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RE: Titles - 8/15/2004 9:23:29 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

Hello,

I prefer to not be called Sir until I have earned it. I am rather informal about such things.

However, if somebody truly feels they should want to / should call me Sir I go with it.

I generally respond to being called Madam by pointing out it is a KILT and not a dress.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to theroebabe)

Post #: 21

RE: Titles - 8/15/2004 9:27:18 PM

perverseangelic

Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline

There is someone I have occational contact with who attempts to -insist- that I call him "Sir" and treat him with "more respect" (in this context it means I should close all other chat windows and talk only to him). This is not something I will do unless that person has been given such authority by my parnter. He's the only one who I call by a title (and even then only occationally as it's not something he prefers).

The person in question got quite irate the first time I told him I wouldn't treat him any differently than I treat any of my online friends. However he's continued to talk to me on a fairly regular basis. I continue to tell him I won't defer to him or call him "Sir" and he continues to hint that I should. Since he hasn't done anything offensive, I see no reason to block him, however I keep wondering why he talks to me if I'm not "really as submissive as [I] should be"

So, in answer to your question Irishlass, if anyone asks me, online, to call them by a title I politely tell them that to do so would be to show disrespect to my partner and that I cannot do that. If they insist, I stay firm. If they get rude or abusive, I stop talking to them. If they insult me, I post their conversations (with the names taken off) in my collarme journal, and feel better.

(no, I never, ever, ever, ever post names in my journal. I simply put up conversations that have made me angry. It's a coping mechanism)

_____________________________

~in the begining it is always dark~

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 22

RE: Titles - 8/15/2004 11:33:03 PM

musicman

Posts: 1
Joined: 5/26/2004
From: North Central Florida
Status: offline

I have to agree with most of the doms here...I have never asked anyone to call me "Sir."

There often comes a time when a partner will do so of her own free will - that is an important decision that she should make for herself. It is so much more meaningful that way!

On a lighter note, I remember working as a "bag boy" in a local supermarket while in high school...about half the time when I called someone Sir or Ma'am they would get indignant, responding how "I'm not old enough to be a Ma'am" etc. etc. I would simply smile and apologize, knowing even then that the honorific has little to do with age and much more to do with respect. Ignorance and vanity rules!

Anytime someone wants to call me Sir, from a partner to a clerk, it is OK by me.

_____________________________

"Don't dream it...BE IT!" -RPHS

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 23

RE: Titles - 8/15/2004 11:39:06 PM

lrishlass

Posts: 20
Joined: 3/25/2004
Status: offline

Thank you all for the replies. :)

I just read through them all and wanted to post my own feelings on the topic.

I am not under contract with anyone at this time and the Dom in question and i began to chat on IM the other morning. We both seemed to have similar backgrounds and he'd indicated a desire to discuss that. I was interested in doing so, thus we added each other to our buddy lists.

Within several minutes, he was requesting that i follow "protocol in this lifestyle we'd chosen" and i immediately guessed what was coming next. He did indeed want me to address him as "Sir" and i had to tell him that this made me quite uncomfortable. We went back and forth a bit and i had to log off but he wanted to IM me later that evening. Whether it was because i wouldnt call him Sir or not, i've not heard from him since.....Oh well, i've no idea if it was my lack of using the title, or not but i will stick to my guns on this one.

Ironically, i do find myself using the term out in the world at large, for instance, if a man holds open a door for me, i always say "thank you Sir". I was brought up this way. It's only when someone insists, right off the bat, that i call him by a title, that i find myself reluctant to do so. There are two dominants that i've had the pleasure of getting to know that i do call Sir.........but neither of them have ever once even asked me to do so, it was over time and in getting to know and respect them that i felt it appropriate and was quite honored even, to address them as such.

Once again, I thank everyone for their thoughtful responses.........my apologies in advance if i rambled on here, am sporting a horrific toothache and have been unable to sleep for what seems like days!

_____________________________

humility is not thinking less of yourself......it is thinking of yourself less

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 24

RE: Titles - 8/15/2004 11:47:40 PM

lrishlass

Posts: 20
Joined: 3/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: musicman

I have to agree with most of the doms here...I have never asked anyone to call me "Sir."

There often comes a time when a partner will do so of her own free will - that is an important decision that she should make for herself. It is so much more meaningful that way!

On a lighter note, I remember working as a "bag boy" in a local supermarket while in high school...about half the time when I called someone Sir or Ma'am they would get indignant, responding how "I'm not old enough to be a Ma'am" etc. etc. I would simply smile and apologize, knowing even then that the honorific has little to do with age and much more to do with respect. Ignorance and vanity rules!

Anytime someone wants to call me Sir, from a partner to a clerk, it is OK by me.

~smiles~ i just read yours, after i posted mine........i wanted to add a funny little story.......

I have a very deep voice and for years now have been called "Sir" on the phone more times than i can count!

I was corresponding with someone on yahoo awhile back and he wanted to call me. I forgot to "warn" him in advance about my voice and when I answered, he hung up! I got an email asking me why a man had answered my phone and I replied "LOL" that it was me!

I was shocked to get back an email that stated..........."You are a man! Do not ever contact me again, or I will report you immediately!!!!" I tried several times, without much luck, to convince him that i was indeed NOT a man but until i was able to send him proof, in the form of a pic, he would not believe me. Eventually, I received an email apologizing and once I got that, I removed him from my buddy list. If I have to work that hard to convince someone that I'm being honest, then I don't feel theyre anyone I'd want to become involved with.....

_____________________________

humility is not thinking less of yourself......it is thinking of yourself less

(in reply to musicman)

Post #: 25

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 12:26:44 AM

TheLadyAlisad

Posts: 15
Joined: 8/15/2004
Status: offline

[color=#336633]As for Me, My name really is Alisad, I use the term Lady because I am a Lady. Most male sub/slaves call me Ma'am by their choice, I never demand to be called anything but Alisad. However if the sub/slave proves to be worth my time, I will ask them to switch to Lady instead of Ma'am, to me Ma'am is what I used to call the old ladies in the park.

(in reply to theroebabe)

Post #: 26

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 12:29:50 AM

darchart

Posts: 35
Joined: 7/20/2004
Status: offline

I was raised in the south and while I do tend to refer to anyone I do not know well as Sir or Ma'am, its is a product of upbringing more than respect.

When I write letters to my nephew I adress them to Master TJ, as he is not a Mister yet.

I can tell you with all honesty I have refered to people as Sir and Ma'am that insisted on it not out of respect but simply because its easy to type than Masterigotmynamelastsonothingelsewasleft.

(in reply to lrishlass)

Post #: 27

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 2:06:32 AM

Majiktrixs

Posts: 13
Joined: 7/20/2004
Status: offline

It depends on if it is deserving that i should call One by their chosen title, its a matter of respect for me to use it.
A little while ago at a BBQ party i was introduced to a Dom as Steven... i presented myself with humble pride and introduced myself using both life-style name and real name. There were about 15 lifestylers attending this get together........ while sitting at the table out of nowhere Steven demanded to see my tattoos which are on my top left arm, His words were in a nasty tone.."Turn around and show me the tattoos"...Ummmmmmmmm i did thinkz..... well i was polite in my answer. 1st of all i asked Him if it was a life-style party or a party with life-stylers attending, He answered attending... on that note i told Him to "Get f****d"........ my tattoos are sacred. He replied "be like that then"....later W/we danced, He took lead... and i called Him Sir for the rest of the evening.
Just a *smile can be the deserving quality that i show my respect......

Now i am the property of Master Majik who is Pro Dom........ i call Him Dom 1, unless i have my collar on then its Sir or Master depending on His mood lol.......... We both agree it is easier for me to work out the words to say "yes Sir" than "yes Master" when im babbling and in space *smiles and He is asking me complicated questions like "Are U ok my subby 1"......
If i was to say to Him... "my darling Master" He would reply "What do ya want?"........ Calling my darling Dom 1 'Master' without my collar on is a definate plan for begging for my own way.......... Crickey i hope He dunna read this... an if Ya do Dom 1.............. Crikey i adore You my Majik One

(in reply to theroebabe)

Post #: 28

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 2:26:53 AM

temptation

Posts: 111
Joined: 2/20/2004
From: heaven
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lrishlass

From the very beginning, the Dom requests that the sub refer to Him as "Sir" and in fact seems to feel quite strongly about it.

Subs, how would you respond?

If from the beginning, they required this from me..

theres a good chance I would just ignore them, or walk away. To assume that everyone else is on the same page as you when looking for a relationship, or just in general can often come off as pretty rude..

I dunno

(in reply to lrishlass)

Post #: 29

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 7:56:16 AM

happypervert

Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline

quote:

I continue to tell him I won't defer to him or call him "Sir" and he continues to hint that I should. Since he hasn't done anything offensive, I see no reason to block him, however I keep wondering why he talks to me if I'm not "really as submissive as should be"

He keeps talking to you in the hopes that one day his domly powers will overwhelm you and you will surrender your will to him by calling him "Sir". If you were actually dating, this would be like trying to into your pants.

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 30

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 8:03:27 AM

perverseangelic

Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert

quote:

I continue to tell him I won't defer to him or call him "Sir" and he continues to hint that I should. Since he hasn't done anything offensive, I see no reason to block him, however I keep wondering why he talks to me if I'm not "really as submissive as should be"
He keeps talking to you in the hopes that one day his domly powers will overwhelm you and you will surrender your will to him by calling him "Sir". If you were actually dating, this would be like trying to into your pants.

I kinda figured as much. It's never gonna happen, but it's interesting to observe at least ;)

_____________________________

~in the begining it is always dark~

(in reply to happypervert)

Post #: 31

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 10:58:05 AM

afmvdp

Posts: 494
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline

Interesting, I normally have the opposite problem. Anyway. If they require the title without living it first they are to be respected the same way you would consider a random person who would call themselves a doctor or a lawyer without having the proper eductation behind them first. Sure they could practice it even, but it doesn't make them legal till it's legal.

I've never really understood the need for superlatives like that, especially before the horse is even out of the gate. My immediate guess would be online scenester.

(in reply to lrishlass)

Post #: 32

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 1:03:28 PM

feline

Posts: 1101
Joined: 2/23/2004
From: CA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: darchart

I was raised in the south and while I do tend to refer to anyone I do not know well as Sir or Ma'am, its is a product of upbringing more than respect.

I wasn't raised in the south, but I was raised to respect my elders. And considering I work with the elderly I tend to use Sir & Ma'am all the time.

quote:

When I write letters to my nephew I adress them to Master TJ, as he is not a Mister yet.

As for using the title Master. That one I have problems with. LOL Simply because everytime I use it the image of "I dream of jeanie" pops into my head. And I usually start giggling.

quote:

I can tell you with all honesty I have refered to people as Sir and Ma'am that insisted on it not out of respect but simply because its easy to type than Masterigotmynamelastsonothingelsewasleft.

Totally agree with this one. Sometimes it's just easier.

Take care,

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Variety is the soul of pleasure.
~Aphra Behn~

(in reply to darchart)

Post #: 33

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 1:06:32 PM

yoursMaam

Posts: 48
Joined: 7/29/2004
Status: offline

Dear Irishlass,
i find that Sir, Ma'am, Mistress, Master, Mes Dames, Mes Patrons, or whatever title tends to have as much meaning as the person saying it allows it to have. i find that they can be as soothing as arriving at the door with a box of chocolates and a long stemmed rose and is more endearing than "Hey You."
i tend to find that both Dom(me)s and subs tended to be much more responsive when addressed by the name they choose. Would you prefer irishlass or celticcolleen, it works out about the same, but you have made your choice, and who am i to change it?

(in reply to lrishlass)

Post #: 34

RE: Titles - 8/16/2004 7:55:36 PM

compes

Posts: 92
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: feline
As for using the title Master. That one I have problems with. LOL Simply because everytime I use it the image of "I dream of jeanie" pops into my head. And I usually start giggling.

That was actually my first objection to being called "Master" - because of the TV show.

<<<< scratches head

Maybe I'd feel better about it if the submissive wore the jeanie costume from the show??

Compes

(in reply to feline)

Post #: 35

RE: Titles - 8/17/2004 5:15:36 AM

theroebabe

Posts: 3155
Joined: 7/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: compes

quote:

ORIGINAL: feline
As for using the title Master. That one I have problems with. LOL Simply because everytime I use it the image of "I dream of jeanie" pops into my head. And I usually start giggling.

That was actually my first objection to being called "Master" - because of the TV show.

<<<< scratches head

Maybe I'd feel better about it if the submissive wore the jeanie costume from the show??

Compes

Well the when i was collared the first thing i would think was the show! i would laugh, it stopped being funny if i got a really hard swat for it! But i got past it it makes me smile now to think of the show. And some day when i am collared again, i am hoping it won't pop up again!

Roe

_____________________________

Roe

People always ask me why I do these things . . .
It's because I can!

(in reply to compes)

Post #: 36

RE: Titles - 8/17/2004 9:04:35 AM

snowleopard

Posts: 18
Joined: 8/16/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

The only person I will address as Master is the one to whom I have submitted, and no other. Until such time as there is a way to show the same degree of respect for a submissive as there is to dominants with these titles then this is one lady who won't use them. For the same reason I don't use a lower case in my screen name Rowena, thats the correct gramatical and respectful way of addressing me, to use a lowercase implies I am somehow deemed not worthy of a capital letter because of some weird "rank" thing. When you are verbally speaking to me just how do you use a lowercase "r"? Answer, you can't, so why do people do so online? yet I have lost count of the online chatrooms I have been booted from merely for daring to spell my name correctly. Similarily I often get called Ma'am or Mistress purely because of that capital letter without anyone even taking the time or trouble to actually ask me what my orentation is.

I use sir very rarely indeed, in fact I can think of perhaps only a handful of occassions where thats ever passed my lips even to my own master, does that mean I disrespect him? Far from it. I'm Welsh I didn't really grow up in a culture where sir or ma'am or master or mistress denoted respect, on the contrary it was frequently spoken with a sneer and eye roll. It very much signifys rank, blue blood, the gentry etc. I am a submissive through informed choice, I am not some lesser being, my choices have equal right to be respected as anyone reguardless of whether they be top, bottom, sub, dom or switch. Address me as subby or girl without being the man who's collar I wear and you will learn real fast what I think of that and of you. Demand I show you respect merely because you can use a shift key on a keyboard? Riiiiiightttttttt.

Offline I will use someones "title" if making introductions, I will ask for permission to use their christian name which I would do reguardless of whether they were lifestyle or not, and if I was unsure of that permission or was told no thereafter I would simply address them by their initials, MA, SD, etc etc.

_____________________________

~submission is something inside you, not something you convince others of by faking an attitude~
Rowenas Ramblings
Snow Time Forums

(in reply to theroebabe)

Post #: 37

RE: Titles - 8/17/2004 9:17:03 AM

theroebabe

Posts: 3155
Joined: 7/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: snowleopard

The only person I will address as Master is the one to whom I have submitted, and no other. Until such time as there is a way to show the same degree of respect for a submissive as there is to dominants with these titles then this is one lady who won't use them. For the same reason I don't use a lower case in my screen name Rowena, thats the correct gramatical and respectful way of addressing me, to use a lowercase implies I am somehow deemed not worthy of a capital letter because of some weird "rank" thing. When you are verbally speaking to me just how do you use a lowercase "r"? Answer, you can't, so why do people do so online? yet I have lost count of the online chatrooms I have been booted from merely for daring to spell my name correctly. Similarily I often get called Ma'am or Mistress purely because of that capital letter without anyone even taking the time or trouble to actually ask me what my orentation is.

I use sir very rarely indeed, in fact I can think of perhaps only a handful of occassions where thats ever passed my lips even to my own master, does that mean I disrespect him? Far from it. I'm Welsh I didn't really grow up in a culture where sir or ma'am or master or mistress denoted respect, on the contrary it was frequently spoken with a sneer and eye roll. It very much signifys rank, blue blood, the gentry etc. I am a submissive through informed choice, I am not some lesser being, my choices have equal right to be respected as anyone reguardless of whether they be top, bottom, sub, dom or switch. Address me as subby or girl without being the man who's collar I wear and you will learn real fast what I think of that and of you. Demand I show you respect merely because you can use a shift key on a keyboard? Riiiiiightttttttt.

Offline I will use someones "title" if making introductions, I will ask for permission to use their christian name which I would do reguardless of whether they were lifestyle or not, and if I was unsure of that permission or was told no thereafter I would simply address them by their initials, MA, SD, etc etc.

Snowleopard,

WHAT you said!! it was the best and i agree with it! the local groups here are so informal and that is what i am used to, so unless my dom wanted this from me for an occasional basis with a higher level of protocol it is not somethibg i would intentionally seek out. Hoever Master is the name i would address someone who wanted me to call him that and second i was collared to and submitting to.

Roe

_____________________________

Roe

People always ask me why I do these things . . .
It's because I can!

(in reply to snowleopard)

Post #: 38

RE: Titles - 8/17/2004 3:56:02 PM

WayHome

Posts: 237
Joined: 8/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: snowleopard

For the same reason I don't use a lower case in my screen name Rowena, thats the correct gramatical and respectful way of addressing me, to use a lowercase implies I am somehow deemed not worthy of a capital letter because of some weird "rank" thing. When you are verbally speaking to me just how do you use a lowercase "r"? Answer, you can't, so why do people do so online?.

I am not a proponent of the capitalization/lowercase thing but I do understand why it exists. I know that, "so why do people do so online?" was a rhetorical question but I am going to use this opportunity to explain anyway.

There is a lot that you cannot do online. See the person you are speaking to for one. Use body language or facial expressions for another. They can't even remember you by your appearance like in the reasl world but must depend only on your screen name for identification.

Also, you meet a LOT of people online very quickly and asking each one a ton of questions that you might not remember the answers to anyway since odds are that you will never see them again is less than ideal.

For all of these reasons, internet culure (BDSM and otherwise) has developed a lot of tools to speed up communication and identification. Smilies are a good example. Acronyms are another. People even use fonts and colors to help distinguish themselves.

Within the online scene, another one of these tools is the use of capitalization. It makes identification easy and fast and prevents people from constantly having to ask other people's disposition so that they can address them appropriately. In various chat areas it is an important tool for the smooth, efficient, and user-friendly operation of the conversations.

It can also be something else. People use it to express their submission, like not using personal pronouns to refer to themselves. People use capitals for themselves outside of normal English grammar to express just the opposite. This might be something you are comfotable with or not. If it is important to you not to be percieved as "submitting" to everyone you meet online who has a capital letter, then I support your decision not to refer to yourself in the lower case. On the other hand, I also support the choice of moderators to boot and ban you from their discussions for failing to follow this protocol. I'm hoping this explanation can help you to also accept their choices in this regard. I hope it will help you to be more understanding the next time someone makes the very reasonable assumption that you are portraying yourself as dominant by using capitals in your name and addresses you accordingly.

< Message edited by WayHome -- 8/17/2004 4:01:10 PM >

(in reply to snowleopard)

Post #: 39

RE: Titles - 8/18/2004 1:54:09 AM

snowleopard

Posts: 18
Joined: 8/16/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome

I am not a proponent of the capitalization/lowercase thing but I do understand why it exists. I know that, "so why do people do so online?" was a rhetorical question but I am going to use this opportunity to explain anyway.

WayHome I am fully aware why it's done online, I have been online for 7 years interacting in various chatrooms and message boards, it wasn't a rhetorical question at all. I was making the point that in r/t if you and I met neither you nor I would have a capital or lowercase letter emblazened on our forehead, instead we would interact and yes even ASK questions to find out more about each other. WHY is it so important to know what my orientation is BEFORE I am deemed worthy of interacting with? THAT is what annoys me about much of the online scene. I am a submissive to the man who's collar I wear, other than that I am a living breathing unique and individual person. My desire to submit to someone isn't the ONLY thing which defines me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
There is a lot that you cannot do online. See the person you are speaking to for one. Use body language or facial expressions for another. They can't even remember you by your appearance like in the reasl world but must depend only on your screen name for identification.

What difference does whether it is capped or not have on their ability to remember who I am?

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
Also, you meet a LOT of people online very quickly and asking each one a ton of questions that you might not remember the answers to anyway since odds are that you will never see them again is less than ideal.

Unless you are trolling for cybersex what need is there for a ton of questions in the first place unless the intent is to get to know someone? If that is the case then whether that person has a cap in their name or not is immaterial, you merely cut out ONE question, and that is whether they consider themselves dom or sub.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
For all of these reasons, internet culure (BDSM and otherwise) has developed a lot of tools to speed up communication and identification. Smilies are a good example. Acronyms are another. People even use fonts and colors to help distinguish themselves.

Indeed it has and that is not always a good thing, particularily when it comes to BDSM. Speed things up? Uhhhh since when has that been a good idea? Again the only thing thats "speeded up" is the labeling of someone by their orentation, nothing more.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
Within the online scene, another one of these tools is the use of capitalization. It makes identification easy and fast and prevents people from constantly having to ask other people's disposition so that they can address them appropriately. In various chat areas it is an important tool for the smooth, efficient, and user-friendly operation of the conversations.

Address them "appropriately"? Care to eloborate on what you mean by this?

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
It can also be something else. People use it to express their submission, like not using personal pronouns to refer to themselves. People use capitals for themselves outside of normal English grammar to express just the opposite. This might be something you are comfotable with or not. If it is important to you not to be percieved as "submitting" to everyone you meet online who has a capital letter, then I support your decision not to refer to yourself in the lower case.

It appears you may have entirely missed my point. Why SHOULD a lowercase letter signify submission at ALL? Let alone to any Tom Dick or Harry who can use a shift key. Why are only online dominants deemed "worthy" of a capital letter? In fact lets go a little deeper shall we? Why should the mere fact that I am a submissive imply in anyway that I would need to stand up for my rights not to be assumed willing to submit to anyone calling themselves dominant? You support my decision? Well thanks ever so... however, I shouldn't require any "support" from anyone dom or sub vanilla or lifestyle for using the correct spelling of my name or for not wanting to be defined or judged on one aspect of who I am.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
On the other hand, I also support the choice of moderators to boot and ban you from their discussions for failing to follow this protocol. I'm hoping this explanation can help you to also accept their choices in this regard.

Where did I say that I didn't support their right to boot me? Frankly I use it as a litmus test, if I am booted or asked to change the way my name is written and no discussion of this is allowed, then that is not a place I would be comfortable in anyway.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WayHome
I hope it will help you to be more understanding the next time someone makes the very reasonable assumption that you are portraying yourself as dominant by using capitals in your name and addresses you accordingly.

You know I tried very hard to overlook the somewhat patronising tone of your entire post, it does however seem to illustrate perfectly the very points I am making. Did you even take the time to read my profile? Visit my site? Find out anything more about me and my experiences online and offline before you chose to answer my post and make such sweeping assumptions?

What makes you assume that I am not understanding of people who address me as a dominant? What leads you to assume that when spoken to in chatrooms and asked to change that I don't very reasonably take the time to explain why I won't be changing it? In fact what led you to presume I know nothing about online protocol? Had you actually avoided the shortcuts you would have seen many articles on my site addressing this topic of online protocols in some depth.

That is one of the reasons why I do feel strongly about it the net encourages people to take shortcuts, speed things up, make it "easier" and that leads to laziness. A great deal of what is good about the lifestyle is the fact that we should take the time to actually get to know people and not rush into labling them and defining them as either one thing or another. I'm a sub who won't lowercase her name, whatelse do you know about me?

_____________________________

~submission is something inside you, not something you convince others of by faking an attitude~
Rowenas Ramblings
Snow Time Forums

(in reply to WayHome)

Post #: 40

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