Collarchat.com

Join Our Community		 Collarchat.com

Home  Login  Search 

RE: insecurities?


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Polyamorous Lifestyles >> RE: insecurities? Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 2:10:13 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xangelbabeex

All that I can say here is that you aren't all hearing the whole relationship story...


And what...you thought we didn't know that already?  Please.

quote:

I am the sister... and please understand that she does get 95% of his time... she sleeps in his bed every night...


If you're having sex with him and waking her up, that's clearly false.  Does he get up after sex with you and go back to the bed he shares with her or does he stay with you?  If he stays, then she's not sleeping in the same bed every night. 

quote:

I did tell her I was upset with her post, yes...


And yet you still felt compelled to come here and post.  That says far more about you than about her.

quote:

because what you aren't hearing is that she appears to be very unhappy in this relationship... long before I came along. He is in a great deal of pain most of the time... he has a shatter back that refused onto the nerves... and she wants what he used to be... the very Dom Master. Over the years they lived together they became VERY vanilla... he doesn't want vanilla. He wants the slave that she was before... and she wants the Master that he was before... (he is still very Dom but cant' do all the things he used to do.)  I am sorry that she has implied that I want him all to myself... it really is the other way around. He can't always follow through on things he says he is going to do... and I am not going to address all of the things she bashed in his and my relationship... but she didn't really tell you that she is not happy with who/what her Master is and wants him to change.


Learning to live with a disability is a process, much like the processes of dying and grieving.  OF COURSE she wants the person he used to be.  He wants to be that person too, I'm sure.  This is something that has nothing to do with you -- so why are you making her feel worse by continuing to point it out?  I'm sure she already feels angry and resentful that an injury took her "master" away and also feels guilty for feeling angry and resentful.  This is a normal part of the grieving process. 
 
For that matter, why are you making your master feel worse by pointing out that he shouldn't have made promises to her when he can't keep them?  Don't you think he knows he can't do all the things he used to do and don't you think he feels bad that he can't provide all the things he used to provide?  The real question is what are you doing to make both of their lives easier?  Or are you just fueling the problem?  Before you criticize her, you need to take a long look in the mirror and figure out how you've contributed to this problem.  Then go fix yourself.

quote:

She doesn't trust anything he says because she has "forced" him to make promises (set some stipulations) that he never should have made to her if he wasn't going to keep them. (and I feel she shouldn't have set on him because he is the Master).


I think this paragraph is a big part of the problem.  Again, this is none of your business.  Their relationship is theirs.  If he made promises to her that he hasn't kept, then that is his responsibility.  He can either renegotiate with her or not, it's his choice.  It's most certainly not your place to decide that he was wrong to make them or that she was wrong to request them.  You're even more out of line to suggest that he shouldn't fulfill those obligations.  How dare you?  You don't have to like it, but you do have to respect their relationship, just as she has to respect his relationship with you.  It's not up to you to decide whether or not she has the right to ask for or even demand whatever she needs to get her emotional needs met and feel secure. 

quote:

She thought this relationship would be different...s he thought it would be what she was in before... where his vanilla girlfriend was the alpha submissive (also switch) He told her from the start this wouldn't be the same... that there would be no alpha and that we would both be on the same level. She doesn't want that. She wants things that are just hers.. (which I understand) but there is nothing that is JUST mine.. nor would I ever ask it... not as his submissive.


So, because the relationship isn't living up to your expectations, you feel justified in doing whatever you can to undermine it and make her look like the bad guy, is that it?  Because that's how you sound. 

quote:

Either way... I am sorry that I was portrayed as this Dom stealing cowboy...


I read your post a couple of times, and then read it to my husband, just to make sure I wasn't unduly prejudiced.  I feel pretty confident when I say you don't have to be portrayed as a cowboy by someone else.  You do a plenty good job of it all by yourself.  If you're as self-serving and manipulative as your post, then it's no wonder she's unhappy with you.
 
If their relationship is malfunctioning, they need to go to therapy or whatever it takes to fix it.  It's your job to be supportive of them and encourage them to get the help they need.  From what I've seen, you're working overtime to drive a bigger wedge between them.  Obviously, your master is in good enough health to enjoy an active sex life with you and is master enough to feel he can handle two slaves.  So if he's doing well enough for you to consider a triad with them, then he's doing well enough to fix his relationship with her.  What are you doing to fix your relationship with her?  What are you doing to support them and make the transition to the new dynamic smoother for everyone?  From what I can see, the answer is nothing except play the victim and try to make your sister slave look bad. 
 
I don't, for a minute, believe anything in her post is news to you, not after two years in the relationship.  You're not a victim, no matter what you'd like us to believe.  It doesn't sound like she's lying to herself, but it does sound like you're trying to lie about her.  At the very least, you need to be honest with yourself as much as you say she does.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

(in reply to xangelbabeex)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 3:39:43 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xangelbabeex

She and I talked about her post... yes... and the fact that if she was going to post to try to get a meaningful opinion then she needed to tell the whole story.


The whole story according to who?  You?  Because that's not a realistic expectation.  Between reading your post and hers, it looks like she did a reasonably good job of telling the whole story, but it's her interpretation of the situation.  That's to be expected.

quote:

most times she and I are good (or I would have thought) other than when she is feeling very insecure...and the jealousy would hit full force.


Jealousy happens, that's life.  It's usually a signal that something is wrong and needs to be addressed.  The trick is to resolve the underlying issues so the jealousy doesn't return.  It sounds like that isn't happening in this case.  Sweeping a problem under the rug, or only making a token effort to resove it before returning to the old, unwelcome behavior isn't fixing the problem.  That applies to all of you, not just her.

quote:

I should also tell you that she wasn't trying to say she had problems with me (or that is what was told to me when I said "you blasted the crap about me in that post") she was trying to say that she had problems with him and the way that he handles things...


I think you should let her speak for herself and STFU.  It's not your place to speak for her.  Chances are she only told you that because you bullied her into saying it.  It sounds like she doesn't like confrontation and will do almost anything to avoid it, a fact you've undoubtedly exploited to your own advantage.

quote:

So you know we didn't wake her up at 3am. She happened to wake up and realize he wasn't in bed with her and got up and heard some things (like creaky floor boards... ) and sat here and got upset that he was in bed with me.


How do you know you didn't wake her?  I sincerely doubt you're as quiet as you think you are.  Maybe she's a light sleeper.  I'm a very light sleeper, so I know that the smallest sound can wake someone up, even if it's people whispering two rooms away.

quote:

I made plans for my own days out of work...


Not that you don't have the right to make your own plans, but why didn't you mention it to both of them at the same time?  At least then she would have had the information at the same time as your master.

quote:

I said to him "if you would like her to take a day out too so that you can have both your girls home on a day when there are no kids I am very okay with that."


Oh, so you deliberately told your master but not her.  Once again, you prove you don't really care about her feelings.  You could have avoided the situation if you'd included her in the plans, even if it was just telling her "By the way, I'm going to try to get these days off.  If you can take them off too so we can all spend time together, that would be great."  Instead, you left it up to your master to play the go-between so you wouldn't have to take the responsibility yourself.

quote:

Nobody told her she had to... he and I weren't making plans for her...


If you don't see how telling her on Tuesday that you're taking Thursday through Friday off and implying your master wants her to take off work on such short notice is inconsiderate or how she could interpret it as the two of you making plans without her or for her, then you're hopelessly naive.  You could have told her when you put in the request for time off, but you didn't.

quote:

He and I had been talking for months about recaulking the bathroom many times in front of her... never once did she say "I would like to help"


Read the bolded part again and then try to claim you included her in those plans.  I call bullshit.  Talking about something in front of another person is not the same thing as including that person in the conversation.  Did you ever ask what she thought?  Did you ask her if she'd be willing to help?  Did you even check to see if the day you'd planned for doing the job was convenient for her?  I'm guessing the answer is no, yet you blame the entire situation on her insecurities?  If I were in her place, I'd have either kicked your ass to the curb or walked out.  The fact that she is still there, putting up with your crap after two years, is a testament to how much she really does want the relationship to work.  You need to check yourself, because you are as much a part of the problem as anyone else.  Maybe more.

quote:

She isn't telling you that the 3 of us have sat down on many occassions and talked this all through... and everything seems fine and poof right back to being jealous.


And how much of that is that is because *poof* you go right back to doing the same things that upset her?  I guarantee it's 50 percent, at a minimum.  It's obvious you don't take her feelings seriously and that you see her as the one who is creating the problem.  You need to check yourself, because what I see is someone who is so selfish she thinks she can do no wrong and, therefore, doesn't need to take any responsibility for her faults.  You are unbelievably arrogant if you think you haven't contributed to any problems the three of you have.  Get a grip.

quote:

most times she ends up making me feel bad that I make more money or take days that she can't.


I get the impression you probably rub it in her face too.  Gee, I can't imagine why she'd be resentful of it.

quote:

 I am sorry that when I buy something for the house (or for them or him) that she takes it personally... she doesn't see that I assist in providing for the house... she just sees that she doesn't make as much money ...and that because I buy stuff for them or the house that I am doing something for him/the house that she can't.


That's exactly what you are doing.  You may see it as being generous, but what you're doing is pointing out that you have more disposable income than she does.  Why are you buying things for the house without consulting her?  Why aren't the two of you -- or better yet, all three of you -- making the decision about what will be purchase and when, together?  She supported herself and your master for four years, by herself.  Now that you all live together, she should have more disposable income.  Why doesn't she?  Oh, that's right...she pays you rent that you clearly don't need, but she's the insecure one.  Un-fucking-believable.

quote:

I sit and play mediator...


You shouldn't have to play mediator between the two of them.  They're adults, it's up to them to resolve their issues.

quote:

she waited until almost a year into the relationship after the feelings were too strong to just toss me aside to say I don't want this... this isn't what I thought it would be.


The first year of a new relationship is the honeymoon phase.  It's easy to overlook things that aren't working when you're in the thoes of New Relationship Energy (NRE).  It's likely she didn't realize the relationship wasn't working for her any sooner.  That's not really the point.  The point is that when she did bring it up and say it isn't working, you and your master told her to suck it up instead of listening and trying to find a solution that would work for all of you.  That's pretty sleazy.

quote:

As far as the poly (and very D/s) relationship and situation... I think I have a better understanding of what it is all about than she does. I have a better grasp of what he wants out of this relationship because this is how I was brought in, no vanilla time in the middle of the relationship, etc.


OMG, you are such an arrogant bitch.  You have no idea what the previous relationship was like or why it worked.  She's been his slave for 9 years, 5 of them as part of a poly relationship, yet you think after 2 years in your very first poly relationship you've got it all figured out?  Astounding.

quote:

She thinks that a poly D/s relationship must be what she was brought into. She isn't open to anything else... and can't handle anything else.


She has every right to want what she knows works for her.  It's true that she should be open to new things, but she still has a right to want what she wants and what will meet her emotional needs.  It's up to you and your master to give it to her.  If you don't, then the problems will never get resolved because her needs aren't being met.

quote:

Master firmly believes that if he was to "give her what she wants" it won't be any better with them...


That's some flawed logic if ever I read it.  How does he know, if he hasn't tried?  If her desires don't work for the current relationship, then it's up to all of you to figure out what the real need is and meet it.  If she wants a certain type of structure to the relationship, then what is it about that structure that she needs?  Is it a sense of security from knowing what is expected of her and what to expect from you and your master?  If that's it, how can you meet that need in another way?  Whatever is lacking, figure it out and fix it.  She's telling you what's wrong, but it's clear neither you nor your master is listening.

If she doesn't want to maintain the poly relationship, then that's something she needs to figure out for herself.  But if she's asking for something to make the relationship work for her -- and by extension, all of you -- then you and your master should try to give it to her.  It's not unreasonable for her to expect her needs to be met, but it really sounds like your master isn't willing to give her what she's craving and trying so desperately to get.  If that's the case, then he needs to man up and break it off with her instead of blaming her for causing problems because he's too lazy/selfish/whatever to tell her he doesn't want her.  And it really does sound like he's trying to replace her with you, from what you've said.  No one deserves such shoddy treatment.
 
 
*Edited for formatting

< Message edited by SylvereApLeanan -- 3/14/2010 3:42:36 PM >

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

(in reply to xangelbabeex)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 4:48:18 PM   
xangelbabeex


Posts: 4
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline 		I am not going to respond to much of this... I just don't have time or energy. You can blast me if you want... you don't know me, Master, my sister or the schemantics of our relationship.... A few things that I can't help but comment on... he does not spend the night in my bed... because of her feelings... because she can't stand him being in my bed... the promises all involved me and what she said he can/can't do with me... (after a year of my being collared to him) promises like when she isn't there he can't have me in his bed... and we stayed to that until she went away for a week... and he made the decision (even though I said I didn't think it was a good idea) to do so... they talked about it before she went away... it wasn't a surprise... but, she said "ok" because she didn't want to say that she wasn't ok with it. Also, Master is the one who tells her time and again that he can't be what he used to be to her... I am not the one who came up with that on my own.

All he cared about was her feelings until he took into consideration that he is the Master and she is the slave and basically if he took her jealousy and feelings into consideration in everything he did he might as well leave. He didn't feel he was ready to do that. We still take a lot of her feelings into consideration... and we do care about what she feels... but shouldn't that go both way? Yes, their relationship would be their relationship if Master wanted it that way... he considers this a relationship of 3 with 3 lives involved. And, I wouldn't probably involve myself but they both come to me with their upsets about each other... there are certain things that I tell both of them that I can't speak to and I listen and shut up.

Yes, I know that she can't stand confrontation... actually neither can I... and I know that she has a lot problems with her own self worth, self image/esteem, sooo many insecurities... and we try to help her by asking what she wants... her only answer (ever) is for him to follow through on anything he says he will do when he implies that he will do it... sometimes those are things that he thought he said he would do... (sometimes she has a valid gripe too)

She is a very heavy sleeper by the way... and most times we are pretty quiet because my two kids are in the house.

All I have to say as an end to my replies on this post is that you don't know me... you only know a tiny shred of everything going on here... I don't understand how your post became so angry to me... I have to rack it up to you don't know me or my sister or the full truth behind the relationship and already made your own conclusions about me long before you read my post. I am sorry that you see me so violently. (and your post to me is quite violent and attacking.)

(in reply to SylvereApLeanan)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 4:54:13 PM   
xangelbabeex


Posts: 4
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline 		So you know... I read a little thing else up there... Master has tried to give her what he thinks she wants... and it doesn't seem to make her happy.... the relationship that she was in... yes, there were some times that it worked... but she also implies that the other relationship was also very painful... she states usually because of the other woman he was with... she wasn't very happy then either. (at least that is what she pretty much says... I don't hear about the good times in that) At this point the only thing that she thinks that will make her happy is the two of them packing up and tossing me aside and going somewhere together. We know she is unhappy with this relationship... we have both tried almost on a weekly basis to help her through things... to help her to understand... and to try to get her to give us some tiny idea... we have tried for the last 2 years... we actually don't want to lose her...

Yes, it is a work in progress and we are trying and working to do what we can... but some of the things being asked ... he might as well just move out and be alone with her.

I am not sure what else to say... ok sorry just going to log off and not read how much someone hates me who doesn't even know me.

(in reply to xangelbabeex)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 6:57:49 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xangelbabeex

the promises all involved me and what she said he can/can't do with me...


This is pretty typical of poly relationships, especially when there is an established primary unit and one of the partners is taking on a secondary partner.  The primary partner can ask for stipulations, such as veto power on a potential partner, that there is a condom compact (a verbal or written contract that states condoms will always be used with anyone other than the primary partner) in place, or where major holidays are spent.  Guess what -- it is her right to ask for those things.  If he didn't want to agree to whatever it was she asked, then he should have said so.  If he agreed to something, then he needs to abide by the agreement or renegotiate it.  However, if she's not willing to adjust or remove the stipulations they both agreed to, then that's her right and he has to live with it or leave.

quote:

promises like when she isn't there he can't have me in his bed... and we stayed to that until she went away for a week... and he made the decision (even though I said I didn't think it was a good idea) to do so...


So what you're saying is that he made a promise to her and then broke it at the first opportunity.  That says a lot about his character, none of it good.  It speaks well of you that you expressed your reservations, but you still went along with what amounts to him cheating on her.  You knew they had agreements in place but you didn't think she had a right to expect them to be kept, so you let him convince you to break his pledge to her.  Putting up a token resistence doesn't absolve you of your responsibility in the situation.

quote:

 they talked about it before she went away... it wasn't a surprise... but, she said "ok" because she didn't want to say that she wasn't ok with it.


Why am I not surprised?  This sounds like a classic case of one partner pressuring the other into agreeing to something out of selfishness.  A share of the blame falls on her for not having the wherewithal to stand up for herself, but more of it falls on your master for pressuring her.

quote:

Master is the one who tells her time and again that he can't be what he used to be to her...


It sounds like they both need to go to counseling.  Clearly, she's having trouble dealing with his disability.  That's fairly common too, but this seems more like a red herring he's using as an excuse to back out of committments he made to her.

quote:

All he cared about was her feelings until he took into consideration that he is the Master and she is the slave and basically if he took her jealousy and feelings into consideration in everything he did he might as well leave.


Guess what, "because I'm the master and I say so" doesn't work in a poly relationship.  Every partner has the right to have his or her feelings considered and validated.  If he's not willing to take her feelings into consideration in everything he does, then she's better off without him.  This sounds like it's the real problem and it's likely her behavior is because she senses it.  It's his responsibility to lead the relationship and do what is best for everyone in it.  It doesn't sound like he's upholding his end of the deal.

quote:

We still take a lot of her feelings into consideration... and we do care about what she feels... but shouldn't that go both way?


Yes, it should.  However, there's a saying among polyfolk that a poly relationship only moves as fast as the slowest member of the group.  That means that the other partners might have to proceed more slowly than they would like in order to make the least secure partner comfortable.  From what you've said, it sounds like you and your master haven't done that although you may think you have.  The bottom line is that your sister isn't comfortable and you and your master are blaming her instead of looking at yourselves and your behavior and trying to figure out how you've contributed to the problem.  You're making her the scapegoat instead of taking responsibility.

quote:

Yes, I know that she can't stand confrontation... actually neither can I... and I know that she has a lot problems with her own self worth, self image/esteem, sooo many insecurities...


Polyamory is no place for someone with major insecurities.  If what you say is true, then she needs to get out of the relationship and stick with monogamy.  However, if all of you are serious about maintaining the relationship, then get to family therapy sooner rather than later.  She may need help to get over her insecurity from a professional trained to provide it.  There's no shame in that, but all of you are going to have to make some sacrifices while she's working her issues.

quote:

we try to help her by asking what she wants... her only answer (ever) is for him to follow through on anything he says he will do when he implies that he will do it...


This speaks volumes about the situation.  Really.  If your master has proved to her through his repeated unreliability that she can't trust him, then her insecurity might be justified.  Blaming her for it is still the wrong thing to do.  She isn't lying to herself when she gives in to fear; she's basing it on his past track record and that's his fault, not hers.

quote:

All I have to say as an end to my replies on this post is that you don't know me... you only know a tiny shred of everything going on here... I don't understand how your post became so angry to me... I have to rack it up to you don't know me or my sister or the full truth behind the relationship and already made your own conclusions about me long before you read my post. I am sorry that you see me so violently. (and your post to me is quite violent and attacking.)


No, I've just been practicing polyamory for more than 20 years and I've seen your situation over and over again.  I've even experienced it myself, so I know what it looks like, inside and out.  Dysfunctional triads like yours are what give polyamory a bad name, because all of you want to pass blame around without taking any of it yourselves.  Eventually, your triad will self-destruct, likely with her leaving or being kicked out, and you'll all blame polyamory for the implosion instead of your own bad behavior.  At the very least, you and your master will blame her and think that replacing her will make it all better instead of recognizing that both of you contributed equally to the problems.  So you'll play this scenario out multiple times, hurting multiple people in the process.  It's hard enough to find people open to the idea of polyamory without dysfunctional triads like yours poisoning the well, so if I come across as angry, that's why.
 
If you're serious about maintaining the relationship with all three of you, then take my earlier suggestion and pick up a copy of Opening Up by Tristan Taormino.  You can get it on Amazon.com and it's not too expensive.  All of you should read it, together if possible, and then talk about each of the sections.  If you can find a family therapist who's friendly toward alternative lifestyles, you should see one together.  For once, try listening to what your sister is really trying to say.  If she's saying "I don't want master to spend the night in sister's bed" what she probably means is "I need to be reassured that I am not expendable and won't be forced out."  If she says, "I want master to follow through on what he says he'll do when he says he'll do it" what she probably means is "master has proven he is unreliable and this makes me feel very insecure."  Master needs to either man up and be reliable or he needs to renegotiate with her if he finds he can't be.  Lack of reliability will destroy the trust in a relationship almost as fast as a bald-faced lie.  As the master, his word is his bond.  If he won't keep his word, then he doesn't deserve to have one slave, let alone two. 
 
quote:

At this point the only thing that she thinks that will make her happy is the two of them packing up and tossing me aside and going somewhere together. We know she is unhappy with this relationship... we have both tried almost on a weekly basis to help her through things... to help her to understand... and to try to get her to give us some tiny idea... we have tried for the last 2 years... we actually don't want to lose her...


It's possible she's just not cut out for polyamory.  However, the way you phrased this says a lot.  "We have tried to help her" and "we don't want to lose her" implies that you already think of yourselves as the primary unit and think of her as a third wheel.  Do you really think she doesn't sense this?  Can you imagine how painful it must be for her to spend 4 years as the primary partner and then to feel herself being slowly edged out and replaced by you?  Can you blame her for feeling insecure?  Yet she's stayed for the past 2 years, trying to make it work and has been with your master for 9 years.  That says a lot, either about her dedication or her co-dependency.  I'll give her the benefit of the doubt and call it dedication.
 
You've been doing the same thing over and over for two years and it's not working.  I'm sure you know the cliche about the definition of insanity.  Time to try something different.  I recommend family counseling for all of you.  At the very least, check out some of the books, message boards, and websites about polyamory.  Use the resources available to you.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

(in reply to xangelbabeex)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 8:28:40 PM   
chamberqueen


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline 		xangelbabeex, I have to admit that I also noticed something Sylvere pointed out:  you say WE as if you and your Master are a team and your sister is an outsider yet in earlier posts it was stated that you two are considered equals.  I'm very surprised that for things like which bed your Master will sleep in that the three of you don't sit down together to discuss it or your Master simply get input from each of you and make up his own mind - or even make it up without consulting you.

In my household I am the Alpha and there are times that my Master and I discuss the beta but that is specifically because it is my ongoing task to train her.  I am to report any punishable offenses but deal with anything petty, including her temper tantrums, myself.  Other than for training purposes, or me explaining to him that something is very difficult for her so that he can help her, we do not discuss her behind her back unless one of us is complimenting her to the other.  If there is a problem that she and I can't settle on our own the three of us sit down and talk about it together.  Our personalities are very different; I am very intellectual and she is very emotional so there are times that it is difficult for the two of us because we can't always understand each other's problems, but one of us never sides with the Master against the other. 

One of the most valuable lessons I've learned is that a large gap in maturity - whether it be within the lifestyle or simply emotional maturity - can be exhausting.  You can both be doing your absolute best for your Master and be looking down your noses at the other because it seems like they can't keep up, but I would bet you each have something very special to offer him.  Some areas no doubt overlap and then there are those that you each wish you could also do well.  You are absolutely right - jealousies can arise from that.  You make more money, your sister wishes she could offer the same things to your Master that she can.  I'll bet that she has something to offer that you wish you could.  Next time she seems jealous try pointing out something that she does well.  I've found that has worked wonders with my own sister.  If one person is good in a lot of areas the other can feel incredibly overshadowed, but by letting them know that you appreciate something specific about them it can really make their day.  For a truly happy family a lot of the hard work falls on the shoulders not of the focal point (Master or Mistress) but of the others.  It is my deep devotion to my Master that makes me try so hard with my own sister.  Because of her poor behavior I would have gotten rid of her long ago, but she makes HIM happy so I am willing to do my best to help her.  Please, remember the focal point - and it isn't either you or your sister.


_____________________________



(in reply to SylvereApLeanan)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 10:46:40 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xangelbabeex

I am not going to respond to much of this... I just don't have time or energy. You can blast me if you want... you don't know me, Master, my sister or the schemantics of our relationship....


Some of your word choices seem to reflect a negative mindset, though reading more makes me think that he's the orchestrator of this negativity, not you.

quote:

A few things that I can't help but comment on... he does not spend the night in my bed... because of her feelings... because she can't stand him being in my bed... the promises all involved me and what she said he can/can't do with me... (after a year of my being collared to him) promises like when she isn't there he can't have me in his bed... and we stayed to that until she went away for a week...


So basically you started the relationship laying down ground rules that would make everyone happy, and then you two decided to break those rules. And you're blaming her with the logic of "if she was really a slave she wouldn't expect her master to stick to his word." That is just so mindbogglingly wrong.

quote:

and he made the decision (even though I said I didn't think it was a good idea) to do so... they talked about it before she went away... it wasn't a surprise... but, she said "ok" because she didn't want to say that she wasn't ok with it. Also, Master is the one who tells her time and again that he can't be what he used to be to her... I am not the one who came up with that on my own.


You thought it was a bad idea, and she thought it was a bad idea from the very start, and it's obviously causing problems in your relationships, and yet you keep doing it. Why?

quote:

All he cared about was her feelings until he took into consideration that he is the Master and she is the slave and basically if he took her jealousy and feelings into consideration in everything he did he might as well leave.


Um no, I think he has that backwards. It's when he doesn't take his partner's feelings into consideration, then he should leave. Because why stay in a relationship with a person if you don't give a fuck about their feelings?

quote:

He didn't feel he was ready to do that. We still take a lot of her feelings into consideration... and we do care about what she feels... but shouldn't that go both way?


Yes it should.

quote:

Yes, I know that she can't stand confrontation... actually neither can I... and I know that she has a lot problems with her own self worth, self image/esteem, sooo many insecurities... and we try to help her by asking what she wants... her only answer (ever) is for him to follow through on anything he says he will do when he implies that he will do it... sometimes those are things that he thought he said he would do... (sometimes she has a valid gripe too)


Wow so the answer to the problem is "follow through on your word" and he can't do that? That's...pretty shitty.

quote:

All I have to say as an end to my replies on this post is that you don't know me... you only know a tiny shred of everything going on here... I don't understand how your post became so angry to me... I have to rack it up to you don't know me or my sister or the full truth behind the relationship and already made your own conclusions about me long before you read my post. I am sorry that you see me so violently. (and your post to me is quite violent and attacking.)


Reading more of your replies makes me think you're not a bad person but your relationship is still very dysfunctional and you (and she, and especially he) did contribute to it being that way. I actually think that you guys could make the poly situation work, but possibly not the M/s situation. How would you feel about her taking an 'alpha slave' role rather than an 'equal slave' role in the relationship?

This part of your other post spoke to me:

quote:

Yes, it is a work in progress and we are trying and working to do what we can... but some of the things being asked ... he might as well just move out and be alone with her.


You mentioned earlier that what she keeps insisting on is that he keeps his promises, and that all of those promises were in the way he relates to you. I'm wondering why those conditions seemed tolerable enough for you to enter this relationship but aren't acceptable to fall back to?

It really seems to me that she wants to take more of a 'primary' role and that she has expectations of having her needs and desires met that might put her more into the 'submissive' category and less than the 'slave' one.

Anyway I was probably a bit harsh before, I'm sorry for that, I hope you both keep coming to this thread because it sounds like you need an outside opinion - all you're saying seems to stem from your master's opinions that can be boiled down to "the master does what he wants" and after hearing about how he hasn't kept his word on things like sleeping in your bed (ie promises that were broken by his choice rather than circumstances of his disability) I think that you all need to make the relationship more about the 3 of you and less just about his needs and wants.

One thing I'd just like to stress - please try to be more considerate. He promised her that he wouldn't sleep in your bed, now you two are breaking that promise. You're helping him break it and that makes you just as culpable - I'm sure she wouldn't mind him sleeping in your bed if you weren't sleeping in it with him, you know? Just think of it like this - someday, down the road, he might promise you something, and it might mean a lot to you that he keeps that promise. Just think how betrayed you'd feel if your sister (her, or a future sister) was helping him break it, then telling you that you should get over it. It would hurt, a lot. And from the type of man he seems to be, him doing this to you seems nearly inevitable.

< Message edited by Elisabella -- 3/14/2010 10:49:48 PM >

(in reply to xangelbabeex)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: insecurities? - 3/14/2010 10:59:59 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxownedslavexx

Well after having both my Master snap at me this morning after I posted this and having my sister do the same I am no longer going to be posting how I feel. Originally I was told by my Master to post here about my feelings and that way a third party could set me straight since I didn't seem to be getting the message from Him. Again it seems in even following a direction given by Him , that I have failed. I am not going to say how I feel and how I see things - which is what I was told to do , only to get lamb basted for doing so


I meant to comment on this earlier...this just seems so abusive to me.

I'll tell you why he got upset, and it's not because you failed. It's because he expected people here to 'set you straight' and instead we called him out on his insensitive jerkitude, and he didn't like it, so he put the blame on you.

It's not your fault. I am so sorry that you are financially supporting this loser to the extent that you don't even have the money to get out of the relationship and move out on your own. And I'll be honest, I don't think it's your sister's fault either. I think this guy is being a colossal jerk.

One thing I want to ask - what happened in your previous relationship with him and the other woman? Did he end up leaving her for you? Because that might explain some of this if it's his tendency to move on to the newer shinier woman thing when he totally wears out the old one.

< Message edited by Elisabella -- 3/14/2010 11:00:22 PM >

(in reply to xxownedslavexx)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: insecurities? - 3/15/2010 1:12:53 AM   
SirKen963


Posts: 8
Joined: 2/24/2005
Status: offline 		Well hello all .. I am the insensative jerk you're all talking about.  Glad to meet you all. Figure I would finally read this and see what is going on .   First off I told her 5 months ago to make a post , and type down what has been going on .

This was to help her get her feelings out in the open  ( even if it was on a post) because she will not say what is bothering her.  Instead it's because you made the bed, or because you did'nt make the bed.  Or my favorite is when she gets home it's.. I thought you did this that is why I and upset.  I love my slave.. I love my submissive.  All I want is for her to be happy and that is just not happenning in any shape or form.  We talk .. I take her feelings into consideration ... the whole house revoles around her not to piss her off.

Having my slave post was a assignment ..one she did fail at because she did not tell it like it was .. so so so much was left out.  And her sister loves and cares for her so much. She would and does so much for her.  And becasue of her not telling the truth in her post , now her sister feels as though she is being bashed for telling the truth.

I do not expect you all to know what is going on and know the whole story and MY GOD I did not think that most of you where so Mean.  Is this how you going about helping people?
There is 2 sides to every story .. there are different emotions and feelings that are just too hard to explain in a post for you to fully understand.  And i do not expect you to understand fully.

Now the last thing I would like to say, for those of you who think you know Me and my disability. You know the lowlife you think I am.  In 96 i had a 1500 lb trailer drop on me and I broke 5 vertebraes in my back. Plus crushed my shoulder and left foot .. and 15 staples in my head. It took me 2 years to get back to work, but i did it. Even when the Drs. were telling me I will be in a wheel chair for most of my life.  So I got back to work for 10 years before I was in to much pain to even stand anymore. 
It saddens me to see my Girls unhappy and I would do anything in the world for them.

So this will be the last post from either one of my Girls for it is not doing them any good . In fact it is doing more harm.

(in reply to xxownedslavexx)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: insecurities? - 3/15/2010 5:38:10 AM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKen963

Well hello all .. I am the insensative jerk you're all talking about.  Glad to meet you all. Figure I would finally read this and see what is going on .   First off I told her 5 months ago to make a post , and type down what has been going on .


It's about time. I was wondering if the one who is supposed to be in charge was going to weigh in.

quote:

This was to help her get her feelings out in the open  ( even if it was on a post) because she will not say what is bothering her.  Instead it's because you made the bed, or because you did'nt make the bed.


Well it half worked. She got to say a lot of things that are bothering her. You're just not taking it seriously. I wonder how much you even contemplated her post - she wrote a LOT of things that bothered her there. Things like feeling left out, feeling like the two of you make plans without reaching out to include her, being insensitive about your sexual activity, you promising you wouldn't sleep in angelbabe's bed then breaking that promise, feeling like the financial inequalities are rubbed in her face, feeling like she's put in a dependant position because even though she earns less than your other slave she still gives you more financial support, etc.

And your response to all those things is to completely and utterly dismiss her feelings and tell her that her feelings are wrong and she wrote them wrong. Do you not see the problem with this?

quote:

  Or my favorite is when she gets home it's.. I thought you did this that is why I and upset.  I love my slave.. I love my submissive.  All I want is for her to be happy and that is just not happenning in any shape or form.  We talk .. I take her feelings into consideration ... the whole house revoles around her not to piss her off.


There is a difference between self righteously walking on eggshells and making intrinsic changes in yourself and your relationship that will get rid of the need to do so.

quote:

Having my slave post was a assignment ..one she did fail at because she did not tell it like it was .. so so so much was left out. 


She wrote her feelings, honestly. Obviously there will be stuff left out in anything shorter than War and Peace, the point is to focus on what she said. The parts that were mentioned are the parts that are in the forefront of her mind and rather than say "but you didn't mention this" you need to look at what she did say and realize that's the core issues she's having.

quote:

And her sister loves and cares for her so much. She would and does so much for her.  And becasue of her not telling the truth in her post , now her sister feels as though she is being bashed for telling the truth.


Well I can tell you're not taking sides here

quote:

I do not expect you all to know what is going on and know the whole story and MY GOD I did not think that most of you where so Mean.  Is this how you going about helping people?


No, it's how I go about telling people the truth. I don't see a healthy relationship here. I see a lot of people making mistakes. The OP included, but from the way you and angelbabe go on it's all her fault. So I encouraged her to leave and find someone who actually likes being around her.

quote:

There is 2 sides to every story .. there are different emotions and feelings that are just too hard to explain in a post for you to fully understand.  And i do not expect you to understand fully.


I understand perfectly - there's a disagreement. You think your side is the 'right' side and the OP thinks hers is the 'right' side. The thing is, both you and angelbabe's posts have strongly reinforced everything the OP said. I'm not taking the OP's word for it, I'm taking your word for it too. The posts by you and angelbabe both say the same thing - you and angelbabe see your relationship as strong and see the OP as someone who is bringing you guys down by having problems that you don't care to fix.

Which is pretty much what the OP said, except she framed it in the sense of "insecurities" and all I can say is if I were in her position with you telling her to leave if she doesn't like it, I'd be insecure too!

quote:

Now the last thing I would like to say, for those of you who think you know Me and my disability. You know the lowlife you think I am.  In 96 i had a 1500 lb trailer drop on me and I broke 5 vertebraes in my back. Plus crushed my shoulder and left foot .. and 15 staples in my head. It took me 2 years to get back to work, but i did it. Even when the Drs. were telling me I will be in a wheel chair for most of my life.  So I got back to work for 10 years before I was in to much pain to even stand anymore. 


That does suck. But like I said in my earlier post there's a difference between changes made because they were forced by your disability and changes that you chose to make, such as sleeping in angelbabe's bed after you'd promised ownedslave you wouldn't. You can't blame that on your disability, that's your own choice to go back on your word.

quote:

It saddens me to see my Girls unhappy and I would do anything in the world for them.


You might want to make that more clear to them because the impression I got from both of them was that you feel that as the master your desires outweigh theirs.

quote:


So this will be the last post from either one of my Girls for it is not doing them any good . In fact it is doing more harm.


I'm sorry that we couldn't tell your girl what you expected her to hear. Perhaps instead of just shielding them from any opinion that contradicts your own you can actually read some of what was written and stop being so selfish. All I see in this post is whining and excuses, no reason why you went back on your promises, no interest in actually hearing what one of your girls has to say, you're basically mad that she told *her* story instead of the story you would have wanted her to tell and when the advice she gets says that you're doing things wrong you get pissy. Which really is all I would have expected from what I heard of you but it's still nice to have my suspicions confirmed that you really are as much of a selfish jerk as you've been portrayed.

< Message edited by Elisabella -- 3/15/2010 5:42:27 AM >

(in reply to SirKen963)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: insecurities? - 3/15/2010 8:05:05 AM   
ownedbyPF


Posts: 126
Joined: 2/18/2010
Status: offline 		SylvereApleanan and Elisabella can I just say you two absolutely rocked on this!!

I'm not in a poly relationship. It is something my Master has some interest in possibly at some point in the future. I admit at first this was a concept whose possibility scared the bejesus outta me! I'm not saying I'm all good with it now, but I've come along way in it because of several things. One being my Master and talking with him about it and secondly from reading over here. The combination has made me go ohhhhh ok I get it... or I get the idea of what it's supposed to be like at any rate.

So I read this whole exchange and even I thought... wow this isn't right at all! This isn't working together or making everyone secure together or anything! And my second thought was.... He promised slave one that slave two wouldn't be in their bed. He broke that promise at first chance. Slave two did atleast say she thought it wasn't a good idea, but to me, bigger picture is that if I were slave two, I'd be wonderring how long it was before the promises made to me were just as inconsequential!?!

And yeah Elisabella I am stumped on whose side he's taking
~s

(in reply to SylvereApLeanan)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: insecurities? - 3/15/2010 10:51:13 AM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKen963

Well hello all .. I am the insensative jerk you're all talking about.  Glad to meet you all. Figure I would finally read this and see what is going on .   First off I told her 5 months ago to make a post , and type down what has been going on .


Took you long enough to muster up the balls to speak.  Only slightly less time than it took your girl to muster up the courage to make her post.  Bravo.

quote:

This was to help her get her feelings out in the open  ( even if it was on a post) because she will not say what is bothering her.  Instead it's because you made the bed, or because you did'nt make the bed.  Or my favorite is when she gets home it's.. I thought you did this that is why I and upset. 


Really?  Because it sounds to me like she's been tying to tell you what's wrong and you're not listening.  More importantly, she told you what she needed and wanted, you promised to give it to her, and then you broke your promise.  If you loved her, you would have kept your word to her, but you didn't.  That's the long and short of it.  You made a vow and then betrayed it.  Spin it any way you like, the fact remains you are foresworn.  She now knows your word is worthless, so why should she trust you to take care of her other emotional needs?

quote:

Having my slave post was a assignment ..one she did fail at because she did not tell it like it was .. so so so much was left out. 


Bullshit.  She posted everything that was important to her and she posted how she felt about it.  If her assignment was to get her feelings out, then she's accomplished it, so don't you dare say she's wrong.  How dare you invalidate her feelings that way?  Fuck you and the horse you rode in on.
 
quote:

And becasue of her not telling the truth in her post , now her sister feels as though she is being bashed for telling the truth.


Wah, wah, wah.  Her sister wasn't bashed for telling the truth, she was called out for her presumptuous arrogance and her utter lack of sensitivity.  She can put on her big girl panties and cope.

quote:

 Is this how you going about helping people?


That's funny, your girl emailed me and thanked me for being understanding.  So yeah, I guess it is.  However, the point here is that you should consider this a wakeup call.  You're getting feedback from neutral parties and, lo and behold, you and your other girl aren't looking too good.  You're both getting your share of the blame rather than laying it all on your first girl's shoulders.  Feels pretty lousy, doesn't it?  Imagine enduring the same thing for 2 years and you'll have an idea of what your first girl has had to deal with from you.  How's that for crappy?

quote:

Now the last thing I would like to say, for those of you who think you know Me and my disability. You know the lowlife you think I am.  In 96 i had a 1500 lb trailer drop on me and I broke 5 vertebraes in my back. Plus crushed my shoulder and left foot .. and 15 staples in my head. It took me 2 years to get back to work, but i did it. Even when the Drs. were telling me I will be in a wheel chair for most of my life.  So I got back to work for 10 years before I was in to much pain to even stand anymore. 


Who gives a fuck?  That is *so* not the point.  Did having a trailer fall on you make you incapable of honesty?  Did it remove your ability to keep a promise you made?  If you're saying it did, then you are completely full of shit.  Take some responsibility for your own actions.

quote:

So this will be the last post from either one of my Girls for it is not doing them any good . In fact it is doing more harm.


Oh yeah, it's doing harm because OH MY GOD your first girl might just realize you're an emotionally abusive asshat and she might not be willing to put up with your crap if she knows other people with experience in polyamory think this situation sucks and she shouldn't put up with it.  Can't have her getting the idea she might have a valid case, now can we? 

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

(in reply to SirKen963)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: insecurities? - 3/16/2010 8:27:40 AM   
allthatjaz


Posts: 2878
Joined: 8/20/2008
Status: offline 		Hell, what a drama! Elisabella said the same things that were on my mind whilst reading this.
Looks to me like its two cowboys and one Indian.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella




I meant to comment on this earlier...this just seems so abusive to me.

I'll tell you why he got upset, and it's not because you failed. It's because he expected people here to 'set you straight' and instead we called him out on his insensitive jerkitude, and he didn't like it, so he put the blame on you.

It's not your fault. I am so sorry that you are financially supporting this loser to the extent that you don't even have the money to get out of the relationship and move out on your own. And I'll be honest, I don't think it's your sister's fault either. I think this guy is being a colossal jerk.

One thing I want to ask - what happened in your previous relationship with him and the other woman? Did he end up leaving her for you? Because that might explain some of this if it's his tendency to move on to the newer shinier woman thing when he totally wears out the old one.



_____________________________

S&M (Steve and Maria) persona libre de convencionalismos


Fan of edgeplay.co.uk

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: insecurities? - 3/18/2010 6:05:34 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		This is great drama indeed

i think jealousy is dreadfully naf... i have experienced sick jealousy and i do not wish it on anybody.

The people who suffer the behaviour of the jealous person have my sympathy

The insecure person has to build their self esteem somehow and stop wining about their insecurities... it is really very unhelpful to wallow in insecurity and helplessness and blame other people for your discomfort and make them suffer your jealousy... it is indeed a sickness, the jealous person will have to cure themselves or get out... there really is no other way....
if you Carry on with the sickly green jealousy you will eventually be puked out.

besides being jealous does the first woman have any nice characteristics?

why is the poorest woman paying for the Dom?

I believe it is a ridiculous notion to be in a poly relationship and be jealous of the sex that other people in the relationship are having...

does that not just mean that you are NOT poly?

Also it seems that the Dominant should take the lead proper and sort his women out. Make proper schedules and timetables, make sure everybody knows who does what and who makes the beds and who sleeps where at what time.

he should not treat the jealousy by walking on egg shells, he should confront it head on and make her do physically tiring chores when she suffers mental anguish, a good workout tends to calm the brain.

(in reply to allthatjaz)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: insecurities? - 3/18/2010 6:51:51 AM   
chamberqueen


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline 		ranja, your post seems like a bit of an oversimplification to me.  A person can be insecure and yet NOT be jealous. 

If you take any two people, each will have strengths that the other does not.  One will be likely to be more secure than the other, one will tend to be quieter than the other, etc.  There may be times when one wishes that she could do some of the things that the other one can, or have some of the privileges or possessions that she has, but it doesn't necessarily mean that she is jealous.

This case, to me, sounds like there is a fairly insecure slave sister who finds it difficult to make herself heard.  It sounds like that is more self imposed than anything.  There is a second slave sister who not only is more secure but takes it even to the level of feeling the need to act as mediator between the Master and the first sister.  While she is trying to be helpful this could actually be detracting from the bond between the Master and the first sister in the long run.  While there has been communication it appears that much of it has not been meaningful enough to work things out. 

I found it very interesting to hear all three perspectives, and I talked with my own Master about the fact that each partner can see the same thing in such different ways.  Our backgrounds and personalities can color how we see the same event and leave each one feeling very differently about it.  In many cases it is because there are hidden truths. 


_____________________________



(in reply to ranja)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: insecurities? - 3/18/2010 11:42:50 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		maybe... quite often they go together and her insecurity is felt as jealousy by both the others...

nobody can give another security, it is something that you have to find within yourself and when you can not find it there is no point in blaming others, that won't help at all.

it is always best to keep problems as simple as possible in my opinion... if you make them too complicated you get confused and there is no way out and everybody remains tangled in a web of unhappyness.

I talked about the thread with my Husband aswell... He thinks that the three people in this thread suffering the problem are most likely only one person just having a laugh.
He does not understand why any self respecting Dom would come into a thread like this and say anything at all.
He is usually right and if He isn't, usually He should be.

Anyhow i thought it was interesting too.

(in reply to chamberqueen)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: insecurities? - 3/18/2010 11:46:58 AM   
chamberqueen


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline 		Actually, my Master said the whole problem would be solved if only they all slept in a king sized bed.  : )  His real point is that both needed to feel included and special.  When one feels on the outside - even if they have put themselves there unintentionally - problems are likely to erupt.

_____________________________



(in reply to ranja)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: insecurities? - 3/19/2010 3:25:36 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		Yes indeed, but i don't think the insecure one wants the other in their bed... i think the insecure one is the one dictating who sleeps in what bed, really she is running the show and miserable with it because she knows in her heart that she is not in control at all... it is very difficult to make a person feel included if they do not cooperate and are not willing to join in or share.

I think it is best to have that chart up on the wall and write down who sleeps in what bed on which nights the girls could have him 3 nights each and one night all together or all on their own depending on their mood.

I found it very strange and totally naive that the insecure one went on holiday and expected the other two to sleep in different beds... i thought it was very strange that people here thought that it was unacceptable that her rules had been broken...
i mean wasn't it obvious that they would sleep together?
Why did the insecure one make them promise that they would not?
and why did they actually appease her?
Why did the three of them make such a mess out of such a straight forward thing?...
one goes on holiday, so the other two will sleep together, basta.

Same with him going off in the middle of the night to have a bit of nookie in the other bedroom, i mean what is the problem?
To me that is exactly what poly is about... otherwise you just have a live in maid or some lodger staying... surely poly means that you actually have sex with other people?

I am only poly in my dreams, and always only about sex... i have no real life experience with poly living but i think the poly thing is unworkable if one is jealous.


(in reply to chamberqueen)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: insecurities? - 3/19/2010 7:42:46 AM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ranja

I found it very strange and totally naive that the insecure one went on holiday and expected the other two to sleep in different beds... i thought it was very strange that people here thought that it was unacceptable that her rules had been broken...

i mean wasn't it obvious that they would sleep together?

Why did the insecure one make them promise that they would not?

and why did they actually appease her?

Why did the three of them make such a mess out of such a straight forward thing?...

one goes on holiday, so the other two will sleep together, basta.



I find it very strange that you find it acceptable to break a promise.

No, but if it was something they both wanted to do, and neither wanted to sleep alone, they should have discussed it first rather than doing it first and discussing it later.

Because she realized that it would cause problems in the relationship, she realized it would provoke jealousy, and guess what, she was right.

Presumably because her partner of 9 years actually loves her and isn't willing to break up with her over whose bed she sleeps in.

I agree, sleeping together while ownedslave was on holiday did create a big mess and an even bigger breach of trust. I'd hate to be with someone who would break his word every time I wasn't there.

If it were that simple it would have been discussed. The fact that they had to wait til she was gone to do it behind her back is proof enough they shouldn't have done it and even the other girl posted here saying she knew it was a bad idea and said so but let the guy talk her into it.

(in reply to ranja)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: insecurities? - 3/19/2010 11:02:44 AM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Whoa, what a mess! A mess I would place right at the feet of the one who is supposed to be in leadership or head of household. This has gone on for far too long which signifies there was a foundation crack in the first place. Rather than pointing fingers and taking sides or tossing out blame, where was the leader of this household? Why after so long did that leader again in my opinion misdirect and tell his submissive/slave/first in this relationship to come here and learn something from all here? Why could he not manage his own household without using those here as a balancing beam or way to prove a point?

Seriously this is far too complicated to handle on a message board. These boards are great for situations less complicated by people who have a decent foundation to start with, but this isn't the case here.

I know about disability and the process of getting disability. I know the suffering of pain and the financial struggles and how long it continues. I know the in's and out's of it and nothing you could say surprises me, but... BUT, when a dominant becomes vulnerable financially and has to move his current household into someone else's home, you are at the start of what could be a real problem if there isn't a sound foundation in which to do so.

So to the dominant who has chosen a side, which is wrong in my opinion even if there is some fault to be had in one of the ladies, he needs to see that it all starts with him. Choosing a side, which he clearly has and laying blame has resulted in his acting out as one he should be in leadership over, not as the leader of a household and family.

Hey, it isn't rocket science to know where your bread is getting buttered. It isn't rocket science to know that this will complicate an unstable situation. It isn't rocket science for many here to see that one has proven expendable in the situation and it just so happens to be the one that cared for him but couldn't do it all and then another was added to the mix, who has more than the first and the first is the bad guy... gee... While I can understand many of the issues here and can even relate to some of them... who is in charge here?

Now things are so out of hand I would recommend ripping the house down and rebuilding or let it fall into foreclosure and run for the hills.


_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!


(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 40
Page:   <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Polyamorous Lifestyles >> RE: insecurities? Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2023
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.184