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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 5:41:58 PM

Mercnbeth

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Addressing first the issues relevant to the OP.

quote:

I will choose to address the less insidious notion and give you some credit (which you have chosen not to give to me, good sir) in assuming the former rather than the latter, and will proceed to direct you to my post wherein I copied and pasted a specific study by a university in Lancaster in the UK covering the statistical plausibility and correlation between trauma to the breast and the presence of breast cancer.

I read what you represent as the "study" however, without a link to vet the source it's nothing to consider authoritative. I base my opinion from the limited quotes you provided.

A sampling of 200 woman in a "semi-structured interview" from a 5600 pool in not significant. The results can be as much as a statistical anomaly as those purporting to show wearing a bra causes cancer. Except in the case of the bra study all 4500 woman were included, not 200; which would make it more valid.

Both provide "statistical plausibility". They also provide statistical doubt. Was there a group of woman who had their breast beaten regularly that never got cancer? Was intensity considered as a factor? Do plastic clips versus wooden, flogger versus crop, single tail versus hand, squeezing versus slapping; make a difference? Was there a control group of woman whose breasts were never touched? Nuns perhaps?

As an educated student of medicine and the 'scientific method' of proof; do you see the problem making ANY assumptions from the data you provided? Of course if you have more sources or even the source document itself, I'm looking forward to reading them.

On a personal note, the source of the definition shouldn't bother you either. Hypochondriasis, isn't only for self analysis. I used in in the context of projection; appropriate as you applied a 200 woman," aged 50-65 years", with 67 reported cases of cancer, who at the "semi-structured" interview were "more likely to report physical trauma to the breast" sampling; to all woman. Your Professor allow you to make such an assumption routinely? Concern, consideration, awareness; we are in agreement. I find no cause and effect correlation beyond the obvious limits of those in the study, nor would I make them a basis of changing any lifestyle choice.

The source of the definition of hypochondriasis was the first I found and, urban or not, unlike the study you used, I provided a link so the reference would be clear. I apologize that it wasn't. By that same token, on behalf of my slave beth I'm happy you understand the fundamental point made concerning her representation and accept your apology.

Whether you "tested out" and are in Med School or not doesn't change the pragmatic facts. I'll concede, as you represent, you "could have occurred to allow me this achievement". I maintain my doubt that they did. It is of no consequence, or relevance, one way or the other.

quote:

Thank you and have a wonderful day.

THANKS! I always do! Please do the same!

Best of luck in your continuing education and schooling!

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 6:08:02 PM

WolvenFury

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Your link:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12131664 (Original Source from which the summation of the study was retrieved)

As to the relevance of the material in question, I point to the original question which was inferring a possible connection to breast cancer from physical trauma. My statement pointed out a correlative plausibility applicable to this specific question, if you care to reread it, in relation to "physical trauma". Specificity was not implied as to the specific method of delivery, merely the question of whether or not "physical trauma" correlated to breast cancer. I answered that question.

The source itself was published in Lancet, May 1994 edition.

In relation to your comment pertaining to hypochrondriasis, there was no relevant basis in utilizing the term other than to insult and degrade, as the term by definition (Source: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hypochondriasis) states, correctly, that it is a psychiatric construct used to describe "...an excessive preoccupation with one's health, usually focusing on some particular symptom, as cardiac or gastric problems" or " excessive worry or talk about one's health", which does not match to your usage of the term and only to the context of the overall subject matter in an abstract, dismissive manner. In my opinion, I believe you are simply attempting to "cover your ass", to interject a cultural colloqiualism into this sideshow "debate".

As to my professor, I am quite sure he or any other sufficiently qualified academic would agree with my use of the study to reinforce my stated fact that it is indeed a statistical probability that physical trauma can be linked to breast cancer and that due to the vague, non-specific nature of the question I was indeed correct in answering the question exactly as worded.

In reference to the personal attack, which I copy below...
"Whether you "tested out" and are in Med School or not doesn't change the pragmatic facts. I'll concede, as you represent, you "could have occurred to allow me this achievement". I maintain my doubt that they did. It is of no consequence, or relevance, one way or the other."
...I will respond by saying first that, to clarify since I believe you may have misunderstood my original statement, I did not "test out" of school, merely past certain grades and out of certain courses which has compounded with my marks and a combination of AP credit for college courses and actual college courses taken in the latter two years of my high school career under dual enrollment, and that second that whatever doubts you may have about it, that the achievement is indeed a valid mention as you called my credibility into question and the level of education I have received is directly supportive of said credibility.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 7:16:42 PM

DesFIP

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Statistical probability that it can be is not proof.

I've read the same, that it could be, but so far there has been no proof. Instead what they do know is that having had some kind of trauma usually involves testing afterwards which finds the existence of hitherto unknown cancers.

The same way there is a statistical link between bra wearing and cancer but that link is better explained by saying that women who need to wear bras are more likely to have bigger, denser breasts in which small tumors are not felt during an annual.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 7:21:41 PM

WolvenFury

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DesFIP: Thank you for steering things back firmly on topic.

I do agree with you that it is not proof, however to simplify my statements on all of it, the original question was posed about the possibility of breast cancer from trauma and the study and statements on the matter are merely confirmation that it is indeed possible.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 7:39:58 PM

fluffypet61

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quote:

ORIGINAL: xoxkittenxox

Well, I'd say, because it seems to be getting larger, thats a sign that its more than just a boo-boo. Then again, is there still damage being done to it? Or have you been more wary since you felt it?

If you have continued to allow damage to be done, I can see why it is getting bigger. But if you have been more careful with Herbert, then I think it should be biopsied...

I think once a year, they fund raise for public screenings to be done. See if you can find when the next one in your city is being done, go in and have a mammogram. They will discuss more about how to help with the cost of a biopsy, if it is anything to worry about and what not.

Better sooner than later, though, even if you have to pay out of pocket. A later diagnosis has less chance of survival....

Anyway, find out how much. I'll pitch in! I'm sure we could find lotsa people to pitch in like ten bucks! We can fund raise with CM!

Good luck!

The rough breast play ended some time before i detected Herbert as i am now longer with that person.

The screening i have been having every 6 months has been paid for out of a state screening program. It does not cover surgery, however.

About naming my "booboo". It's a lot easier that saying "the palpable mass in my left breast" all the time. And a sense of humor is helpful when faced with a possible serious problem.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 7:45:26 PM

fluffypet61

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quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

Fluffy,

Have you called your local chapter of American Cancer to explain that without a biopsy you simply don't know?

Maybe they know of a grant or something?

There is a medicaid program that is not income determined that handles some pre-cancerous conditions... are you sure that having a suspicious lump does not qualify?

Were it me, I would be calling the university hospital every day.

I am sorry for the hard spot you are in.

The "local" (quite some distance away) chapter of the ACS does not deal with pre diagnosis issues.
To get the medicaid i have to have a diagnosis of Cancer.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 7:48:32 PM

fluffypet61

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The univ Dr's office wants me back for more mammo views this week. We'll see what that shows.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 7:53:47 PM

WolvenFury

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I wish the most luck and send my hopes and positive thoughts with you, darlin'.

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 8:07:54 PM

manxcat

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

...If you have breast torture done to you do you worry about possible breast cancer down the road after long term "abuse"?...

No.

But an interesting study was done showing a possible correlation between wearing a bra and an increased risk of breast cancer.

Wearing a bra may be cancer causing "breast abuse".

quote:

...Singer and Grismaijer then studied 4,500 women in five cities across the U.S. about their bra wearing habits and later published their findings in a book "Dressed to Kill". Though the study did not take into account other lifestyle factors, the results are too striking to be denied:

3 out of 4 women who wore their bras 24 hours per day developed breast cancer.

1 out of 7 women who wore bras more than 12 hour per day but not to bed developed breast cancer.

1 out of 152 women who wore their bras less than 12 hours per day got breast cancer.

1 out of 168 women who wore bras rarely or never acquired breast cancer.

Link to Full Article Here

wooohooo i am safe ;;-)))

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/21/2009 9:29:48 PM

DavanKael

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3 out of 4 women who wore their bras 24 hours per day developed breast cancer.

The above statistic may mean bad things for me as I often wear a bra unless I am in the tub, doing fun things that involve me and other(s) naked, and/or am wearing something supportive enough to prevent my chest from hurting.
I've worn a bra much of the time, even while sleeping, since I was in 3rd grade with the exception of a couple of years where I was lax about the while sleeping thing (Though, now I sometimes don't, though more often do).
I hope to avoid breast cancer but this isn't the first time I've seen stats like the one noted above. The theory I read was that the pressure of the bra impedes lymphatic flow.

Regarding what Maria said, I must emphatically agree. I, too, had a breast contusion (I have no idea how I got it; my ex- and I found it while attempting to have dun activities involving nakedness one Valentines Day...boy, did that kill the mood!). Rushed off to the doctor as soon as we found the lump, the doctor yelled at me for being a spaz and saying that no one was cutting off my breast (His contention was that it was non-sensical to say that I wouldn't allow such a thing...not that he was trying to allay my fears). The next day, I got a mammogram (Ouch! Freakin' ouch!) and an ultra-sound.
Several weeks later, my ex- and I were sitting in front of a surgeon who slapped the file down on the desk, looked at me like I was stupid and said, "You have a contusion". I looked at him and said, "A bruise?" He said, "Yeah, how did you get it?" I told him I had no idea. The lump was golf-ball sized and appeared quickly and went away, I believe within a month or so. I would have thought I would have to hit my breast about hard enough to take it off to cause that sort of bruising but apparently not.

As everyone has said, when in doubt, get it checked out.

Another idea that may not have been floated is that if you're feeling 'railroaded' by the system, perhaps calling your local representatives (Register to vote if you haven't already) and explaining this serious womens' health issue. Some things may open up with a little bit of political pressure exerted.
Hope everything turns out okay,
Davan

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/22/2009 7:42:24 AM

xoxkittenxox

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I kind of wonder if the type of bra has any difference on these statistics. I wear sports bras because I am usually skating or running home and whatnot. I don't even think I own any other kind of bra.

Of course, lumps are not the only thing to watch out for. Hardening, discolouration, a "bruised" appearance, may be signs of inflammatory breast cancer, which is an even worse form. Of course, in our case, I would look more for the hardening, since they probably always look bruised or discoloured. >> << >>
^
Looks like a long fish. Maybe a shark?!

< Message edited by xoxkittenxox -- 9/22/2009 7:43:01 AM >

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RE: Breast abuse contribute to breast cancer? - 9/23/2009 8:00:35 PM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: xoxkittenxox

Just don't irradiate girly parts and we're safe!

Damn. Does this mean I have to give up X-raying the ladies during sex?

Health,
al-Aswad.

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