Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (Full Version)

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variation30 -> Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 10:41:08 PM)

I was explaining to an individual at a bar how obama is, as far as the constitution is concerned, not the president until the swore the oath. they then brought up the 20th amendment. I told them that the 20th amendment only ended the previous president's term. she didn't believe me so I pulled out my pocket constitution and checked. this is what I read...

"Amendment XX
Section 1. The terms of the President and Vice President shall end at noon on the 20th day of January, and the terms of Senators and Representatives at noon on the 3d day of January, of the years in which such terms would have ended if this article had not been ratified; and the terms of their successors shall then begin."

so at noon on the 20th, Bush and Cheney's term ends. the terms of their successors begins.

the line of succession is as follows:

president (ended by 20th amendment), vice president (ended by 20th amendment), the speaker of the house, the president pro temp, and then the secretary of state.

now according to the presidential succession act:

"then the Speaker of the House of Representatives shall, upon his resignation as Speaker and as Representative in Congress, act as President."

and

"Then the President pro tempore of the Senate shall, upon his resignation as President pro tempore and as Senator, act as President."

...well...neither the speaker nor the president pro temp resigned, so the line of succession goes to the acting secretary or state. that having been said, Condoleezza Rice was, for at least three minutes, the first black president AND first woman president of the united states.

why? article 2 section 1 of the constitution.

"Before he enter on the Execution of his Office, he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation:"

now that I think about it, Condie was president for a while, as obama just has completed the oath.



servantforuse -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 10:52:45 PM)

We could only hope that Condi was now the President. My question is this. Why do they say he is the 1st. black president.? He is 1/2 black and 1/2 white.. Why isn't he white??? Why is he black??/



hardbodysub -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 10:56:22 PM)

Ridiculous.



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 10:57:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hardbodysub

Ridiculous.


I know. that constitution thing is WHACKY!



MissIsis -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:02:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
Why do they say he is the 1st. black president.? He is 1/2 black and 1/2 white.. Why isn't he white??? Why is he black??/


It goes back historically, in this country, I believe a holdover when slave owners slept with their slaves, and producing offspring.  They didn't want a slave, someone who was part black to be able to have inheritance rights.  So it became accepted that anyone who had even a partial amount of black blood, automatically, was put into the black category. 

In this day & age, I think the whole thing is rather silly.   The black people are claiming Obama is "black" & say he is the first black president.   Actually, he is white, with half black African genes, raised by a white mother & grandmother in a white household.   To my way of thinking, that would make him more white than black, since culturally, he was raised white, but what do I know?  I suspect had Obama been raised with his black daddy, his upbringing would have been different, & he wouldn't be in the place he is now, nor would he be the Obama everyone thinks they know. 



bestbabync -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:06:49 PM)

[sm=agree.gif]



Musicmystery -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:16:37 PM)

She would also have to have been sworn in, just as happens in a hurry when Presidents have died in office.

She wasn't.



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:22:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

She would also have to have been sworn in, just as happens in a hurry when Presidents have died in office.

She wasn't.


she would have been the president in name but could not have actually done anything as one has to recite the oath before they can execute any power. I've been looking at related acts to see if there is anything that says the president elect becomes the president until the oath...but I've got nothing yet.

all I've gotten so far is this: obama is the president elect until the oath. condie was the president (though could not do anything as she hadn't taken the oath) until obama took the title.



Musicmystery -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:28:57 PM)

This is silly. Clearly the President-Elect would then be President in name until sworn in, not the ex-Secretary of State.

Ya can't just make up the rules as you go.



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:32:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

This is silly. Clearly the President-Elect would then be President in name until sworn in, not the ex-Secretary of State.

Ya can't just make up the rules as you go.


I've been copy/pasting the rules, not making them up. as I said, I've been looking (though not any more as I got bored) for anything on the status of the president elect.

normally this isn't an issue as the president take the oath at noon...

I'm not asking that condie be added to the annals of presidency, I'm just pointing out a fun technicality that occurs when a president is a few minutes late to swear in an oath.

p.s. if you can find me anything about the status of the president elect until the execution of his office, please do. but until then, I'm going to have fun with this. I also don't know whether or not she's the ex-secretary of state until the new president has a new cabinet (which would mean he'd have to have executive power).



Musicmystery -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:33:56 PM)

I'm still working on how an ex-Secretary of State becomes president by succession.



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:36:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I'm still working on how an ex-Secretary of State becomes president by succession.


20th amendment only applies to president and vice president. and there isn't a new cabinet until the new president has the power to place them (which requires the oath). so it seems as if she wasn't the ex secretary of state.



Musicmystery -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:38:35 PM)

If you're claiming that Bush is out of office but his cabinet is still in place, even for 20 minutes, you've a LOT of explaining to do.



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:42:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

If you're claiming that Bush is out of office but his cabinet is still in place, even for 20 minutes, you've a LOT of explaining to do.


I am. under any other circumstance when the president is out of office (like death), the cabinet stays. I'm going to look at all the old succession acts and see if they say anything about this, but I don't think they do.



BbwCanaDomme -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/21/2009 11:43:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

We could only hope that Condi was now the President. My question is this. Why do they say he is the 1st. black president.? He is 1/2 black and 1/2 white.. Why isn't he white??? Why is he black??/


He's bi-racial, but he looks black. If you saw him on the street, and didn't know who he was, you would not assume he was white. Race is a largely social construct, because of the way he looks, he would be more likely to experience the same advantages/disadvantages as someone who was black, as opposed to having the same experiences as someone who is white. If that makes sense, I'm kinda medicated currently.



Hiskajirah -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/22/2009 12:00:30 AM)

Hello everyone

He is white as much as he is black and he is black as much as he is white. If he chose to call himself white, I would accept that, since he is. If he's content being black, I'm right there supporting him still. But society has done what Canna suggested, they see him as black. And it's true if we did not know who he was, we too may see him as a black man walking down the street. Most would not even second guess it. Many bi racial people are forced to deal with this everyday. In support of the black community and many of their history when it was all about the man, the man... the man.

President Obama is now.... the "man" himself.

~claps

Best wishes,
~Twinkle



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/22/2009 12:12:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hiskajirah

President Obama is now.... the "man" himself.


I thought he woudln't ascend to his throne on high until after his second term?



Hiskajirah -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/22/2009 12:18:34 AM)


Nah

It's a right away thing.



variation30 -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/22/2009 12:22:35 AM)

this is what I get for not attending my local cult meetings.

is the appropriate term obamessiah or are we going to go with dear leader?



Vendaval -> RE: Congrats to Obama, Second Black US President! (1/22/2009 12:23:14 AM)

Fast Reply -
 
The "one drop rule" has is unique to the U.S.A. and is different from how race and ethnicity are viewed in other countries. 

"Who is Black? One Nation's Definition"

by F. James Davis

"The nation's answer to the question 'Who is black?" has long been that a black is any person with any known African black ancestry. This definition reflects the long experience with slavery and later with Jim Crow segregation. In the South it became known as the "one-drop rule,'' meaning that a single drop of "black blood" makes a person a black. It is also known as the "one black ancestor rule," some courts have called it the "traceable amount rule," and anthropologists call it the "hypo-descent rule," meaning that racially mixed persons are assigned the status of the subordinate group. This definition emerged from the American South to become the nation's definition, generally accepted by whites and blacks. Blacks had no other choice."

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/jefferson/mixed/onedrop.html



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