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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/7/2010 10:46:50 PM   
ModTwentyOne


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Status: offline 		If your post(s) disappeared, you may wish to check your inbox for a note.  Please feel free to debate the topic without resorting to name-calling.

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Edited to clarify:  Always consider a post from a moderator to be a fast reply, unless you are quoted in the reply.
 


< Message edited by ModTwentyOne -- 8/7/2010 11:11:34 PM >

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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/7/2010 10:48:08 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Panda I'm not conservative... moderates can dislike illegal aliens who purposely take advantage of our welfare system too.


Oh, I know you're not a conservative. My point is that for him to come in and argue about who does and does not say that there is financial advantage to having welfare babies is irrelevant if someone in the discussion he's interrupting did, in fact, say that very thing. Or words to that effect.

Mind you, I'm not criticizing the argument you were making, or trying to revive our debate. I understood and empathized with where you were coming from, I had a different point of view, you and I agreed to disagree, and we moved on. I only brought it up again with him to point out that he's off base. Not trying to stir things up again between you and me. I hate disagreeing with you at all; i sure don't want to do it twice on the same subject.


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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/7/2010 11:59:41 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		I can't understand why all these people who get bent out of shape over Mexican nannies and landscapers are willing to cut multinational corporations every conceivable tax break. Do you guys know why the emergency bill for medical care for 9/11 volunteers was defeated this past week? Because about 150 Republicans voted against closing an offshore tax loophole for corporations. Unbelievable.

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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 12:00:49 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Its not only Republicans who are against illegal immigration.

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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 12:04:38 AM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		Tazzygirl, I don't think anyone is IN FAVOR of illegal immigration. The question is what we're going to do about it.

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Profile   Post #: 85
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 8:14:25 AM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline 		two things might be nice... seal the southern border and starty going after the businesses that hired them in large numbers.

That would work wonders

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Profile   Post #: 86
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 8:19:57 AM   
willbeurdaddy


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Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Tazzygirl, I don't think anyone is IN FAVOR of illegal immigration. The question is what we're going to do about it.


The party that stands to gain the most votes from illegal entry and then amnesty is in favor of illegal immigration.

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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 9:49:19 AM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Tazzygirl, I don't think anyone is IN FAVOR of illegal immigration. The question is what we're going to do about it.


The party that stands to gain the most votes from illegal entry and then amnesty is in favor of illegal immigration.



There seems the dilemma. D's stand to gain votes from Hispanics but R's stand to gain donations and votes from business types. So, really both Parties stand to gain in some fashion. The only losers are native workers who have to compete for lower wages.

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Profile   Post #: 88
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 11:30:48 AM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline 		Guess again.  I'm not in favor of illegal immigration.
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Tazzygirl, I don't think anyone is IN FAVOR of illegal immigration. The question is what we're going to do about it.


The party that stands to gain the most votes from illegal entry and then amnesty is in favor of illegal immigration.


(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 12:41:01 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		I`m a liberal and definitely DON`T want illegals here.Here within the law yes,otherwise no.

I don`t like demonization or taking it out on the UMs,tho.

I want what has to be done ,done but within the law and our Constitution.

I don`t think most Americans who agree with that are prejudiced against illegals.

I`m with FDD,I don`t want to change the 14th or even tweak it.


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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 1:18:19 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		~FR

I was thinking about this topic while i was out and about.

Last i checked, the fees for naturalization was around 600 dollars.

If we offer a pathway to citizenship, should they pay that fee? Should the amount be increased? Decreased? Waived?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 91
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 1:48:30 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		I've said it before and I'll say it again: if you want to do something about illegal immigration, crack down on the employers who hire them.  Anything else is a farce (usually a politically-motivated one).

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Profile   Post #: 92
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 1:52:38 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		The problem is... they are here. Many are honest, hard working people whose only crime is coming into this country illegally and working "illegally". Compared to other crimes, this is pretty benign, for the most part. I would rather enforce other laws and see this one rectified. I dont see an end to the immigration problem by just going after the employee and employer. I dont even see an end with amnesty... thats usually a one shot deal.

edited to take this to its own topic

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 8/8/2010 1:53:04 PM >

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 1:57:04 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Tazzy, you can't have a "pathway to citizenship", that's just another term for "amnesty."

Lord, I agree, we need to start getting real *aggressive* about going after employers who hire them.
And this should be about law enforcement for both parties, not about "politics."

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Profile   Post #: 94
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 1:59:06 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

The problem is... they are here. Many are honest, hard working people whose only crime is coming into this country illegally and working "illegally". Compared to other crimes, this is pretty benign, for the most part. I would rather enforce other laws and see this one rectified. I dont see an end to the immigration problem by just going after the employee and employer. I dont even see an end with amnesty... thats usually a one shot deal.

edited to take this to its own topic



Tazzy, you forgot "law abiding!"

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"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

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RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 2:00:15 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		It`s a sticky wicket for sure.No one`s going to be happy with the solutions but we must start now.

I`ve also said go after employers many times.

That,is where the tens of millions of dollars should be spent.Cracking their selfish un-American heads.

Take their assets,fine their asses and take thier liberty.

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"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

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Profile   Post #: 96
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 2:00:33 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		In many aspects, they are law abiding, pops.

Once here, many work hard to remain out of the laws field of vision, so many try hard not to break any other laws.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 2:04:01 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		If their employers were suddenly taken to account for employing them, they'd go home.  But there's a reason why that doesn't happen...

Personally I think the whole issue is a right-wing red herring, because the economy can hardly function without illegal labor, and everyone in politics knows that.  It's exactly why there will never be a real solution to the problem.  Just a lot of bullshit designed to get voters riled up.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

The problem is... they are here. Many are honest, hard working people whose only crime is coming into this country illegally and working "illegally".

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 2:04:17 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		One of the worst things illegals face is abuse from those that would use their illegal status against them.

Every manner of crime and outrage is suffered b/c they can`t go to the law.



< Message edited by Owner59 -- 8/8/2010 2:05:27 PM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

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Profile   Post #: 99
RE: 14th amendment debate - 8/8/2010 2:05:51 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Exactly, Owner. They are often abused and mistreated. Both by their own community who knows they are illegal, and therefore unable to complain against crime... and by employers who can screw them over at any chance.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 100
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