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Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 8:25:33 AM   
Candlescandles


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Have any of you had weight loss surgery? If so how did your partner respond to it or support it? Did it change your dynamic at all if you did? Did it change the way you play or the safety precautions you take?

This is something I'm looking into and was curious as to others experience with it.

Thanks-
Candles
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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 10:08:07 AM   
NorthNewbie


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I can't say anything on the subject, I'm afraid, except for one thing:

Surgery in order to lose weight should be a last resort. It will never be the best solution to any problem with your body, when there's other alternatives available. Before surgery is considered, I have to ask, have all other alternatives been considered? As in, have you tried simple things like consistent exercise and diet? These will almost always be superior options to surgery. Some long talks with your doctor, trainers and nutrition specialists with honesty about the lifestyle may also provide a lot of insight that these forums may not provide. The problem with asking such things is often that the positive/negative experiences you hear of are specific to that individual and may not apply even remotely to your own case.

Anyway, good luck whatever you decide on.

(in reply to Candlescandles)
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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 10:15:19 AM   
GraciousLady


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I agree with northnewbie. Surgery has many more risks than just sticking to a decent diet. Instead of dieting why not try a reasonable and fairly healthy diet with normal portions? Eat 3 normal meals a day and throw in a snack where ever you feel you need it. Make sure to eat a piece of fruit once a day as well. If you can throw in a walk in the park a couple of times a week that would be great. You may never be skinny but you may be a healthy weight if you just eat normaly and kinda healthy.

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 10:37:09 AM   
lizi


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I'm assuming you are talking about gastric bypass? I knew someone who had it and i asked her quite a few questions. It's completely changed her life and how she has to eat. After losing the weight in a more rapid fashion she now has flaps of extra skin that she has to 'fold' into her clothing.

After considering it myself I realized that I'd rather lose it more slowly and not have the extra skin to deal with. I changed my life around in eating habits and exercise 4 years ago and have been amazingly pleased with how things have turned out as a result. Yes, it's hard but it's totally worth it. I now exercise 6 days a week, ride bikes regularly for up to 40 miles and go kayaking, hiking, and swimming. I wanted to compete in my first triathlon this summer at the age of 48, but had to put it off because of a knee injury- next summer I'd like to do it. I've gone down in size from a 22 to a 12. I've got more to lose and am concentrating on that now but I live a very full life and enjoy it more now than when I was sitting on the couch overweight and immobile.

I know your question wasn't strictly about which method is better but my  is that I think doing it the old fashioned way is better. I'm not just telling you what I think, I've done this in my life as well so I'm speaking from the view of someone who has accomplished major weight loss without surgery.
You obtain better health as a result of dieting and exercise- surgery doesn't improve your health. You will also look better as a result of doing it the slower method and won't have drapes of skin hanging off your body. I continue to eat normally without having to restrict my food intake to a certain type and amount on a certain schedule. Also there's the risk when any surgery is done that the results may harm you.

One more thing...if i could do this almost anyone can. I could barely manage the workouts at first. I've still got more to go but I'm very happy with what I've accomplished. That's another thing that a diet/exercise program will give you that surgery won't...the personal accomplishment that you gain as a result. It's not a little thing.

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 11:07:13 AM   
bestheadyet


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i was considering the same thing candles.....turns out with loving support from Master and friends here and RL that i can do absolutely my best. i have a long journey ahead and accountability is key.....im blogging my intake and feelings.....none of its easy.
neither is surgery.......even one of the worlds heaviest men has lost weight from his bed. all things are possible with self belief and finding at least one more person who will support you.there's a biggest loser thread here on cm forums....check it out.
hugz
josie

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 11:14:38 AM   
UniqueRaven


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One of the ladies i worked with years ago died on the operating table during weight loss surgery.  She left behind a 12 year old son with special needs that had to be adopted by the Minister of her church (Dad no where to be found).  Very sad especially since she had no medical conditions that made weight loss critical - she just wanted it to be "easier."

Do yoga, meditate, eat fewer empty carbs, no packaged/processed foods (and no fast foods or chains like Chili's), more protein, and fewer calories overall. 

A great book is "Food Rules" by Michael Pollan - a small purse-sized paperback of rules for healthy (and simple) eating.   Just start small, one day at a time, and realize that this is a journey - not a quick fix.  It may take years but the lifelong changes are worth it.

Good luck to you. 

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 11:57:27 AM   
barelynangel


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OP, i am not going to comment on whether or not you or him should or shouldn't have the surgery that is a personal choice and there are good and bad stories and good and bad results of same. I trust you have talked to the professionals if this is you and made an informed decision. Telling you good or bad stories to me isn't and shouldn't change that for you.

i knew of two people who had this surgery and while it wasn't BDSM in nature of playing and such, my cousin's fiance and she did not work out because he had a hard time with the "new" her so to speak. She was more outgoing, wanting to do and enjoyed different things that they had done previously and sorta changed her whole personality (which somethig like this does). It wasn't that he didn't like the changes, but what he said was he could handle and process the changes. She did become more assertive and more i don't want to say stood her ground but that's what she did. She no longer just went with the flow but did what she wanted. She said he did enjoy the sex life though lol but she still had major body image issues but it was more about her not really know what to "do" with her new body and the lose skin and simply the shape of her body. So while i won't say her weight loss and surgery wasn't THE reason they broke up, i do believe from what i have heard from both of them that it did change things for them. However, she got this done during the beginning when this was still a new procedure. She is now gaining the weight back because she never really learned to eat correctly, just less -- a lot less.

Good luck with your decision or your journey if you already had it done. Just be true to yourself and maybe see your relationship and ask your partner to perhaps take into consideration that someone new will be joining you two -- the new you -- or new him if he is the one getting it done. And you both need to make allowances for this new person and not fight the new person entering your relationship.

One day at a time and recognition that things will change should help. I would also if you are speaking of yourself -- is get into some counseling program that you should be able to obtain from the place who is doing the surgery for you BOTH together and separate or some relationship counselor who has experience with i know this is going to sound weird but life changing injuries for couples. WHile the surgery isn't an injury the results are the same -- new and unknow will emerge from same. This may help you both with issues that you aren't ready for or know how to handle because you haven't had to deal with them in the past.

Also, is this is a signifcant partner long term and they have worries about the surgery, i would seriously make sure those are settled prior to getting it done, you both will have enough changes to become accustom too without previous issues regarding your or him having the surgery constantly coming up.

This is what i garnered from both people i know who had this done simply by talks and listening to their struggles etc. While the weight loss may be quickly, the getting accustom to emotionally, mentally and yes physically, takes time and effort for you and others in your life.


angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 4/24/2010 12:00:42 PM >


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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 12:07:29 PM   
tropicalhoney


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Good luck Candles, whatever you decide. You have been given great information, so please use it carefully and thoughtfully.

I am trying without surgery and am down 25 pounds just from changing my diet. Now I know I have to start to exercise, and I am wondering if anyone has anything that is good for an old broad who hasn't exercised in years.

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/24/2010 1:01:38 PM   
Phoenixpower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UniqueRaven

One of the ladies i worked with years ago died on the operating table during weight loss surgery.  She left behind a 12 year old son with special needs that had to be adopted by the Minister of her church (Dad no where to be found).  Very sad especially since she had no medical conditions that made weight loss critical - she just wanted it to be "easier."


that reminds me of this article where also a mother died on that surgery

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/derbyshire/8249397.stm

whatever you do just ensure that you take the risks associated to it seriously.

In 2000 I had lost 18kg in one year with just not eating anymore after 6pm (some people say its bullshit but one explanation I found online made sense why it worked for me, because I tended to eat my snacks in the evening in front of the TV...so with not eating anymore after having dinner around 6pm those calories were not taken in anymore).

Also in 2008 I lost once 26lbs in 14 weeks with just cutting down my chocolate and coke intake to once a week...and currently I am working on getting back to that rule again...so I do know how I can lose fast well, just have to make sure to stick to that regime and not to fall back into my old habbits anymore.

Good luck with whatever you do :o)

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/25/2010 12:11:53 AM   
Helana


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Hi candles, since no one responded who actually has had wls I thought I would chime in.
First of all, wls is a huge step, as I am sure you already know and not one to be taken lightly.
Now, there are 4 different types of weight loss surgical procedures they all have pros and cons.
I suggest you look into each of them before deciding which one if any would be right for you.

The first procedure is commonly known as the lap band. This procedure wraps a silicone band around your stomach and you have a port that goes under your skin. The band then gets filled through the port to increase or decrease the amount of restriction you receive.
This procedure allows you to feel full faster and for a longer period of time. Some people do really well with the band and others do terribly. There rarely seem to be people in the middle.

Pros:
Minor surgical procedure can be done with only 1 small incision
Completely reversible if necessary
No gastrointestinal side effects

Cons:
Generally there are complications within 7 years
Slippage
Port moving or turning
You have a piece of medical hardware inside your body
Constant aftercare (getting your band filled and unfilled)
Restriction that isn’t always constant
Foods like ice cream and sugary drinks go right through the band
General surgical risks (blood clots, infection etc.)

The next procedure and the one you have probably heard the most about is called the Roux-en-Y gastric bypass.
In this procedure the stomach has a very small (30 cc) portion stapled off to form a pouch, then the duodenum and pyloric valve are bypassed and your intestines are connected to the new pouch. When you eat the food goes from your pouch right into your small intestine (bypassing the upper portion) thus you are absorbing fewer calories.

Pros:
Faster weight loss because it is restrictive and malabsorptive
It can be done laparoscopically
Many doctors perform this procedure

Cons:
Dumping syndrome - because you have no pyloric valve sugars can enter your intestine more quickly which results in something known as dumping syndrome for about 50% of people who have the gastric bypass. It includes nausea, diarrhea, vomiting, hot flashes and huge amounts of discomfort. (some actually view this as a positive thing since it keeps them from eating sweets)
You will need to take high doses of bariatric vitamins for the rest of your life. - because you do not absorb all the calories from foods you do not absorb all the nutrients either.
You will need to get lab work done every few months initially and then at least once a year to make sure you are not deficient in any vitamins or minerals
Food gets stuck in the pouch
Cannot drink 30 min before or after meals
Leaks in the staple line
Must stick to a high protein, low fat diet
You lose most of the malabsorptive component after a couple of years
Limitations on medications you can take


The next procedure is called a vertical sleeve gastrectomy. This is a restrictive only procedure similar to the lap band except you do not have most of the problems associated with the lap band. Think of your stomach as being shaped like a bean. This procedure removes most of your stomach so that it is now shaped like a banana. This provides restriction but no malabsorption so you have your own fully functioning stomach only smaller.

Pros:
It’s your own stomach
You feel fuller faster
It will never be able to stretch to be as large as your former stomach
constant restriction
doesn’t involve seeing doctors every few months or tons of vitamins
can be done laparoscopically
losing the part of your stomach that produces the hunger hormone ghrelin

Cons:
Still a surgical procedure
chance of leaks etc.
permanently losing part of your stomach
Many insurance policies will not cover the sleeve because they consider it to be *experimental*




The last procedure is known as the duodenal switch. Like the Roux-en-Y it is a restrictive and malabsorptive procedure but unlike the RNY you do not have a pouch but rather a sleeve gastrectomy (see above) for your stomach, although it’s generally slightly larger if you are having a Duodenal Switch procedure than a straight Vertical Sleeve. This means that you can eat small normal sized meals and drink with your meals which is nice during social situations. You also maintain pyloric function so there is no dumping syndrome. With this procedure, 2 cuts are made in the small intestine. The first is made in the duodenum and the second is made at the alimentary limb (lower 8f of the small intestine). You then connect the alimentary limb to the duodenum. The bypassed section is called the biliopancreatic limb, which is where most digestion takes place, is now connected to the end of the small intestine. The last part of the small intestine is called the common channel, which is where your food and enzymes digest. Because you are bypassing so much of the small intestine the amount of calories you actually get from food are greatly reduced. The estimated absorption numbers are 20% fat, 50% protein, 60% complex carbs and 100% simple carbs. This means that if you eat a food that has 100 calories, 8g fat and 7g protein you are actually only absorbing about 28 calories instead of 100.

Pros:
Most people who have this procedure lose 85% of the weight they needed to lose and maintain it 10+ years out. This is the highest sustainability rate of any weight loss surgery.
The fastest weight loss.
Can be done laparoscopically
Ability to eat small normal sized meals
Ability to drink while eating
Maintain pyloric function
No pouches
Cures type 2 diabetes in 99% of cases often before you even leave the hospital
Has the highest cure rate of comorbidities overall

Cons:
Very complicated surgical procedure and many surgeons aren’t skilled enough to perform the procedure
Surgical risks including leaks, infection, blood clots etc.
Gas! - this is probably the biggest downfall with this procedure. For many people, simple carbs, at least during the first year after surgery cause offensive gas. It will take some time to figure out what you can or cannot eat when you are going to be going out to eat or will be around people. In general, after you have a duodenal switch you go on a high protein, high fat diet and keep the carbs pretty low. It will take a while until you will be able to eat carbs and because you don't absorb 50% of protein you must make sure to get at least 90g of protein in a day. You always eat your protein first and if you still have any room in your stomach you can eat some carbs.
Vitamins! - for the rest of your life you will not be absorbing a large percentage of what you eat you will need to supplement with a lot of vitamins, sometimes taking 20 or more pills a day and it generally will cost about $100/month. You must be able to afford this and commit to it for the rest of your life.


If you want to find out more about the duodenal switch check out www.dsfacts.com and http://www.obesityhelp.com/forums/DS/a,messageboard/board_id,5357/

As for my story, the duodenal switch saved my life. I yo yo dieted for years and probably lost over 1000 pounds if you count how many times I lost weight only to gain it back. It wasn’t a matter of putting down the fork and moving a bit more. In order for me to maintain a weight of 160 pounds, which isn’t even thin, I would have to eat about 800 calories a day and spend 2 hours at the gym 5 days a week. It was miserable for me and almost impossible for me to maintain. As soon as I would slip up even a little the weight would just come on so quickly. I could gain 5 pounds in a week just slipping up a little and it would take me over a month to lose it again. I ate less than all my friends, I obsessed over food counting calories and carbs. I didn’t know a thing about weight loss surgery; I used to swear by eating less and moving more. I blamed my problems on a sluggish thyroid, years of yo yo dieting, slow metabolism etc. I started gaining weight at 17 and there were points in my life where I was at a normal bmi, most of the time it was overweight and then obese. Even being obese I was living a very active life and making healthy food choices. If you asked anyone at the time they would insist that I was the healthiest eater they knew. I tried low fat, low carb, vegetarian, vegan, crash diets, weight watchers, medifast, pills, personal trainers, nutritionists, hypnosis, liquid diets, fasting, and just about anything that you can think of. Most of them worked to some degree, they were just unsustainable for the long term. The best results I had were low carbing where I kept a weight of 160 pounds for 2 years but again, that was at eating 800 calories a day to get that low and 2 hours at the gym. DS saved my life. I had the procedure done 5 years ago, I lost 175 pounds in a year and a half and I have been at 130 pounds since. I eat more now than I have ever eaten on any diet before, I no longer feel like I am starving all the time. I don't have cravings like I used to. I am off my blood pressure meds, I am ovulating on my own, my hormones balanced themselves out. I have never been healthier in my life. I am active but I no longer have to live at the gym. I don't even really think about my food any more, the best thing about DS for me is that food is no longer an obsession in my life. I eat when I am hungry, I make sure to get my protein and vitamins in and other than that I eat whatever I want. I had some gas issues for the first year but its mostly white flour in large quantities that makes me gassy. When eaten with protein and fat (like fried chicken) I don't have any problems.

WLS is a huge step and it isn’t for everyone. It’s a very serious commitment and there are very serious risks involved including malnutrition. From my perspective there were also serious risks involved in being the size that I was. I didn’t have a life, I was tired all the time, I hid indoors because of the way I was treated by people. The risk, to me, was worth it. I only wish I did it sooner. I lost my 20s due to my constant struggle with food but my 30s have been the best years of my life. As far as excess skin is concerned, everyone is different. I have some excess skin but it isn’t too terrible. Nothing that spanx can't cure. My arms are the worst and I would like to get those taken care of but right now my husband and I are considering having a baby so I am going to wait until I am done having children before I think about a tummy tuck. If it wasn’t for my DS I would still be infertile.

As for playing and things like that, it depends on a lot of things including the procedure you have. The lap band is an outpatient procedure and you can be back to work by the end of the week. The DS takes a while to heal. You are on liquids for the first 2 weeks and then soft foods for the next 2 weeks while your stomach heals. I would say that 6 months out the play can be pretty normal... while very rare I believe that a leak can happen even up to 3 years post op so you should be a little careful. Also, as you get thinner you will discover things like your bones and they hurt when you bump into things, especially when you are used to being cushioned. Let your body be your guide.

Anyway, I wish you the best of luck with whatever you decide to do.


Edited to add: Check out a WLS support group if there is one in your area, meet people who have had the procedure done and share a meal with them. Look at their scars, loose skin, how much weight theyve lost, any regain, see what they eat and how much. Ask yourself honestly if you can make that commitment. It took me a lot of soul searching before I knew that I could do it. Talk to surgeons that perform all 4 procedures (many do not perform the DS) and ask them which patients are the happiest and most successful. Look at the statistics for dieting vs. wls and who keeps what percentage of weight off longest. Ask yourself what are your reasons for doing this. Can you remember to take vitamins 4+ times a day or would you do better with something that was purely restrictive?

< Message edited by Helana -- 4/25/2010 12:29:41 AM >

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/25/2010 12:44:04 AM   
hlen5


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What an informative post, Helana!! Thank you for your firsthand and valuable contribution to the thread. I wish you success for  your  future family!

Candlescandles, I wish you success in whatever you decide to do.



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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/25/2010 6:05:16 AM   
barelynangel


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Thanks for that informative post Helana about the surgeries. I am really glad yours was a success -- congrats!!!

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/25/2010 4:18:50 PM   
MistressLucyK


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well written Helena and thanks so much

Its given me much to think about as I'm one of those YoYo's people having lost more than I need to lose now and thats a lot!
For every 20 -50lbs lost, I'd have some crisis and its would all pile back on

I sometimes wonder if surgery is my answer as I'm no longer young, children has left the nest

Should I continue to restrict the amount and quantity of food and just enjoy life?

lots to think about

(in reply to barelynangel)
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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/25/2010 4:31:23 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline
lol that's me -- its like i lose a certain amount usually about 25 lbs and start looking halfway decent and them WHAM, i just stop, something happens or i just revert back to my comfort zone. My friend says i am afraid lol to be what i once was so my brain won't allow me to continue getting back to what i was once.

To me, my issue is more psychological rather than a physical issue.

angel

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RE: Weight Loss Surgery - 4/28/2010 2:57:13 PM   
sweetnurseBBW


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I have had lap band surgery. contact me if you want to talk. I will give you real advice not what others have heard. The myths are outnumbered than the actual truths are.

< Message edited by sweetnurseBBW -- 4/28/2010 2:58:44 PM >


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