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Submissive adaptation. - 1/6/2010 6:54:04 AM

osf

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Submissive adaptation.

I have found that some submissives have this ability to adjust their intelligence to a certain degree to whatever man they may be interested in at the time. If he is not quite as smart as she is she can dumb down a bit to enable the fantasy that she has a wise and knowing dom.

I’m not disparaging this, it is after all part of the package that makes them a submissive.

She wants this so energetically that when going to him for advice or explanation that if he can come anywhere near the proper response, she immediately will think it’s gods honest truth and adapt it on the spot. When she has questions regarding her own motivations and if he is observant enough and can come up with a plausible explanation, she will enfold it into herself and it becomes the truth. So in effect he is explaining and molding all at once.

One may wonder if it’s wise for me to put this out there, won’t it hinder me in my search? Not at all remember I said this is instinctive, they can’t act any other way and besides some of the dears may think this is oh so wise of me.

Remember the hand is smarter than the ass.

Well that has been my observation from my past, milage may vary.

< Message edited by osf -- 1/6/2010 7:04:58 AM >

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/6/2010 7:15:23 PM

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I couldn't fit this mold even if I wanted to. In certain parts of the intellectual spectrum, the people are kind of isolated from the vast majority of society by simply not being able to connect with the thought structures of most people. Folks just don't really understand them. I am functional and socially viable, but for a more intimate relationship I need to be understood in these areas that elude others. A connection of any other kind just will not hold up in this kind of intensive dynamic. I need someone who can challenge the core of my thought processes and conceptualizations. When I found that person, it was phenomenal. Of course, I have no issue with shaking up his internal world either. He wants me to be able to get inside him like that. It means I get him and he isn't quite as isolated either. People leave their impressions on each other. If they didn't, then the interaction was not worthwhile.

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/6/2010 8:10:43 PM

osf

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i'm sure if you think you'll have seen this phenomena, where a woman will connect with a guy and at first think he is wonderful only to become disillusioned and say how really dumb he was
, but she couldn't see it at the time

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/6/2010 8:30:18 PM

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Yes, but I will also contend it happens in reverse as well and is not limited to people of submissive orientation. Anyone of any flavor can be subject to buyer's remorse.

lovingpet

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RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/6/2010 9:12:20 PM

osf

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i've noticed it to be pronounced in submissive women wanting the man to be smarter than they are

never much took notice of sub men for some reason

ever see a dom say he wanted someone smarter than he?

but you often see women say that, and sometimes they try to make it so by dumming down a bit

it doesn't happen if there is a great deal of difference, i guess they can only fool themselves so much

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 5:52:19 AM

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I still don't think it is a gender and orientation specific trend. I have seen the occasional male dominant wanting someone smarter than him simply for the joy of reducing him/her to the base elements underneath all the intellect.

Mostly I see a lot of people attempting to appear smarter than they really are because it seems to be a near fetish in the bdsm world to the more open lifestyle people. In the end, the group is split about the same as any population, so that means that half are going to be of average intellect or below and about half will be above it with most falling closer to that average mark to the tune of about 30% (bell curve and all). I reasonably expect most people are not actually what they appear when it comes to this particular trait. Even if things are askew some to the higher side, it is not going to be to the extremes people try to make it appear. I might be a different kind of bird, but I am more likely to force you to reveal your lacking in this area than to buy that you are what you say you are just because you said so. As much as I want someone who can engage me on this level, so much so it hurts sometimes, I can't fool myself in the least. I will open up a line of thought unwittingly that makes the issue a little hard to ignore. It is a natural way for me to interact. The moment I realize I am having to fit into intellectual constraints, it is painfully clear.

I am not saying any of this as though I have some crazy level of intellect. I am not even saying I am a cut above. I just know what I need and am not all that great about self deception. I used to be able to convince myself Mr. Wrong was oh so Mr. Right, but a few hard lessons knocked that out of me, but then again those delusions were about other aspects of them. I am probably the wrong person to be responding to you. I am not all that typical of most any group. I kinda go my own way. That being said, I did wind up with someone very likely my intellectual superior simply because he is who I could connect with on that level. Everyone else was a void for me in that area. If someone cannot know my mind, then how can we ever form an intimate relationship?

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 7:49:45 AM

osf

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quote:

I still don't think it is a gender and orientation specific trend. I have seen the occasional male dominant wanting someone smarter than him simply for the joy of reducing him/her to the base elements underneath all the intellect.

never ever saw that

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 2:51:08 PM

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It is admittedly rare, but I have. I guess it is a simple matter of differing life experiences.

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 5:33:33 PM

osf

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i have this theory about some types of submissives that their psychie wont allow them to look inside them selves to figure out whats happening, they need him to do it for them , i don't know why but i have experienced that, maybe their need to have someone to look inside does it, that's just a guess as to why but the effect is real

i bet you didn't think there were distinct characteristics some different types of subbies have i common

< Message edited by osf -- 1/7/2010 5:39:36 PM >

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 6:54:57 PM

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I am sure there are. I'm not prepared to state that you are hitting upon them, but there may be a few that cover MOST submissives. I will say there are always foilables and outliers in any set, especially when that set includes people.

As for this idea that submissives need the dominant to do the soul searching for them, I am not sure that there is any way for a submissive to defer the entire task to him. It is like a diving team or digging expedition. One will take the adventure and go down into the depths of the other, but only when it comes to the surface can anyone appraise what has been discovered and attach a meaning to it. If my partner finds things within me, only I can really tell him what those significance they carry for me. He may find his own value in them, but that interpretation belongs to him. Again, I have been known to waken things in him as well, but only he could tell me what those things meant.

Applying generalizations is always hard. In order to do so, you have to be able to account for and explain anomolies among the data.

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 7:11:35 PM

osf

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if a person say has to known characteristics then a third can be inferred from the two because we are made that way to have characteristics in complimentary sets, if not then psychiatry wouldn't work

maybe it's the barriers they create in themselves so he can penetrate them, like i said i don't know why, i've just seen it and delt with it in the past, it's as though she wants him to discover her, perhaps to gratify her perceived need for him

i'm getting tired and rambling

i'll tell you what it's a hell of a lot of enjoyment to deal with

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 7:28:28 PM

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Maybe it is the joy I get out of discovering things in others, but I do kind of tend to fall into that wanting him to discover things about me for himself. It makes my discovery much more valuable to me when I had to do the working, mining, digging, cutting, and polishing myself and I like for that kind of value to be attached to someone I care for rather than to myself. Probably a bit narcissistically (sp?), I want that kind of value attached to my traits in the eyes of another. I think the other side of it is simple submission. I don't get to interfere with any process he decides to have me undergo for him and that includes him probing into areas that I have been afraid to explore in the past about myself. It is like tearing down a mental/emotional...possibly psychic....limit (if I did the whole limits thing anyway). It may not always be that I WANT him to dredge up new and potentially scary areas of my character or psyche, but it isn't about what I want. It is about what he desires.

I think a lot of things play into how and why a dominant person tends to be the one to lead the way in the submissive's self discovery. Most is just the leadership role in general. Part is needing to be valued by his/her partner. The rest is just individual eccentricities probably. I don't know if it is totally an internal trend as your theory suggests, but I think it is safe to say most submissives will go through periods of "forced", intentional self discovery at the hands of the dominant. I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing.

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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(in reply to osf)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 7:38:28 PM

osf

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this may sound cold but the better he knows her the more able he is to use her, a dominant puts in a lot of effort in understanding her and her motivations and there has to be something he gets out of it, and that is whatever he wants

there's always an ulterior motive in what he does, it's part of the package

it's hard to drive a car you don't understand

and my take on it is that he is willing to invest the time and effort in her because he can get from her what he couldn't get from any other woman ie nilla woman

what i want is the ultimate porno toy, scary no? but then i'm willing to pay the price for one

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 8:10:47 PM

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But that isn't really an ulterior motive then, is it? Especially in a consensual relationship, it is pretty clear to what end all personal, intimate information will be used. All the cards are pretty well on the table. You can't really exploit that which desires to be exploited, now can you?

The ultimate porno toy does cost dearly in the time and effort department. A porno toy with more useful dimensions in addition is even harder to come by. He isn't just stoking my sexual fires. He is flirting with every aspect of my person to draw out of me those traits that allows him to lead unquestions and me to serve in any way he may desire. I have come to derive just as much joy out of cooking him a meal, doing his laundry, or fulfilling his fantasy, but they all speak to different parts of my personality. I know I have been manipulated and will be over and over again. I enjoy the feeling of my very being squishing and oozing through his fingers as he fashions just what he desires, casts me down, drowns the old broken shards, and starts anew.

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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(in reply to osf)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 8:38:01 PM

osf

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when i speak of ulterior motives i'm saying i see no higher moral plane to this, there is no more growth than any nilla relationship

i freely admit to the world at large see i'm a pervert, in fact i revel in it and the things i want, well we'll leave that blank here, just to suffice most wouldn't think them nice

my ulterior motive is and i admit this up front is to extract from her whatever i want and i'll go to great lengths to do this, i'm not a sentimentalist, i'm not going to feel guilty

and if it's a real problem for her, then there comes a time for her to suck it up and obey, may sound harsh, but if she consents to a relationship with me , those are the terms

it excites me and i have had and have seen other women that maybe not immediately but in the long run were excited by that too, to have done can over come having to do, does that make sense to you? the accomplishment

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 8:57:30 PM

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The accomplishment of the thing.....

On the subbie side, it is that amazed moment of, "I can't believe I just did that... and I'm still me and I survived." that cements the dynamic. If I follow the dominant down a path and I don't think I can handle it, I am sure I can't as a matter of fact, that dominant has a hell of a burden of responsibility at that point. If he lets me just crash and burn, the spell is broken and trust is gone. If it goes well and he has taken me through to the other side, I will be that much more enamoured to him. If it goes disasterously bad and he takes upon himself the consequences of forcing me down that road and helps me come back to myself again, then again I am head over heels for him.

Each and every thing that he gains from me is his to use as he sees fit. I don't know why anyone would expect otherwise. There is no guilt in using what is freely given to your own benefit. I don't find that scary. I find a lot of fulfillment in such a sentiment because it means that what I have given won't given in vain. He is getting his fullest pleasure out of it, even at my own expense. Yes, sometimes that means I will endure some very messed things in many instances. That is the bed I chose. It means I am at ease in that bed and not at all inclined to complain about what it is like to lay in it.

lovingpet

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If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

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RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 9:02:11 PM

osf

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on the flip on the flip side i wrote this for my journal

You got this brand new pornographic women toy, and she’s willing to make your most nasty erotic fantasy a reality, you know the one that has been developing in you head for ever so long,

now is your big chance to make it reality, you put in a lot of effort to arrange it and the big moment arrives and lo and behold the bitch does it to perfection, couldn’t have gone better.

Now it’s the next day and you’re having second thoughts about what happened and her, now neither seem so desirable anymore.

Now what?

Didn’t think of that did you?

it can happen on both sides

i make better since when im not tired lol

< Message edited by osf -- 1/7/2010 9:03:02 PM >

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 9:13:16 PM

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That's why a one dimensional relationship rarely works out. It is also why going through with a fantasy has to be thought through very carefully. How you will feel about it in the cold light of day can leave behind regrets. I think adaptability and flexibility is important to a relationship. My role and my uses do not remain static nor does his. Who is in charge and who follows may not change, but we should be able to approach each other and meet each other in many different ways.

Getting tired myself.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to osf)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/7/2010 9:22:04 PM

osf

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but still the final decisions has to be his

i sincerely believe in a way its harder to be the sub, because after all it's your body that is the playground but i doubt even so you'd want it any other way

i do have a since of reality about me

fantasies should be measured by the yard stick of reality, and again that is not your responcibility

what is done should not be as important as it is important that you do it

or what may be a whim on his part is an obligation on your part

i'm full of quips i made up lol

but any way the responsibility is his and he should be certain of his desires and his ability to handle them

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: Submissive adaptation. - 1/8/2010 5:08:02 PM

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quote:

have found that some submissives have this ability to adjust their intelligence to a certain degree to whatever man they may be interested in at the time. If he is not quite as smart as she is she can dumb down a bit to enable the fantasy that she has a wise and knowing dom.

I could never do this! I could not submit to someone that was always saying things that I knew were wrong. I have a pretty extensive academic background, so, this is just an absurd notion to me. I want the person that I'm submitting to to be smarter than I am, period. I wouldn't be able to respect someone if I was constantly wanting to correct their spelling, among other things.

(in reply to osf)

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