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RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 4/2/2006 6:12:37 PM   
Cloudz


Posts: 836
Joined: 9/13/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeniluscious

I've said this in another place; let's see how it works over here...
******************
Hello. My name is Jen and I'm a non-apologetic, completely unreformed romantic.

This transcends even a prospective submissive treating me like a real person when we first begin to talk, this is after we decide to start testing that water, dipping a toe, so to speak, in the babbling brook of friend-maybe-more.

I want to be courted; is that so wrong? /harveyfiersteinoff

Before anyone overreacts and thinks I mean flowers, poetry and candy (allergies, acerbic tastes, diet), that's not what I meant. I mean affection, that edge of eagerness that says 'I've been SO looking forward to seeing/talking/meeting you!' that's pleasant to hear. Other words might be kindness, consideration. Why can't such things happen? I don't want to and I am not going to make all the moves forward. That is offensive to my delicate sensibilities.

I want to be pursued. I want the man to show me he's pursing ME, not some fanciful vision of domme-ness that any nameless, faceless woman could fulfill. I want to be feel cherished in some indefinable way. I want to feel appreciated. Desired.

To forestall any "Haven't we outgrown those antiquated points of view?" the response is, obviously, NO, not all of us have. I'm not one of the boys and I don't plan to be treated like one. Neither am I a "womyn". While I may be more than adequate to hold my own in a belching contest (thank you, diet DP), I don't do it at the Opera (except during slow bits of Die Walküre). Open my door; ask me what I want to drink, pick up my pocketbook if I drop it. This isn't submission; this is courtesy. This is, IMO, being a gentleman.

Now, I freely admit that not every dominant woman wants someone that necessarily fits my criteria, but not every submissive male (or female) knows that immediately. Maybe it's me; maybe I put off a vibe that's just wrong for communicating my expectations. 



Stands and applauds


_____________________________

Enjoy the Journey,
~Cloudz

"Life isn't about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain."


(in reply to Jeniluscious)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 4/2/2006 6:14:16 PM   
Cloudz


Posts: 836
Joined: 9/13/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsSonnetMarwood

It may not be completely dead, but it's definately on life-support with the overhanging thread of the plug being pulled.

Listen up, boys, particularly those that can't figure out why it is that they can't seem to meet/connect wiht a Domme.  


Standing and applaudingAGAIN

_____________________________

Enjoy the Journey,
~Cloudz

"Life isn't about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain."


(in reply to MsSonnetMarwood)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 4/2/2006 11:59:43 PM   
SDFemDom4cuck


Posts: 2809
Joined: 5/23/2005
From: P'burgh PA
Status: offline
Jeni

I just had this same conversation/debate with a potential.

I love this phrase "Even though I am a strong, opinionated, Dominant Woman, I do enjoy being sought-after and "swept off my feet", so to speak."  I am sooo going to use it when the conversation regarding this continues! I'm so sorry I can't find who used it but thank you! 

Just because We are strong Dominant assertive Women doesn't make Us completely without heart or emotions. I fully admit to being a hopeless romantic as well and I'm glad to see I'm not the only one among My fellow Sisters! For the longest time I thought prehaps I was. I insist on anyone that applies with Me to be a gentleman with the manners and sensibilities therein. I have more than once sat in a car or by the front door waiting for the door to be opened for Me or stood next to the table waiting for My chair to be pulled out. Its never taken more than a subtle throat clearing and pointed look to remind them of their manners. With My potential My arguement was this...Wouldnt they do these things in dating a vanilla female? Yet somehow as the embodiment of their dreams as Dominant women We don't deserve the same treatment???? How are we somehow beyond the realm of a "normal" woman and the things they enjoy or need during courtship?? to his remark of  ' i hadn't really thought of You as needing the same things as a "normal" woman."  Grrrr! Thanks for the great question again Jeni!  I'm thinking that you should post this in "ask a sub" as well so that they can realize that being a gentleman, courtship, wooing are as important to Us as their gasps moans and whimpers of submission.

_____________________________

Ms Jo

She dealt her pretty words like Blades -
How glittering they shone -
And every One unbared a Nerve
Or wantoned with a Bone -

I want a sensitive man - one who'll cry when I hit him.

(in reply to Cloudz)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 4/3/2006 10:35:57 PM   
apb


Posts: 103
Joined: 9/21/2005
Status: offline
I for one do not think that romance/chivalry are dead.  As a sub, I feel that my MissTress courts me every day.  Our sexual interaction began after two days of flirting online (after we already met in person).
In return, I also court her every day.  I love to take her out to eat - drive her wherever she wants to go - open doors for her - give her massages and generally wait on her in anyway I can.
Her male partner enjoys dressing me up and taking me out.  So romance abounds in our home!


_____________________________

~ apb

"This is who I am - you can like it or not. You can love me or leave me 'cos I'm never gonna' stop."
~ Madonna

(in reply to SDFemDom4cuck)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 4/3/2006 11:08:22 PM   
FangsNfeet


Posts: 3758
Joined: 12/3/2004
Status: offline
Courtship caused my neighbor to be in trouble. I walked my darlin sub to my car and open the door for her. All of a sudden I heard "See, he does it for her." I turned to see it was my neighbors girl friend talking to him and pointing at me.

_____________________________

I'm Godzilla and you're Japan

(in reply to Jeniluscious)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 4/4/2006 2:32:08 PM   
DiannaVesta


Posts: 1087
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Mid-Atlantic area
Status: offline
The D/s dance is by far the most romantic courtship I’ve ever encounter. Once I encountered it I knew my life would never be the same and it hasn’t. I’ve tired stepping into “vanilla” relationships here and there but soon into it I feel like a huge part of me is unfulfilled.  

A male sets his sights on the woman of his dreams and does whatever it takes to get her attention and keep it. He must be strong and clever to win what so many men desire. He must work very hard and be willing to prove himself worthy of her passions. We are not ordinary women; therefore he MUST know the great secrets to win a woman’s heart. Before he ever bends a knee he pays close attention to her. What’s important to her? What brings a smile to face and set free the butterflies in her heart?  

Beg for me. Painfully long for me. Buy me flowers, find my favorite wine, take me for a long peaceful walk through the woods & then feed me on a beautiful blanket. Tell me I’m the only woman and let me see it in your eyes. Subjugate yourself before me and let me feel, in my heart, that you will literally do *anything* to please me. Tuck me in at night and rub my body until I fall asleep.

Wake me up with coffee in your hands as you kneel next to my bed to sing, “My beautiful Goddess, the sun is shining, the birds are singing and how is my wonderful Goddess today?” knowing that is its raining you’ll be punished. Lol
 

Oh yes, it is the epitome of romance and the best times of my life were during these precious moments where the dance was pure dominance and submission.  
   

< Message edited by DiannaVesta -- 4/4/2006 2:47:35 PM >


_____________________________



(in reply to FangsNfeet)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 12:17:18 AM   
mechbot972007


Posts: 29
Joined: 4/28/2006
Status: offline
i think it comes down to loving the female form.....being sharp..being atentive...watching the way the wind moves her hair..enjoying her scent..watching the different smiles that she was...watch her face to see the noticeable differentness with each thought that she has...its called being intimate...its not a race to feel her or touch her...its the road aka the tease...i know that i would be at fault if i missed a chance to witness one of these many sparks that make up this star...i know some guys that say they don't get this kind of observations from the opposite sex.. i guess you get what you put into it....i think its one of the plus's of being in a bdsm relationship...i know when im bound and blindfolded im being watched for every lil thing that goes  through my mind...

wouldn't that be proper...lets say that three of your past female relationships had the power to judge you a non romatanic...and the penance would be enduring a bdsm relationship twice the length of the three past relationships total....if us men will not yield to romance i say its up to you Ladies to beat it into them 
Respectfully
chris


(in reply to DiannaVesta)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 9:41:13 AM   
MdmSarah


Posts: 32
Joined: 4/30/2006
Status: offline
quote:


if us men will not yield to romance i say its up to you Ladies to beat it into them 



Unfortunately if I have to teach basic courtship to a sub, it rather spoils it for me.  It should come from the heart, not because I told you to.


(in reply to mechbot972007)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 10:17:24 AM   
MHOO314


Posts: 3628
Joined: 9/26/2004
Status: offline
I stand strong with you-I too want to be courted--I court---I send cards, do special things and I expect that as well- I want to know My submissive WANTS to make a difference, wants to show he cares, wants to pursue Me and when that doesn't happen--well dammit if I'm worth it, show Me!

_____________________________

SLUTS: Southern Ladies Under Tremendous Stress...

Mistress Hathor


(in reply to Jeniluscious)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 10:51:34 AM   
FLsubmalecd


Posts: 143
Status: offline
It is so good to see many Dommes that have that desire for romance as I do. I don't do D/s without the love attached to it.And in order to find that love, romance and courtship is alla vital part of it. Without it, how and what is it you have with a D/s relationship?  Seems like it would be just a "do each other thing without all the warm loving emotions that to me are the main attraction of a good loving D/s relationsship.
Iread way to many Domme profiles that seem like they are not interested in love and or romance. Just a sub or slave to do what they are told unconditionally. There is no way I'd lift a finger to do anything for any Domme without a strong romantic loving bond. Yet I understand that is not what all Dommes or subs are looking for. it's not for me, but fine for them.   

_____________________________

"Don't make someone a priority in your life, When you're only an option in theirs"

(in reply to MHOO314)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 11:51:55 AM   
LadyLupine


Posts: 12
Joined: 1/17/2006
Status: offline
I love this thread; it reminded Me of one of the sweetest, most endearing roses I ever received...each beautiful, red American Beauty with a note tied in black ribbon...12 reasons why he went to his knees for Me.  As far as pursuit goes, I might be initiating the dance..like a flower enticing the bee, but your sincerity will shine through in how you pursue Me.

(in reply to FLsubmalecd)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 1:04:46 PM   
MistressWolfen


Posts: 578
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DiannaVesta

Beg for me. Painfully long for me. Buy me flowers, find my favorite wine, take me for a long peaceful walk through the woods & then feed me on a beautiful blanket. Tell me I’m the only woman and let me see it in your eyes. Subjugate yourself before me and let me feel, in my heart, that you will literally do *anything* to please me. Tuck me in at night and rub my body until I fall asleep.

Wake me up with coffee in your hands as you kneel next to my bed to sing, “My beautiful Goddess, the sun is shining, the birds are singing and how is my wonderful Goddess today?” knowing that is its raining you’ll be punished. Lol
   
 


that absolutely sums it up for Me Dianna especially with your qualifier; "and let me see it in your eyes...let me feel it in my heart" because without that genuine adoration it is nothing but insipid flattery. If My boy did that every day that we spent together and I could assure him that he would be an irreplaceable treasure....*sighs all romantically and munches on an egg salad sarnie for lunch*

_____________________________

Quoth the raven

(in reply to DiannaVesta)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/1/2006 4:21:40 PM   
MichMasochist


Posts: 234
Joined: 12/23/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeniluscious

I've said this in another place; let's see how it works over here...
******************
Hello. My name is Jen and I'm a non-apologetic, completely unreformed romantic.
[/code]

Hi Jen.

[/code]
This transcends even a prospective submissive treating me like a real person when we first begin to talk, this is after we decide to start testing that water, dipping a toe, so to speak, in the babbling brook of friend-maybe-more.

I want to be courted; is that so wrong? /harveyfiersteinoff

Before anyone overreacts and thinks I mean flowers, poetry and candy (allergies, acerbic tastes, diet), that's not what I meant. I mean affection, that edge of eagerness that says 'I've been SO looking forward to seeing/talking/meeting you!' that's pleasant to hear. Other words might be kindness, consideration. Why can't such things happen? I don't want to and I am not going to make all the moves forward. That is offensive to my delicate sensibilities.

I want to be pursued. I want the man to show me he's pursing ME, not some fanciful vision of domme-ness that any nameless, faceless woman could fulfill. I want to be feel cherished in some indefinable way. I want to feel appreciated. Desired.

To forestall any "Haven't we outgrown those antiquated points of view?" the response is, obviously, NO, not all of us have. I'm not one of the boys and I don't plan to be treated like one. Neither am I a "womyn". While I may be more than adequate to hold my own in a belching contest (thank you, diet DP), I don't do it at the Opera (except during slow bits of Die Walküre). Open my door; ask me what I want to drink, pick up my pocketbook if I drop it. This isn't submission; this is courtesy. This is, IMO, being a gentleman.

Now, I freely admit that not every dominant woman wants someone that necessarily fits my criteria, but not every submissive male (or female) knows that immediately. Maybe it's me; maybe I put off a vibe that's just wrong for communicating my expectations.

Tell me, what would you expect to hear from a domme in these early, tentative stages? How should the subject be broached?

Dommes, what do you find prevalent during the early stages? Is that something you like?

I look forward to hearing your opinions.

Jeni

[/code]

Unfortunately I really don't think it exist any more.  This is the fast food era, throw away society. 

(in reply to Jeniluscious)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/13/2006 9:39:53 AM   
LTRsubNW


Posts: 1604
Joined: 5/6/2006
Status: offline
Hi.  My name is JJ and I'm a reforming romantic.

("Hi JJ")

It started when I first understood girls were different from me and ohhhh so appealing.  Shortly thereafter, I'd give the girl I liked the most some candy.

("That's how it always begins JJ...tell it...")

Soon I was up to giving the girl flowers, going down to the local Kresges and spending all of my allowance on cheap 5 dollar rings (hey, I was 11...what did I know from diamonds?).  In time, I'd befriend the girl of my dreams neighbor just so when she came out I could look over, wave and say something foolish like "Oh!!! You live right there???  Imagine that!!!"

("JJ, I've BEEN there!!!  You are among friends...continue...")

So, one day I met her.  "The One".  I courted her immeasurably.  I pulled out all the stops, to the point where, my method of asking her to marry me not only got us on the front cover of the local paper (above the fold I might add) as well as a local daytime afternoon TV show.

I held out her chair, helped her with her jacket, always waited for her to eat first, asked for her order at restaurants and then placed it for her....

Ohhhh....I was a helpless man.

And then I found the 12 step program.

("Amen Brother!!! Amen").

But I slipped.

Last week I asked a girl out...and within moments I was back to my old, weak, incapable self.  Please don't hate me, but...

I POURED HER WINE GLASS FULL WHEN IT WAS 1/3RD EMPTY !!!!

(I'm so ashamed).

I'm here today to tell you all that I can't go through with this.  I want to be like all other men, rude, inconsiderate, abrupt...but I'm weak.

I'm leaving the 12 step program and going back to pulling out chairs and holding open doors.

Forgive me.




(in reply to Cloudz)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/13/2006 8:31:16 PM   
HouseofBear


Posts: 1280
Joined: 2/9/2005
Status: offline
Quite honestly, courtship is often appreciated by a lady, whether she be dominant or submissive.  And the way in which it is done by the male, the attitude can also be either dominant or submissive in nature.  Same manners, different attitude and motivation, chuckles

Lady Ursa

(in reply to primeslave)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Is Courtship Really Dead? - 5/14/2006 12:04:38 PM   
Kuratori


Posts: 11
Joined: 5/10/2006
Status: offline
I'd like to throw in my two cents on this one.  I don't think courtship and romance is dead.  I think it is extremely hard to find, and I also think that romance is interpreted differently for each person - Dominants really shouldn't think that subs are telepathic in this area - wave red flags, send up smoke signals, let them know what you want and expect.  Eventually, anyone who really is romantic will pick it up and start paying attention (D or s).

I have both sides of this wonderful world.  My vanilla held me in his arms and told me stories until I fell asleep - easily one of the most romantic things I have ever experienced.  My pet, who is male, I romance him and enjoy the hell out of it.  I gave him a dozen tiger striped roses once in front of my riends (made him blush like a lighthouse).  He was touched by my choice of flowers as his fursona is a tiger - it means I pay attention.  In his turn he has since dried the roses and made a frame of them on our bedroom wall encircling my art.

Romance is a tapestry - little bits here and there can make a beautiful picture when you step back and look at it in it's entirety.

Never settle for anything less than you want but don't gve up right away either if it starts out less than perfect.

Kuratori


_____________________________

advice is something you seek when you already know the answer, but wished you didn't

(in reply to Jeniluscious)
Profile   Post #: 36
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