RE: BDSM and the media

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cravinspankin -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/21/2006 11:35:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JohnWarren This was one of the main reasons I outed myself. Originally Loving Dominant was to have the author as "Mentor." Then I realized it and the scene needed a real spokesperson. I don't know how many roldexes I'm in, but I regularly get calls from news media types who want background or a quote on a story. To their credit, most of the ones I've dealt with have been after "the truth" rather than trying to spin the story to meet agenda. This is one reason to support NCSF since they are often the "primary front person" for the scene these days. Thank You, for Your positive comments about the media that you've dealt with. As a member of that media, i can attest that most of us are responsible and operate on a high sense of ethics, with truth and balance an absolute must. Anything else, in our minds, is unacceptable. Most of us... and i'll be the first to admit not all are as responsible or ethical.. but most of us go after the truth. Yes.. we may have an idea what the story is when we start reporting, but are professional enough to realize that story may change, our perceptions and what we thought was the truth when we started gets altered as we conduct the interviews and do the research. So we don't go into a story with an "agenda." We go into it only seeking the true story. BTW.. if i may ask.. what is NCSF?

cravinspankin -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/21/2006 11:36:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Domin81 BDSM is getting more and more exposure in various media. Some good and some bad, but over the years, I believe the ratio is turning to more positive and realistic portrayals being shown. Check out www.mini.ca , just click past the questionnaire and click through the ‘Dominate Winter’ box. You will see crops whips and paddles….used to sell cars. Definitely becoming more mainstream? I love this ad!!! all my kinky friends did, too!

IronBear -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 12:20:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross quote: ORIGINAL: IronBear It's a pity LA that you so often post in a manner which can easily be taken that you speak for the entire community and for all places. I'd venture to say that your comments may be true for the USA but not for other nationalities who participate in the CM Forums too. Perhaps some small disclaimer that you refer to your area of living and experience would place things in perspective??? Well I certainly can't account for all cultures and experiences, but I know I have a best friend/ex-girlfriend who is a native and current resident of Australia and very active in the kink community near Brisbane and she and I discuss the culture over there a lot and in my travels through Europe I made a lot of contacts and tried to expose myself to as much of the culture there as possible. So I take all that I can and amalgamate it into a big "I think, in general" type statement. An admirable thought and fair coment LA, However the BDSM and general kiunk scene varied from state to state as a number of friends keep telling me. Even in Brisbane the scene is fractured and thus what is true for some areas is not true for the rest of the scene. This is why I am considering removing myself from all public areas except for the occasional visit to one of the clubs to meet with friends on a social level.. I'm contemplating replacing BDSM and Lifestyle activities with fishing and helping Lady Neets acquire a suitable potential kajirus). I still feel personally that a disclaimer acknowledging that you do not speak with total authority regarding other countries where you have not had years of first hand experience would be to your advantage.. But I immagine that you and I can continue to agree to disagree to most things.... If nothing else you do make me think and are an entertainlig lady. (was going to say wench but that may have been misinterpreted).

cloudboy -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 7:07:29 AM)
quote: Do you feel under attack, or do you welcome it and the resulting curious minds that will inevitably follow? I'm sure you'd be less than thrilled if TV 11 came knocking on your door asking about your slave trade. For 'the latest thing,' see: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/page.cfm?objectid=12987678&method=full (the short story) >But until Larry Wachowski emerges from his self-imposed exile, if he ever does, nobody will know how deeply into his own personal Matrix the director has gone. "As far as I know," says Porsche Lynn, who remains in touch with Karin Winslow, "they're living happily ever after."< Larry W. has essentially gone into hiding. Unless a person is a true attention / media whore or a business domme engaged in marketing --- I think one is uncomfortable with being spotlighted in the BDSM world. So my vote would be "under attack" or if not that, "under uncomfortable scrutinty." http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/9138137/the_mystery_of_larry_wachowski/?rnd=1140619130292&has-player=true (The long story) Marv Albert, the venerable basketball analyst, had to resign after it went public he's a masochistic CD at heart. Differences are generally NOT APPRECIATED by society at large.

JohnWarren -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 7:49:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cravinspankin Thank You, for Your positive comments about the media that you've dealt with. As a member of that media, i can attest that most of us are responsible and operate on a high sense of ethics, with truth and balance an absolute must. Anything else, in our minds, is unacceptable. Most of us... and i'll be the first to admit not all are as responsible or ethical.. but most of us go after the truth. Yes.. we may have an idea what the story is when we start reporting, but are professional enough to realize that story may change, our perceptions and what we thought was the truth when we started gets altered as we conduct the interviews and do the research. So we don't go into a story with an "agenda." We go into it only seeking the true story. I was a newspaper reporter for over a decade including a stint in SE Asia and after getting my doctorate I taught journalism. quote: BTW.. if i may ask.. what is NCSF? It is the National Coalition for Sexual Freedom, a sort of clearing house for legal and media matters concerning the scene and the swinging community. The website is http://www.ncsfreedom.org/

thetammyjo -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 8:10:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chaingang Links: http://www.nbc13.com/news/6812175/detail.html I see two issues here. First, the wife called the cops -- this gets back to the trust thing again. Clearly she had a problem, with him, with herself, who knows, maybe that will come out. Secondly, the issue of child pornography really makes this more intense. When someone sees this, regardless of the other stuff, they've basically decided against him. I find the lack of signatures quite interesting. If this were a "real" contract shouldn't it have expectations and limits for both parties plus signatures and dates? All of my contracts have had these things as standard. I think we as a community need to be very cautious when these events come up in the media. As much as we may love to believe that everyone who uses terms we use does so from consensual relationships the fact is that they do not. The terms commonly used by folks who do BDSM are widely known and can be easily used by abusers and users. I know this secondhand cause one of my sisters was married to such a.... creature who would beat her (made her lose their baby with one beating) and then say "Get over it, its just SM". Not SM -- just abuse. He'd just beat on her and then try to excuse it. It happens far more often than we might like. When its one spouse or partner against another, we should be very cautious about supporting either side but it doesn't look like anyone is doing that on this thread that I can see so we have a healthy skepticism I'd say.

amayos -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 9:33:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cloudboy quote: Do you feel under attack, or do you welcome it and the resulting curious minds that will inevitably follow? I'm sure you'd be less than thrilled if TV 11 came knocking on your door asking about your slave trade. For 'the latest thing,' see: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/page.cfm?objectid=12987678&method=full (the short story) >But until Larry Wachowski emerges from his self-imposed exile, if he ever does, nobody will know how deeply into his own personal Matrix the director has gone. "As far as I know," says Porsche Lynn, who remains in touch with Karin Winslow, "they're living happily ever after."< Larry W. has essentially gone into hiding. Unless a person is a true attention / media whore or a business domme engaged in marketing --- I think one is uncomfortable with being spotlighted in the BDSM world. So my vote would be "under attack" or if not that, "under uncomfortable scrutinty." http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/9138137/the_mystery_of_larry_wachowski/?rnd=1140619130292&has-player=true (The long story) Marv Albert, the venerable basketball analyst, had to resign after it went public he's a masochistic CD at heart. Differences are generally NOT APPRECIATED by society at large. Cloudboy, excellent points. It's funny you brought up Larry Wachowski; I have dealt with his Mistress Ilsa Strix before. She is a rather impressive lady.

amayos -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 9:39:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross quote: ORIGINAL: amayos All of this prompts me to ask what you may think about our little world vs. the larger one, and how 'we' are being perceived. When the flashy media monster of spin, scandal and vanilla titillation rears its head on the lifestyle you enjoy and identify with, does it bother you a little? Do you feel under attack, or do you welcome it and the resulting curious minds that will inevitably follow? Is media attention to the practice of BDSM good or dilutive in some way? Do you even care? Quite curious to know. I think on the whole that "kinky stuff" in general is viewed as fun, cute, accepted and fine as long as it's in the bedroom with the lights out. Quite true...sadly enough. quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross When it becomes organized, into "sex clubs" or "a lifestyle" I think most people are intrigued, but still considering it nasty, dark and bad- resulting from an unloved childhood or the like. I think over time (generations) it will become a normal everyday type of choice. I have often wondered if there will ever be a day in the far-flung future where BDSM is considered a "normal" lifestyle activity, and if so, how much higher the social tabboo bar may be raised. What will be considered scandalous then?

amayos -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 9:46:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie i do find it unfortunate, however, that the Dominance/submission aspect is always viewed so negatively, and often as something "sick." By focusing on only the weird and deranged stories related to D/s, the media propagates that mindset. Eventually D/s = weird and sick, thus pushing us further into silence. It is always entertaing to me to read past versions of the DSM. There were a lot of natural human sexual behaviors classified as "disorders" or paraphilia.

TallDarkAndWitty -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 10:54:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: IronBear I'd venture to say that your comments may be true for the USA but not for other nationalities who participate in the CM Forums too. Was there anything she said in particular that you disagree with, or were you just trying to catch the lady's attention? This is a public forum, and if you haven't internalized that everything said by everyone is just their own opinion, and may not be true for other people, places, or planets, you might look into doing so. Taggard The preceeding statements refer only to my area of living and experience.

IronBear -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 12:04:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty Was there anything she said in particular that you disagree with, or were you just trying to catch the lady's attention? 1. It was the whole tone of the post (and a few others too). 2. Why should I wish to catch her attention especially as we rarely disagree on anything? quote: This is a public forum, and if you haven't internalized that everything said by everyone is just their own opinion, and may not be true for other people, places, or planets, you might look into doing so. Sarcasm doesn't become you IMO. I simply have a problem when some one make sweeping statements often which can be taken to infer that the comments applies to my locality when I know it is inaccurate in that case. In several cases i have had messages from other readers who asked if some of LA's statements were right for my locality.. I just believe that it would be reasonable to add something along the lines I suggested. I never really expected LA would do such a thing though..... Interesting that the only two times you have even acknowledged me is in defence of LA.... Most interesting .. I remember your last comment was to the effect that LA was the cheese on a Pizza to which I replied that I dont like cheese on a pizza.. That should have given you some concept of my relationship with the Lady in question. I simply dont agree with her often but on the occasions that I do, I post in agreement and in a complementary manner. Please don't expect me to sit quietly by when I see something I disagree with and say nothing. I could have made a different post but I believe that my suggestion and the explanation as to why I found hers regardig the Brisbane scene flawed. Still you are more than welcome to post your disaproval of anything I post if that turns you on. I may or may not chose to respond.. Sort of depends if I have time, inclination or sufficient coffee. regards "Ya gota play the game. It's all in the game and how you play it!"

DestinyCommander -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 6:23:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thetammyjo Secondly, the issue of child pornography really makes this more intense. When someone sees this, regardless of the other stuff, they've basically decided against him. I tend to discount reports of child porn. I do believe it exists, and I think it is a disgusting thing. But it is also one of those things that becomes a "guilty until proven innocent". So much so, that I think law enforcement sometimes makes it up to make someone look worse. The contract in and of itself isn't really a bad thing. It isn't illegal, because it wasn't signed. And it's entirely circumstantial, unless they've got his fingerprints on it. So this woman's case comes down to he-said vs. she-said. Then what's a prosecutor to do? Make up a child porn charge. Then in the public's mind, the guy is automatically guilty of anything else they choose to throw at him. I honestly don't know how child porn is brought in as evidence in a trial, but I highly doubt they print the photos and show it to the jury. If they did, the proscecutor would be guiltly of disseminating it. If the police are motivated in putting the guy away because they didn't like the contract, they might well be willing to stretch the truth a little on the stand when in comes to what they found on his computer. (That's not to say the police are "lying", just that since they are convinced he's guilty of something, they are subconsciously motivated to make others believe it.) Even if they never persue the child porn charges officially in court, public opinion (e.g., the jury's opinion) is stacked against him, and the guy never gets a chance at a fair trial. Now that's not to say it wasn't true... but I certainly don't believe everything I read.

thetammyjo -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 6:50:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DestinyCommander quote: ORIGINAL: thetammyjo Secondly, the issue of child pornography really makes this more intense. When someone sees this, regardless of the other stuff, they've basically decided against him. I tend to discount reports of child porn. I do believe it exists, and I think it is a disgusting thing. But it is also one of those things that becomes a "guilty until proven innocent". So much so, that I think law enforcement sometimes makes it up to make someone look worse. The contract in and of itself isn't really a bad thing. It isn't illegal, because it wasn't signed. And it's entirely circumstantial, unless they've got his fingerprints on it. So this woman's case comes down to he-said vs. she-said. Then what's a prosecutor to do? Make up a child porn charge. Then in the public's mind, the guy is automatically guilty of anything else they choose to throw at him. I honestly don't know how child porn is brought in as evidence in a trial, but I highly doubt they print the photos and show it to the jury. If they did, the proscecutor would be guiltly of disseminating it. If the police are motivated in putting the guy away because they didn't like the contract, they might well be willing to stretch the truth a little on the stand when in comes to what they found on his computer. (That's not to say the police are "lying", just that since they are convinced he's guilty of something, they are subconsciously motivated to make others believe it.) Even if they never persue the child porn charges officially in court, public opinion (e.g., the jury's opinion) is stacked against him, and the guy never gets a chance at a fair trial. Now that's not to say it wasn't true... but I certainly don't believe everything I read. You basically explained what I was trying to say which is that the child porn charge really will outweight the other stuff in the public's mind and the legal system both. It is the one area where in the USA the Supreme has routinely agreed it is perfectly all right to limit free speech. (I taught a history of erotic literature class last semester and we spent some time on these issues) There's also a third possibility in that the spouse might be the one collecting said porn or may have placed it there to help her case. Again, I don't think its wise to pass judgement or claim this as attacks on BDSM in general when crap like this shows up in child custody, domestic abuse and divorce cases all the time. Sometimes what is said is true, sometimes its an attack.

Petruchio -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 8:54:22 PM)
quote: I honestly don't know how child porn is brought in as evidence in a trial, but I highly doubt they print the photos and show it to the jury. If they did, the proscecutor would be guiltly of disseminating it. That's in fact what prosecutors do. Two days ago, yet another central Florida prosecutor landed a video store owner in prison for a year (plus a nominal fine) for having a porn video on the shelf that reportedly showed 1 woman and 94 men. (Hmm… I can hear women here lining up right now!) The jury watched all of it before convicting him. (I think they all rushed home afterwards and jumped their mates' bones.)

Petruchio -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/22/2006 9:04:27 PM)
quote: the issue of child pornography really makes this more intense. When someone sees this, regardless of the other stuff, they've basically decided against him. I was shocked when a separated teacher I was dating said that her friends advised her to claim her husband had molested their daughter to gain the advantage in the divorce. Although she ultimately did not go this route, the fact she seriously considered it raised huge flags with me. Another aspect I find disturbing is when people talk about how sexual and slutty children in beauty pagaents look, i.e., Jon Benet Ramsey. I look at see only little children dressing up, and that makes me really wonder about those pillars of society who see sexual images. And one final rant: Prosecutors have attempted to go after pics of girls/guys who, in the prosecutor's opinion, LOOK younger than 18 but are not. Not stopping there, at least one effort was made to crack down on an artist who drew young images in an attempt to make him out to be a child pornographer. How weird– how totalitarian is THAT!

amayos -> RE: BDSM and the media (2/28/2006 4:08:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Petruchio I was shocked when a separated teacher I was dating said that her friends advised her to claim her husband had molested their daughter to gain the advantage in the divorce. Although she ultimately did not go this route, the fact she seriously considered it raised huge flags with me. That is rather disturbing, to say the least.

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