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RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/17/2006 5:02:37 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline 		A male friend of mine, age 40, recently and somewhat reluctantly got married. On the way to the threshold, he was "taking inventory" with his other male friends about getting married --- the upside and the downside. One of his friends coined a term: STDs. He said, "Women don't have enough STDs."

STD = STUFF TO DO (hobbies, interests, passions, pursuits)

He actually had the opposite fear you have, which is that his wife would be too smoothering, too dependent, and too needy --- always looking to him for every area of activity and free time --- and being resentful when he had STDs that excluded her.

The moral of the story is simple, IMO.

When you have a couple and one person is active with STDs and the other is inactive with no STDs --- you have a problem.

IMO, the best way to solve this problem is not to cut the active person's interests, but rather for the inactive person to develop their own. If this means going separate ways, so be it, but each person needs somewhere to go and something to do. In a LTR, people getting away from each other is good, therapeutic, and regenerative --- and it makes each individual person more interesting.

To wit pissdoll said,

>i spent almost 10 years in a 24/7 where any interests that didn't match my Master's were taken away from me. Having had time now to look back and reflect, i think we really both suffered for it.

There is nothing like a slave/submissive who is passionate, and passion spills over into all areas of life. i think i became a very boring and uninteresting "thing." Yes, he had total servitude from me, etc etc...but he could have had so much more.<

No matter what, I think its important for any couple that each individual have some sort of viable, independent life.

Take away a slave's independent life and his STDs, and I think you just shorten his expiration date in the relationship.

O, and BTW JFK once said, "Show me a man who's an excellent golfer, and I'll show you a man who's neglecting something."

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 4/17/2006 5:07:07 PM >

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/17/2006 6:05:04 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

O, and BTW JFK once said, "Show me a man who's an excellent golfer, and I'll show you a man who's neglecting something."


Well, I will agree with that quote!  And I have met with and/or spoken on the phone with more than My fair share of golfers!
 
The STD's is nice in theory, and it is also mentally and emotionally healthy, within reason.  I have plenty to do, and I would love a slave who would be with Me and supportive of Me while I am doing that...maybe even helping Me with some if it.  I am not bored, or needy or clingy. 
Since I seek M/s, life is altered.  The purpose of a slave is to make My life easier.  If he is always off and running to take care of other excessive personal business and entertainment preferences that have become a habit, there is not much time left for the Domina. 
I only bring this up for discussion because there is a line, and, even with the M/s relationship, the line will be drawn in different places.  But I have been consistently amazed at the number of petitioners who have such busy lives between work, family and their buddies, I am not sure how they ever expect to live as a slave. Quite often, when I question certain other commitments, there is a dead stop, and then the boy realizes that this is something that needs some additional thought.  This is one of the reasons I seldom seriously a consider a boy who is divorced and has youngsters.  I consider that the first obligation needs to be to those short people.  Often, the ramifications of actual relocation (within the USA) is not fully taken into consideration. 
It just makes it harder for all concerned. LadyMorgynn just wrote a lovely piece in the "What does a Domme do for the sub" thread.  We don't say that all other life is cut off (although I have had more than a few boys who want that...I call them "the runaways").  But when one approaches and they already have a very full schedule, then how does one even have the time?  It's not about changing residence and kneeling down once in a while.  It's about living a completley different life and that includes different priorities. 
So easy and romantic to say "I am a slave" or "I wish to be a slave", but the reality is much more involved.

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


(in reply to cloudboy)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/17/2006 8:35:00 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
I knew you'd like the JFK quote.

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
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RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/17/2006 11:50:57 PM   
liks2plzlf


Posts: 390
Joined: 7/21/2005
Status: offline 		I will probably get lambasted by the Doms for this post, and maybe rightfully so. I should decide I can't be a slave, get off of collarme, or begin preparing to make a tremendous sacrifice. But I still struggle with that decision, because the desire to slave for a woman,  won't just go away, and some of the Dominas here have made that desire a tremendous obsession. There are alot of incredible Dominas on this site, and I love reading their posts, and have learned considerable in just a few days.I don't know if it is appropriate to mention Doms by name, but some of the comments they made,make me want this all the more. Comments like"he melts to his knees in surrender,  he gives she takes, he can't say no, his place is at my feet", just entice me to want this all the more. I say the above to try to portray how difficult it is to give up. But the sacrifice can be much more for some than others. If your family lives far away and visits were infrequent, and your std's, as mentioned before, are things local to the Domina, it much less difficult.Maybe not difficult at all. However, daughters, and grand kids, that you are with on an almost daily basis, is the hardest to overcome. Being an avid backpacker, is easier to give up, but its very attraction, is almost the exact opposite of slavery. For me it was self reliance, independence, and freedom, all things a slave surrenders. So this has become a horrific struggle. A local Dom with similare interests would be great, but to my knowledge, she does not exist. So, knowing, when you fall in love with a woman, she becomes almost irresistible, the decision becomes easy. So I wonder if A slave is always in love with his/her owner, or will such a relationship work without being in love. As a woman or someone once stated, there is a differance between loving someone, and being in love. I believe I am refering to the latter here. I also point out,(very humbly of course),that some of those Doms complaining, have indicated a desire to own, or do own, more than one boy. Must you have both in continual service!!!It's not fair, you should, no wait, it is fair, you take we give, and I like it that way, I really do. However I don't know that you realize how much must be given up sometimes for us to serve.Another JFK quote was"ask not what your slave can do for you, but what can you do for your slave"? Or was it the other way around?

(in reply to cloudboy)
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RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 1:35:07 AM   
Dustyn


Posts: 1044
Joined: 4/5/2006
Status: offline 		Liks, not to be raining on your parade or anything, but I've noticed after about a decade of chatting, forum boards and even BBS'ing, there is a strong tendancy for people to create a bit of a fanciful idea of a person that they 'admire' and rarely ever make the connection that the person that they are idolizing is only presenting one side of themselves.

It's not difficult to look educated, intelligent, goofy or downright idiodic online.  All it really takes is a grasp of the English language and a flair for using it.  Nothing online can ever prepare you for something in person, including the person that you are face to face with.  A good example is bad habits that are physical in nature almost never intrude on written posts in forums.  Friend of mine a while back ran into a girl that was his dream girl.  Smart, funny, the whole package, right?

WRONG!

He lived with her for about a month and left utterly disgusted with her and himself.  Her for doing all sorts of things that literally drove him up a wall and himself for deluding himself that what he read was all there was to the person.  Hell, I've done it myself a few times in the past and felt dumber than a box of rocks afterwards for setting expectations so high that the fall down kills everything in the general vicinity, including the relationship.

Not bashing you, or anything.  Just a comment for the margins of the book, I guess you could say.  If you take it in a bad way, sorry but it's not meant that way, honestly.

- Dustyn


_____________________________

Mother is the name for God on the lips and hearts of all children.

Murderer?! Murderer! Let me tell you something about murder. It's fun; it's easy; you gonna learn ALL about it. - Tin Tin

Can you be more amusing?

(in reply to liks2plzlf)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 7:05:51 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessDustyGold
When seeking a submissive or a slave (please bear in mind that I seek slaves) where do others draw the line regarding recreational activities?
I'm relatively flexible as long as I feel that I am his priority.  Anytime his life is so full that I only hear from or see him as a secondary thought (only when he has extra time), as others have said, we reevaluate the relationship, and see if perhaps we are the right match.
 
When getting to know someone, I usually allow him  time/room to be himself, and proceed according to his instinct.   I tend to guide by giving him suggestions of what I would prefer, and my needs/wants.  
If he pays attention and works toward that goal, things tend to go well; there have been times when they don't heed suggestions, and it is usually the ones who need it most, because they didn't take courtship 101, and have no idea how to woo a lady.
If during the initial courtship I find he is excessively busy with his life, and will not adjust it to fit a domina/mistress, I step aside, and allow him to live his life on his terms, after a conversation expressing the issues.   I believe we all make choices, and if his choices leave me feeling like I'm at the bottom of his priority list, we have a problem, and I don't stay for that kind of treatment.
 
quote:

 I really have no problem with friends and family, but I am of the firm belief that if you want a Mistress (Master), then your main focus should be your Mistress (Master). 
I note that twicehappy, who is now with ShiftedJewel and ScooterTrash specifically sought a Dominant who rides (motorcycles) so that is an activity that is loved by all and shared by all.
 I'm in agreement that one's Master/Mistress should be his main focus.   The only exceptions I would agree are reasonable in terms of his independence are his work, and his family, more specifically, his unmentionables.   I would not interfere in matters relating to work, or matters relating to unmentionables; everything else, is up for debate and my ultimate input. 
 
 I am at a point in my life where I don't need someone to be attached at the hips 24/7, but that doesn't mean the dynamics of the relationship would change simply because I am doing what I enjoy, and he is doing what he enjoys...  I do expect to have a say in how much he does in terms of personal leisure, explaining that with me, the more I get what I need/want, chances are the more he will get what he needs/wants.
Depending on the activity, it may be something permitted dailly, weekly, or monthly, as long as it doesn't interfere with him showing up and tending to me/my needs first.   M

P.S.  I loved what Slavejali had to say:
quote:

Being in a Master/Mistress slave/submissive relationship is supposed to be about dominating and submitting. One dominates and one submits, I cant help but think if there is conflict in this area either the wrong partner has been chosen or the submissive just really isnt submissive, or at least not submissive enough to be involved in a long term day to day dominant/submissive relationship, which is totally fine, but why pretend it's more than it is?


< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 4/18/2006 7:14:29 AM >

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 7:20:01 AM   
Ceyx


Posts: 89
Joined: 8/23/2005
Status: offline 		From what I've been reading, this seems to be less a question of giving up interests or activities-- the original subject-- and more a question of time and attention. As a Domina in an M/s relationship, you want to be the primary focus of your boy's life, and that will require a degree of commitment that may very well include (as a corollary) cutting back on or, more rarely, doing away with certain interests.

That seems to me a perfectly legitimate desire in this sort of relationship. Surely you should not be 'pencilled in.' The best answer, as has been said, would be to find someone with compatible interests, so that those interests can become a part of the time and attention that you rightly require; also important would be open-mindedness on both sides, a willingness to explore a boy's interests (and his willingness to explore yours) and a degree of creativity in making them a part of his service. Beyond that, I don't think it's wrong to establish a certain level of attentiveness that you'll require from anyone you take on, and to keep looking if you don't get it.

You don't want someone to cease to be who they are in order to become your slave. That would be inhumane and against the spirit of the thing. On the other hand, if they can't put you at the center of their focus to the extent that you require, then 'who they are' is clearly not the boy for you.

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 9:29:29 AM   
Submotive


Posts: 440
Joined: 9/9/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessDustyGold

Well, I agree about the give and take idea.  Meaning they give and I take.  *Smile*
I don't mean to be unclear, but, for Me, in seeking an M/s relationship, I do expect that energy flow all the time, and that is hard to maintain if the boy has to be out on the golf course every Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday, while I am at home alone. Although leisure activites are important, I am wondering, in terms of D/s and M/s, not just kinky playtime, what adjustments people have made from both sides of the whip.


i believe that it's very important to take ALL interests into consideration when deciding on a "right" match. Master loves the hobbies and interests i have because they bring new things to the relationship for His pleasure. Also, i am willing to learn about His interests and hobbies so that He can share them with me, as this also brings Him pleasure. i believe this is very important to the health of O/our Relationship in general. 

But my focus, first and foremost, is Master. Anything i "give up" is only to be more pleasing and available for Him and so it is pleasure for me, not sacrifice at all. All i do and develop is to add to the happiness of Master and O/our relationship. But i've never been one to feel complete satisfaction in accomplishing things just for me, so maybe that makes a difference.

i think it's paramount for anyone to understand their own priorities. If You need/want to be the center of Your slave's world, then it's important to find one who shares that feeling. Otherwise it will be a constant frustration for Y/you both, IMHO, Ma'am.

_____________________________

Owned by Scotch Master

i would rather continue alone than be permitted to show only parts of myself to my Beloved.

If you're not living as you would like to today, when are you going to start?

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 11:07:50 AM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline 		Again, thank you to all.  Such wonderful and thoughtful responses.
I would like to respond to liks2plzlf...I can see that this is quite a quandry.  I agree that it might not be as hard if you can still maintain your current interests and family ties at the same level.  But the fact that it is hard for you to think about making adjustments might be a signal to you that you should rethink the "slave" aspect.  A slave is a slave is a slave.  I have said this before, and I cannot budge from that.  It is My viewpoint.
I see that your interest is a rather solitary one.  Being self-reliant is a good thing, and a quality that I (and many others I know) seek.  Frankly, I am not interested in a boy who will look to Me for every single minor decision. In the beginning, a boy would learn My preferences, and there would always be discussion about alternate ways to handle situations.  I don't feel like I am any less Dominant because I listen to a boy's expertise in areas of plumbing or electrical or a new way to plant the garden.  It is still a life shared, albeit, not the typical life. 
I would say you are right regarding the independence and the freedom that your activity represents.  And there is nothing overly upsetting about that either.  I guess it would all depend on the amount of time you felt you needed.  A backpacking trip for several days every three months or so might be perfectly acceptable.  A long weekend on most weekends might really cramp your Mistress's style.  Operative word "might".  If you are antsy and feel you must have this time quite often to maintain your sense of peace and equilibrium, for Me, it would mean that service and dedication to the Mistress is a part time relationship that you can do only when you feel refreshed from your solitary time.  There is a big difference between two or three days away most weeks, and reading or exercising every day.  Different things satisfy different people. 
No, having someone in constant service is not the reason a Lady might choose to have more than one slave.  It is a way to further enrich life and share more.  I have more than one child, and I can't imagine having an only child.  I might or might not choose to have more than one. It makes more time for all to have more than one/
Spending time daily with your daughters and grandchildren is wonderful, but not practical, unless you have a Domina who is extremely family orniented Herself, and this time was either shared, or freely and happily given. Again we are speaking, of course, about the amount of time.  An hour?  Three hours?  Half the day?  Lots of special outings often planned?  It all depends.  You also say that you cannot find a local Domina to get to know as your potential Mistress.  This would mean that you are looking at a possible relocation.  It is important to think about how relocation would impact your life as it currrently stands. 
It is just as important to be honest with yourself as with the Lady you contact.  With that, I would suggest, since I have looked at your profile, that you flesh that out a bit.  It is fairly brief and you do state that you seek a 24/7 slave relationship and that you will submit in almost any way to the right Lady.  Pardon the paraphrase and I apologize if I get the gist of it wrong.  I often see profiles similar to this which are brief, but taken at face calue.  Then comes the "buts" and the "maybes".  I am not talking about the BDSM interests or limits.  I am talking about the life limits.  We begin to see that the "slave" who was so willing to do anything is probably really referring to the BDSM scenes.  He is not referring to altering his life or his preferences in any meaningful way in order to make his Mistress the priority.  He can do it if he can still play golf twice a week, or keep his $600 a month truck, meet his buddies every week at the sports bar to watch the game and go to Disneyland twice a year.  Submitting as a slave is not just about BDSM limits.  Submitting also includes personal life and personal habits.  Yes, you should be in, at least, serious like, with the Lady you choose.  Slaves can love and be in love.  And that would also make things easier.  Dominas also love and sometimes fall in love with a slave.  Falling in love is not a priority with Me.  It might happen, but I am not seeking it.  That does not mean I am cold or uncaring or treat the boy as a piece of furniture.  It is just a different kind of relationship, and sometimes being a slave includes acceptance of that fact. Your need to serve must come from a need to serve.  Not from an attraction to a photo and a romantic notion about kneeling in private. 
I don't think you should leave the site.  I do think what you seek is out there, and perhaps it is right under your nose and you don't realize it yet.  Baby steps...a slow coming to terms with what you want and what you are willing to adjust in your life to have it.   
Because, in the end, as has been said, if you feel like you are sacrificing one thing for the other, rather than enriching your life by changing priorities to achieve a higher goal, no one will be happy.

< Message edited by GoddessDustyGold -- 4/18/2006 11:25:05 AM >

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


(in reply to Submotive)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 2:46:58 PM   
liks2plzlf


Posts: 390
Joined: 7/21/2005
Status: offline 		GoddessDustyGold   OUCH!!! You are absolutely right. I was just pointing out that some sub/slaves, have more to sacrifice. I have been wrestling with the sub vs slave thing for weeks now. I should probably only consider being a sub, but the feeling I envision, and seek, would not be the same as a sub.The interaction would not be there as in  a 24/7 situation. And my main focus is not on the bdsm, unless it is in the Doms interest.I know there are numerous slaves on this site who are incredibly happy being owned by there Dom, so I know it is possible, just hard to achieve. At least I will know I tried, and it just wasn't to be. I don't want to resign myself to another vanilla relationship just yet. I do totally agree with your post, and it game me much  more to consider. Reading the forums has certainly given me an education. Thanks to all.

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 3:03:55 PM   
Proprietrix


Posts: 756
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Ohio/West Virginia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: liks2plzlf
I have been wrestling with the sub vs slave thing for weeks now. I should probably only consider being a sub, but the feeling I envision, and seek, would not be the same as a sub.The interaction would not be there as in  a 24/7 situation.


Hiyas  :)
subs can be 24/7 also.
Many years ago I lived in a situation where there was a 24/7 Dominant, a 24/7 slave, and a 24/7 submissive in the same household. It worked out very well.

(in reply to liks2plzlf)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Matching Vanilla - 4/18/2006 4:29:49 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Proprietrix

quote:

ORIGINAL: liks2plzlf
I have been wrestling with the sub vs slave thing for weeks now. I should probably only consider being a sub, but the feeling I envision, and seek, would not be the same as a sub.The interaction would not be there as in  a 24/7 situation.


Hiyas  :)
subs can be 24/7 also.
Many years ago I lived in a situation where there was a 24/7 Dominant, a 24/7 slave, and a 24/7 submissive in the same household. It worked out very well.


Absolutely!  As I stated in My original post, I seek slaves.  Definition of slave, for Me, is "owned property; chattel".  I will take good care of that property, but I am not going to invest in a vehicle because I think it is pretty and I love driving it, if it is too expensive and a hassle to keep up.  I have to decide how much I am willing to give up for the opportunity to drive it.  Maybe, if I am sensible, I can see down the road and know that I will get tired of all the work it takes to own it.  Then it is no longer a pleasure, it is a burden. 
You should also remember, in the never ending battle of sub vs slave, that one person's slave might be a submissive in My mind.  Another person's submissive might well fit My definition of slave.
Rather than base your exploration on whether or not you are called "slave" because that is what you seem to want, look for someone who is compatible and compliments your life as you need it. 
There is, or should always be certain flexibility on both sides.  If the two sides are too far apart, then you need to move on and keep searching.

< Message edited by GoddessDustyGold -- 4/18/2006 4:31:00 PM >

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


(in reply to Proprietrix)
Profile   Post #: 32
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