RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance?

RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (Full Version)

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Cloudz -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:22:24 AM)
The reward for a gift well given. quote: ORIGINAL: ProtagonistLily So here I am, with all the humility I can possibly muster, asking the Doms and Dommes, the Masters and the Mistresses to please let us all know, if Submission is a Gift, what is Dominance? Kassie

Cloudz -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:25:45 AM)
It was nice to see mention of Lord Colm and jade...it brightened my morning.

MHOO314 -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:27:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ProtagonistLily So here I am, with all the humility I can possibly muster, asking the Doms and Dommes, the Masters and the Mistresses to please let us all know, if Submission is a Gift, what is Dominance? Kassie quote: Sub, Dom, top bottom etc etc. These are roles, not "gifts". I believe the question addressed not the adjective but the noun--(if I understand it correctly) Dominance is a musician, submission is the instrument--without the two together, there is no music---for a musician can think of notes, tunes, melodies but there is no magic, no passion, no life until it is brought to an instrument. Submission is the instrument, standing at the ready, finely tuned waiting--there is no music until One begins to play. There are bad players, sour notes, broken instruments and bad music--but when the right musician comes together with the right instrument, the dance of the dynamic begins. My boys submission is a gift--to Me--because he chose to lay it at My feet and no one else--because he chose to open himself, he chose freely and willingly--and at anytime he can choose to remove that gift from Me because I have not cared for it.

Smythe -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:31:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ProtagonistLily I've been doing WIIWD for a long time now. I was around pre-internet explosion, when it was much harder to find the organizations and other people into what we are into. Thanks to Lord Colm and jade, we were all alerted that 'submission is a gift." Ok, well, if submission is a gift, then what is Dominance? Seriously, while my 'sisters in submission' and I roll our eyes and laugh our preverbial assess off and compare notes about our 'gifts' it occured to me that Dominance doesn't have something so wholly assinine associated with it. So here I am, with all the humility I can possibly muster, asking the Doms and Dommes, the Masters and the Mistresses to please let us all know, if Submission is a Gift, what is Dominance? Kassie An idea doesn't stick around or fall into general usage unless it carries some kernel of truth, or at least something that most people relate to. "Submission is a gift" is one of those things that we have all heard a million times. I don't really buy it either, when it seems so clear to me that BDSM relationships are a very complicated interweaving of fantasy, reality, both peoples' needs, giving and taking. "Submission is a gift" doesn't begin to explain all that...and yet... there are times when I am completely satisfied and I lay down my paddle, and my boy is panting and sweating and still bound and fiery red and I am amazed and exhilarated and he kisses my paddle hand. Honestly, that feels like a gift. What do you think, protagonist lily...can you be partly a gift ?? :) Smythe

michaelGA -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:34:49 AM)
is there a gift card submissives can give Dominants to use however they want?

justatoy2 -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:37:53 AM)
whether or not submission is a gift doesn't really matter...it is whatever it is to each individual person. I have heard this argument bantered around for so long i want to scream. There is no right or wrong answer. There are some people who think its a gift..and some who think its a power exchange and some who think its merely role playing....but in the end all that matters is that the two (or three or more) people involved in that paticular relationship all agree as to what it is. We are never going to agree on whether submission is a gift. Because to some people it is. To others its a sybmiotic relationship, and to others it means something else. So why do we keep trying to make everyone else believe that your own paticular belief is the right one? I prefer to say..hey you believe submission is a gift..thats great for you and im glad it works for you.....we as a community need to start accepting each others own points of view instead of trying to tear each other apart...just my 2 cents.

michaelGA -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 5:45:47 AM)
it's a curse, i tell ya...a curse...ARRRRRRRRRHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGG...LOL

thetammyjo -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 6:43:22 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ProtagonistLily I've been doing WIIWD for a long time now. I was around pre-internet explosion, when it was much harder to find the organizations and other people into what we are into. Thanks to Lord Colm and jade, we were all alerted that 'submission is a gift." Ok, well, if submission is a gift, then what is Dominance? Seriously, while my 'sisters in submission' and I roll our eyes and laugh our preverbial assess off and compare notes about our 'gifts' it occured to me that Dominance doesn't have something so wholly assinine associated with it. So here I am, with all the humility I can possibly muster, asking the Doms and Dommes, the Masters and the Mistresses to please let us all know, if Submission is a Gift, what is Dominance? Kassie I'd say mine is either a gift too or its like a degree which you earn. I would apply these same ideas to submission though as well. Both, in my opinion, should be earned over time. Just because you work on giving or getting said gift or degree does not mean it will be accepted or not rejected. I wonder if maybe the gift idea also relates to the etiquette rule that while you receive a gift what you do with it is entirely up to the person given it. Thus it maintains the idea that the receiver (the dom if you only believe submission is a gift) has the power once he/she takes the gift.

ExistentialSteel -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 6:56:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: michaelGA is there a gift card submissives can give Dominants to use however they want? Now that was funny.

truesub4u -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 7:47:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MHOO314 quote: ORIGINAL: ProtagonistLily So here I am, with all the humility I can possibly muster, asking the Doms and Dommes, the Masters and the Mistresses to please let us all know, if Submission is a Gift, what is Dominance? Kassie quote: Sub, Dom, top bottom etc etc. These are roles, not "gifts". I believe the question addressed not the adjective but the noun--(if I understand it correctly) Dominance is a musician, submission is the instrument--without the two together, there is no music---for a musician can think of notes, tunes, melodies but there is no magic, no passion, no life until it is brought to an instrument. Submission is the instrument, standing at the ready, finely tuned waiting--there is no music until One begins to play. There are bad players, sour notes, broken instruments and bad music--but when the right musician comes together with the right instrument, the dance of the dynamic begins. My boys submission is a gift--to Me--because he chose to lay it at My feet and no one else--because he chose to open himself, he chose freely and willingly--and at anytime he can choose to remove that gift from Me because I have not cared for it. Smiles... so do love to see how you word things MHOO. And this is the best reponse I've seen on any forum. (Being a music buff made me bias though.. lol)

angelic -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 7:52:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MHOO314 quote: ORIGINAL: ProtagonistLily So here I am, with all the humility I can possibly muster, asking the Doms and Dommes, the Masters and the Mistresses to please let us all know, if Submission is a Gift, what is Dominance? Kassie quote: Sub, Dom, top bottom etc etc. These are roles, not "gifts". I believe the question addressed not the adjective but the noun--(if I understand it correctly) Dominance is a musician, submission is the instrument--without the two together, there is no music---for a musician can think of notes, tunes, melodies but there is no magic, no passion, no life until it is brought to an instrument. Submission is the instrument, standing at the ready, finely tuned waiting--there is no music until One begins to play. There are bad players, sour notes, broken instruments and bad music--but when the right musician comes together with the right instrument, the dance of the dynamic begins. My boys submission is a gift--to Me--because he chose to lay it at My feet and no one else--because he chose to open himself, he chose freely and willingly--and at anytime he can choose to remove that gift from Me because I have not cared for it. what true said... wow

RiotGirl -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 7:58:58 AM)
Do these gifts get naked and jump outta cakes? Cos i might want a gift too quote: If submission is a gift, then Dominance is plainly God's gift to women. ::bows to the oh so dominant one:: BLESS this earth and all that are on it.. for God created Dominant men................. and realised he could do better... and created submissive women [:D]

amayos -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 8:51:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MsSonnetMarwood I've always felt that if submission is a gift - it's only a gift to oneself, to accept this part of themselves, deal with it in a constructive manner, and be at peace with it. Well said.

michaelGA -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 9:13:02 AM)
maybe there's a gift shop Dominants can go to to find that special sub for them?

BeeQueen -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 10:09:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sophia37 Sub, Dom, top bottom etc etc. These are roles, not "gifts". yes yes yes and yes

BeeQueen -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 10:12:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lashra Alot of things are romantized or sugar coated so that it has greater marketing appeal, particulary with females. What better way to promote boring domestic chores then to make it look like a beautiful scene from some movie? She stands there in her black PVC french maids outfit with the lacey apron and 7 inch stiletto heeled shoes on as she is doing the dishes when the One walks in. He see's her , smiles at his obedient and wonderful lil one. He walks up behind her, kisses her on the back of the neck and then pushes her over the sink and begins to smack her bare ass until she squeals like a monkey. REALITY- She's hot, sweaty up to her elbows in dirty dishes and she's wearing sweatpants, a tshirt and tennis shoes. She's worked all day and housework, contrary to popular belief, is neither fun nor easy, she's run a bunch of errands and has waited on his ass all morning. Her head hurts, she's tired and she really wishes that sometimes he'd get off his lazy ass and help do something around the house when he walks in. He's grumpy because he had a bad day at work and traffic was just a bitch. He walks up behind her looks at her and then at the dishes she's doing. "Why isn't my dinner on the table? Its 6 o'clock." So if submission is a gift, I'd have to say Dominance is a responsibility. It is my responsibility to see to it that my sub performs within my set of rules and that I adhere to the standards I have set for myself for taking care of them. Lashra yes and yes..and again yes too much sugarcoat (especially in american szene) too much talking it nice too much romantic book ideas that r taken for real its a set of roles we take for living...and nothing else is bdsm...another set of roles that we use and its in the responsibility of both to make the roles liveable...can keep ur romantic thoughts..but dont confuse the romantic im his/her pet with the reality where him/she just treats u like shit and uses u for the housework and quick and fast sex Bee

KnightofMists -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 12:06:54 PM)
I don't see submission as a gift! nor do I see Dominance as a gift! these are parts of people... a Part .. Not a whole of person. It's an interact dynamic.. It's a behavior, It's a personality.. it's alot of things... But for me they are not gifts. When I recieve a gift form someone they leave me... well I still have the gift. to do as I will... well the relationship ends... my dominance comes with me... their submission goes with them. We share these parts of ourselves! From this sharing.. I am enhanced as a person. from the memories, the experiences, the lessons amoung other things... but I am not a better submissive because someone thinks they give me a gift of submission!

ExistentialSteel -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 12:32:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KnightofMists I don't see submission as a gift! nor do I see Dominance as a gift! these are parts of people... a Part .. Not a whole of person. It's an interact dynamic.. It's a behavior, It's a personality.. it's alot of things... But for me they are not gifts. When I recieve a gift form someone they leave me... well I still have the gift. to do as I will... well the relationship ends... my dominance comes with me... their submission goes with them. We share these parts of ourselves! From this sharing.. I am enhanced as a person. from the memories, the experiences, the lessons amoung other things... but I am not a better submissive because someone thinks they give me a gift of submission! True, it is more accurately described as a synergistic effect where both make each other stronger than they would be without the other(s).

HoosierScorpio -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/6/2006 12:51:29 PM)
I have talked with allot submissive and I know they feel full fill when they are being controlled or collared. I think Domination and submission are part of the hierarchy of relationship dynamics. If you look in the animal kingdom they have the same thing for example, I have two female dogs and I notice one is Dominate while the other one is submissive and she will take care of her. Since I have been in this lifestyle and read allot about Domination and submission I have notice more of this every day. We have decided to say submission is a gift but what if is part of who we are and with out a Dominate you feel lost or not whole. I am not saying this is a bad thing but this is my viewpoint and how I see things. I do not want to tear any one down to build myself up but to teach them how to soar and fly with the strength they never knew before.

OscarHargraves -> RE: If Submission is a 'gift', what's Dominance? (3/7/2006 7:18:12 AM)
'Obsession' is the word that comes to mind.........

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