Question to Ponder #7 (Full Version)

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Dustyn -> Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 12:06:55 AM)

Enough of the "Do switches exist" and "Why do switches exist".  Too many trite answers to trite questions.

What influences do you think makes a switch who and what they are?



BitaTruble -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 12:16:41 AM)

quote:

 "Why do switches exist".  Too many trite answers to trite questions.

What influences do you think makes a switch who and what they are?



The difference between the two questions seems to be one of semantics.  I suppose any answer given will be considered trite as well.

Good luck on finding whatever it is that you're seeking.

Celeste



stef -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 6:33:30 AM)

I thought you had enough of the trite questions?

~stef



fergus -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 7:23:19 AM)

Sometimes I have a hard time letting go of the notion that I am smart.  Inteligence can be a gift and a curse at the same time.  Only on the last decade or so have I started to discover that by letting go of ego answers flow more freely.

perhaps it is this dichotomy that makes me a switch?

fergus



Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 10:07:00 AM)

This really isn't that trite of a question.

I assume that most everyone agrees that a desire for control in one's life is a leading influence on someone considering themselves a dominant.  I've read it a number of times on several different forums, including this one, so that seems to be the general opinion.  A desire to relinquish control is often said to be a leading influence for being a submissive, or so I have read.

A switch, however, possesses both of these characteristics in a roughly equal amount, or at least that is what I have concluded fromw hat I have read.

With dominants, they are generally, but not always, found in positions of little power in their jobs, at home are often not the ones deciding what gets done and by whom, so on and so forth like that and usually the opposite for a submissive.  That is just personal observation from my own questions of those that I know.

How do influences like that shape a switch is what I am getting at.  Are there any major things in your life that has or is happening that psushes you, for lack of a better term, into seeking the release from it in BD/SM?  I understand quite a bit of the motivations in my life that guide me in either direction, like my job, home life a few years ago and, in part, how I was raised.  I'm just wondering if it is similiar for other people is all.

Call it my need to identify with other people to better understand them.  It makes it easier for me to deal with people if I can find points of similarity between us. Common ground, so to speak.



WyrdRich -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 4:25:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fergus
Only on the last decade or so have I started to discover that by letting go of ego answers flow more freely.
fergus



   There is a marvelous saying in Zen philosophy that "those who say they know, do not know and those who say they don't know, know."



LaMalinche -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/13/2006 11:41:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

This really isn't that trite of a question.

I assume that most everyone agrees that a desire for control in one's life is a leading influence on someone considering themselves a dominant.  I've read it a number of times on several different forums, including this one, so that seems to be the general opinion.  A desire to relinquish control is often said to be a leading influence for being a submissive, or so I have read.

A switch, however, possesses both of these characteristics in a roughly equal amount, or at least that is what I have concluded fromw hat I have read.

With dominants, they are generally, but not always, found in positions of little power in their jobs, at home are often not the ones deciding what gets done and by whom, so on and so forth like that and usually the opposite for a submissive.  That is just personal observation from my own questions of those that I know.

How do influences like that shape a switch is what I am getting at.  Are there any major things in your life that has or is happening that psushes you, for lack of a better term, into seeking the release from it in BD/SM?  I understand quite a bit of the motivations in my life that guide me in either direction, like my job, home life a few years ago and, in part, how I was raised.  I'm just wondering if it is similiar for other people is all.

Call it my need to identify with other people to better understand them.  It makes it easier for me to deal with people if I can find points of similarity between us. Common ground, so to speak.



Wow. . . how solipsistic can you get?

I am impressed.


Best,

LaMalinche




Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 12:25:51 AM)

Wow, can you make a bigger ad hominem attack?



WyrdRich -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 6:34:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

Wow, can you make a bigger ad hominem attack?




     Since you ask, sure.....

     Dustyn, you are too foolish to understand that that the best thing to come out of a penis are the wrinkles.  How's that?



Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 7:24:59 AM)

You've lost me.



LaMalinche -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 9:17:13 AM)

Well see. . . you tried to point out a logical fallicy. . . but you did not clarify whether you meant . . . Argumentum ad Hominem Abusive . . . .or . . . . Argumentum ad Hominem Circumstantial. . . . both are informal and are fallacies of relevance . . . if you are curious. . .

So WyrdRich chose the former. . . since you asked. . .

For myself. . . I was not making an arguement. . . I was making an observation. . . if anything it would fall under the fallacy of Complex Question. . . another informal fallacy . . . just so you are clear. . .

But. . . in an inductive argument like the one you gave. . . you cannot deliver a conclusion that is demonstratively certain. . . the most you can hope for is probability. . . you may end up finding that black swan . . .


Hope that cleared things up. . .



Best,

LaMalinche




Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 2:10:38 PM)

It doesn't matter... shouldn't have bothered anyone else with my questions... just ignore me



Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 4:15:29 PM)

Just curiosity, La Malinche.

Being solipsistic, one has to believe that they are the only thing in the universe that is real, right?  Is it really solipsistic to quantify things in terms what one has read/learned/experienced, as opposed to putting them in terms of what others have read/learned/experienced?  Everyone gives advice based on what they have trapped in their brains, including you. Does that make your advice suspect because it qualifies as being solpsistic, or egocentric to think that you can quantify things in those terms but others shouldn't?

Just the musings of a man missing oblivion.



fastlane -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 5:47:54 PM)

You are a switch...so obvious and so confused....LOL

Admit it and accept it...Your freedom is at hand...or cock..LOL, Kevin



LaMalinche -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 6:19:16 PM)

Solipsism: n.  the theory that only the self exists, or can be proved to exist.  2.  extreme preoccupation with and indulgence of one's feelings, desires, etc.; egoistic self-absorption.


You keep trying to put Switches, and others from this thread. . . such as Doms and Subs, into neat little boxes that you have come up with.  You have these neat and tidy definitions and have seemed to overlook the multitude of threads and respondants saying that there is NO RIGHT OR WRONG WAY.  There is no 'true' definition.  There is no checklist to see if you fit into a particular catagory.  You have a desire for things to fit into your world the way you want them. . . and when they do not. . . you either change your arguement or try to convince others that your ideas are the correct ones. 
>>>>>>This Just In<<<<<
 
We. . . and WIIWD does not fit into your boxes. 
 
You are trying to generalize where you cannot.  The human experiance is too varied.  The BDSM dynamic is too mutable for that kind of generalizability. 
 
My advise is not solipsitic because I do not believe that me essential "I" is the only thing that can be proven to exist.  I accept that there are other interpersonal dynamics, other than my own.  I do not try to give them validation or existance by pinning them down with a definition. . . I know that they exist.
 
 
And you are welcome to ja accuse me of quantifying as soon as I use a quantifier. . . okay? 
 
In fact there is only one formal logic statement I have a tendency to ever use, and I do not believe that I have ever used it on these boards. . . however you are more than welcome to go and check over my four hundred and fifty some odd posts and see if I have.  I will even give you a hint. . . it is a famous syllogism.
 
I am not quite sure what word you thought you were using.  
 
 
And yes. . . anyone's advise is suspect. . . you cannot know the true motivations of someone, unless you are a telepath. . . hence the phrase, "Taken with a grain of salt."  But if you are given solutions or advice and you do not take them because you are so sure that you know better. . . and then keep coming back with the same quandry. . . well, let us just say that even BitaTruble is gonna get tired of it. 
 
If you truly want to understand, and wrap your mind around a concept. . . you have to look at it with a fresh start . . . through out the conceptionalizations that you hold so dear. . . and look at it anew . . . otherwise you will never ever get it.  And it is even possible that afterwards you will go back to what you originally believed. . . but that belief will be enhanced. . . and you will know WHY you believe that way.
 
Best,
 
LaMalinche
 
 
What you are is a question only you can answer.      --The Warrior's Apprentice, 1986



WyrdRich -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 7:57:38 PM)

       WOW LaMalinche, if you had said that right off the bat I'd still be wearing that damn ice cream cone.



LaMalinche -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/14/2006 9:22:10 PM)

I will make sure and put ice cream on you at the party. . .


Come on over. . . .


Besides. . . I am hungry for sweets . . . *WEG*


Best,

LaMalinche




Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/15/2006 1:26:53 PM)

A lot of things in my head have been muddied up in the last few years, and more so in recent months... still trying to figure out who and what I am, and was thinking that maybe if other people defined themselves, it might give me a basis for understanding myself...

no one ever said I do things the right way around... or at least not in my hearing. LOL



WyrdRich -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/15/2006 2:05:41 PM)

        Fergus mentioned letting go of ego,  I've never been able to do that very well but I've reached the best understandings of myself after it has been soundly horse-kicked.

       Self-definition?  Perhaps I'm being trite again but as God said to Moses, "I am who I am."  The best I can do is accept responsibilty when I screw up and keep in mind that I'm exactly dumb enough to do it again if I'm not careful.

     I try to keep my definitions loose because I know they are probably wrong.



Dustyn -> RE: Question to Ponder #7 (4/15/2006 6:20:18 PM)

trust me, wasn't looking for hard definitions, just some general views... nothing major though... :D



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