quote:

ORIGINAL: CynthiaWVirginia
It would be interesting to see what the real pictures would look like then…

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady
As LT pointed out the disturbing images that the OP posted are not actual images that come from the machines. Rather they are "mock ups" designed, quite obviously, to promote hysteria. The images that shallowdeep posts, while the subject can still be determined to be male (or female), are much less detailed.

The reality is that the bomb the "underwear bomber" was carrying would not have been detected by any means other than a strip search. It was covered enough to get past any dogs, placed in a position that is not permitted to be patted down and covered in such a way as to completely avoid detection. So if everyone wants to use this guy as the example, then apparently there is nothing that can be done and all security measures are useless.

It is a well known and well publicized fact that El Al has never been compromised. However, as was also pointed out, their security measures on the ground are extreme. For those who say they have no problem with arriving 5 hours before a flight....do you also have no problem with the cost of your flight increasing anywhere from 3-5 times the amount you are currently paying? Because obviously, those types of security personnel would require a great deal more training and they will require a higher, on going salary to do that job AT EVERY SINGLE AIRPORT. The cost for that is going to go directly to the consumer.

The option exists for having a "pat down" instead of being scanned. Given that fact, anyone's distaste or problem with the scanner's becomes somewhat irrelevant. You won't be subjected to it, you will opt for the pat down search instead. Personally, given the pictures I have seen, I would much rather, if my child were still young, that he be scanned rather than have some stranger touching him. A stranger patting down my small child, regardless of their security status, would be a huge "no way in hell" for me. With the scanners, everyone can rest assured that the personnel operating them are not looking at the private parts of the people being scanned with any more interest than an x-ray tech. Does that mean that if a woman were to go through a scanner and had enormous EEE breasts that no one would look at them? No more than they would be staring at her fully clothed body. Likewise if a guy had a cock so big he strapped it to his leg (which we all know is a myth anyway [;)]).

The idea that somehow, some weird security person is going to make copies and post them all over the internet or sell them is misguided hysteria. If you don't want to be scanned, opt out and have some stranger feel you up. No one is stopping you from doing that.

The reality is that if someone is going to want to hijack or bomb the plane you are on, they are going to find a way. El Al wouldn't be able to stop them. Specially trained dogs wouldn't be able to detect them, scanners won't detect them and pat downs won't detect them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Since the way Israeli security officers do the profiling is by asking passengers intelligent questions, and not by singling out people according to their ethnic origins, my answer is yes.

Critics of El Al note that its security checks on passengers include racial profiling[50] and have argued that such profiling is unfair, irrational, and degrading to those subject to such screening. Supporters of El Al argue that there is nothing inherently racist about passenger profiling and that special scrutiny of Muslims may often be necessary for security purposes

"In the blink of an eye, Israeli security would have pulled out a 23-year-old male travelling alone who had recently been in Yemen," said Mary Schiavo, former U.S. Transportation Department inspector general.

"He and his luggage would have been completely searched."

The problem is, Israeli procedures come up against western anti-discrimination laws.

"One of the major differences between us and Israel is that part of their profiling includes nationality, national origin, race, religion, age and physical appearance," Schiavo says.

With the heavy summer travel season looming, airport directors from U.S. cities on Tuesday studied Israel's airline passenger screening system, known as one of the world's toughest and most effective.

The visitors noted the main difference between the two countries - Israeli security openly employs profiling, singling out passengers for stricter screening based on their appearance or ethnic group, a practice that is banned in the U.S.

...

"The Israelis are legendary for their security," said Steven Grossman, head of aviation at the Oakland, California, International Airport.

Israeli experts say bolstering security efforts requires an extensive, and at times intrusive, interrogation process. Upon reaching the departure terminal, all passengers undergo individual questioning by security officers, who probe everything from their religious beliefs to travel companions inside the country.

Since profiling is employed, stricter security checks are not random. Instead, Israeli citizens are passed through with minimal questioning, unless they are Israeli Arabs, who are often subjected to humiliating body searches and interrogation. The security process has triggered many complaints, but little has been done to ease the checks.

Foreigners almost automatically receive closer scrutiny, and racial or other types of profiling can trigger extensive questioning and searching.
The Israelis believe this is one of the keys to their success, and the airport officials from the U.S. could only speculate about how it would affect their work.

"Let's face it. The whole issue of profiling - that is a difficult word to use in the United States," Grossman said. "The level at which they do it is far beyond, I think, anything we practically can do, for reasons of legal liability and higher number of passengers."

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ORIGINAL: thornhappy

They've been bit by their profiling, though.  They were concentrating on young men, so organizations sent young women through as suicide bombers.

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ORIGINAL: shallowdeep
Whether or not it would have helped detect something like Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab's bomb is questionable

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ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
One of the major reasons that Israeli security is so good, is due to racial, ethnic and religious profiling.

Do you still think that the US system should use the same system of profiling?

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ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: shallowdeep
Whether or not it would have helped detect something like Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab's bomb is questionable

Indeed, especially since I read somewhere the testimony of a woman who had seen him at the check in desk at Schiphol airport in The Netherlands. She testified that a USA man sharp-dressed very much like CIA personnel insisted that UFA be permitted on the plane.

Google: "Umar Farouk" schiphol witness "Kurt Haskell"

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ORIGINAL: pahunkboy
The plans tho- are to take security mobile- and to anywhere there is public.    Shopping- schools, sports- all will copy the airports. It is in the homeland security white papers.

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ORIGINAL: Rule

I do not think that you are right. But then again, maybe you are.

Wanna bet? Thirty years from now it ought to be clear what the purpose of this black ops was, or whether it was not a black ops at all. If you were right, I will admit that if the internet censors permit that. If I am right, you will admit as much.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

I had no need for the testimony of the Haskells to suspect foul play. I already suspected as much from the very first moment that I read the report about this alleged attempted suicide bomber.

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ORIGINAL: rulemylife
I guess the primary question though is if there is anything, anything at all, that you do not suspect a conspiracy is involved?