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A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 9:06:13 AM

camille65

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From: Austin Texas
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I wasn't sure where to put this... so here it is in Off Topic. It is a fairly long and rambly post because I am finding my way as I write.

A couple of weeks ago I began treatment at a pain clinic. It is right now focusing on the emotional side of everything and it is rough going for me.

My therapist (with whom am I having communication problems, alas) wants me to write in great detail a place where I feel happy and safe. I went through different scenarios in my mind, an oasis. The deep woods. A beach, a warm pool etc.

None of them fit, none of them are a place where I can feel utterly relaxed and safe.

I am worried about revealing my safe place, I do not want this therapy to segue into the world of BDSM because I am positive that it will derail things. But... my safe place, my safe place is with him. It is effortless for me to call up the feeling of being held in his arms. The tickle of his chest hair against my face, his long strong arms that actually wrap around me. His warm hands petting me, soothing me, loving me. The sensation of his skin against mine. It isn't precisely a sexual thing (although it often is uhhuh yum

) and it really is the one place where I KNOW I am okay.

I guess I am trying to find a balance, or way to um.. sigh. Am I wrong to be witholding this part of me? Or am I right in thinking that it has no relation to the work I am doing with the pain clinic?

This is the first time I have seen a therapist (which is probably obvious lol) and I think I am asking if 'you' think that it would... oh crap I don't even have the right words.

Part of this section of therapy (I also am doing physical therapy with another part of the clinic) is trying to give me control over pain. To use other sensations to interrupt overwhelming pain and become a substitute for all the medication.

Many of you understand the link between chronic pain and BDSM, I have never discussed it with a stranger. Many of you also are more familiar with therapy than I am.

Ideas.. please?

Thank you.

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

Post #: 1

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 9:20:39 AM

Lockit

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From my own experience with the medical community and deciding to be open, I say... keep it tempered and mostly to yourself. You can mention a certain someone and go into more vanilla type situations without the details and an appearance of dependency some would try to see that wouldn't be healthy in their minds. But to tell too much... like I did... the paper trail follows and each doctor after list's whatever their take is on future documents. If they think you have a personality disorder... good luck getting the things you need even if you have medical reason to need them. They will be pushing the anti depressants at you like never before. They won't take you seriously.

I always thought it best to be honest and tell them the truth so that they would trust me. I found that the truth in the wrong hands means a long trail of trouble for myself as well as multiple letter's and evidence that they were wrong about me. Just be careful. I would rather talk to a friend and get their input than to try to get someone who may be looking for the weak spot and the drug addict. My medical and personal are now kept apart!

I hope you get what you need in care!

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Post #: 2

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 9:51:41 AM

camille65

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From: Austin Texas
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Lockit you hit right on it, I want to be honest and open but I think it would be detrimental. Especially since communication between us seems to be on slightly different levels. He is very heavy on the belief that my emotions control/cause my auto immune problems and that I can overcome it all by changing my emotions and my reactions to pain. It is... very frustrating. I feel like I am back in 1982, pre-acceptance of the medical reality concerning my problems.

Yet I want to try, I need to try.
Yet I have to hold things back while wanting really badly to be open.

I am not good at being guarded in this situation so it seems that I have to learn how to do that and also learn what he is trying to teach me.

Thank you for your response, I was hoping that you would catch this thread.

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~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

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Post #: 3

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 10:00:15 AM

Termyn8or

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Joined: 11/12/2005
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fr

Arms, touch, embrace, nothing kinky about that. No need to mention the whips and chains, but if that is where you feel safe, in his arms, say so. Nothing to be ashamed of.

Not that there is anyway, but you, like me, judge the audience. Some people are not ready for the "hairy" details. Don't let that stop you from getting real help. If that's where you feel safe, say so.

In fact, if a romantic interlude makes you dismiss the pain, concentrate on the moment, perhaps that is the key to subsequent happines, or at least better management of the pain.

I am still taken aback with the fact that your doc won't let you smoke weed. But I will not make a judgement, it might not be that he is persnickety about it, he may want to keep the results of the efficacy of certain treatments pure, without that outside influence. Personally I would take my business elsewhere, but that's just me. My decisions are not right for everybosdy, nor do I have any idea why he has this aversion for you smoking a bit of herb. But on the other hand I can't say that he has no valid reason, I would have to get inside his head for that, and that is quite impossible.

So the arms, chest hair and so forth, OK. The whips and chains, not OK. That's the way I see it.

T

(in reply to Lockit)

Post #: 4

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 10:02:46 AM

GreedyTop

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From: Savannah, GA
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*hugs* Camille.. can you try changing therapists to find one who you may be able to communicate better with?

Otherwise.. I'd say leave it with what you said about feeling safe in his arms... no need to go into any detail about bdsm or sexuality (if the therapist wants to delve into the sexual aspect, tell him you are not comfy discussing your sexual life with a stranger).

good luck, sweetheart!!

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Post #: 5

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 10:15:05 AM

Lockit

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The best thing I can tell you is to do some research before you go any further. Pain in the ass it is and a lot of hours seeking and putting together information that no one may look at... but it will secure your mind on this and will give you something to push into their face if they mess with you and most will.

Go find out anything you can that makes his point or proves it. Go and find the point you know is true, which is... you have a disorder that is real... that isn't caused by emotions in itself and how emotions might make it worse, but didn't cause it. I know I have info here that would help but my vista isn't working with the printer/scanner and I can't get it to you. A lot of it is older info found on the net that was very valuable to me and others when I had my web site. I spent years researching and a lot of my research was stolen, but I have some good bits.

Like with fibro... did you know that we have more nerve fiber endings than others? Ours multiply much faster and that says to me... although I could be wrong... but that we are more sensitive to all types of stimulation than others... which could feed into that newer disorder... that I can't remember the name of... but it is hyper sensitivity and maybe the hyper sexual stuff... but with my memory I may be way off here. I read stuff I have had for years and knew... and yet it is all new to me. So take parts of what I say with a grain of salt and check my facts. If I wasn't working on my own case here... I would be at my files for you in a heart beat, but I am without meds.. and life has become a hell and I just can't even think to do the medical thinking I must to get my meds!

It is like you have to re-invent the fibro proof every time you get a new doctor. One question saved me a lot of time and that is my asking each one what they thought about fibro. By their evasion or avoidance or answer, I had mine. I would in a heartbeat try to get someone else if the communication or their attitude was off and most especially if they do not listen to you and add that bonus of the neurotic woman syndrome! Part of the problem in switching doctors is they then claim you are doctor shopping for narcotic's. So we tend to stay to prove we aren't doing that or because of lack of funds.

While some are benefited with good thinking... less stress of course and some treatments, not all are and if you establish that.. if you argue with them even mildly, they will lable you a difficult patient. Which means you will do what they want you to so that they will hear you or believe you and that can be dangerous. If they do not have a good handle on the illness itself and blame it all on emotions, you need someone else! Grrrr I could write books on this stuff that I still remember... If I think of anything I know of that will help and I remember...lol... I will let you know.

Do try to look up the research that Ross Peroe funded with a university in TX that proved gulf war disease and fibromyalgia using a FMRI on the brain. Any of those words should take you to things that were done online. You still may have a lot of reading to get to it. I think they buried the results though.

Also try FibroHugs and other support groups for info on proving things. I am not current with it all as I have been researching cadasil more lately. There are two doctor's named Bennett that write about fibro. One is odd.. but the other is more realistic, or was. He recommends narcotics for some fibro patients and you might find him through that fibro magazine out of Orange County CA. They do tend to go with the positive thinking and the new meds which I wouldn't take if I was dying... but there is also good info even in some of the bad.

I hope some of this helps. You are always free to contact me if you need more info or for me to make something more clear... I think I live in a fog these days! Hang in there and good luck!

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 6

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 10:39:22 AM

camille65

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From: Austin Texas
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Heyas Termy. I don't really have much choice in who I see, there are limited options in regards to those that can treat me and most won't even freaking see me since I haven't health insurance. I can pay cash, I do pay cash, yet I am refused as a patient. So I have to 'abide by their rules' which means no weed. I can't even take the muscle relaxers or breakthru medication prescribed by my previous doctor. Huge huge problem.. but no choice. I was actually drug tested on my first visit! Very offensive to me, and of course I turned up positive for THC. If I turn up positive again then they can 'fire me as a patient' and I do NOT want that in my records. Ugh.

Yes he is not coming across as someone who would be okay with the hairy details (and btw, I do shave! heh).

There are only 2 therapists available at this pain clinic, and for all I know he is the better of the 2.

Greedy, thank you for the line of not being comfortable discussing certain aspects.

Hopefully I can find a way to write what he needs, and keep out the details that I need. The worry is, if I withhold then will it negatively impact the technique...?

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

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Post #: 7

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 12:28:56 PM

hizgeorgiapeach

Posts: 1672
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quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65

Lockit you hit right on it, I want to be honest and open but I think it would be detrimental. Especially since communication between us seems to be on slightly different levels. He is very heavy on the belief that my emotions control/cause my auto immune problems and that I can overcome it all by changing my emotions and my reactions to pain. It is... very frustrating. I feel like I am back in 1982, pre-acceptance of the medical reality concerning my problems.

My first suggestion - demand that the clinic give you the other therapist - cause that guy is a fucking moron. Remind him - And The Clinic In General - that you pay their salary, not the other way around, and therefore they are effectively your employees - not the other way around. They need you - the client - significantly more than you need them, on a sheer financial basis. No clients = no money = no jobs for those who work at clinic. Remind them about that whole "I pay YOU, not the other way around - so it's YOU who can be fired" thing the next time they make comments about drug testing you as well.

That "therapist" needs to pull his head out of his ass - perhaps you should offer him a gallon of vasoline, a native guide, and a map, and he'll get the hint.

_____________________________

Rhi
Light travels faster than sound, which is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
Essential Scentsations

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 8

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 12:45:34 PM

calamitysandra

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Do you really feel that this clinic, and this therapist in addition, are really the right place/person for you? From what you write, it does not seem so.
However, I see nothing kinky in the safe place you described.

I wish you good luck moving forward.

< Message edited by calamitysandra -- 2/24/2009 12:48:14 PM >

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Post #: 9

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 3:04:42 PM

Kalista07

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Damn Camille....As a person who lives with chronic pain and as a person who works and lives in the 'field' that You were describing....All i can say is i'm sorry.
This post seriously gives me rage!!! i was initially excited at Your post, mostly because my experience with pain clinics is they are just glorified opiate pushers....Sadly, it seems in Your case that they have once again bastardized a somewhat okay philosophy...It appears to me that Your therapist is one of cognitive behavioral techniques.. (CBT). The main premise with CBT is that it is actually your thoughts that lead to your feelings and if you can learn to identify your thoughts, you can learn to control your feelings. i can not for the love of me emotionally comprehend wtf he is even thinking saying your feelings are linked to your pain issues. Cogntively i think i can get it...
i would recommend being as honest as You are capable of being but remember that it is You who is in charge. There was nothing wrong or inappropriate with your description of your safe place. In fact, one of the things that HOPEFULLY this dumb ass will suggest as a result of this is massage...even if self induced...
I've had dumb ass horrible therapists...i have tried to work 'with' them...In the end i generally find that if our basic philosophies don't mix we are screwed....Sorry i could not be of more help...i'm blaming it on the illness. :P
Feel free to write me on the other side if i can be of any assistance what so ever.
In addition, it might be beneficial for you to find out what kind of therapist this man is...If his primary approach is CBT i have a book that i would recommend that might be very beneficial to you.....
Good luck,
Kali

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~~Sweedish Proverb

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Post #: 10

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 3:40:08 PM

camille65

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From: Austin Texas
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Bingo Kalista! He is all about CBT, and while I understand it.. right now I need my damn pain medication back to the proper level before I can even begin to concentrate on that. I am open to it (sort of, sometimes, depending) and he wants to try EMDR with me. He was a bit ticked off when I replied that the studies I have read about it show no tangible proof of effect.

It is hard for me to be aggressive, to stand up for myself. Most especially in a medical setting because I am literally scared of doctors and their ilk. I am trying though, and my owner is trying to keep me trying.

Just got home from physical therapy and am totally wiped out.. who knew standing/floating in a pool doing nothing was so tiring heh.

Thank you all, for your support and words of wisdom. I see the PA tomorrow morning at 8am (egads that is so early lol) and am really trying to work myself into someone who can calmly and clearly state what her body needs.

I swear I had NO idea that this was all going to be such an ordeal, this whole finding another doctor thing. Part of me wishes I'd never moved out of that frozen tundra known as Michigan.

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

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RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 3:58:34 PM

Crush

Posts: 1031
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Camille,
It is a shame you have to even have these questions when it comes to your care. I know too well chronic pain and I've a Spinal Cord Stimulator implanted that just "fuzzes" over the pain...doesn't remove or reduce it.

The only time my pain lessens is when I get into that pain subspace myself. Then those endorphins kick in and I'm in pain, but pain free. And it continues after the session as well.

Is there a possibility that your pain can be treated some other way, or is it some sort of systemic kind of pain?

Otherwise, I wish you well, even if you have to keep back a bit from your therapist. Not really the best, but perhaps you can fuzz the edges a bit and still find a way to control your pain.

_____________________________

"In religion and politics, people's beliefs and convictions are in almost every case gotten at second hand, and without examination." -- Mark Twain

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Post #: 12

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 4:06:53 PM

Lockit

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That is what I am going through Camille. I needed to move here for my family, but the move was the worst thing for me. I am back to being a drug addict without examination, without looking at my records and them actually lying to me with a witness there with me. I looked it up... MO, has a law that even if they think you are an addict, they cannot deny you pain medication. Yeah... right. Just reading my medical records would prove my situation as honest... So it takes months to get into the clinic I need and I get to go without for months! The way my blood pressure is spiking because of pain... and using NSAID's I am at risk because of the cadasil, but they won't even believe in the cadasil because it isn't taught here.

It is insane. I have heard of two people here locally who get medication when they don't need it and I can't get any to help me care for son and self. Moving can really suck!

I hope tomorrow's visit will help you in some way!

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!

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Post #: 13

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 4:50:04 PM

Vendaval

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camille,

I agree with the suggestions of finding another doctor and also keeping the kink out of the therpay sessions. Your records are supposed to be private and all that but I know from experience that people talk and gossip about patients. You can say that your partner is who makes you feel safe without saying anything about him being your Master or Dominant or being specific about anything.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE

http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 14

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 4:50:31 PM

camille65

Posts: 5746
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From: Austin Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crush

Is there a possibility that your pain can be treated some other way, or is it some sort of systemic kind of pain?

Otherwise, I wish you well, even if you have to keep back a bit from your therapist. Not really the best, but perhaps you can fuzz the edges a bit and still find a way to control your pain.

Systemic yes. Systemic Erthomyisis (surely spelled that wrong lol) Lupus, along with the fibromyalgia n tempromandibular joint disorder. Dang red lines say I am spelling all sorts wrong, sorry.

Glad glad that you've found something that works, tis hopeful reading, that others even if different type of problem are finding relief. In the end that is all that matters. Quality of life, eh.

Lockit, perhaps MO is worth looking into at a future time. Easy to say, move from here, but I moved here to be close to him. It would have to be a more desperate situation than this, to leave him. Yet this struggle wears upon me in all ways. Tonighe we organize list of questions and target items for tomorrow, including why no ordering of my old records. Is so very very offensive to me, to have drug screen before meeting doctor. Puts onus of proof to firmly upon me I feel. Ugh also feel that I am struggling with typing/thoughts. Will be intersting after consumption of this rum cocktail at my side...... *smiles*

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

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Post #: 15

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 4:51:49 PM

Vendaval

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Lockit,

Are there any other choices available to you at all in Missouri? Can you contact a university medical center or find a patient's advocate?
Are there legal ways of challenging this situation? The way they are treating you is barbaric.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE

http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to Lockit)

Post #: 16

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 5:10:23 PM

hizgeorgiapeach

Posts: 1672
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quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65

Systemic yes. Systemic Erthomyisis (surely spelled that wrong lol) Lupus, along with the fibromyalgia n tempromandibular joint disorder. Dang red lines say I am spelling all sorts wrong, sorry.

Systemic Lupus Erythmatosis - SLE - and Fibro are what I have. And what put mom in her grave, after years of having doctors tell her it was all in her head, that she was a hypochondriac, that she didn't Really need pain meds - she should just think positive and focus on something else. Yeah.... like it's Possible to "focus" on anything other than "gods, just let someone do a drive by shooting and have a random bullet hit me, but no one else in the area- at least it would hurt less."

Camille, I know better than you realize what you're going through with trying to convince the asshole "therapist" that the pain associated with Lupus and Fibro is real. I gave up attempting to convince any doctor other than the rhumy that treated mom, grandmother bat, and myself. We only quit seeing him because the insurance companies decided he was "to agressive" (read : to quick to believe that we weren't all simply drug addicts looking for a fix!) and refused to cover visits to him any longer. It drove him out of specializing in Lupus patients, and he turned strictly to Research in Oncology and Rhumatology.

BTW - yes, Crush - SM sessions, especially the long lasting, hard hitting, deep bruise inducing sort - actually do bring a bit of temporary relief for several others of us. Two hours or so under the flogger, inducing bruises from the top of the shoulders to the bottom of the buttcheeks kicks the lagging endorphines into overdrive, and I actually get 2 or 3 days that I'm pain free, can sleep soundly, and don't suffer from daily bouts of depression and anxiety. Oddly enough, my current therapist knows about my involvement in BDSM - and my reasons for continuing to be involved, even though I shun power exchange - and has discouraged me from giving it up as a hobby, since it helps. But I got Veeery lucky in finding a BDSM friendly shrink.

_____________________________

Rhi
Light travels faster than sound, which is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
Essential Scentsations

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 17

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 5:14:02 PM

Aynne88

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I have had SLE and Raynaud's since I was a teenager and I have heard of doctor's saying the pain from fibro was "imaginary" *as if, but never have I run across that with lupus. That is amazingly ignorant. I would find a new rheumatologist immediately.

_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)

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Post #: 18

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 5:21:00 PM

camille65

Posts: 5746
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Austin Texas
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Question just popped into my rum sodden brain.

Is is okay that this therapist guy, types every word I say then sends that on to the doctor? Because that is what he does, he told me I am free to read over what he types but I've been reluctant to do so.

While I am grateful beyond words that I can ask my questions here and get support I am equally unhappy to read of others problems in getting treated.

It simply is, wrong.

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

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Post #: 19

RE: A Question Of Balance And Discretion - 2/24/2009 5:29:38 PM

Aynne88

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God Camille, that would make me very uncomfortable. I have seen a therapist before too and to my knowledge he had no interaction at all with my Rh. Doc. Is this something that he "has" to do? I would ask him about that. It seems unneccesary and kind of overly intrusive.

_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 20

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