RE: Well, you all were right about him...

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sexyred1 -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:40:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slaveluci quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 Domiguy's post was fucking right. Why? Because whatever happens to us, unless it is say, cancer, is our own fault. Well, that's certainly one opinion. Not mine, however. I know it's sacrilege to question the great one(s) around here, but I beg to differ with you both. "Whatever" happens to us - except cancer - is our own fault, eh? Wow, that's certainly an erroneous declaration from on high. I can think of several things that aren't someone's own fault that doesn't involve cancer. For instance, Master's stepdaughter worked an after-school job as a high school student. She was working the late shift in Wendy's one night when a gang shooting happened in the street. A bullet came through the restaurant window and hit her. That was her own fault? Yeah, I guess it was because (1) she chose to work, (2) she had the bad luck to be born in a town that had gangs and a myriad of other stupid "reasons" she was to blame for her own shooting. I'll have to let her know how much to blame she is for that[8\|]. Things happen to people all over the world everyday that, once again, is not cancer, and it's through no fault of their own. To think otherwise is pure stupidity and tunnel vision. I guess the point you were trying to make is that she really does need to take responsibility for her choices. That's true. I just wouldn't take my advice to the extreme that anything but cancer is her own fault............luci Once again, a disgruntled poster types before thinking. Shocking. I also love the attempt at sarcasm in saying "its sacrilege to question the great ones around here." and "declaration from on high". I am flattered you think we are so great, envious much? Anyway, not that I give a crap what you particularly think, however I do care about the other posters reading and contributing here. WHAT I said was what OTHERS besides Domiguy said, was that one can only control the actions of oneself. When it comes to relationships, patterns that need breaking, choosing partners, what you allow to happen to you and decisions to stay or go, YOU control the choices that effect the outcome. The OP asked a question and was warned that her actions would result in what happened and look, it went the way it did. I don't speak for Domiguy but I am sure he meant the same thing as I did. You chose to focus on cancer, something that happens to many people, out of their control. How stupid of you to think that was the extent of of my comparison. Do you honestly think that I or anyone else thinks that all the random evil and crap that happens daily to ALL OF US, not just YOUR family, is our own fault? You are the one with myopia and tunnel vision; you don't like my posts, so you could not control YOUR reaction to my post and interpreted it incorrectly. You made yourself look like an idiot. Everyone knows what I meant, except you.

LafayetteLady -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:40:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slaveluci Wow, wordy. First of all, I'm not using anything "obscure" to "validate" anything. I am very clearly making the point, based on something that happened in my own loved one's life, that many things happen to people that are totally out of their own control. I have no desire to attempt to make people "believe that we are nothing but dust in the wind...Just flotsam and jetsam moving about on a current of which we have no control over." I don't believe that and I never insinuated that I did. Totally fiction. You said, "The odds say that you are not being genuine with your post about the random shooting. Not to doubt you, but can I google the shooting?" Ya know, Domiguy, I know you pride yourself on being a total prick, but that just about clinches it. Fuck you, man. I don't lie and I have certainly never come into these forums and lied, esp. about something this important and tragic in my own family's life. I made a very true and very valid point and your response is to insinuate it's a lie. It's easy to hide behind a keyboard and Tupac's picture and spout such bullshit. What a coward, dude. Sad indeed. I stand by my post and by my sentiments. People ARE responsible for most of their choices but random shitty things happen to folks all the time and it is none of their own fault. If you can't grasp that, you've living a very sheltered life................luci luci, Of course there are random, horrible things that happen to people far beyond their control, and the tragedy to your family certainly would be among them. My sincerest hopes for your step daughter's full emotional and physical recovery. But I think your justified overwhelming anger that this random act struck your family may have you looking at things a little off kilter. The comparision of what happened to the OP and your stepdaughter are not even remote. In the case of the OP, she DOES need to own up to her own responsibility in what happened, with your stepdaughter, it was a horrible situation of wrong place, wrong time. That certainly doesn't negate any of your statements about domiguy, however. [:)] ETA: The face value of red's statement is different when the word "say" is used. "Unless it is cancer..." or "unless it is, say, cancer" makes "cancer" and example of something out of one's control.

sexyred1 -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:43:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... I don't want to hijack, but I am truly interested in what you said above. If you would care to elaborate either here or privately to me, I would appreciate it. Perhaps you never had incidents of cancer in your family or for yourself, so please indulge my curiousity.

juliaoceania -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:45:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... I don't want to hijack, but I am truly interested in what you said above. If you would care to elaborate either here or privately to me, I would appreciate it. Perhaps you never had incidents of cancer in your family or for yourself, so please indulge my curiousity. I will in private and perhaps I shouldn't have posted my beliefs on this thread..

domiguy -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:46:09 PM)
It's a horrible event and I feel sorry for the gal that got struck by a bullet through no fault of her own. Living in Chicago you hear of innocents getting caught in gang fire at a disturbing rate. It is hardly a newsworthy event anymore. However, in the larger picture it means absolutely zilch. If you look at all gunfire incidents and "accidental deaths" those struck by bullets where they are not the intended target is virtually a meaningless event. Not to downplay the devastating effects felt by those injured or their families and I hope the gal recovered from her injuries....To use her as an example is not overly relevant to the conversation...She is the anomaly of anomalies. To get an understanding of responsibiltiy you have to look at those struck by gunfire and what were they doing or participating in prior to being shot. This is going to be a bit harsh but let's take a look at the stepdaughters situation....I have no idea where this ocurred. There are some people that would refuse to work in a gang infested area. They would take a bus or a train to attempt to find work in an area that might minimize the danger. Many might not. Again, her situation is incredibly unique. Others who have been caught in drive by shootings were friends and accompanying the intended targets when they got hit. Are they to blame? No!!...Maybe? .Well, sort of...They played a part in their injuries by hanging out with some very suspect people. If I got shot at the bar while hanging out with Jeffff I should have recognized the fact that Jeffff has fucked more married women in this city than ovarian cancer and I should have chose better when picking a drinking companion. Jealous husbands are so sensitive!!! What's up with that shit? How many people are injured, hurt or killed due to their own actions or lack there of? I would guess it is a very strong majority. this conversation has gone way off topic. But what you are using to invalidate my point is rather akin to being struck by lightening. People don't walk around overly fearing the random acts of God...Gangs are another thing altogether. I hope the best for the gal that was shot but don't believe that is has anything to do with the present conversation at hand.

Jeffff -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:49:44 PM)
Look dude just wear the vest and everything will be fine.

domiguy -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 6:58:59 PM)
Cancer. Some of it is genetic...A predisposition for the shit which should be highly monitored. You got a pile of colon cancer in your family you better get checked out on a regular basis. Let's say you are the average dude. A pile of colon cancer in your family...You do nothing. Is it your fault when you get diagnosed with a devastating degree of cancer? What about sunscreen. I know the sun rays are damaging. I frequently go out fishing and for some reason forget to apply sunscreen or not on a frequent enough basis. I am not stupid. I know the risks. When a melanoma shows up should I blame the Sun. What about my diet? No one force feeds me. I choose what I consume. Should I eat healthier?...Ya think? We have control of so much that happens in our lives. So much we ignore for a variety of reasons. I'll eat better later. I'm young so I don't have to worry about any ramifications today. I'll start excercising soon. I am far from perfect. I can only imagine that when my health deteriorates I will wish that I had done more to prevent whatever is ocurring.

domiguy -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 7:02:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jeffff Look dude just wear the vest and everything will be fine. You wear the jimmy and I'll wear the vest. You are a very bad man. I hope June doesn't read this.

LafayetteLady -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 8:18:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... I don't want to hijack, but I am truly interested in what you said above. If you would care to elaborate either here or privately to me, I would appreciate it. Perhaps you never had incidents of cancer in your family or for yourself, so please indulge my curiousity. I will in private and perhaps I shouldn't have posted my beliefs on this thread.. I'm sure everyone who has ever had cancer strike them or their loved ones would love to hear how you think they deserve to be suffering from cancer and how they brought it on themselves. Yes, julia, there are times when it is best to keep one's beliefs to themselves lest they look like an unsympathetic fool

Phoenixpower -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 8:32:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... I don't want to hijack, but I am truly interested in what you said above. If you would care to elaborate either here or privately to me, I would appreciate it. Perhaps you never had incidents of cancer in your family or for yourself, so please indulge my curiousity. I will in private and perhaps I shouldn't have posted my beliefs on this thread.. I'm sure everyone who has ever had cancer strike them or their loved ones would love to hear how you think they deserve to be suffering from cancer and how they brought it on themselves. Yes, julia, there are times when it is best to keep one's beliefs to themselves lest they look like an unsympathetic fool have to agree to that one...particular - as we know - that it is a bit more complex then just facts such as that smoking can lead to lung cancer...whilst I do know people where I know facts which might have contributed to their cancer...I also know a variety of people who suffered from lung cancer despite not smoking and despite having grown up and lived within a non-smoker family her whole life...or a distant family member who was proud of his very healthy lifestyle and still got non-hodgkin-lymphoma, where he died from about 10 days after my grandma died from exactly the same condition as well...even pages like this one http://www.patient.co.uk/health/Lymphoma-Non-Hodgkin's.htm state that the cause is unknown...I am sure they would love to hear from you when you obviously have the perfect conclusion how it is the own fault from those affected by cancer [8\|]

domiguy -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 9:09:06 PM)
Let's not get carried away. We cannot control every single episode that transpires within our life. I have been fortunate. But at the same time I had a mother that passed away very young from alzheimers...I just never viewed this as an event that was happening to "me." It simply was. We, as a family, dealt with it in the best fashion that we could and moved on. There was no responsibility or blame to give or to overly fret over the situation...It simply happened and we dealt with it. In hindsight I might have been a little flippant in my original post. I do apologize to luci for it. I sincerely mean that. But this is really outside of the scope of the conversation at hand. I should have stated that the vast majority of what befalls us lies at are own feet. Did my mother deserve to get alzheimers? No fucking way. She was one of the most intelligent, upbeat and creative women that I have ever met in my entire life. Even when I think back on my mother's illness I think for the most part it was handed with a great deal of dignity and kindness. I never heard my father once lament about the cards that were dealt to him...It would have been easy to feel bitter or to think that some how he had been cheated. He cared for my mother and slowly watched her die. An unbelievable man. What is lacking so much out here is the recognition of what is actually occurring in the moment. It is as simple as the serenity prayer... God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change; courage to change the things I can; and wisdom to know the difference. Far too many fail to recognize that they have so much power over the things that they simply choose to accept. Then they wonder why things did not proceed to their liking. Should have phrased it better the first time around. I do apologize to luci for a poor choice of words and questioning her integrity

thishereboi -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 9:26:20 PM)
quote: Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... Really, and just what did all those kids who died from luekemia last year do that made it their fault they got sick? What about all the men and women who get breast cancer, what exactly makes it their fault? How about all those who get lung cancer, but have never smoked or spent a lot of time around smokers? I could go on, but I think I made my point.

LafayetteLady -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 9:35:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: domiguy Let's not get carried away. We cannot control every single episode that transpires within our life. I have been fortunate. But at the same time I had a mother that passed away very young from alzheimers...I just never viewed this as an event that was happening to "me." It simply was. We, as a family, dealt with it in the best fashion that we could and moved on. There was no responsibility or blame to give or to overly fret over the situation...It simply happened and we dealt with it. In hindsight I might have been a little flippant in my original post. I do apologize to luci for it. I sincerely mean that. But this is really outside of the scope of the conversation at hand. I should have stated that the vast majority of what befalls us lies at are own feet. Did my mother deserve to get alzheimers? No fucking way. She was one of the most intelligent, upbeat and creative women that I have ever met in my entire life. Even when I think back on my mother's illness I think for the most part it was handed with a great deal of dignity and kindness. I never heard my father once lament about the cards that were dealt to him...It would have been easy to feel bitter or to think that some how he had been cheated. He cared for my mother and slowly watched her die. An unbelievable man. What is lacking so much out here is the recognition of what is actually occurring in the moment. It is as simple as the serenity prayer... God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change; courage to change the things I can; and wisdom to know the difference. Far too many fail to recognize that they have so much power over the things that they simply choose to accept. Then they wonder why things did not proceed to their liking. Should have phrased it better the first time around. I do apologize to luci for a poor choice of words and questioning her integrity I have to say that THIS domiguy is someone I could actually develop respect for. When tragedy strikes, many people ask "why?" It is perfectly natural to want to "blame" someone or something on the horrible thing that is happening, because if we can "blame" someone or something, maybe we can prevent it from every touching our lives again. As we watched my father die from lung cancer (and no he doesn't smoke and not all lung cancer is caused by smoking, FYI), my mother watched the only man she ever loved wither before her very eyes, much like your father did with your mother dg. I think those are the times when we truly see how strong a person can be and we learn much about our parents during those times. There are so many things that aren't the "fault" of the person suffering, and people will wonder "why," when there really is no answer. As domiguy has said, that isn't the case here. The OP can ask herself "why" until she is blue in the face, but there IS an answer, and at least part of that answer and the fault does lie with her. So often these threads derail to a point where the OP is no longer relevant because people will take something out of context and take offense about something that didn't even have anything to do with them, but because of their own personal issues they jump on that "reply" button quicker than a fly lands on shit. It always amazes me when I see the incredible leaps one makes when they read something that no one even thought of them when writing it, but they are supremely offended just the same. Perhaps there are times when someone really should just avoid the boards because they are going through personal stuff and might be a bit oversensitive. Domiguy, my sincerest condolences on the loss of your mother. The way you have just written about her and your father speaks more volumes about who you are than any smart ass comment you have ever made. luci, as I said before, I sincerely hope that your step daughter makes a full recovery both emotionally and physically. The OP is young, only 25. She most definately has learned something about herself from this experience, and I'm pretty sure that she won't be so quick to fall in the same position again. Some women DO learn from their first experience with an abusive partner and never let it happen again. Realistically, her relationship was only a few months (I think 3) old, so her emotional scars from this will heal much better than had it been years long. It would be nice if everyone could learn to keep things in perspective, but I know that is hoping for too much. I'm pretty sure dg's next post will be back to talking about the gash....

LadyOddsworth -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 9:53:17 PM)
I am so sorry sweetie. That's rough to go through. hugs.

sexyred1 -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/8/2010 9:58:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: domiguy Let's not get carried away. We cannot control every single episode that transpires within our life. I have been fortunate. But at the same time I had a mother that passed away very young from alzheimers...I just never viewed this as an event that was happening to "me." It simply was. We, as a family, dealt with it in the best fashion that we could and moved on. There was no responsibility or blame to give or to overly fret over the situation...It simply happened and we dealt with it. In hindsight I might have been a little flippant in my original post. I do apologize to luci for it. I sincerely mean that. But this is really outside of the scope of the conversation at hand. I should have stated that the vast majority of what befalls us lies at are own feet. Did my mother deserve to get alzheimers? No fucking way. She was one of the most intelligent, upbeat and creative women that I have ever met in my entire life. Even when I think back on my mother's illness I think for the most part it was handed with a great deal of dignity and kindness. I never heard my father once lament about the cards that were dealt to him...It would have been easy to feel bitter or to think that some how he had been cheated. He cared for my mother and slowly watched her die. An unbelievable man. What is lacking so much out here is the recognition of what is actually occurring in the moment. It is as simple as the serenity prayer... God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change; courage to change the things I can; and wisdom to know the difference. Far too many fail to recognize that they have so much power over the things that they simply choose to accept. Then they wonder why things did not proceed to their liking. Should have phrased it better the first time around. I do apologize to luci for a poor choice of words and questioning her integrity Wow, that was very intense. Thanks for sharing that about your mother; I have a relative dealing with Alzeimers right now and it is hell for all concerned. I agree with LafayetteLady, sometimes these threads take turns in directions one should not go. In the end, you can only take one day at a time and try to be positive. Or just try and laugh over gash jokes. :)

RCdc -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/9/2010 1:23:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... I don't want to hijack, but I am truly interested in what you said above. If you would care to elaborate either here or privately to me, I would appreciate it. Perhaps you never had incidents of cancer in your family or for yourself, so please indulge my curiousity. I will in private and perhaps I shouldn't have posted my beliefs on this thread.. I'm sure everyone who has ever had cancer strike them or their loved ones would love to hear how you think they deserve to be suffering from cancer and how they brought it on themselves. Yes, julia, there are times when it is best to keep one's beliefs to themselves lest they look like an unsympathetic fool Whilst I don't necessarily agree with julia, I don't equate her statement with being foolish. My observation is that she is making an opinion based on a number of factors. Diet, environment and lifestyle choices can play a part of any illness, as can genetics and my take on her statement is that she takes those into consideration. I don't for a moment feel that she was being unsympathetic, but stating something that has been mulled around by certain medical and scientific communities for a long time. the.dark. (.econerd.)

WinsomeDefiance -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/9/2010 2:34:41 AM)
Julia is a pretty nice gal, and I've often found her posts thoughtful and caring. I'm sure she didn't mean to come across as callous. My father died of cancer, so I understand it can be a very sensitive subject, but I don't take offense at her statement. WinD

ranja -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/9/2010 2:35:58 AM)
If you have any marks Take pictures of the bruises

OsideGirl -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/9/2010 7:39:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi quote: Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... Really, and just what did all those kids who died from luekemia last year do that made it their fault they got sick? What about all the men and women who get breast cancer, what exactly makes it their fault? How about all those who get lung cancer, but have never smoked or spent a lot of time around smokers? I could go on, but I think I made my point. My cancer was due to a drug that the Doctor gave my mother while she was pregnant with me. The drug was used to prevent miscarriages. How is that my fault?

sexyred1 -> RE: Well, you all were right about him... (2/9/2010 7:47:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RCdc quote: ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania Actually, I think the cancer is our own fault too, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with people who get it..... I don't want to hijack, but I am truly interested in what you said above. If you would care to elaborate either here or privately to me, I would appreciate it. Perhaps you never had incidents of cancer in your family or for yourself, so please indulge my curiousity. I will in private and perhaps I shouldn't have posted my beliefs on this thread.. I'm sure everyone who has ever had cancer strike them or their loved ones would love to hear how you think they deserve to be suffering from cancer and how they brought it on themselves. Yes, julia, there are times when it is best to keep one's beliefs to themselves lest they look like an unsympathetic fool Whilst I don't necessarily agree with julia, I don't equate her statement with being foolish. My observation is that she is making an opinion based on a number of factors. Diet, environment and lifestyle choices can play a part of any illness, as can genetics and my take on her statement is that she takes those into consideration. I don't for a moment feel that she was being unsympathetic, but stating something that has been mulled around by certain medical and scientific communities for a long time. the.dark. (.econerd.) Anything can be speculated upon to say that an illness was caused by something. But no matter how disciplined you are with nutrition, diet, exercise, etc. sometimes shit happens, in the form of cancer, that cannot be blamed on anything. You can be genetically tested and found negative, have no family history and live in a paradise, and you can still get cancer and potentially die. You can give out positivity and good karma all day long, and you can still get cancer and potentially die. The medical and scientific community have no idea why people get certain diseases so it is easy to throw around lifestyle comments. Since this is quite an inflammatory subject, I am going to stop now, as it will serve no one well. This was too much of a hijack already.

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