolarber -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/15/2008 6:56:01 AM)
The simple fact is, whenever you pay people to sign others up for voting, they cheat. When you are paid $00.10 or $00.25 for every voter card you turn in completed, there's a strong temptation to just grab the phone book, or take a trip out to the local cemetary to get names to fill them out with. After all, if these folks were really great at their work ethic, would they be doing temp work like this? ACORN is hardly a concerted effort by dems to "steal the election." Rather, it's just this season's GOP "boogieman" that they are using to attemt to disenfranchise voters. The head of the elections comission for Virgina was on the radio On Monday talking about the ACORN dust up and has said that about 1/24 of the names turned in are ones they have to deny due to inelegibility. So, the case could be made that, although they end up creating a lot of extra work for the folks who have to verify the names, their overall effect is a positive one. Which explains why John McCain was a guest at several of their rallies up until a year ago, and in fact, was a keynote speaker at one of their meetings about this time in '06. Yet, when you really look at the history, the GOP has been involved in concerted efforts to deny black voters their rights since about 1964 (when they first began voting in larger numbers) As the election in FL showed in 2000, republicans were willing to deny perhaps as many as 8,000 black voters access to the democratic system, and many, many more via scurrilous practices like "caging," mail retun disqualification, and non verifiable felony records. (i.e. their names sounded like those on a list of convicted felons.) and of course the old classics like disqualifying motor votor laws, and having literacy tests. Bush won in FL, by supposedly more or less 350 votes. Yet, in FL, over 8,000 people were turned away from the polls illegally by GOP opratives that year. So yes, this crap really does matter.

Musicmystery -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/15/2008 7:21:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: groundhogphil And what year did the Bush Admistration push to nationalize Investment Banking, And now Comercial Banking. Hmmmm me thinks the Democrats are in control so wouldn't they have to approve this? Point is, both parties and in fact all of Europe too are headed in the same direction on this. Label it if you wish, but it's not a partisan issue.

bestbabync -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/15/2008 9:26:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery quote: ORIGINAL: groundhogphil And what year did the Bush Admistration push to nationalize Investment Banking, And now Comercial Banking. Hmmmm me thinks the Democrats are in control so wouldn't they have to approve this? Point is, both parties and in fact all of Europe too are headed in the same direction on this. Label it if you wish, but it's not a partisan issue. exactly, so why support either side with your vote. i came to this conclusions weeks ago. just depends on which road you want to take to get there.

Musicmystery -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/15/2008 9:31:31 AM)
Because the world is more complex than a single issue.

bestbabync -> RE: Obama, ACORN, and more.... (10/15/2008 9:35:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Because the world is more complex than a single issue. oh god i know that![sm=banghead.gif] duh...the economy, the war and corruption!

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