RE: inspired submission

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lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/2/2009 5:55:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: agirl quote: ORIGINAL: lally2 hey.the dark and sunshine(miss) [:)] i have been inspired to submit by someone who took me way beyond myself, beyond my preconceived ideas of myself and made me more aware of me and what i am than anyone else in my life. and i have submitted to people because submission is inherent in me and it is what i am in the end. i would take the former any time. Isn't that really saying that you submit because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted? I mean, you still have to submit initially...or was he taking you places before you even submitted? etc agirl yes [:)] basically that is what im saying. its a process, it doesnt all happen in the first day, so submission is given/taken and from there the personalities eventually relax and the dynamic starts to develop. and yes he was challenging my perception of myself from the very start and took me somewhere i had never imagined i would go or even wanted to go and that was actually before he had my full submission. the thing is i think most of us here are capable of submitting to the physical with a Dominant we trust but not all of us are capable of submitting emotionally and mentally without the right sort of encouragement. the right encouragement is different for everyone

lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/2/2009 6:04:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: wisdomtogive Hi lally I been meditating on your thread these past couple days, and came up with this for representation of who i am and how i respond to people and life in general. There are aspects of me that are always there, and submissiveness is one of these aspects. It doesn't go away, but i think it takes certain people, and their chemistry, for it to come out in different degrees within me. As you know and we have had many conversations over this, i am a natural born psychic and work as one. When reading tarot or just using my psychic abilities, some people i will connect more with then another. In thinking about this, i realize this can be applied to all areas of my life. Everyone connects in our world, but at different degrees. Hope you are doing well, my friend. wisdomofgiving hi sweetheart, ive highlighted the bits that are basically what im kinda trying to say here. we all respond to different people in different ways or to different levels of depth. some relationships are quite superficial and then you go from there to really deep open and honest. if you look at those two polarities, superfical = deep it isnt hard to then take the next step and say that a superficial relationship will not necessarily inspire you to feel any strong feelings one way or the other. whilst the deep relationship is likely to inspire feelings of love, warmth, happyness (in the way that you inspire me to feel every time i see youre smiling face [:)]) - its true, you do. so there! [:)]

sunshinemiss -> RE: inspired submission (12/2/2009 8:12:29 PM)
quote: Isn't that really saying that you submit because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted? I mean, you still have to submit initially...or was he taking you places before you even submitted? etc agirl Hey girl, this quote above... good food for thought. Thank you for that. Best, sunshine

NihilusZero -> RE: inspired submission (12/2/2009 9:21:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: agirl *Isn't that really saying that you submit* because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted?** In which case what is actually being "inspired" is the depth of devotion, with submission taking a more pervasive nature due to that feeling of chemistry, comfort, and trust. Of course it does seem that the bigger differences seem to be just linguistic in this whole thing.

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: inspired submission (12/2/2009 10:46:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: agirl *Isn't that really saying that you submit* because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted?** In which case what is actually being "inspired" is the depth of devotion, with submission taking a more pervasive nature due to that feeling of chemistry, comfort, and trust. Of course it does seem that the bigger differences seem to be just linguistic in this whole thing. I'm not quite so sure about that. To my eye, the most significant point of departure seems to be a lack of a common definition of the word "submission" - some people seem to be regarding it as a way of being, others as a deliberate action or set of actions. And that seems to be the point in the road where both sides just sail past each other. Which seems very strange to me. I am a submissive; I am always a submissive, it's who and what i am, it's my nature. Yet, even though I am always a submissive, i rarely submit. There are very few women I meet who... inspire... that reaction in me. In my mind, it's a very good, even an elegant term for what happens when i meet and interact with someone whose personal chemistry is such that I find myself wanting to simply follow her around like a puppy waiting to see what I can do to please her or make her smile at any given instant. The fact that only a few women inspire that reaction in me - the fact that i don't have that reaction to every single woman I meet - doesn't make me any less a submissive. Others in this thread seem to be arguing differently, and frankly it's a very strange argument to my ear. I have to believe the breakdown is more semantic than anything else. People just aren't talking about the same thing, and don't even realize that.

lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 1:41:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: agirl *Isn't that really saying that you submit* because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted?** In which case what is actually being "inspired" is the depth of devotion, with submission taking a more pervasive nature due to that feeling of chemistry, comfort, and trust. Of course it does seem that the bigger differences seem to be just linguistic in this whole thing. yes. thats it completely and when you feel it linguistics have very little to do with it.

lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 1:53:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: agirl *Isn't that really saying that you submit* because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted?** In which case what is actually being "inspired" is the depth of devotion, with submission taking a more pervasive nature due to that feeling of chemistry, comfort, and trust. Of course it does seem that the bigger differences seem to be just linguistic in this whole thing. I'm not quite so sure about that. To my eye, the most significant point of departure seems to be a lack of a common definition of the word "submission" - some people seem to be regarding it as a way of being, others as a deliberate action or set of actions. And that seems to be the point in the road where both sides just sail past each other. Which seems very strange to me. I am a submissive; I am always a submissive, it's who and what i am, it's my nature. Yet, even though I am always a submissive, i rarely submit. There are very few women I meet who... inspire... that reaction in me. In my mind, it's a very good, even an elegant term for what happens when i meet and interact with someone whose personal chemistry is such that I find myself wanting to simply follow her around like a puppy waiting to see what I can do to please her or make her smile at any given instant. The fact that only a few women inspire that reaction in me - the fact that i don't have that reaction to every single woman I meet - doesn't make me any less a submissive. Others in this thread seem to be arguing differently, and frankly it's a very strange argument to my ear. I have to believe the breakdown is more semantic than anything else. People just aren't talking about the same thing, and don't even realize that. it is totally possible for it to be a way of being and for submission to be a deliberate process - you go on to qualify youre position on submission, that you dont submit to all and sundry only to the one that inspires the desire to follow them around like a puppy - i would argue that many submissives work along those lines. real life and the fact that when we are not with a Master we have to get on in with life means that we have to suck it up, get on with it and push through this world like everyone else. submitting to everyone all over the place just wouldnt work - i woke up to that one a bit late, but im now about as capable as any woman of any walk or persuasion. maybe in a way thats part of it. it takes a certain approach now to stop me dead in my tracks and for me to take notice, but thats just me having gone through a lengthy process of discovering what works and what doesnt work for me.

wisdomtogive -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 3:47:24 AM)
Lally another take on this is meeting someone who has inspired us enough to try again....Maybe not so much inspiring our submissiveness, it is there one way or another, but to inspire to do the song and dance again. To enter the stages of a relationship, any kind and take the risk In most cases the inspiration is not about inspiring our submissive nature or for that case the Dom. nature, but inspiring us to do the tap dance of relationships again. i always have a smile for you lally, and a lot of respect my dear friend

agirl -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 5:17:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: agirl *Isn't that really saying that you submit* because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted?** In which case what is actually being "inspired" is the depth of devotion, with submission taking a more pervasive nature due to that feeling of chemistry, comfort, and trust. Of course it does seem that the bigger differences seem to be just linguistic in this whole thing. Certainly, where I'm concerned, that's the case. I'm not submissive and when I asked to be owned many moons ago, it wasn't from feelings of wanting to submit. I just wanted to be his, lock, stock and barrel. I didn't think about submission. I knew it meant I'd have to do what he said.....but that was something I'd been doing for years anyway because doing what he said had proved to be a pretty good idea over time. Being owned meant that he could insist on it, rather than me just choosing to do what he said or suggested. I had no idea how significantly that seemingly subtle difference would affect me. I'm still not submissive, even after years of being owned.......but HAVING to submit in those hard times, those teeth-grindingly stubborn times, over years, HAS inspired my worship, slavish devotion and heart-stopping vulnerability. He didn't have all that when the collar went on......I didn't have it then, either. Last week someone said, "He can do no wrong in your eyes"...... Well, no, he can't...... but what she can't grasp or understand is, that I'm not guarded, I LET him have access, I risked having my feelings hurt.....I gave him the chance to REALLY know the good, the bad and the ugly. If you don't dare step along that path, you're unlikely to know the possibilities there. I'm not waiting for the wrong, I'm not looking for it , I'm not wasting energy protecting myself from him. To me, or FOR me........ it isn't JUST about the man HE is and what HE inspires.......I had to be a willing participant in joining him and continually trusting him, even when it's tugging horribly on parts of me that'd rather it went away. So..submitting is the least of it........ trusting and going there with my REAL self has been the bigger journey, for me. agirl

lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 5:49:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: agirl quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: agirl *Isn't that really saying that you submit* because you're submissive and that certain people have had the ability to connect with you in a way that others don't or haven't, ONCE you have submitted?** In which case what is actually being "inspired" is the depth of devotion, with submission taking a more pervasive nature due to that feeling of chemistry, comfort, and trust. Of course it does seem that the bigger differences seem to be just linguistic in this whole thing. Certainly, where I'm concerned, that's the case. I'm not submissive and when I asked to be owned many moons ago, it wasn't from feelings of wanting to submit. I just wanted to be his, lock, stock and barrel. I didn't think about submission. I knew it meant I'd have to do what he said.....but that was something I'd been doing for years anyway because doing what he said had proved to be a pretty good idea over time. Being owned meant that he could insist on it, rather than me just choosing to do what he said or suggested. I had no idea how significantly that seemingly subtle difference would affect me. I'm still not submissive, even after years of being owned.......but HAVING to submit in those hard times, those teeth-grindingly stubborn times, over years, HAS inspired my worship, slavish devotion and heart-stopping vulnerability. He didn't have all that when the collar went on......I didn't have it then, either. Last week someone said, "He can do no wrong in your eyes"...... Well, no, he can't...... but what she can't grasp or understand is, that I'm not guarded, I LET him have access, I risked having my feelings hurt.....I gave him the chance to REALLY know the good, the bad and the ugly. If you don't dare step along that path, you're unlikely to know the possibilities there. I'm not waiting for the wrong, I'm not looking for it , I'm not wasting energy protecting myself from him. To me, or FOR me........ it isn't JUST about the man HE is and what HE inspires.......I had to be a willing participant in joining him and continually trusting him, even when it's tugging horribly on parts of me that'd rather it went away. So..submitting is the least of it........ trusting and going there with my REAL self has been the bigger journey, for me. agirl the highlighted para is where its at. its the whole exposing youre entire self to someone you trust and respect and with whom you know you are ultimately safe emotionally, physically and in all other ways. when you go down that road the freedom of their total acceptance of you, makes stepping into that vulnerable place where you can be emotionally exposed and incredibly honest truely fab. i think in most relationships, even with youre parents (maybe especially with youre parents lol) the degree of total honesty you share with one another is always subject to a certain amount of editing. but with a Master who has all of you, the honesty and openness that transpires is like no other relationship youre likely to have.

NihilusZero -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 2:00:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lally2 yes. thats it completely and when you feel it linguistics have very little to do with it. Aye. I mean that it's semantics that are (for the most part) causing the confusion. [:)]

lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 4:39:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: lally2 yes. thats it completely and when you feel it linguistics have very little to do with it. Aye. I mean that it's semantics that are (for the most part) causing the confusion. [:)] easily done aboard HMS Collarme - sorry, must have been the 'aye' - i got all naughtycal for a sec [:)]

Icarys -> RE: inspired submission (12/3/2009 7:20:14 PM)
I don't know..I guess it seems to me that some people put so much emphasis on the idea of being inspired..so much so that it sounds as if a Dominate must do something special (just for them) to attract their attention. I wouldn't ever say I'm inspired in any way to be who I am naturally..seems kinda backwards to me. If I see someone that needs help and I decide to help because it's in me to want to do that..I wouldn't say that comes from that person inspiring it..It comes from within...with little to do with that person at all.. I do it for the feeling and satisfaction I get in the act because of the way I feel about doing it in the first place. My happiness and desire for another person comes from within as well..not from anything else other than how I feel about who that person is to me as a whole. Inspire to me seems romantic sure. I was inspired to write a poem because of her compassion and beauty. I was inspired by another's work of art for a commercial sign job.(Okay not so much romantic there :>) Inspiration seems singular, sudden, a little fleeting, lofty or momentary..not something I equate to a relationship. There are a few sayings and words that just prod me a little when I hear them: I need a Dominate to inspire my submission. My submission is a gift..etc etc. Like the above posters are saying: Maybe it's just semantics..(Shrugs)

lally2 -> RE: inspired submission (12/4/2009 10:35:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Icarys I don't know..I guess it seems to me that some people put so much emphasis on the idea of being inspired..so much so that it sounds as if a Dominate must do something special (just for them) to attract their attention. . that isnt whats being said atall, again - it is the feelings involved, provoked that inspires submission or dominance (either infact) - i dont believe anyone has said that the Dominant should do something special, well cept for you ofcourse [:)]

hardbodysub -> RE: inspired submission (12/4/2009 12:05:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lally2 quote: ORIGINAL: Icarys I don't know..I guess it seems to me that some people put so much emphasis on the idea of being inspired..so much so that it sounds as if a Dominate must do something special (just for them) to attract their attention. . that isnt whats being said atall, again - it is the feelings involved, provoked that inspires submission or dominance (either infact) - i dont believe anyone has said that the Dominant should do something special, well cept for you ofcourse [:)] Well, even if no one else said it, what the heck is wrong with the idea that a dominant needs to do (or be) something special? Nothing at all is wrong with it. If you're the type of submissive who just needs to submit to someone, anyone, without feeling that there's something special about that person, well then fine, good for you. You shouldn't have any trouble finding what you want, and there's nothing wrong with that. But believing that a dominant person should never have to do anything to "inspire" or induce submission, and any sub who thinks that way is "topping from the bottom", well that's just way off base. Frankly, a "dominant" who's not exerting some influence over another's behavior isn't dominating at all, but merely passively accepting submission. Someone said earlier that they think the problem lies in differing definitions of "submissive". Well, I think it lies just as much in the definition of "dominant".

NihilusZero -> RE: inspired submission (12/4/2009 3:29:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub Well, even if no one else said it, what the heck is wrong with the idea that a dominant needs to do (or be) something special? In order to gain someone's desire for partnership or to gain that same partner's submission? It's a pertinent difference. quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub If you're the type of submissive who just needs to submit to someone, anyone, without feeling that there's something special about that person, well then fine, good for you. You shouldn't have any trouble finding what you want, and there's nothing wrong with that. I don't think anyone here has suggested this. quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub But believing that a dominant person should never have to do anything to "inspire" or induce submission, and any sub who thinks that way is "topping from the bottom", well that's just way off base. Frankly, I consider my job in a relationship to be to "inspire" the desire of the person to stay with me. I expect the roles within the dynamic to be otherwise static. quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub Frankly, a "dominant" who's not exerting some influence over another's behavior isn't dominating at all, but merely passively accepting submission. Oh, really? All D/s dynamics must be wrought from continual overt enforcements? Do explain how a relationship where the s-type is "passively accepting dominance" and the D-type is "passively accepting submission" is not D/s? Is this like saying that no one is heterosexual unless in the midst of copulation with a member of the opposite sex?

hardbodysub -> RE: inspired submission (12/4/2009 8:32:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub Well, even if no one else said it, what the heck is wrong with the idea that a dominant needs to do (or be) something special? In order to gain someone's desire for partnership or to gain that same partner's submission? It's a pertinent difference. Not really. A relationship is a relationship is a relationship. quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub But believing that a dominant person should never have to do anything to "inspire" or induce submission, and any sub who thinks that way is "topping from the bottom", well that's just way off base. Frankly, I consider my job in a relationship to be to "inspire" the desire of the person to stay with me. I expect the roles within the dynamic to be otherwise static. The discussion has been about a D/s relationship, not a vanilla one. If you're dominant in a D/s relationship, when you "inspire" the desire of the person to stay with you, you're inspiring a sub to stay with a dom. quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub Frankly, a "dominant" who's not exerting some influence over another's behavior isn't dominating at all, but merely passively accepting submission. Oh, really? All D/s dynamics must be wrought from continual overt enforcements? You've badly misrepresented what I said. I never said or implied anything related to "continual", "overt", or even "enforcements". Influence can be exerted in many ways. And, lest we forget, the OP was about the beginningof a D/s relationship, not the dynamic of an established one. "Which comes first" - remember?

CaringandReal -> RE: inspired submission (12/6/2009 1:42:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark I smiled when I read this.. a very warm smile. Because yes, I totally believe that a person can find their own happiness and I would. But then, that it is me. Lots of people in different situations - whether confinement or knowledge of death (as another example) find their own internal peace and joy. As for submission? I would submit to my surroundings - call it submitting to ones 'fate' and being accepting of it. Yes, I could find the essence to do that. If you are in confinement, that doesn't make you unable to be straight. It just means you have no way of expressing it with someone else(ie having sex). It doesn't mean you aren't a brunette, just because you are alone Or any other part of the self that makes you what you are. I would disagree that because we are social or that we naturally are predisposed towards being grouping creatures. There are many people who chose to be alone or cut themselves off. We are like birds - some of us flock together, some just come together when the need arises(to procreate etc) and spend as much time alone as we can. I love company, but I am happy and content alone also, because I feel at peace with myself and my spirituality. Life it stunningly beautiful. Even in the quiet. the.dark. You're quite lucky. I will try not to be envious. I think I am one of those that would go crazy without human contact--it reaffirms who and what I am. All of who and what I am, actually. :) I've chatted with people, however, who've done full (tank) or partial (the latter usually enforced by sickness) sensory dep., and they've all claimed that the mind fills in, in unusual and brilliant ways, the blanks left by the environment being limited or shut off. So maybe there'd be hope for me. I'd just rather someone not decide to find this out through a scientific experiment!

RCdc -> RE: inspired submission (12/6/2009 3:25:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CaringandReal You're quite lucky. I am totally blessed. quote: I think I am one of those that would go crazy without human contact--it reaffirms who and what I am. All of who and what I am, actually. :) Up until a few years ago, I would have been right there with you. I don't know, mayb e I just had an epiphany or something...[;)] quote: I've chatted with people, however, who've done full (tank) or partial (the latter usually enforced by sickness) sensory dep., and they've all claimed that the mind fills in, in unusual and brilliant ways, the blanks left by the environment being limited or shut off. So maybe there'd be hope for me. SD is rocking! I'd recommend it - but not for long the first time. Take time to build it up. quote: I'd just rather someone not decide to find this out through a scientific experiment! I believe they did in psych units.[>:] the.dark.

sunshinemiss -> RE: inspired submission (12/6/2009 6:16:01 PM)
quote: a "dominant" who's not exerting some influence over another's behavior isn't dominating at all, but merely passively accepting submission. Hello hard body sub, That is an interesting point. Never thought of it that way. And I am of two minds about it. It's the "exerting" and the "passively accepting" that are niggling at my brain. Does someone have to ACTIVELY exert influence or is their merely being who they are enough? I would think that both yes and no are correct. (thus the divided mind). To some degree it is passive as far as not micromanaging, but it is very active in that expectations or presumptions might have the force to influence behavior. Not really active, but somehow not quite passive either if we add a time line of some sort. I still am gonna stand by my word "inspired". I like it. It works for me. To me it means that I, the strong, pain in the bum woman that I am, opinionated, difficult, get all ooey gooey and WANT to give up control, allow the natural force of him to take over. (or her - equally opportunity chica here [;)]). I'm not sure how where "active" ends and personality begins, or if there is even a difference. What I do know is that there are any number of dominant people who do not connect with me in the way that makes me want to treat them any more deferrentially than I do the guy on the street. But there are a few dominant people who make me catch my breath, hold my tongue, and want to purr and slither up against them and follow them. I'm gonna have to think on this. Thanks for your points. And to the whole crew here - this is quite an interesting discussing. I appreciate the candor. best, sunshine

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