GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (Full Version)

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Cagey18 -> GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 8:48:30 AM)

Just saw these headlines on politicalwire.com:

GOP Hits All Time Lows
Washington Monthly points out that the polls show the favorability of the Republican party hitting new all time lows.

NYT/CBS Poll: "While Republicans have steadily increased their criticism of Mr. Obama, particularly on the budget deficit, the poll found that the Republican Party is viewed favorably by only 28% of those polled, the lowest rating ever in a New York Times/CBS News poll. In contrast, 57% said that they had a favorable view of the Democratic Party."

WSJ/NBC poll: "25% hold a favorable view of the Republican Party, which is an all-time low for it in the poll. 45% hold a favorable view of the Democratic Party."

Obama Approval Remains High
A new Pew Research survey finds a solid majority of Americans (61%) continue to approve of President Obama's job performance, "although they express mixed views of several of his policies."

"An important positive sign for Obama is the public's continued optimism that his policies will improve the economy -- fully 65% express this view. A smaller majority (55%) is optimistic Obama will reduce the budget deficit over the long-term. Nonetheless, Obama's job approval on the economy has declined from 60% in April to 52% currently."

"The slippage in the president's economic ratings appears unrelated to the public's assessments of his administration's impact on current economic conditions... Instead, it may have more to do with his relatively poor ratings for handling the problems of troubled automakers General Motors and Chrysler."
http://politicalwire.com/archives/2009/06/18/obama_approval_remains_high.html




OrionTheWolf -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 10:07:42 AM)

I will comment later, like next summer. How many of the polls do we have to discuss before people realize:

1) The country is not run via polls
2) Most presidents enjoy high poll numbers their first year
3) The GOP is not the conservative party. They had power (not Bush) to make changes for a long time, and they lied. The GOP needs to go, and be replaced by a real Conservative party, or maybe a Centrist/Mod Party.
4) Making unpopular decisions, that wind up being good for the country is one of the best tests of a good leader. This means you can be a good leader and the polls will not reflect this.
5) The media continues to lead people around by the nose with sculpted news stories and polls.



servantforuse -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 10:12:38 AM)

Another 'unbiased' poll from the New York Times. Good grief. I'm with Orion. Lets wait another 6 months or so. Things will certainly change when health care starts to get taken over by the Feds..The saying Nothing is free will hit home



Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 11:03:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

I will comment later, like next summer. How many of the polls do we have to discuss before people realize:

1) The country is not run via polls

No one is claiming such.  Polls are, however, a measure of public opinion.  And the public's opinion of the GOP is dismal.

quote:


2) Most presidents enjoy high poll numbers their first year

How many of these high poll number Presidents faced an staggering economic crisis and the U.S. so unpopular worldwide?

quote:


3) The GOP is not the conservative party. They had power (not Bush) to make changes for a long time, and they lied. The GOP needs to go, and be replaced by a real Conservative party, or maybe a Centrist/Mod Party.

Actually the GOP is more conservative than ever.  Moving to the right proved disastrous for them.

quote:


5) The media continues to lead people around by the nose with sculpted news stories and polls.

And you of course have proof that the above polls are "sculpted", yes?




Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 11:05:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Another 'unbiased' poll from the New York Times.

And you of course can show the bias in this poll, yes?

(newsflash:  actually it's NYTimes and CBS and Wall Street Journal and NBC and Pew Research...)



rulemylife -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 12:28:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Another 'unbiased' poll from the New York Times. Good grief. I'm with Orion. Lets wait another 6 months or so. Things will certainly change when health care starts to get taken over by the Feds..The saying Nothing is free will hit home


Yes definitely, good grief. 

We'll have to wait at least another six months for you to be able to prove he is the failure you have been labeling him as since before he was elected, since things don't seem to be following your predictions so far.

But hey, you have to hold on to your dreams.




pahunkboy -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 2:33:42 PM)

bring Bush back.  At least he had balls.



OrionTheWolf -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 2:42:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cagey18

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

I will comment later, like next summer. How many of the polls do we have to discuss before people realize:

1) The country is not run via polls

No one is claiming such.  Polls are, however, a measure of public opinion.  And the public's opinion of the GOP is dismal.


As it should be, and has nothing to do with Bush. It should have to do with the broken "Contract with America" and how the GOP abandoned their supposed core priciples.

quote:


quote:


2) Most presidents enjoy high poll numbers their first year

How many of these high poll number Presidents faced an staggering economic crisis and the U.S. so unpopular worldwide?


Uhhh. Do your own research. Popularity is based upon what at the moment? It is like the first 90 days of a new employee, nothing to base performance on yet. Some things he has done I like and some things I do not like. There has not been much that has shown me a lot of "change" though. I am glad people feel good, now they need to take that feel good and do what?

quote:


quote:


3) The GOP is not the conservative party. They had power (not Bush) to make changes for a long time, and they lied. The GOP needs to go, and be replaced by a real Conservative party, or maybe a Centrist/Mod Party.

Actually the GOP is more conservative than ever.  Moving to the right proved disastrous for them.


Actually the GOP does not know what in the hell it is now. This is why if you were to take a poll, you would find many former Republicans, such as myself. They were hijacked many years ago by the Non-conservatives (Neo-cons).

quote:


quote:


5) The media continues to lead people around by the nose with sculpted news stories and polls.

And you of course have proof that the above polls are "sculpted", yes?




Sculptured news stories yeah. Polls are easy to sculpt, and assisted in creating one for a marketing campaign at a corp I used to work with. There are many things you can do to skew any poll, such as waiting until certain news stories run in succession before launching the poll to how the questions are asked. I look at polls like statistics, to paraphrase "there are lies, there are damn lies, and then there are polls and statistics".

I will wait a year or so, and then look at poll numbers to see how things are going. Hopefully within a few years, GOP will be gone and replaced by something else that can balance out the ideals of the Democrats. The scales swinging back and forth so drastically is not good for the nation, and instead we need engaged and workable oppositions to ideas.



awmslave -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 3:52:10 PM)

Obama is very charming and nice personality. What result would you expect from ignorant celebrity worship crowd? If one takes serious look at Obama-Summers-Geithner economics s/he would get very worried.



Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 4:21:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cagey18
And the public's opinion of the GOP is dismal.

As it should be, and has nothing to do with Bush. It should have to do with the broken "Contract with America" and how the GOP abandoned their supposed core priciples.

And the fact that the GOP is devoid of ideas.  Instead all they can do is complain about Obama, while offering nothing of substance as an alternative.


quote:


quote:


quote:


3) The GOP is not the conservative party. They had power (not Bush) to make changes for a long time, and they lied. The GOP needs to go, and be replaced by a real Conservative party, or maybe a Centrist/Mod Party.

Actually the GOP is more conservative than ever.  Moving to the right proved disastrous for them.

Actually the GOP does not know what in the hell it is now. This is why if you were to take a poll, you would find many former Republicans, such as myself. They were hijacked many years ago by the Non-conservatives (Neo-cons).

Actually, as I stated, they are more conservative than ever.  Most of the moderate Republicans resigned or got replaced by Democrats; what remains is the hardcore right.


quote:


quote:


quote:


5) The media continues to lead people around by the nose with sculpted news stories and polls.

And you of course have proof that the above polls are "sculpted", yes?

Sculptured news stories yeah. Polls are easy to sculpt, and assisted in creating one for a marketing campaign at a corp I used to work with.

Proof, not "what could have been" or "what would be easy to do."  Any idiot can speculate.




Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 4:24:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Another 'unbiased' poll from the New York Times. Good grief. I'm with Orion. Lets wait another 6 months or so. Things will certainly change when health care starts to get taken over by the Feds..The saying Nothing is free will hit home


Yes definitely, good grief. 

We'll have to wait at least another six months for you to be able to prove he is the failure you have been labeling him as since before he was elected, since things don't seem to be following your predictions so far.

But hey, you have to hold on to your dreams.



And if President Obama's polls are still up, they'll be saying "well it's only been a year, we need to wait until the middle of his term for a meaningful assessment..."
[8|]




Sanity -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 5:06:23 PM)


Obama's job approval is trending downwards.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/121028/Obama-Job-Approval-Slips-58-First-Time.aspx



OrionTheWolf -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 5:14:35 PM)

I guess you will have to wait a year, as any idiot can speculate ;).

Personally the 15 month point is where I will take a long look at things. It should be enough time for the emergency programs to start having some effect, if they work. It is enough time for other things to transpire that will test him. It is enough time to look at pattern decisions. It is enough time to make a more informed opinion.

You see I hope he is successful in many things. I want the economy to get better, as the welfare of my family and friends rely upon that. I want my country more secure and less worried about attacks on US Citizens, or being drug into another war. I want to see things stabilize with our foreign affairs.

I hope each President that takes office will be the best President yet, regardless of political party. This is the difference between those that really want to see America succeed, and don't care about touting some idealogical or party line.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cagey18

And if President Obama's polls are still up, they'll be saying "well it's only been a year, we need to wait until the middle of his term for a meaningful assessment..."
[8|]





Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 6:35:41 PM)

Found that proof for your claim of "sculpted" polls yet?




Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 6:37:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Obama's job approval is trending downwards.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/121028/Obama-Job-Approval-Slips-58-First-Time.aspx

So in your world, one data point constitutes a "trend" then?

[8|]




OrionTheWolf -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 6:49:59 PM)

Is that like a neener, neener? I stated an opinion, like you so often do. The opinion is based upon reading analysis of past polls, you can look it up if you wish.

Arguing in this forum is just a form of entertainment to you, isn't it? I suppose on the forums and email lists that I Mod we have a much stricter term for that.

So am I the ping and your the pong, or the other way around? Your serve?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cagey18

Found that proof for your claim of "sculpted" polls yet?





Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 6:55:00 PM)

Uh, no, a claim that the media is "sculpting" polls isn't an "opinion", it's a claim.  One you have yet to back up.



OrionTheWolf -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 6:56:31 PM)

~FR~

Within 5 minutes I came up with this:

" The latest New York Times/CBS News poll is based on telephone interviews conducted June 12 through June 16 with 895 adults throughout the United States. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/18/us/politics/18mbox.html?_r=1

"Reasons to be Skeptical

We doubt that this study will be the last word on this subject, and we think the results of the Pew study include some good reasons to be somewhat skeptical of polling results in general. For one thing, the study illustrates that cell-only users tend to be very different from the landline sample. In the Pew study, the cell-only users tended to be:

  • Young: 46 percent of the cell-only sample was in the 18 to 29 age group, compared with 12 percent for landline users.


  • Male: Men made up 61 percent of the cell-only sample but only 48 percent of the landline sample.


  • Less White: 19 percent of the cell-only sample was black, versus 11 percent for the landline sample. Asians made up 5 percent of the cell-only sample, versus 1 percent of the landline sample.


  • More Hispanic: Hispanics (who can be of any race) were 13 percent of the cell-only sample compared with 6 percent of the landline sample. "
 
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/are_polls_skewed_because_many_people_only.html
 
If I had more inclination, I could show how polls can be skewed, knowingly and unknowingly. To believe otherwise is to either be purposefully obtuse or naive.



OrionTheWolf -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 6:58:12 PM)

I used the word sculpting to describe their new stories. Skewed would be a word I would use for polls, though with enough effort you might call it sculpting as well.

Ping, pong your fav game. You win, I am going out for some pool and a few beers. have fun.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cagey18

Uh, no, a claim that the media is "sculpting" polls isn't an "opinion", it's a claim.  One you have yet to back up.



Cagey18 -> RE: GOP Hits All Time Lows; Obama Approval Remains High (6/19/2009 7:00:10 PM)

You're funny!  You're using criticism of a Pew poll to question a NYTimes poll?  Really?

Nice try...




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